Re: Re: Where to find a reliable provider of CygwinX?
--- jsm > I want to terminate this discussion, originating from my concern for > consistency among distribution providers. > > Originally I reported on a successful installation of basic Cygwin, i.e. > without X, followed by a failing attempt to install X. Of course I have > been aware all the way that X did not come with the basic installation, > and I have no idea of how to install X on top of it without using > setup.exe by Cygwin. Still I am asked to specify how I obtained the > packages for X, because they are not part of the basic installation. > > I see no reason to spend more time on this, the experience of which is > like being part of an absurd comedy, to say it mildly. I feel confident > that I can overcome the technical issues if I use the time on them instead. > > End of discuss I cannot understand why you do not want to use setup.exe to install Cygwin-X. However, it is not necessary to use Cygwin-X as xserver for Cygwin. I myself use VcXsrv as xserver for Cygwin and WSL(windows subsystem for linux), Tatsuro -- Problem reports: http://cygwin.com/problems.html FAQ: http://cygwin.com/faq/ Documentation: http://cygwin.com/docs.html Unsubscribe info: http://cygwin.com/ml/#unsubscribe-simple
Re: Where to find a reliable provider of CygwinX?
* Jørgen Steensgaard (Wed, 02 Feb 2011 18:34:15 +0100) I want to terminate this discussion, originating from my concern for consistency among distribution providers. Originally I reported on a successful installation of basic Cygwin, i.e. without X, followed by a failing attempt to install X. Of course I have been aware all the way that X did not come with the basic installation, and I have no idea of how to install X on top of it without using setup.exe by Cygwin. Still I am asked to specify how I obtained the packages for X, because they are not part of the basic installation. I see no reason to spend more time on this, the experience of which is like being part of an absurd comedy, to say it mildly. I feel confident that I can overcome the technical issues if I use the time on them instead. You were asked simple and specific questions. You didn't bother to answer these questions. That's not absurd but rather sad. Thorsten -- Problem reports: http://cygwin.com/problems.html FAQ: http://cygwin.com/faq/ Documentation: http://cygwin.com/docs.html Unsubscribe info: http://cygwin.com/ml/#unsubscribe-simple
Re: Where to find a reliable provider of CygwinX?
I want to terminate this discussion, originating from my concern for consistency among distribution providers. Originally I reported on a successful installation of basic Cygwin, i.e. without X, followed by a failing attempt to install X. Of course I have been aware all the way that X did not come with the basic installation, and I have no idea of how to install X on top of it without using setup.exe by Cygwin. Still I am asked to specify how I obtained the packages for X, because they are not part of the basic installation. I see no reason to spend more time on this, the experience of which is like being part of an absurd comedy, to say it mildly. I feel confident that I can overcome the technical issues if I use the time on them instead. End of discussion. Jørgen -- Problem reports: http://cygwin.com/problems.html FAQ: http://cygwin.com/faq/ Documentation: http://cygwin.com/docs.html Unsubscribe info: http://cygwin.com/ml/#unsubscribe-simple
Where to find a reliable provider of CygwinX?
After having installed a basic version of Cygwin I wanted to install X and a few programs that depend on it. Using one mirror I thought I was doing well, but no program X were found. Somehow I got the information that xinit was needed, but that I could not obtain from the mirror. So I found another and lo-and-behold: I got xinit, X, and Xemacs. From previous experience I knew that the X-server should be started somehow, but I could not resist to call Xemacs right away. And believe it or not: it could not start, and complained about a missing cygjpeg-62.dll. So back to the provider to have a look for the package libjpeg-62, identified by a lookup elsewhere. But neither of the two providers had such a package, but instead some different libjpeg-*. After having downloaded all of these, the complaint came back again. So: please give me some advice on where to find a provider of all packages and preferably also some about how packages have been tested for completeness. Sincerely Jørgen Steensgaard -- Problem reports: http://cygwin.com/problems.html FAQ: http://cygwin.com/faq/ Documentation: http://cygwin.com/docs.html Unsubscribe info: http://cygwin.com/ml/#unsubscribe-simple
Re: Where to find a reliable provider of CygwinX?
On Tue, Feb 1, 2011 at 3:20 PM, Jørgen Steensgaard wrote: After having installed a basic version of Cygwin I wanted to install X and a few programs that depend on it. Using one mirror I thought I was doing well, but no program X were found. Somehow I got the information that xinit was needed, but that I could not obtain from the mirror. So I found another and lo-and-behold: I got xinit, X, and Xemacs. From previous experience I knew that the X-server should be started somehow, but I could not resist to call Xemacs right away. And believe it or not: it could not start, and complained about a missing cygjpeg-62.dll. So back to the provider to have a look for the package libjpeg-62, identified by a lookup elsewhere. But neither of the two providers had such a package, but instead some different libjpeg-*. After having downloaded all of these, the complaint came back again. the package is libjpeg62 http://cygwin.com/cgi-bin2/package-cat.cgi?file=libjpeg62%2Flibjpeg62-6b-21grep=cygjpeg-62.dll are you sue that xemacs need cygjpeg-62.dll ? on the setup.ini file it is reported libjpeg8 @ emacs-X11 sdesc: X11 binaries for Emacs. ldesc: This package contains the X11 binaries for emacs. Install it if you want to run emacs using the X window system for display. The binaries also can be used in non-X11 mode. category: Editors Interpreters requires: alternatives emacs font-adobe-dpi75 font-misc-misc libICE6 libSM6 libX11_6 libXft2 libXpm4 libXrender1 libdbus1_3 libfontconfig1 libfreetype6 libgcc1 libgdk_pixbuf2.0_0 libgif4 libglib2.0_0 libgtk2.0_0 libjpeg8 libncursesw10 libpng12 libtiff5 cygwin version: 23.2-3 what is the output ofcygcheck emacs-X11.exe ? So: please give me some advice on where to find a provider of all packages and preferably also some about how packages have been tested for completeness. any mirror should contain all the packages. The problem you see is more likely due to the fact that libjpeg62 is an obsolete package, So to see it on the select packages window list you need to unset hide obsolete packages in the left down corner of the window . Sincerely Jørgen Steensgaard Regards Marco -- Problem reports: http://cygwin.com/problems.html FAQ: http://cygwin.com/faq/ Documentation: http://cygwin.com/docs.html Unsubscribe info: http://cygwin.com/ml/#unsubscribe-simple
Re: Where to find a reliable provider of CygwinX?
Thanks Marco. Below I react in-line to most of your questions. My main point is the lack of distribution consistency I have reported on. Jørgen On 01/02/2011 16:45, marco atzeri wrote: On Tue, Feb 1, 2011 at 3:20 PM, Jørgen Steensgaard wrote: After having installed a basic version of Cygwin I wanted to install X and a few programs that depend on it. Using one mirror I thought I was doing well, but no program X were found. Somehow I got the information that xinit was needed, but that I could not obtain from the mirror. So I found another and lo-and-behold: I got xinit, X, and Xemacs. From previous experience I knew that the X-server should be started somehow, but I could not resist to call Xemacs right away. And believe it or not: it could not start, and complained about a missing cygjpeg-62.dll. So back to the provider to have a look for the package libjpeg-62, identified by a lookup elsewhere. But neither of the two providers had such a package, but instead some different libjpeg-*. After having downloaded all of these, the complaint came back again. the package is libjpeg62 Sorry for the added hypen. I use another computer to send mail for the moment. http://cygwin.com/cgi-bin2/package-cat.cgi?file=libjpeg62%2Flibjpeg62-6b-21grep=cygjpeg-62.dll are you sue that xemacs need cygjpeg-62.dll ? Only to the extent that I can rely on the reaction to my attempt to run xemacs. on the setup.ini file it is reported libjpeg8 @ emacs-X11 sdesc: X11 binaries for Emacs. ldesc: This package contains the X11 binaries for emacs. Install it if you want to run emacs using the X window system for display. The binaries also can be used in non-X11 mode. category: Editors Interpreters requires: alternatives emacs font-adobe-dpi75 font-misc-misc libICE6 libSM6 libX11_6 libXft2 libXpm4 libXrender1 libdbus1_3 libfontconfig1 libfreetype6 libgcc1 libgdk_pixbuf2.0_0 libgif4 libglib2.0_0 libgtk2.0_0 libjpeg8 libncursesw10 libpng12 libtiff5 cygwin version: 23.2-3 what is the output ofcygcheck emacs-X11.exe ? 1. could not find emacs-X11.exe 2. cygcheck xemacs-21.4.22.exe outputs several lines, one of which reads: cygcheck: track_down: could not find cygjpeg-62.dll So: please give me some advice on where to find a provider of all packages and preferably also some about how packages have been tested for completeness. any mirror should contain all the packages. I agree that this should be the case, but experience that it is not. The absence of X and xinit from one provider and presence in another is more than annoying. The problem you see is more likely due to the fact that libjpeg62 is an obsolete package, So to see it on the select packages window list you need to unset hide obsolete packages in the left down corner of the window . Thank you for a hint to work around this particular situation. My main objective is to discuss distribution consistency. Sincerely Jørgen Steensgaard Regards Marco -- Problem reports: http://cygwin.com/problems.html FAQ: http://cygwin.com/faq/ Documentation: http://cygwin.com/docs.html Unsubscribe info: http://cygwin.com/ml/#unsubscribe-simple
Re: Where to find a reliable provider of CygwinX?
On 2/1/2011 11:26 AM, Jørgen Steensgaard wrote: On 01/02/2011 16:45, marco atzeri wrote: On Tue, Feb 1, 2011 at 3:20 PM, Jørgen Steensgaard wrote: snip So: please give me some advice on where to find a provider of all packages and preferably also some about how packages have been tested for completeness. any mirror should contain all the packages. I agree that this should be the case, but experience that it is not. The absence of X and xinit from one provider and presence in another is more than annoying. The problem you see is more likely due to the fact that libjpeg62 is an obsolete package, So to see it on the select packages window list you need to unset hide obsolete packages in the left down corner of the window . Thank you for a hint to work around this particular situation. My main objective is to discuss distribution consistency. As you know, you get Cygwin from a mirror. Mirrors are not controlled by cygwin.com. So if you're having trouble with a mirror or its content, it's best to contact the mirror provider directly. Otherwise you can email Cygwin's sourcemaster. But before doing any of that, please make sure that the mirror you're choosing is on the list of active mirrors. You can find the list of active mirrors (which 'setup.exe' references) along with details of how it's maintained here: http://cygwin.com/mirrors.html -- Larry _ A: Yes. Q: Are you sure? A: Because it reverses the logical flow of conversation. Q: Why is top posting annoying in email? -- Problem reports: http://cygwin.com/problems.html FAQ: http://cygwin.com/faq/ Documentation: http://cygwin.com/docs.html Unsubscribe info: http://cygwin.com/ml/#unsubscribe-simple
Re: Where to find a reliable provider of CygwinX?
Hi, On Tue, Feb 1, 2011 at 3:20 PM, Jørgen Steensgaard wrote: After having installed a basic version of Cygwin I wanted to install X and a few programs that depend on it. Using one mirror I thought I was doing well, but no program X were found. Under Cygwin, /usr/bin/X is a symlink to /usr/bin/XWin.exe : http://cygwin.com/cgi-bin2/package-cat.cgi?file=xorg-server%2Fxorg-server-1.9.3-2grep=XWin.exe Somehow I got the information that xinit was needed, but that I could not obtain from the mirror. So I found another and lo-and-behold: I got xinit, X, and Xemacs. I find it hard to believe that downloading xinit would get you Xemacs. From previous experience I knew that the X-server should be started somehow, but I could not resist to call Xemacs right away. And believe it or not: it could not start, and complained about a missing cygjpeg-62.dll. So back to the provider to have a look for the package libjpeg-62, identified by a lookup elsewhere. But neither of the two providers had such a package, but instead some different libjpeg-*. After having downloaded all of these, the complaint came back again. Did you use Cygwin's setup.exe? If yes, what version? So: please give me some advice on where to find a provider of all packages Have you tried http://www.cygwin.com/mirrors.html ? Also, don't forget: Problem reports: http://cygwin.com/problems.html Csaba -- GCS a+ e++ d- C++ ULS$ L+$ !E- W++ P+++$ w++$ tv+ b++ DI D++ 5++ Life is complex, with real and imaginary parts. Ok, it boots. Which means it must be bug-free and perfect. -- Linus Torvalds People disagree with me. I just ignore them. -- Linus Torvalds -- Problem reports: http://cygwin.com/problems.html FAQ: http://cygwin.com/faq/ Documentation: http://cygwin.com/docs.html Unsubscribe info: http://cygwin.com/ml/#unsubscribe-simple
Re: Where to find a reliable provider of CygwinX?
On Tue, Feb 1, 2011 at 5:26 PM, Jørgen Steensgaard wrote: Thanks Marco. Below I react in-line to most of your questions. My main point is the lack of distribution consistency I have reported on. Jørgen I guess no one in the cygwin community could guarantee that a mirror is complete all the time. There is a periodic check and if a mirror is not in line is removed from the list, but it is not fault proof. I have not big problems on this side, probably you are just unlucky. I notice that in reality we have both xemacs and emacs-x11 , and xemacs requires libjpeg62. From setup.ini @ xemacs sdesc: A powerful, highly customizable open source text editor and application development system ldesc: XEmacs is a powerful, highly customizable open source text editor and [cut] category: Editors Interpreters requires: cygwin libcompface0 libX11_6 libXau6 libXaw3d7 libXft2 libXpm4 libaudio2 libdb4.5 libgmp3 libintl8 libjpeg62 libncurses8 libopenldap2_3_0 libpng12 libpq5 libtiff5 So the installation of xemacs should also pull libjpeg62 Marco -- Problem reports: http://cygwin.com/problems.html FAQ: http://cygwin.com/faq/ Documentation: http://cygwin.com/docs.html Unsubscribe info: http://cygwin.com/ml/#unsubscribe-simple
Re: Where to find a reliable provider of CygwinX?
Thanks for the guidance. But: yes, I refer to a provider on the list of mirrors found in setup.exe; and yes, I realise the difficulty to ensure consistency and the urge to put responsibilities on mirror owners. Some mechanism of mirror authorisation is in my opinion needed. Is the original distribution available to common users? Or at least details of the contents? If not, I have no reference system and cannot identify derivations? Do remember that the impressions left by inconsistencies will stick also on the original -- which is actually fair. Jørgen On 01/02/2011 17:40, Larry Hall (Cygwin) wrote: On 2/1/2011 11:26 AM, Jørgen Steensgaard wrote: On 01/02/2011 16:45, marco atzeri wrote: On Tue, Feb 1, 2011 at 3:20 PM, Jørgen Steensgaard wrote: snip So: please give me some advice on where to find a provider of all packages and preferably also some about how packages have been tested for completeness. any mirror should contain all the packages. I agree that this should be the case, but experience that it is not. The absence of X and xinit from one provider and presence in another is more than annoying. The problem you see is more likely due to the fact that libjpeg62 is an obsolete package, So to see it on the select packages window list you need to unset hide obsolete packages in the left down corner of the window . Thank you for a hint to work around this particular situation. My main objective is to discuss distribution consistency. As you know, you get Cygwin from a mirror. Mirrors are not controlled by cygwin.com. So if you're having trouble with a mirror or its content, it's best to contact the mirror provider directly. Otherwise you can email Cygwin's sourcemaster. But before doing any of that, please make sure that the mirror you're choosing is on the list of active mirrors. You can find the list of active mirrors (which 'setup.exe' references) along with details of how it's maintained here: http://cygwin.com/mirrors.html -- Problem reports: http://cygwin.com/problems.html FAQ: http://cygwin.com/faq/ Documentation: http://cygwin.com/docs.html Unsubscribe info: http://cygwin.com/ml/#unsubscribe-simple
Re: Where to find a reliable provider of CygwinX?
On Tue, Feb 01, 2011 at 07:13:51PM +0100, J??rgen Steensgaard wrote: Thanks for the guidance. But: yes, I refer to a provider on the list of mirrors found in setup.exe; and yes, I realise the difficulty to ensure consistency and the urge to put responsibilities on mirror owners. Some mechanism of mirror authorisation is in my opinion needed. As previously mentioned, we already have that. Is the original distribution available to common users? Or at least details of the contents? If not, I have no reference system and cannot identify derivations? Do remember that the impressions left by inconsistencies will stick also on the original -- which is actually fair. How about if we treat your problem as a support experience rather than a call to redesign all of the mirror handling? You have not provided such basic details as: What, exactly, did you select when installing that would lead you to believe that you should have had X programs installed? What mirror did you use? What error message did you receive when you tried to install xinit but found it unavailable? I have a very hard time believing that you found official cygwin mirrors which did not have the libjpeg62 package but, if you did, we'd certainly like to know which ones are in error. cgf -- Problem reports: http://cygwin.com/problems.html FAQ: http://cygwin.com/faq/ Documentation: http://cygwin.com/docs.html Unsubscribe info: http://cygwin.com/ml/#unsubscribe-simple
Re: Where to find a reliable provider of CygwinX?
A previous reply informed me that libjpeg62 may be included as an obsolete package. I have not checked that out, so the discussion including the following should be understood in that context. I have not checked whether it actually is available that way. I deliberately omitted the identity of the actual provider, since this mailinglist is so widely read. Send me a private email-address and I shall provide you with the information. The missing presence of X and xinit I experienced by use of 'which' and making certain that these were commands in a 1.5-version that is running on another computer. In fact I looked in vain for a folder with binaries for X. I then switched provider, used an unmodified selection of packages and checked that the two commands were present in a relevant folder. I have not yet the X-server running. I used the search facility of setup.exe with libjpeg to find packages, none of them showed libjpeg6.2 and subsequently checked with the complete name. This was the behaviour observed with two different providers. I was not aware of means to disclose obsolete packages. Another experience that emerge from this discussion is that it seems very hard to be believed. It is also very hard to document the details of what goes on during installation. Please take than into account when you take this as a support experience, which certainly is in line with my intentions. Do not forget to send a non-mailinglist email-address for information about which providers I have experienced. You may then decide, if the information should be published here. You might of course also emphasize your doubts of my credibility, if you want to close the actual discussion. Jørgen On 01/02/2011 19:27, Christopher Faylor wrote: On Tue, Feb 01, 2011 at 07:13:51PM +0100, J??rgen Steensgaard wrote: Thanks for the guidance. But: yes, I refer to a provider on the list of mirrors found in setup.exe; and yes, I realise the difficulty to ensure consistency and the urge to put responsibilities on mirror owners. Some mechanism of mirror authorisation is in my opinion needed. As previously mentioned, we already have that. Is the original distribution available to common users? Or at least details of the contents? If not, I have no reference system and cannot identify derivations? Do remember that the impressions left by inconsistencies will stick also on the original -- which is actually fair. How about if we treat your problem as a support experience rather than a call to redesign all of the mirror handling? You have not provided such basic details as: What, exactly, did you select when installing that would lead you to believe that you should have had X programs installed? What mirror did you use? What error message did you receive when you tried to install xinit but found it unavailable? I have a very hard time believing that you found official cygwin mirrors which did not have the libjpeg62 package but, if you did, we'd certainly like to know which ones are in error. cgf -- Problem reports: http://cygwin.com/problems.html FAQ: http://cygwin.com/faq/ Documentation: http://cygwin.com/docs.html Unsubscribe info: http://cygwin.com/ml/#unsubscribe-simple
Re: Where to find a reliable provider of CygwinX?
On 2/1/2011 3:10 PM, Jørgen Steensgaard wrote: Another experience that emerge from this discussion is that it seems very hard to be believed. It is also very hard to document the details of what goes on during installation. Please take than into account when you take this as a support experience, which certainly is in line with my intentions. Many if not most of setup's actions are recorded in log files in the /var/log directory of your Cygwin installation. Take a look at the setup.log and setup.log.full files. Among the information provided there are the mirror(s) and package(s) you selected. There are also error messages which could be relevant to this discussion. Unfortunately, I think the files are blown away and rewritten every time you run setup.exe. -Jeremy -- Problem reports: http://cygwin.com/problems.html FAQ: http://cygwin.com/faq/ Documentation: http://cygwin.com/docs.html Unsubscribe info: http://cygwin.com/ml/#unsubscribe-simple
Re: Where to find a reliable provider of CygwinX?
On Tue, Feb 01, 2011 at 10:10:40PM +0100, J?rgen Steensgaard wrote: A previous reply informed me that libjpeg62 may be included as an obsolete package. I have not checked that out, so the discussion including the following should be understood in that context. I have not checked whether it actually is available that way. So, to translate: Bug report: xemacs is relying on an obsolete dll. Action Required: Check with the xemacs package maintainer. Also, try to track down why setup.exe didn't install the library automatically. I deliberately omitted the identity of the actual provider, since this mailinglist is so widely read. Send me a private email-address and I shall provide you with the information. If there is a public mirror which needs to investigated then please send it here. No one's feelings will be hurt or reputation tarnished. Again, please send the problematic mirrors here. Translation: Potential cockpit error or seriously screwed up mirror. Action Required: Determine exactly which mirrors were involved. I will investigate once those are known. The missing presence of X and xinit I experienced by use of 'which' and making certain that these were commands in a 1.5-version that is running on another computer. In fact I looked in vain for a folder with binaries for X. I then switched provider, used an unmodified selection of packages and checked that the two commands were present in a relevant folder. I have not yet the X-server running. I can't say for sure if you know this or not but Cygwin/X is not installed by default. You have to specifically select it. This is why I'm asking for specific details about what you did to select X applications. Translation: Potential cockpit error or seriously screwed up mirror. Action Required: Determine exactly which mirrors were involved. I will investigate once those are known. I used the search facility of setup.exe with libjpeg to find packages, none of them showed libjpeg6.2 and subsequently checked with the complete name. This was the behaviour observed with two different providers. I was not aware of means to disclose obsolete packages. Translation: Bug report: You can't search for packages marked obsolete via setup.exe. Action Required: I'll ask some of the setup developers if that is by design. Another experience that emerge from this discussion is that it seems very hard to be believed. It is also very hard to document the details of what goes on during installation. Please take than into account when you take this as a support experience, which certainly is in line with my intentions. Third person usage aside, you're right. We do not automatically believe the *interpretation* of someone reporting problems since their interpretation is likely to be inaccurate. You don't have all of the facts at your disposal. I do have more than you so I don't automatically believe you when you claim that a mirror is missing packages. For instance, you seem to be under the impression that X is installed by default. You also seem to think that the fact that you can't find libjpeg62 via search in setup.exe means that a mirror is out-of-date when it doesn't mean that. It is likely another problem entirely. This is why I'm asking for details - to help congeal what is actually going wrong from your interpretation of what is going on. cgf -- Problem reports: http://cygwin.com/problems.html FAQ: http://cygwin.com/faq/ Documentation: http://cygwin.com/docs.html Unsubscribe info: http://cygwin.com/ml/#unsubscribe-simple
