Re: constant encryped stream

2003-01-08 Thread Sam Ritchie
Eh, I know I'm running a little bit behind on my reading, so this is a tad
late for the discussion-- but why not just pluck a hair from your head, wet
it, and smooth it over the door and the wall? Assuming that your enemy isn't
searching for stray hairs, you could just check if it was still there, and
in doing so see if the door has been opened. (now off to read the rest of
the responses...)
~~S

 From: Eugen Leitl [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 Date: Wed, 01 Jan 2003 10:00:10 +0100 (CET)
 To: Thomas Shaddack [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 Cc: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 Subject: re:constant encryped stream
 
 On Tue, 31 Dec 2002, Thomas Shaddack wrote:
 
 Is there a way to RELIABLY find the mail was opened?
 
 I have a related question. I have a little server sitting in a wall
 closet. Does anyone have an easy solution (preferably low tech) for
 figuring out that the closet door has been opened?




Re: constant encryped stream

2003-01-04 Thread Michael Shields
In article [EMAIL PROTECTED],
Peter Fairbrother [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 Get the pull from a party popper and wrap it in a dollar bill. Record
 the serial number of the bill (some crypto here maybe). Make it impossible
 to open the closet without setting the pull off, ie no trapdoor.

 Fairly good tamper-evidence, and the token is hard (and very illegal!) to
 forge.

Most of the security features of a dollar bill are not directed
toward the serial number; they are designed to prevent changing the
denomination, or to increase the cost of creating a real-looking bill
from scratch.  Changing the serial number is likely to be fairly
straightforward.

For this to be secure, you would have to keep the serial number a
secret; and in that case, the paper could be any piece of paper with
a secret written on it.

 Depends on your threat model, of course.

But of course.
-- 
Shields.




Re: constant encryped stream

2003-01-04 Thread Peter Fairbrother
Get the pull from a party popper and wrap it in a dollar bill. Record
the serial number of the bill (some crypto here maybe). Make it impossible
to open the closet without setting the pull off, ie no trapdoor.

Fairly good tamper-evidence, and the token is hard (and very illegal!) to
forge. Also the dollar bill is still spendable, so the only cost of your
accesses are the pulls.

Depends on your threat model, of course.


-- 
Peter Fairbrother




Re: constant encryped stream

2003-01-03 Thread Thomas Shaddack
   Isn't the obvious way to handle this to include an undeveloped
 (latent image) photograph of some obscure object, person, or place on
 the film rather than just a blank film ? ?   You could then develop it
 and check for light damage and evidence of lack of authenticity.   I
 suspect there are tricks involving calibrated exposures of objects with
 known optical power ratios (a kind of hidden grey scale strip) or even
 holograms superimposed on normal looking photographs of scenes that
 might be  rather hard to easily duplicate by developing the latent image
 and making either an optical or contact print of it on a similar medium.

The hologram trick is very interesting; could cause a lot of problems for
the adversary. Now the question remains, how to make a hologram within the
resources of a common person, to make the system suitable for wide use,
not only for a handful of high-tech geeks with closets full of
cutting-edge gears. Also, how to make sure the image got properly exposed,
so it couldn't happen that a mistake of the sender couldn't result in a
false alarm. (Maybe to develop part (half, stripe...) of the image and
then check under the red light, before using?)

The issue starts to look more complicated than it seemed on the first
glance. We have a resourceful adversary, who will quickly learn the
tricks. We need a low-tech technology that will be highly resistant
against undetected tampering by the adversary. Does anyone know if this
wasn't already being solved during the Wars, or the Cold War? I am pretty
sure many embassies had problems with adversaries going through their
diplomatic mail.




Re: constant encryped stream

2003-01-03 Thread anonimo arancio
On Fri, 3 Jan 2003 07:24:12 +0100 (CET), you wrote:

 We have a resourceful adversary, who will quickly learn the
 tricks. We need a low-tech technology that will be highly resistant
 against undetected tampering by the adversary.

Hindering the adversary is the fact that he must face thousands 
of homebrew approaches, rather than simply discover once a means 
of defeating the Mark 423 Mod 8 Closet Opening Detector.

Low tech is quite best. Using cameras and receivers that rely on 
RF simply broadcasts the nature of the device. They are useful 
primarily to distract from the real device. Likewise magnets 
scattered about, and a few small lengths of wire connected to 
light bulb filaments, or whatever.

Using devices based on storing evidence of incursion on the 
diskdrive is overly complicated and easy to defeat. (A crash, 
followed by auto-discovering of a bad sector, reboot, you are in 
doubt, etc.)

You need to deal with radiographic analysis, expert 
manipulation, micro-camera inspection, etc. You need to use what 
you can find in a prison kitchen, for example. You need to be 
able to make it with only implements and materials that a 
prisoner might have access to. Hey, if you are going to be 
paranoid

Assuming you want only to detect a door opening (not removal and 
reinstallation of the wall opposite the door, etc.) here is a 
nice low tech way.

Get a tablespoon of flour and dye it red with food coloring. Dry 
it completely. Separately, dye another tablespoon of flour 
orange and dry it.

Get a small clear plastic needle box or fishing lure box, and 
sprinkle some of the orange flour onto the bottom of the box, in 
the form of a set of digits, say 8 3 7. Now cover that up 
completely with the red flour. Now the digits can only be seen 
from the bottom of the box, and when the box is placed bottom 
down on a piece of balsa, it is immune to radiographic viewing, 
or micro camera viewing (more on this).

Superglue (or make glue from flour and water, if the warden 
doesn't permit superglue) a thin paper hinge strip to the edge 
of the piece of balsa (or several sheets of flat paper glued 
together with flour-water glue) and superglue the other edge of 
the strip to the inside opening edge of the closet door, using a 
thin strip of paper as a hinge between the inside of the door 
and the balsa shelf. Now you have a very small hinged shelf that 
is hanging down, on which to place the needle box containing 
your hidden flour digits, when the hinge is propped up in the 
shelf position.

To prop the hinged shelf up so you can place the needle box on 
it, go inside the closet and close the door. Now glue a 
toothpick in the door facing on the inside of the closed door 
that holds the shelf up. When the door is closed from the inside 
and that toothpick is in place, the toothpic just barely 
supports the rear edge of the hinged shelf. If the door were to 
be opened a quarter inch, the shelf drops off the toothpick 
supporting it, and the shelf drops, erasing the flour letters.

Now exit the closet, and use a dremel to drill a very small hole 
in the closet door. If your warden doesn't allow dremels, use a 
paperclip, or use a screw and screwdriver, or whatever. You have 
time on your hands anyway, if you can't come up with a way to 
drill a micro hole in a closet door, you have larger problems. 
The position is just under the shelf.

Now to arm it. From the outside of the opened door, stick a 
tooth pick into the hole in the door under the hinge, supporting 
the shelf. Place the flour holding needle box on the shelf. 
Close the door. Remove the toothpick from the outside of the 
closed door. The hinged shelf drops slightly onto the facing-
mounted toothpick. It is armed. To open, insert the toothpick 
into the hole from the outside of the door and open slowly.

Glue a medium size paper board box to the door facing, uncovered 
on the side toward the closed door, so that the entire works has 
freedom to operate, but is enclosed when the door is closed and 
the shelf is armed. This protects from micro cameras.

Now drill several more holes in line with the real one. At the 
inside of each of the dummy holes, link them using a popsicle 
stick and toothpick linkage to a stick that pushes the toothpick 
in the inside door facing slightly back, dropping the flour 
needle box. Tamper detection, even if they don't open the door.

Write on a sheet of paper and super glue it over the outide of 
the armed door over all the holes. That should show some crude 
tampering and cover the holes from pre-cracking surveillance 
expeditions. Alternatively, use thumbtacks or push pins in the 
holes to display some ubiquitous prison regulations. If they 
remove the regs, they expect to see the little holes in the 
surface of the closet door. Make lots of such tack holes.

Now, they can't use radiography, there are no magnetic or metal 
parts, they can't do micro camera analysis without robotic 
disassembly, and even then