Re: [darktable-user] rgb curve or tone curve

[Edgardo Hoszowski]

Hi,

The main difference between them is that the tone curve works on
prophotoRGB (when in rgb mode) and rgb curve works with the work profile.

Then there are some new options on rgb curve:

-you can scale it so the middle grey is at 50% (compensate middle grey)
-you can zoom by cntrl+scroll
-you can apply a norm so colors are not so saturated when contrast
increases (preserve colors)

Based on your description seems that the issue with the tone curve is just
for display, so you can choose the one that better fits your needs.

El lun., 20 may. 2019 a las 10:32, Stefan Klinger (<
dt-l...@stefan-klinger.de>) escribió:

> Hi,
>
> does anyone here know what the actual status of the "tone curve"
> vs. the "rgb curve" modules is?  I was not aware of the existence of
> the latter, I've always only used "tone curve".
>
> Was that wrong?  Which one is better?
>
> I'm asking, because "tone curve" seems to be buggy now [1], and it was
> suggested to switch to "rgb curve" instead.
>
> What would that mean for all the images I've processed that have "tone
> curve" settings in their stack?
>
> Cheers
> Stefan
>
>
> 
> [1] https://github.com/darktable-org/darktable/issues/2506
>
>
> --
> http://stefan-klinger.deo/X
> I prefer receiving plain text messages, not exceeding 32kB. /\/
>   \
>
> 
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>
>


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Re: [darktable-user] offset during mask placement

[Edgardo Hoszowski]

This is an issue with the crop & rotate, in particular when using the flip
option, nothing I can do about it. You can enter a bug report on github.


El mié., 20 mar. 2019 a las 19:29, Erik Schidlack () escribió:

> Hi Edgardo,
>
> please find the old and new attached.
> Let me know if you need anything else.
>
> Cheers,
> Erik
>
> On Wed, 20 Mar 2019 at 14:39, Edgardo Hoszowski <
> edgardo.hoszow...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> Can you share the xmp?
>>
>> El mar., 19 mar. 2019 a las 20:30, Erik Schidlack ()
>> escribió:
>>
>>> Hi Edgardo,
>>>
>>> I tried things as you suggested.
>>> You were right, I did only look at the last photo where I did see the
>>> issue.
>>> I do see the issue still in this photo when restarting darktable. And I
>>> see it on all masks.
>>>
>>> Now I tried a new imported photo ... and I do not see any problem with
>>> the masks.
>>>
>>> I went back to the first photo and removed the xmp file and opened the
>>> photo ... the masks were still jumping.
>>>
>>> Next try was to copy the .nef file to a new folder and import this one.
>>> The masks are not jumping here.
>>>
>>> Anything else to try?
>>>
>>> On Sun, 17 Mar 2019 at 12:26, Edgardo Hoszowski <
>>> edgardo.hoszow...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>> Hi Erik,
>>>>
>>>> Please keep your answers to the list.
>>>>
>>>> This seems to be a different issue. Does it happens with all the masks?
>>>> Try the following:
>>>>
>>>> -On a new edit enable exposure, add a circle, move it. Does it
>>>> reproduces the issue?
>>>> -Same with the retouch module
>>>>
>>>> When you have the issue, if you re-visit the edit (close darktable and
>>>> re-start it) the mask is still with an offset or thing go back to normal?
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> El dom., 17 mar. 2019 a las 7:57, Erik Schidlack ()
>>>> escribió:
>>>>
>>>>> Hi Edgardo,
>>>>>
>>>>> I tried the current master now but still see this offset happening ...
>>>>> which direction can I look further?
>>>>> Would you need some details from my side?
>>>>>
>>>>> By the way, the current master seems very slow with LXQT. Something
>>>>> like 10s for every click. LXDE and Plasma did not show this.
>>>>>
>>>>> Cheers,
>>>>> Erik
>>>>>
>>>>> On Tue, 5 Mar 2019, 02:13 Edgardo Hoszowski, <
>>>>> edgardo.hoszow...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> There was a similar issue a while ago that has already been fixed, if
>>>>>> you can build from source check the current master.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> El lun., 4 mar. 2019 a las 20:06, Erik Schidlack ()
>>>>>> escribió:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Hi,
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I have some curious issue when placing masks. It started when a
>>>>>>> friend with 4 paws tried to help me editing the photos, of course 
>>>>>>> standing
>>>>>>> on the keyboard.
>>>>>>> The situation is now, for example for spot removal using a circular
>>>>>>> mask, when selecting the mask the circle follows the mouse movement 
>>>>>>> nicely.
>>>>>>> But as soon as I place it on the spot of interest it jumps to the
>>>>>>> side.
>>>>>>> The effect of the mask is still happening on the spot I selected,
>>>>>>> but the mask is displayed with an offset. Making it really difficult to
>>>>>>> handle it later on.
>>>>>>> It gets more confusing when you have several spot masks placed.
>>>>>>> This happens with all masks.
>>>>>>> I see that the little cross of the mask origin has an offset too.
>>>>>>> Any idea where I can adjust that?
>>>>>>> So far I tried to remove/install darktable with removal of the
>>>>>>> configs.
>>>>>>> I also tried different GUIs (KDE Plasma, LXDE, LXQT), all with the
>>>>>>> same effect.
>>>>>>> System is updated (Arch).
>>>>>>> Is that maybe some X11 setting that changed?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Thanks for any pointer,
>>>>>>> Erik
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> darktable user mailing list to unsubscribe send a mail to
>>>>>>> darktable-user+unsubscr...@lists.darktable.org
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>


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Re: [darktable-user] offset during mask placement

[Edgardo Hoszowski]

Can you share the xmp?

El mar., 19 mar. 2019 a las 20:30, Erik Schidlack () escribió:

> Hi Edgardo,
>
> I tried things as you suggested.
> You were right, I did only look at the last photo where I did see the
> issue.
> I do see the issue still in this photo when restarting darktable. And I
> see it on all masks.
>
> Now I tried a new imported photo ... and I do not see any problem with the
> masks.
>
> I went back to the first photo and removed the xmp file and opened the
> photo ... the masks were still jumping.
>
> Next try was to copy the .nef file to a new folder and import this one.
> The masks are not jumping here.
>
> Anything else to try?
>
> On Sun, 17 Mar 2019 at 12:26, Edgardo Hoszowski <
> edgardo.hoszow...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> Hi Erik,
>>
>> Please keep your answers to the list.
>>
>> This seems to be a different issue. Does it happens with all the masks?
>> Try the following:
>>
>> -On a new edit enable exposure, add a circle, move it. Does it reproduces
>> the issue?
>> -Same with the retouch module
>>
>> When you have the issue, if you re-visit the edit (close darktable and
>> re-start it) the mask is still with an offset or thing go back to normal?
>>
>>
>> El dom., 17 mar. 2019 a las 7:57, Erik Schidlack ()
>> escribió:
>>
>>> Hi Edgardo,
>>>
>>> I tried the current master now but still see this offset happening ...
>>> which direction can I look further?
>>> Would you need some details from my side?
>>>
>>> By the way, the current master seems very slow with LXQT. Something like
>>> 10s for every click. LXDE and Plasma did not show this.
>>>
>>> Cheers,
>>> Erik
>>>
>>> On Tue, 5 Mar 2019, 02:13 Edgardo Hoszowski, <
>>> edgardo.hoszow...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>> There was a similar issue a while ago that has already been fixed, if
>>>> you can build from source check the current master.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> El lun., 4 mar. 2019 a las 20:06, Erik Schidlack ()
>>>> escribió:
>>>>
>>>>> Hi,
>>>>>
>>>>> I have some curious issue when placing masks. It started when a friend
>>>>> with 4 paws tried to help me editing the photos, of course standing on the
>>>>> keyboard.
>>>>> The situation is now, for example for spot removal using a circular
>>>>> mask, when selecting the mask the circle follows the mouse movement 
>>>>> nicely.
>>>>> But as soon as I place it on the spot of interest it jumps to the side.
>>>>> The effect of the mask is still happening on the spot I selected, but
>>>>> the mask is displayed with an offset. Making it really difficult to handle
>>>>> it later on.
>>>>> It gets more confusing when you have several spot masks placed.
>>>>> This happens with all masks.
>>>>> I see that the little cross of the mask origin has an offset too.
>>>>> Any idea where I can adjust that?
>>>>> So far I tried to remove/install darktable with removal of the configs.
>>>>> I also tried different GUIs (KDE Plasma, LXDE, LXQT), all with the
>>>>> same effect.
>>>>> System is updated (Arch).
>>>>> Is that maybe some X11 setting that changed?
>>>>>
>>>>> Thanks for any pointer,
>>>>> Erik
>>>>>
>>>>> 
>>>>> darktable user mailing list to unsubscribe send a mail to
>>>>> darktable-user+unsubscr...@lists.darktable.org
>>>>>
>>>>


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Re: [darktable-user] offset during mask placement

[Edgardo Hoszowski]

Hi Erik,

Please keep your answers to the list.

This seems to be a different issue. Does it happens with all the masks? Try
the following:

-On a new edit enable exposure, add a circle, move it. Does it reproduces
the issue?
-Same with the retouch module

When you have the issue, if you re-visit the edit (close darktable and
re-start it) the mask is still with an offset or thing go back to normal?


El dom., 17 mar. 2019 a las 7:57, Erik Schidlack () escribió:

> Hi Edgardo,
>
> I tried the current master now but still see this offset happening ...
> which direction can I look further?
> Would you need some details from my side?
>
> By the way, the current master seems very slow with LXQT. Something like
> 10s for every click. LXDE and Plasma did not show this.
>
> Cheers,
> Erik
>
> On Tue, 5 Mar 2019, 02:13 Edgardo Hoszowski, 
> wrote:
>
>> There was a similar issue a while ago that has already been fixed, if you
>> can build from source check the current master.
>>
>>
>> El lun., 4 mar. 2019 a las 20:06, Erik Schidlack ()
>> escribió:
>>
>>> Hi,
>>>
>>> I have some curious issue when placing masks. It started when a friend
>>> with 4 paws tried to help me editing the photos, of course standing on the
>>> keyboard.
>>> The situation is now, for example for spot removal using a circular
>>> mask, when selecting the mask the circle follows the mouse movement nicely.
>>> But as soon as I place it on the spot of interest it jumps to the side.
>>> The effect of the mask is still happening on the spot I selected, but
>>> the mask is displayed with an offset. Making it really difficult to handle
>>> it later on.
>>> It gets more confusing when you have several spot masks placed.
>>> This happens with all masks.
>>> I see that the little cross of the mask origin has an offset too.
>>> Any idea where I can adjust that?
>>> So far I tried to remove/install darktable with removal of the configs.
>>> I also tried different GUIs (KDE Plasma, LXDE, LXQT), all with the same
>>> effect.
>>> System is updated (Arch).
>>> Is that maybe some X11 setting that changed?
>>>
>>> Thanks for any pointer,
>>> Erik
>>>
>>> 
>>> darktable user mailing list to unsubscribe send a mail to
>>> darktable-user+unsubscr...@lists.darktable.org
>>>
>>


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Re: [darktable-user] ATTENTION: darktable master may go unstable.

[Edgardo Hoszowski]

So everybody is in the same page, a few notes:

Modules can now be moved pretty much everywhere (with shift + drag), if
not, the system will not allow it (i.e. RAW modules can't be mixed with
Lab/RGB modules)
The only exception is:
Lab modules can't be before input color profile or after output color
profile, if so, results are unexpected. This will be eventually handled,
but we're not there yet.

A new profile 'work profile' has been added to the input color profile. RGB
modules between input color profile and output color profile will use this
RGB color space. For modules that were before the input color profile
results should be very close, as the default is linear rec 2020, and camera
RGB is also linear.

Backwards compatibility is guarantee, so previous edits should be exactly
the same, if not, let me know and I'll look into it.

El jue., 7 mar. 2019 a las 17:48, Pascal Obry () escribió:

>
> ATTENTION: darktable master may go unstable.
>
> I'm about to merge a commit in master that could make darktable
> unstable. This is an extensive change from Edgardoh which adds:
>
> - mask history (that is a mask is now part of the history and when
> changed will not change the same mask in the same module in the
> history.
> - the possibility to have custom module order (with drag & drop)
> - a working color space
>
> Both Edgardoh and I have used this of course. We have migrated our
> whole database and have no issue recently. But those changes touch
> almost all part of the code.
>
> So, you're advised to backup your databases. Note that you won't be
> able to go back to 2.6.x (except if you revert to the saved databases).
>
> The merging is done now to let more people test this, report issues and
> hopefully fix the remaining issue for 2.8.
>
> You'll be warned... Now let's bit the bullet...
>
> Thanks,
>
> --
>   Pascal Obry /  Magny Les Hameaux (78)
>
>   The best way to travel is by means of imagination
>
>   http://photos.obry.net
>
>   gpg --keyserver keys.gnupg.net --recv-key F949BD3B
>
>
> 
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>
>


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Re: [darktable-user] offset during mask placement

[Edgardo Hoszowski]

There was a similar issue a while ago that has already been fixed, if you
can build from source check the current master.


El lun., 4 mar. 2019 a las 20:06, Erik Schidlack () escribió:

> Hi,
>
> I have some curious issue when placing masks. It started when a friend
> with 4 paws tried to help me editing the photos, of course standing on the
> keyboard.
> The situation is now, for example for spot removal using a circular mask,
> when selecting the mask the circle follows the mouse movement nicely.
> But as soon as I place it on the spot of interest it jumps to the side.
> The effect of the mask is still happening on the spot I selected, but the
> mask is displayed with an offset. Making it really difficult to handle it
> later on.
> It gets more confusing when you have several spot masks placed.
> This happens with all masks.
> I see that the little cross of the mask origin has an offset too.
> Any idea where I can adjust that?
> So far I tried to remove/install darktable with removal of the configs.
> I also tried different GUIs (KDE Plasma, LXDE, LXQT), all with the same
> effect.
> System is updated (Arch).
> Is that maybe some X11 setting that changed?
>
> Thanks for any pointer,
> Erik
>
> 
> darktable user mailing list to unsubscribe send a mail to
> darktable-user+unsubscr...@lists.darktable.org
>


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Re: [darktable-user] undo freeze darktable

[Edgardo Hoszowski]

Thanks Pascal, is working fine now.

El sáb., 2 mar. 2019 a las 6:41, Pascal Obry () escribió:

> Hello Edgardo,
>
> > With latest master any undo operation on darkroom freeze darktable.
>
> Should be fixed now.
>
> It was indeed a bad interaction with the lighttable undo/redo.
>
> --
>   Pascal Obry /  Magny Les Hameaux (78)
>
>   The best way to travel is by means of imagination
>
>   http://www.obry.net
>
>   gpg --keyserver keys.gnupg.net --recv-key F949BD3B
>
>


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[darktable-user] undo freeze darktable

[Edgardo Hoszowski]

With latest master any undo operation on darkroom freeze darktable.

With or without opencl.


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Re: [darktable-user] Inaccurate color display or color picker?

[Edgardo Hoszowski]

> I may not be understanding all the issues correctly, but this seems much
> less useful than basing the values on an output profile that you actually
> intend to use for exporting to. Would it make sense to have the
> picker/histogram always use the profile that the soft proofing toggle is
> set to (whether soft proofing is enabled or not)? Or would changing to this
> behavior be to dispruptive to existing workflows?
>
The main issue now is that is not clear the requirement or use-case, or
maybe there are many workflows with different needs. This way is the most
generic so people that want to check using the output color profile can do
it, and people that want it with the soft proofing also have a way to do
it. If this is an overkill and is better to have it only with one of those
profiles there's no problem, that can be done.


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Re: [darktable-user] Inaccurate color display or color picker?

[Edgardo Hoszowski]

You are mixing things and getting off-topic here, we'll never be able to
define a requirement this way.

The final histogram/color picker/overexpose does collect the data at the
end of the pipe, that is, when it has finished processing the image. Not
converting it to another profile makes no sense, as the last module can
work on any colorspace, and the program will be choosing for you how the
data is displayed.
What the PR does is to allow you to select the colorspace (or profile) on
which the data is displayed. If you want you can select the colorspace of
the last module, that's up to you.

El jue., 7 feb. 2019 a las 14:58, Normand Fortier (<
normand.fort...@cgocable.ca>) escribió:

> Le 19-02-07 à 07 h 36, Edgardo Hoszowski a écrit :
> > PR 2069 is ready, please test it.
>
> Thank you for the quick response! Sorry for the long posts, but I think
> we're not quite on the same page. I am still trying to figure how to
> incorporate your PR into my DT source, so I can't test yet, but I read
> the comments under your PR, here is my take.
>
> The short story: the histogram and global color picker should indicate
> the values at the end of the last module in the history stack (or of
> whatever module/step is selected in history), without converting them to
> another profile, be it the destination/output profile or the display
> profile. I don't see this as being tied to over/underexposure specifically.
>
> The detail: I admit I am still confused as to which profile is used by
> DT modules that work in RGB. My initial understanding of the behaviour
> of the global color picker and the main histogram was that, since they
> report rgb values as per the display profile, it meant that the working
> profile for RGB modules was the display profile. But your comment now
> mentions that ProPhoto is actually being used as a working profile. On
> the other hand the manual mentions the output color profile being
> applied (at the place in the pipeline where DT switches from working in
> Lab to working in RGB, I gather). Where does the ProPhoto profile come
> into play then? Which modules work in ProPhoto, and which ones work in
> the output profile?
>
> If indeed modules working in rgb use ProPhoto as a profile, then that is
> good news, but then I would expect the main histogram and the global
> color picker to provide data (histogram itself + rgb values) according
> to the ProPhoto values.
>
> As I mentioned earlier, that is what RawTherapee does: it uses ProPhoto
> as default working profile
> (https://rawpedia.rawtherapee.com/Color_Management#Working_Profile); the
> UI indicates "If enabled, the working profile is used for rendering the
> main histogram and the Navigator panel".
>
> That is also what Lightroom does: "Lightroom uses a wide gamut RGB space
> similar to ProPhoto RGB to do all the image calculations, and the
> histogram and RGB percentage readouts are based on this native Lightroom
> RGB space."
> http://www.adobepress.com/articles/article.asp?p=1930486
>
> Normand
>
>
> 
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Re: [darktable-user] Inaccurate color display or color picker?

[Edgardo Hoszowski]

PR 2069 is ready, please test it.


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Re: [darktable-user] Inaccurate color display or color picker?

[Edgardo Hoszowski]

I do most of my processing for the web so the current design is good enough
for me, and more important, I'm not sure about your needs. What I do want
as a user is the over/under exposed, gamut check, final histogram & color
pick to work on sRGB, because that is what I use to export. That happens to
be my display profile, so I'm happy (let's say).

You are talking about the final histogram & color picker only, and that's
very different from having in synch over/under exposed, gamut check, final
histogram & color pick, all on the same colorspace, so could you please
clarify that?

No matter your answer, there's a catch, right now there are some modules
after the output color profile, so if you use some of those modules,
results may be different on the color pick & histogram and the exported
image, this is a limitation of the current design that is being fixed wit
PR 1841 [1] (but don't hold your breath on this)

We are talking about the requirement here, so there's no need to go into
implementation specifics.

[1] https://github.com/darktable-org/darktable/pull/1841

El mié., 6 feb. 2019 a las 12:19, Normand Fortier (<
normand.fort...@cgocable.ca>) escribió:

> Thank you for looking into this. Here is what I understand,
> unfortunately my knowledge is quite limited, so thanks for your patience!
>
> We need the display profile to display the image on the monitor that DT
> is using, but the ultimate destination of the image is something
> different: it could be the Web (sRGB) or a printer. In my case I export
> images with ProPhoto and then the Turboprint driver applies the correct
> profile for the printer and paper combination.
>
> In other words the display profile and the output profile (meaning: the
> profile that will be used for export) are different and should be
> treated distinctly in DT. As M. Moy said in an earlier post (same thread):
> "A more rigorous approach would run the image through the pipeline up to
> the output color profile, and then export to monitor space to display
> the image and to another monitor-independant space for the picker and
> histogram."
> I think this is also what S. Klinger what referring to in yet another
> post from same thread:
> "Hmmm, does that mean that the histogram is calculated from the
> on-screen representation instead of from the image that would be
> created just before export?  I was hoping for the latter, and expected
> that to be also used to implement gamut checking?"
>
> I would prefer that, past the stage where camera (input) RGB is used,
> processing be done within the largest possible color space to minimize
> artifacts, etc (this is why DT used 32bit floating, I assume). Since
> some modules work/display data in RGB and some in Lab, the RGB space
> should be as large as possible to minimize data loss during to and fro
> conversions. Adjustments for a narrower space on output should be done
> on export or using soft proofing.
>
> This is what RawTherapee and Adobe products do, I think: PS uses
> ProPhoto as a working space, but offers Lab modules as well (while DT
> takes the reverse approach). (See earlier post:
>
> https://www.mail-archive.com/darktable-user@lists.darktable.org/msg06968.html
> ).
> In this perspective the display profile is not satisfactory since it
> could be rather narrow. Besides, using the display profile for modules
> that work in RGB means such processing done on the image will be
> impossible to reproduce exactly on a different monitor (unless keeping a
> copy of the profile of the monitor with which the image was processed).
>
> Normand Fortier
>
> Le 19-02-05 à 22 h 23, Edgardo Hoszowski a écrit :
> > In dt some modules work on camera rgb, others on lab or prophotoRGB or
> > whatever the output color profile returns. The final histogram and color
> > picker collect the data after the last module (gamma) has been processed
> > and display it in the display profile (and lab).
> >
> > The color picker is returning inaccurate results and is being fixed in
> > PR 2066 [1] (you are welcome to test it)
> >
> > Other than that, I'm not sure what your request is. We are talking about
> > the final histogram, so this is the right place to collect the data. Do
> > you want the data to be displayed in other format than the display
> profile?
> >
> >
> > [1] https://github.com/darktable-org/darktable/pull/2066
> >
> >
> > El mié., 23 ene. 2019 a las 15:22, Normand Fortier
> > (mailto:normand.fort...@cgocable.ca>>)
> > escribió:
> >
> > I am creating test images in order to get a better grasp on soft
> > proofing for printing. These images simply contain patches of
> different
> > shades of gray. I

Re: [darktable-user] Inaccurate color display or color picker?

[Edgardo Hoszowski]

In dt some modules work on camera rgb, others on lab or prophotoRGB or
whatever the output color profile returns. The final histogram and color
picker collect the data after the last module (gamma) has been processed
and display it in the display profile (and lab).

The color picker is returning inaccurate results and is being fixed in PR
2066 [1] (you are welcome to test it)

Other than that, I'm not sure what your request is. We are talking about
the final histogram, so this is the right place to collect the data. Do you
want the data to be displayed in other format than the display profile?


[1] https://github.com/darktable-org/darktable/pull/2066


El mié., 23 ene. 2019 a las 15:22, Normand Fortier (<
normand.fort...@cgocable.ca>) escribió:

> I am creating test images in order to get a better grasp on soft
> proofing for printing. These images simply contain patches of different
> shades of gray. I created them using Inkscape and then exported to png
> (see appended image).
>
> If I inspect the image using Geeqie or Gimp with the same monitor color
> profile I am using in Darktable, the rgb values all match the intended
> value: each hexagonal patch has an rgb value which corresponds to its
> displayed number (e.g. "24" -> rgb 24,24,24). However in DT, the values
> provided by the global color picker (set to point and rgb) are different.
>
> For example, in the upper left group:
> 24 -> (29,29,28)
> 25 -> (29,30,29)
> 26 -> (30,30,29)
> 27 -> (31,31,30)
> 28 -> (31,32,31)
> 29 -> (32,33,32)
> 30 -> (33,34,33)
>
> I set the monitor profile explicitly in Geeqie and Gimp, as well as in
> DT using the monitor icon in lighttable mode and the soft proofing and
> gamut icons in darkroom mode.
>
> It seems DT is not displaying the image properly, or the picker is
> reporting faulty values. Could anyone offer an explanation?
> Thanks!
>
> Normand
>
>
> 
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Re: [darktable-user] Preview images are just black

[Edgardo Hoszowski]

There's a similar issue that happens with the denoise non-local means and
opencl that has already been reported and is being fixed, so I'll say first
check if the affected images use that module and if the issue is gone
disabling opencl.

El sáb., 12 ene. 2019 a las 19:26, Ryan Martinie ()
escribió:

> Ever since updating to darktable 2.6, I've encountered this issue where
> previews of my images in lighttable don't show up; they're uniformly black.
> A few additional details
> - this doesn't happen 100% of the time so if I edit an image, then switch
> from the darkroom to the lighttable, sometimes the preview shows up
> correctly, but sometimes it's just black (I'd say at least half the time).
> If I go back and forth a few times, I can often get it to show up correctly
> after a few tries
> - this seems to affect the export function as well; sometimes (maybe
> ~40-50% of the time) the exported jpg will be uniformly black (or sometimes
> uniformly blue)
> - this also occasionally affects the darkroom preview; I'll make a change
> and the image will go black. Usually I can rectify this by zooming in a bit
> and then back out; the image re-renders and usually shows up.
>
> This all started happening when I switched over to darktable 2.6; I should
> mention I'm using the Windows build. Are others encountering this issue?
> Any ideas for potential fixes? Should I attempt to create a backtrace (not
> sure how to do that in Windows).
>
> Thank you in advance for any advice!
> Ryan
>
> 
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Re: [darktable-user] backup advice needed

[Edgardo Hoszowski]

There's an option on lighttable under history stack "write sidecar files",
that should do it.

El dom., 23 dic. 2018 a las 20:54, I. Ivanov () escribió:

>
> On 2018-12-23 15:28, Patrick Shanahan wrote:
> > * I. Ivanov  [12-23-18 17:57]:
> >> Hi Guys,
> >>
> >> I had an unfortunate event to clear metadata from about 600 images (it
> took
> >> me close to 3h to restore as much as I could).
> >>
> >> Because there is no "undo" this brings me to the question.
> >>
> >> What can I do to have a good backup for such cases? I can backup easily
> (and
> >> very frequent) "/home/myhome/.config/darktable"
> >>
> >> However - if metadata (or tags) happen to be deleted by accident and I
> >> restore the DB - how can I push the DB to re populate the XMP files?
> > perhaps (not tried), remove the images from the db
> >   import the images again
> > will/should read the accompaning xmp files
> >
> > or, maybe just telling dt to read the xmp files will work
>
> Not sure if I expressed myself correctly... If I backup
>
> "/home/myhome/.config/darktable" then data.db and library.db would be the
> "correct" ones.
> To my best knowledge - when Darktable works - it uses data from the .DB
> files (not from .XMP) and when the file changes - it populates the data to
> .XMP
>
> The reason why I am trying to backup the database (as an opposite to the
> .XMP) is because I can easily backup the DB in the cloud with multiple
> versions (and restore what I need). I wouldn't be able to easily restore
> the .XMP files (to the belonging locations) even if I manage to accelerate
> the frequency of their backups.
>
> DT can check for changed .XMP files but I am under impression that the
> checking and populating of changes is unidirectional - XMP to DB (not DB to
> XMP). Is it possible at all to push what is stored in the .DB files to the
> .XMP? For example - can I delete the .XMP files and rely that the
> information stored in the .DB would create accurate .XMP for all files that
> are missing the .XMP?
>
> Regards,
>
> B
>
> >
>
> 
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Re: [darktable-user] Bulk export without crop settings

[Edgardo Hoszowski]

You can apply a style on export on lighttable, creating a style with the
crop disabled should do it.

El sáb., 8 dic. 2018 a las 23:07, Terry Duell ()
escribió:

> Hello All,
> I have a few thousand family photographs, all shot in raw and processed
> in
> darktable.
> What I would like to do is pass these on to family members as jpg, with
> all the darktable processing with the exception of crop settings.
> I have experimented with calling darktable-cli from a bash script, and
> that provides an easy way of doing the export to a nominated path, but it
> does so utilising the current crop settings for each image.
> If I exclude the .xmp files from the list passed to the bash script the
> exports are uncropped but have none of the other darktable post processing.
> Is there a relatively simple way of excluding any crop settings whilst
> keeping all other PP for each individual image?
>
> Cheers,
> --
> Regards,
> Terry Duell
>
> 
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Re: [darktable-user] Another Spot Removal Question

[Edgardo Hoszowski]

The healing should be simple enough with the retouch, just select the path
or brush, paint over the area and adjust the source to taste.

On busy backgrounds it gets tricky, you have to choose the source
carefully,  maybe use several shapes, it really depends on the image.

El sáb., 27 oct. 2018 a las 11:55, David Vincent-Jones ()
escribió:

> Is there a simple approch to the removal of phone/power lines either
> with basic spot removal or the recently added repair module?
>
>
> 
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Re: [darktable-user] spot removal question

[Edgardo Hoszowski]

Presets, styles and history don't handle masks, so for now the only option
is to copy/paste history.

El sáb., 27 oct. 2018 a las 2:38, I. Ivanov () escribió:

>
> On 2018-10-26 15:03, Patrick Shanahan wrote:
> > I tried making a preset with all the spots defined but it doesn't seem to
> > work, nor does a style.  am I missing something or is that approach not
> > possible and I should continue copy/pasting from one image to another or
> > group?
> >
> I tried myself with a preset - just to test. Behaves very odd. The
> preset does preserve the individual strokes but only for the image that
> had them applied. So you can go down the history stack and even compress
> it. Then when you go back to the preset and apply it - everything is
> applied properly. Then when you move to the next image and apply the
> very same preset the strokes are not there. I find this odd.
>
> You can save the mask in a side cart and then load it with appending but
> I don't see benefit comparing to what you are already doing.
>
> Regards,
>
> B
>
>
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Re: [darktable-user] New module Retouch

[Edgardo Hoszowski]

I'm not sure I understand what you are saying here, and of course if you
like better LR over dt I have nothing to say about it. But as far as I know
LR don't have a wavelet decompose, so if you are fine using the healing
alone, in dt you don't even need to enable the retouch module, just add the
shapes and you are done. I don't think that LR can be easier that this.

About the complexity of the wavelet decompose, for me what's complex is the
editing technique, once you are comfortable with this technique the UI
makes easy the work, at least that's my experience.


2018-09-17 8:04 GMT-03:00 kneops :

> Yes, a 'small' difference in team size, and that said it is amazing what
> DT is and can do! [image: ]
>
> I understand what you say, and indeed I may have forgotten that 'painting'
> over an image is a different thing. It's just that I installed LR in a
> virtualbox and the first two things I looked at was the base quality of an
> image, and the retouch tool :). Because unfortunatelly my sensors keep on
> getting dirty. In LR in 95% of all cases that retouch tool is enough.
>
> I think I will keep my workflow as it is for now: first edit everything in
> DT, and at the end if necessary open the image in GIMP for retouching. That
> works rather well I must say, and for the rest I will clean the sensor more
> often.
>
> Jack
>
>
>
>
> Op 17-09-18 om 12:26 schreef Remco Viëtor:
>
> On lundi 17 septembre 2018 11:53:51 CEST kneops wrote:
>
> I haven't tried it yet (waiting for the official release using the Linux
> software update), but in general I think Coding Dave does have a point.
> For end users (not technicians) things should be kept as simple as
> possible. Most photographers are people that work on intuition. That's
> why default tools in Gimp and Photoshop/Lightroom like dodging/burning
> and the healing brush and clone stamp work so great. You visually repair
> or change the image on the spot, using a brush tool, without ever having
> to think about settings, except ofcourse the brush size and opacity. In
> DT the tools may be more advanced, they are never really intuitive.
> Things like wavelet decompose are great for very delicate work on
> crucial images, they should be available next to a more basic and
> intuitive tool like those in Gimp and in Adobe software. I showed DT to
> a friend who works as a photographer for a news agency and who does
> concerts. Yes, she is used to use Photoshop and not DT, but she hates
> it. And I must say, when I sit beside her looking how she handles and
> adjusts images 'in a flow' in Photoshop and Adobe Bridge (not even
> Lightroom), I'm jealous and makes me think why I use DT at all ;). But I
> do use DT and I really like it, but I really think what the developers
> need is another UI specialist who will look at the software from an end
> users point of view.
>
> Jack
>
>
> The interface is indeed not the most accessible. However, you have access to
> all the variables influencing the result.
>
> And that's the rub: in most cases, to get a simple to use interface, you have
> to simplify. In the case of dt, that would mean making certain variables
> inaccessible. That limits what an experienced user can do with the tool.
>
> And in this particular case, you have a tool that sounds extremely powerful,
> but that same power makes it complex. One intermediate solution could be
> having presets for some of the effects, so that the user basically only 
> selects
> the area of effect.
>
> Also, dt is basically a global editor , not a pixel level editor like
> photoshop; i.e. all changes are applied to the whole image, unless you limit
> the area through a selection. So for each tool, you'll have to limit its 
> effect
> through a selection.
>
> That is a *different* workflow compared to Gimp and photoshop, where you paint
> over the individual pixels with the brush; to limit the effect area, you do
> *not* need a selection. (I know there are tools that affect the whole image
> layer in Gimp/PS as well).
>
> So if you need to use a lot of selections to limit e.g. burning and dodging,
> you might be using the wrong tool for (that part of) the job.
>
> Remco.
>
> P.S. There's also a 'small' difference in the size of the development team
> between dt and PS.
> 
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>
>
> 
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Re: [darktable-user] New module Retouch

[Edgardo Hoszowski]

This is in the development version only, you'll have to build it from
source. It will be available as PPA with the next release.

Yes, is still one spot at the time.

2018-09-14 11:58 GMT-03:00 kneops :

> Is the new tool available when I add this PPA to my system?
> https://launchpad.net/~pmjdebruijn/+archive/ubuntu/darktable-release
>
> If I understand it correctly you still have to add one spot / area at a
> time? Not like how the heal brush works in Gimp for instance?
> That would be ideal to have too, but a better retouch tool is very welcome!
>
> I will test is as soon as I know how to install it on my pc.
>
> Jack
>
>
>
>
> Op 13-09-18 om 19:44 schreef Edgardo Hoszowski:
>
> A new module Retouch has been merged into master recently. It allows to
> heal, clone, fill and blur certain areas of the image. It can also perform
> a wavelet decomposition and apply those operations to each wavelet scale.
>
> Any help on testing it will be much appreciated.
>
>
> Here is a description of the features:
>
> For a basic use, with default parameters, add the shapes to the image like
> with the Spot Removal.
>
> To use the wavelet decompose first select the current scale (see below)
> and then add the shapes, as a shapes cannot be moved individually to
> another wavelet scale.
>
>
> The UI is divided in 3 main sections: retouch tools, wavelet decompose and
> shapes.
>
>
> *Retouch tools section*
>
>
> *Shapes toolbar*: allow to add new shapes to the image. Shapes
> creation/editing behaves like the Spot Removal.
>
>
> *Algorithms toolbar*: allows to select between heal, clone, fill and blur
> algorithms. Before creating a shape the algorithm must be selected, once a
> shape is created the algorithm cannot be changed.
>
>
> Any combination of shape type/algorithm can be added to the image.
>
>
> *Wavelet Decompose section*
>
>
> *Wavelet Decompose bar*: it controls the wavelet decompose algorithm. It
> has two sliders and a central area divided in boxes. The first box, scale
> zero, is the original image, the second is the wavelet scale 1, and so on.
>
>
> - The bottom slider adjusts the number of scales, zero means no wavelet
> decompose is done. The maximum number of scales depends on the image size,
> but any number can be selected. If the image is not big enough for the
> selected number of scales the maximum number of scales is used and the rest
> is ignored.
>
>
> The image is decomposed on the selected number of scales + the residual
> image, so if 5 is selected as the number of scales, scale zero is the
> original image, scales 1 to 5 are the detail scales, and scale 6 is the
> residual image.
>
>
> - The central area allows to set the current scale. Any scale can be
> selected as the current scale, even if it is greater than the number of
> scales.
>
> Shapes are added to the current scale, so if scale zero is selected when
> adding a new shape, the algorithm associated with the shape will be applied
> to the original image. If a shape is added to a scale greater than the
> residual image it will be ignored, as the scale is not processed.
>
>
> Only the shapes on the current scale are displayed, when the current scale
> is changed shapes will be displayed accordingly.
>
>
> A green line on top of each box indicates that the scale has shapes
> associated with it.
>
> A light gray line indicates that the scale is visible at current zoom
> level.
>
>
> - The top slider adjusts the merge from scale, zero means that no merge
> will be used. If greater than zero, then each detail scale, starting from
> the merge from scale, will be merged with the previous one before applying
> the algorithms. Residual image is not affected by this setting.
>
>
> *Display wavelet scale *button allow to view the current wavelet scale.
> If the current scale is greater than the residual image, the residual image
> will be displayed.
>
> Blend module is temporary disabled when this option is set.
>
> If mask is displayed on blend module this option cannot be set.
>
> When this option is active a new section, preview single scale, will be
> displayed, allowing to adjust the levels for the image displayed.
>
> An auto levels button is also available; it works on the displayed image,
> so different results can be expected depending on the image displayed when
> zoomed in/out.
>
> Levels are only applied to detail scales, not the original or residual
> image.
>
>
> *Cut/Paste *buttons allows to move all the shapes from one scale to
> another. In order to do this first select the current scale, click the cut
> button, select the destination scale and click pas

[darktable-user] New module Retouch

[Edgardo Hoszowski]

A new module Retouch has been merged into master recently. It allows to
heal, clone, fill and blur certain areas of the image. It can also perform
a wavelet decomposition and apply those operations to each wavelet scale.

Any help on testing it will be much appreciated.


Here is a description of the features:

For a basic use, with default parameters, add the shapes to the image like
with the Spot Removal.

To use the wavelet decompose first select the current scale (see below) and
then add the shapes, as a shapes cannot be moved individually to another
wavelet scale.


The UI is divided in 3 main sections: retouch tools, wavelet decompose and
shapes.


*Retouch tools section*


*Shapes toolbar*: allow to add new shapes to the image. Shapes
creation/editing behaves like the Spot Removal.


*Algorithms toolbar*: allows to select between heal, clone, fill and blur
algorithms. Before creating a shape the algorithm must be selected, once a
shape is created the algorithm cannot be changed.


Any combination of shape type/algorithm can be added to the image.


*Wavelet Decompose section*


*Wavelet Decompose bar*: it controls the wavelet decompose algorithm. It
has two sliders and a central area divided in boxes. The first box, scale
zero, is the original image, the second is the wavelet scale 1, and so on.


- The bottom slider adjusts the number of scales, zero means no wavelet
decompose is done. The maximum number of scales depends on the image size,
but any number can be selected. If the image is not big enough for the
selected number of scales the maximum number of scales is used and the rest
is ignored.


The image is decomposed on the selected number of scales + the residual
image, so if 5 is selected as the number of scales, scale zero is the
original image, scales 1 to 5 are the detail scales, and scale 6 is the
residual image.


- The central area allows to set the current scale. Any scale can be
selected as the current scale, even if it is greater than the number of
scales.

Shapes are added to the current scale, so if scale zero is selected when
adding a new shape, the algorithm associated with the shape will be applied
to the original image. If a shape is added to a scale greater than the
residual image it will be ignored, as the scale is not processed.


Only the shapes on the current scale are displayed, when the current scale
is changed shapes will be displayed accordingly.


A green line on top of each box indicates that the scale has shapes
associated with it.

A light gray line indicates that the scale is visible at current zoom level.


- The top slider adjusts the merge from scale, zero means that no merge
will be used. If greater than zero, then each detail scale, starting from
the merge from scale, will be merged with the previous one before applying
the algorithms. Residual image is not affected by this setting.


*Display wavelet scale *button allow to view the current wavelet scale. If
the current scale is greater than the residual image, the residual image
will be displayed.

Blend module is temporary disabled when this option is set.

If mask is displayed on blend module this option cannot be set.

When this option is active a new section, preview single scale, will be
displayed, allowing to adjust the levels for the image displayed.

An auto levels button is also available; it works on the displayed image,
so different results can be expected depending on the image displayed when
zoomed in/out.

Levels are only applied to detail scales, not the original or residual
image.


*Cut/Paste *buttons allows to move all the shapes from one scale to
another. In order to do this first select the current scale, click the cut
button, select the destination scale and click paste.

This can be useful when there’s edits on the residual image and one has to
change the number of scales; since the residual image is changed, shapes
need to be moved to the new one.


*Switch off shapes* button disables the process of all shapes, so
before/after can be seen.


*Display masks* button works similar to the one on the blend module, but it
will display only the shapes on the current scale.

This option and display mask on the blend module cannot be set at the same
time.


*Shapes section*


*Shape selected* label displays the selected shape (if any). To select a
shape click on it, to un-select click on a free area on the image.


*Mask opacity *is displayed when a shape is selected. It display/sets the
opacity of the mask. This is a property of the shape, not the algorithm, so
it won’t be used as default value for new added shapes.


Different properties will be displayed depending on the selected algorithm:


- Fill algorithm:


*Fill mode*: can be erase or color.

Erase is used to delete details from a wavelet scale.

Color allow to select a color to fill the area defined by the shape.


*Brightness*: adds the selected value to the color, allowing to make it
brighter or darker. Works with both fill modes.

Re: [darktable-user] Healing brush?

[Edgardo Hoszowski]

we are just starting with this, so it may suffer changes that breaks
backward compatibility. it's probably better to wait until the merge to
master.

2017-11-21 3:55 GMT-03:00 Hans Bull <bull...@gmail.com>:

> That's great, Edgardo!
> Since I'm quite ignorant when it comes to branches, how can i merge
> your new stuff with my local version of darktable, which is built
> daily from source? Any magic one-line git command I can add?
> Cheers, HB
>
> 2017-11-20 16:16 GMT+01:00 Anders <and...@alweb.dk>:
> > På Mon, 20 Nov 2017 12:00:46 -0300
> > Edgardo Hoszowski <edgardo.hoszow...@gmail.com> skrev:
> >> I'm currently working on this feature, see
> >> https://github.com/darktable-org/darktable/pull/1548
> >
> > Great news! I will be looking forward to using that :)
> >
> > Kindly,
> > Anders
> >
> >>
> >> 2017-11-19 16:17 GMT-03:00 Anders <and...@alweb.dk>:
> >>
> >> > Is a healing brush the most-wanted feature in darktable? I for sure
> >> > would love one! ;)
> >> >
> >> > Kindly,
> >> > Anders
> >> > 
> >> > 
> >> > darktable user mailing list
> >> > to unsubscribe send a mail to darktable-user+unsubscribe@
> >> > lists.darktable.org
> >> >
> >> >
> >>
> >> 
> 
> >> darktable user mailing list
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> >> darktable-user+unsubscr...@lists.darktable.org
> >
> > 
> 
> > darktable user mailing list
> > to unsubscribe send a mail to darktable-user+unsubscribe@
> lists.darktable.org
> >
> 
> 
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Re: [darktable-user] Healing brush?

[Edgardo Hoszowski]

I'm currently working on this feature, see
https://github.com/darktable-org/darktable/pull/1548


2017-11-19 16:17 GMT-03:00 Anders :

> Is a healing brush the most-wanted feature in darktable? I for sure
> would love one! ;)
>
> Kindly,
> Anders
> 
> 
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[darktable-user] Masks & combine inclusive

[Edgardo Hoszowski]

Hi,

When I define a draw & parametric mask with combine inclusive the entire
image is always selected.
The expected behavior is the drawn mask to be added to the selection made
on the parametric mask, as when the combine exclusive the drawn mask is
subtracted.

As far as I can tell it works the same on all modules, with or without
opencl.

I can provide a raw & xmp if you find it useful.

Regards,
Edgardo.


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Re: [darktable-user] A better starting-point for Nikon RAW-files

[Edgardo Hoszowski]

Sorry about that, I didn't notice the size of the file, I'll have it in
mind the next time.

2016-08-01 19:20 GMT-03:00 Terry Duell <tdu...@iinet.net.au>:

> Hello Edgardo,
>
> On Tue, 02 Aug 2016 04:10:22 +1000, Edgardo Hoszowski <
> edgardo.hoszow...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> Sure, see attached
>>
>>
>>
> The 'attached' that arrived here was 6.5 MB.
> I'm not sure what others think, but in view it is bad etiquette to attach
> large files to posts to mailing lists, as everyone ends up getting a copy.
> In my view the 'correct' approach is to provide a link to the file on
> Dropbox or similar.
>
> Cheers,
> --
> Regards,
> Terry Duell
>
>
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Re: [darktable-user] A better starting-point for Nikon RAW-files

[Edgardo Hoszowski]

Same here with a D5100, with a D7100 all went fine, I have 2 or 3 different
profiles that give different colors cast, but so far there's always one
closer to the camera jpg.
Using the D7100 profiles on a D5100 raw seems ok too,  much closer to the
camera jpg.


2016-07-31 8:18 GMT-03:00 Colin Adams :

> So I tried this (I have a Nikon D810).
>
> When selecting any of the generated icc profiles except the last one, I
> get a message:
> "unsupported input profile has been replaced by linear Rec709 RGB!"
> So I selected the last one, and set unbreak input profile to 0.0 as you
> instruct.
> The resulting image indeed looks to have slightly better quality, but it
> has a green cast.
> This is with darktable 2.0.5-1 rather than 2.0.4. I'm doubtful if that
> should be making the difference though.
>
> On Wed, 27 Jul 2016 at 15:39 Jean-Luc CECCOLI 
> wrote:
>
>> Hello,
>>
>>
>>
>> Very interesting.
>>
>> Thanks for sharing.
>>
>>
>>
>> Rgds,
>>
>>
>>
>> J.-Luc
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> > Message du 26/07/16 20:41
>> > De : "Vidar Hoel" 
>> > A : "Jean-Luc CECCOLI" ,
>> darktable-user@lists.darktable.org
>> > Copie à :
>> > Objet : Re: [darktable-user] A better starting-point for Nikon RAW-files
>>
>>
>> >
>> > On 26. juli 2016 20:16, Jean-Luc CECCOLI wrote:
>> > > Hello,
>> >
>> > Hi!
>> >
>> > > Just one thing that puzzles me : Nikon ViewNX2 generates a profile for
>> > > each picture it processes, so each
>> > > profile is based upon the parameters of this picture.
>> >
>> > Almost. It generates a different profile for each camera setting (it
>> > seems like). So of mine 98 pictures, I got 10 different profiles.
>> >
>> > > That would mean that, for each picture, one would have to use the
>> > > corresponding imported profile, else one
>> > > might get even worse results than using the DT dedicated basecurve,
>> > > isn't it ?
>> >
>> > After applying all 10 different profiles to the same image, I
>> discovered
>> > it was only minor differences, and so small I can neglect them. I have
>> > never seen them make a worse result than the dedicated base curves. But
>> > this is a subjective observation!
>> >
>> > Regards,
>> > Vidar Hoel
>> >
>> > > That said, I think that that is the way profiles work...
>> > >
>> > >
>> > >
>> > > Regards,
>> > >
>> > >
>> > >
>> > > J.-Luc
>> > >
>> > >
>> > >
>> > >
>> > >
>> > > > Message du 26/07/16 18:45
>> > > > De : "Vidar Hoel" 
>> > > > A : darktable-user@lists.darktable.org
>> > > > Copie à :
>> > > > Objet : [darktable-user] A better starting-point for Nikon RAW-files
>> > > >
>> > > > Hi,
>> > > >
>> > > > some time ago I noticed that the JPGs from my Nikon were better then
>> > > > what I could achieve from processing the RAW-file (NEF) in
>> Darktable.
>> > > > After some digging on the Internet, I figured out I could use an
>> > > > alternative to the default base-curves in Darktable - and that
>> > > made me
>> > > > get a better starting-point when processing my Nikon RAW-files (and
>> I
>> > > > was able to achieve a better image than the JPGs from my camera!)
>> > > >
>> > > > Today I finished a step-by-step video of what I did, so anyone can
>> > > see,
>> > > > learn and perhaps do it themselves.
>> > > >
>> > > > Some notes before viewing:
>> > > > - I am not really sure behind the technology behind this. I am not
>> > > sure
>> > > > if a Nikon RAW-file has a profile embedded, but it seems so.
>> > > > - I am not sure if there is an other way to achieve this is
>> Darktable?
>> > > > - As explained in the video, you will need Windows, or a friends
>> > > laptop
>> > > > with Windows, once, to make this work.
>> > > > - My native language is not English :-)
>> > > >
>> > > > https://youtu.be/O1nS3URVSYA
>> > > >
>> > > > Enjoy :-)
>> > > >
>> > > > Best regards,
>> > > > Vidar Hoel
>> > > >
>> > >
>> 
>> > > > darktable user mailing list
>> > > > to unsubscribe send a mail to
>> > > darktable-user+unsubscr...@lists.darktable.org
>> > > >
>> > > >
>> > >
>> >
>> 
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>>
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