My second Facebook thoughtcrime in two weeks!
On 4/20/19 9:39 PM, Punk wrote: > On Sat, 20 Apr 2019 18:11:53 -0400 > Steve Kinney wrote: > > > me: > > Then you have rampant censorship at the hands of the asshole > users themselves. So the vast majority of groups are heavily censored and > just echo chambers. >> > >> Yup. However, those echo chambers do have their potential uses: One >> must always preach to the choir, else how will they get on the same page >> and work together effectively at show time? > > > Even if the group has a legitimate purpose, censorship is unacceptable. > But what commonly happens is that censorship allows assholes to be > unaccountable and fraudsters to go unchallenged. And unsurprisinly censorship > is one the core 'features' of facebook. People LOVE to block and ban their > betters because they know they can't never hope to refute them. Legitimate: In accordance with the law. Latin root "leige" meaning "Lord" or, in practical terms, one's owner. Probably not a good baseline for anarchist value judgments. :o) >> As an example, The Facebook has enabled me to distribute hundreds of >> copies of this package of documents to receptive readers: >> >> http://web.archive.org/web/20190110192354/http://pilobilus.net/strategic_conflict_docs_intro.html >> >> >> I think that alone makes screwing around with The Facebook a net win. > > > Well, I don't think that's sound and complete accounting. Customer satisfaction, on the customer's own chosen terms, provides the final bottom line. As long as I continue to consider The Facebook useful, I will continue to use it. >> >>> Then you're running tons of javascript malware, including a keylogger. >>> Because of course the whole point of facebook is to automatically spy on >>> you with milliseconds resolution. >> >> Javascript? Optional. Replace the www in any Facebook address with m, >> for the legacy mobile version. I learned this exists when searching for >> a convenient way to download videos posted directly on The Facebook - in >> the mobile version, just right-click and save-as. Since then, mobile >> has become my default mode. > > > I knew about the 'mobile' mode though it was rather crippled at the > time I used it. But if you manage to use facebook without running JS, that's > good and congrats. > > Also I assumed that by now that mode didn't exist anymore, or it > required JS since 'modern' retard phones happen to have a lot of memory and > fast multicore processors...for the very purpose of running JS malware. Funny > that the NSA hasn't updated m.facebook.com yet... m.facebook.com would exist to support for legacy systems and software, and incidentally provide accessibility for visually impaired users. I don't expect it to go away any time soon. >> >> The "fancy" version of The Facebook requires JS from facebook.com and >> fbcdn.com ["facebook content distribution network"]. Block Javascript >> from all other sites while on the facebook.com domain and the thing >> works faster and better, without 3rd party user tracking. > > > Yeah well. I don't think there's any 3rd party tracking in facebook. > I'd assume facebook.com doesn't serve googletagmanager.com malware. And in > the absurd case that they did, blocking google doesn't solve the problem of > running facebook's malware. I just loaded up The Facebook and switched off all filters. On The Facebook, NoScript indicated that the page had loaded a script from google.com. [...] >> The Facebook's pages load a keylogger? I would like to hear more about >> that; so far I have seen no evidence of one. > > IIRC when you 'tagged' 'friends', the tags were automatically > recognized (or there even was autocomplete?) - Thing is, when you typed a > message, there was a piece of code looking for 'friends' names. That means > that *every time* a key-press event is triggered, some code runs. In other > words, a keylogger. Whether the code saves all the key presses and sends them > to the NSA I don't know, but it would be trivial for it to do that. > > I'm not sure if there was some sort of spell checker as well or other > similar feature that required key press events to be processed in real time. > I think there was but I can't recall the details. > > Bottom line of course is : once you run malware from something like > facebook you can (and should) assume the worst. That would be Javascript all right: A tangled mess that sometimes slows the browser down to a crawl. I only /rarely/ shift out of "mobile" mode. But a keylogger "logs" keystrokes. The speed at which The Facebook populates autocompleted "suggestions" seems to indicate a script that compares strings after the last space to a preloaded list on the client side, not traffic to and from The Facebook itself. And presumably, one would intend to transmit anything typed in a Facebook web interface to The Facebook anyway... Here's a fun thing though:
Re: clockwork statist propaganda was : Re: My second Facebook thoughtcrime in two weeks!
On 4/20/19 9:49 PM, Punk wrote: > On Sat, 20 Apr 2019 17:43:17 -0500 > "\\0xDynamite" wrote: > [...] >> free-riders of the commune who weren't pulling their fair share of >> work, etc. > > FREE RIDERS! GASP!! In any social matrix, everybody contributes something, if only consistent honesty, reliability and concern for others. Except those who can't manage even that - and yeah I seen a few, fortunately just a few, here and there on my travels. From that all else follows, with regard to On vs. Off The Bus issues: The rider's own choice, take it or leave it. :o) signature.asc Description: OpenPGP digital signature
Re: My second Facebook thoughtcrime in two weeks!
Using the tools of the State against the State is the only way to make progress. The disconnected utopia was tried in the 60s and in the end they couldn't get away from the same things the State was addressing: crime within their ranks and the need to punish, the sick and elderly, free-riders of the commune who weren't pulling their fair share of work, etc. Marcos On 4/20/19, Steve Kinney wrote: > > > On 4/20/19 3:01 PM, Punk wrote: > > [...] > >>> I got a Facebook account for maybe seven or eight years ago. Since then >>> I have used it to find and hook up with local activist orgs; get >>> feedback on propaganda materials (handbills, flyers, etc.) in production >>> and distribute the finished products to people who used them IRL; do >>> volunteer intelligence work for activist orgs; picked up a few paying >>> gigs; and I managed to seriously blow about a dozen minds that I know >>> of. On the whole, The Facebook has served /my/ purposes adequately; the >>> question of whether that's "good" depends who you ask. >> >> >> I too had an account in a previous life and used it to do some of the >> things you mention. But as time went on the costs of using an NSA weapon >> designed to attack us outweighted any perceived benefit. >> >> For instance, it should be kinda self-evident that what you see inside >> facebook and which people you get to 'meet' is (heavily) manipulated. > > No question: The Facebook presents as a 'computer dating service' of > sorts, profiling users' interests and personalities and pulling users > into echo chambers populated by "their own kind." To a lesser extent > The Facebook also exposes users to "opposite" personalities and > messages, to encourage conflict and polarization - because that drives > user engagement and, in the long run, promotes our rulers' "divide the > conquered" agenda. > > The Facebook primarily works to find users' existing biases and magnify > them; their business model includes "changing minds" with regard to > consumer purchasing preferences and frequency. In the sphere of > political ideology, The Facebook spots, classifies and reinforces the > users' already established patterns, enhancing their predictable > responses to targeted political propaganda. > >> Then you have rampant censorship at the hands of the asshole users >> themselves. So the vast majority of groups are heavily censored and just >> echo chambers. > > Yup. However, those echo chambers do have their potential uses: One > must always preach to the choir, else how will they get on the same page > and work together effectively at show time? > > As an example, The Facebook has enabled me to distribute hundreds of > copies of this package of documents to receptive readers: > > http://web.archive.org/web/20190110192354/http://pilobilus.net/strategic_conflict_docs_intro.html > > > I think that alone makes screwing around with The Facebook a net win. > >> Then you're running tons of javascript malware, including a keylogger. >> Because of course the whole point of facebook is to automatically spy on >> you with milliseconds resolution. > > Javascript? Optional. Replace the www in any Facebook address with m, > for the legacy mobile version. I learned this exists when searching for > a convenient way to download videos posted directly on The Facebook - in > the mobile version, just right-click and save-as. Since then, mobile > has become my default mode. > > The "fancy" version of The Facebook requires JS from facebook.com and > fbcdn.com ["facebook content distribution network"]. Block Javascript > from all other sites while on the facebook.com domain and the thing > works faster and better, without 3rd party user tracking. NoScript does > the deed quite conveniently. AdBlock plasters over some of the cracks > that may be left. > > Another tracking feature: Links to posted URLs displayed in The > Facebook do not point to the targets advertised, but to The Facebook > itself, with PHP arguments appended; when clicked on, these links result > in a fast redirect to the target site, with a Facebook tracking code > appended, again as a PHP string. As far as I know, nobody has made a > browser plugin to automagically sanitize this process; but the real link > does appear in the on-page Facebook link; users can extract the real > link, to kill that component of Facebook user tracking. > > The Facebook's pages load a keylogger? I would like to hear more about > that; so far I have seen no evidence of one. > >> It should also be self-evident that nobody is ever going to be able to >> use a NSA-govcorp bulletin board to attack NSA-govcorp in any meaningful >> way. While you managed to inform a dozen people about the real nature of >> the society they live in, govcorp used facebook to disinform and >> manipulate 12 million people (or some such ratio between benefits and harm >> caused). > > That strikes me as a case of "making the perfect the enemy of the good." >
Re: My second Facebook thoughtcrime in two weeks!
On 4/20/19 3:01 PM, Punk wrote: [...] >> I got a Facebook account for maybe seven or eight years ago. Since then >> I have used it to find and hook up with local activist orgs; get >> feedback on propaganda materials (handbills, flyers, etc.) in production >> and distribute the finished products to people who used them IRL; do >> volunteer intelligence work for activist orgs; picked up a few paying >> gigs; and I managed to seriously blow about a dozen minds that I know >> of. On the whole, The Facebook has served /my/ purposes adequately; the >> question of whether that's "good" depends who you ask. > > > I too had an account in a previous life and used it to do some of the > things you mention. But as time went on the costs of using an NSA weapon > designed to attack us outweighted any perceived benefit. > > For instance, it should be kinda self-evident that what you see inside > facebook and which people you get to 'meet' is (heavily) manipulated. No question: The Facebook presents as a 'computer dating service' of sorts, profiling users' interests and personalities and pulling users into echo chambers populated by "their own kind." To a lesser extent The Facebook also exposes users to "opposite" personalities and messages, to encourage conflict and polarization - because that drives user engagement and, in the long run, promotes our rulers' "divide the conquered" agenda. The Facebook primarily works to find users' existing biases and magnify them; their business model includes "changing minds" with regard to consumer purchasing preferences and frequency. In the sphere of political ideology, The Facebook spots, classifies and reinforces the users' already established patterns, enhancing their predictable responses to targeted political propaganda. > Then you have rampant censorship at the hands of the asshole users > themselves. So the vast majority of groups are heavily censored and just echo > chambers. Yup. However, those echo chambers do have their potential uses: One must always preach to the choir, else how will they get on the same page and work together effectively at show time? As an example, The Facebook has enabled me to distribute hundreds of copies of this package of documents to receptive readers: http://web.archive.org/web/20190110192354/http://pilobilus.net/strategic_conflict_docs_intro.html I think that alone makes screwing around with The Facebook a net win. > Then you're running tons of javascript malware, including a keylogger. > Because of course the whole point of facebook is to automatically spy on you > with milliseconds resolution. Javascript? Optional. Replace the www in any Facebook address with m, for the legacy mobile version. I learned this exists when searching for a convenient way to download videos posted directly on The Facebook - in the mobile version, just right-click and save-as. Since then, mobile has become my default mode. The "fancy" version of The Facebook requires JS from facebook.com and fbcdn.com ["facebook content distribution network"]. Block Javascript from all other sites while on the facebook.com domain and the thing works faster and better, without 3rd party user tracking. NoScript does the deed quite conveniently. AdBlock plasters over some of the cracks that may be left. Another tracking feature: Links to posted URLs displayed in The Facebook do not point to the targets advertised, but to The Facebook itself, with PHP arguments appended; when clicked on, these links result in a fast redirect to the target site, with a Facebook tracking code appended, again as a PHP string. As far as I know, nobody has made a browser plugin to automagically sanitize this process; but the real link does appear in the on-page Facebook link; users can extract the real link, to kill that component of Facebook user tracking. The Facebook's pages load a keylogger? I would like to hear more about that; so far I have seen no evidence of one. > It should also be self-evident that nobody is ever going to be able to > use a NSA-govcorp bulletin board to attack NSA-govcorp in any meaningful way. > While you managed to inform a dozen people about the real nature of the > society they live in, govcorp used facebook to disinform and manipulate 12 > million people (or some such ratio between benefits and harm caused). That strikes me as a case of "making the perfect the enemy of the good." All the better State sponsored dissident groups do that, both to assert their acolytes' moral superiority and to discourage anyone from doing anything that might have unwanted real world political impacts. As I said before, "It's a piss poor pitiful anarchist who's too stinkin' good to use the State's resources against the interests of the State." I would stack up the long term social and political impact of the dozen or so minds The Facebook may have helped me ruin forever up against any 12,000 or so Normal
Re: Julian Assange LiveStream
Assange presaged this in his papers "State and Terrorist Conspiracies," November 10, 2006 and "Conspiracy as Governance," December 3, 2006, published a few weeks after WikiLeaks was founded in October that year. https://cryptome.org/0002/ja-conspiracies.pdf Bluntly, WikiLeaks is a perfect waterhole to attract leakers to be documented by waterhole watchers. Org secrecy combined with public protection avowal essential by spy guide. The org's various sustained, ostentatious gambits for 12 years have been masterfully planned and executed as regularly done by professional spy agencies. Press co-optation and manipulation, after initially, to 2010 Collateral Murder press conference, condemning the press until needing to invoke press privilege. Iceland, Sweden, Interpol, UK arrest, Manning, embassy asylum, Snowden, lately RU-hacked emails, long-rumored indictment, media-staged arrest, Mueller report celebritization, with months if not years of sustained publicity to come. End game: Show trial(s), conviction(s), appeal(s), followed by pardon if not suicided or whacked. New identity and pension possible, or a Sabu-like continued undercover service. On Fri, 19 Apr 2019 04:56:02 -0400 John Young wrote: > or converted to a high value undercover (deeper than since 2006). Not sure how serious your comment is, but if you actually mean that assange is some sort of 'undercover agent' since 2006, do you mind providing some details? (facts, 'sources' or something...)
Re: My second Facebook thoughtcrime in two weeks!
> inform and manipulate 12 million people There is a time cost profit tradeoff using those BBS, and you're dealing with mass of ignorant, thus can only convert a few, that's certainly valuable. Just don't forget to deploy your own propaganda bots NLP "talking" to the masses and linking them out to better resources. Adversaries do it because it's practically free. So should you.
