Re: Call for bids for DebConf24
On 2023-10-31 01:13 +0100, Judit Foglszinger wrote: > I'd like to add - of course any bid for an in-person for 2024 is better than > an "online" debconf Not from an emissions point of view it isn't. Wookey -- Principal hats: Debian, Wookware, ARM http://wookware.org/ signature.asc Description: PGP signature
Re: Driving from France to Prizren: visa requirements
On 2022-03-20 23:03 +0100, Thomas Goirand wrote: > I probably will drive from France (next to Geneva) to Prizen, because it may > be cheaper and easier this way (compared to fligh + rent a car, and since > I'm planning to come with all of my family). Apologies for thread-hijacking, but I was also considering driving (from the UK, with my wife, mostly to have a 2-3 week camper holiday in the area around debconf (and get stuff to Austria for an expedition)), and have a similar question. People with country-specific expertise may be able to answer both visa and covid regs aspects. It's about 9 countries and we are somewhat concerned that every country will have different covid rules and there might be significant risk of getting 'stuck' for a week or 10 days at a border with a failed covid test which would rater spoil the excercise. Obviously these things are subject to change and _might_ have all gone away by mid 2022, but then I thought that about a year ago too... Has anyone (e.g. you Thomas?) looked at the rules for tests and entry etc for any of UK, France, Belgium, Germany, Austria, Slovenia, Croatia, B&H, Kosovo, Serbia, Albania? Is this actually a bad plan for this year and best left for some other time? Wookey -- Principal hats: Debian, Wookware, ARM http://wookware.org/ signature.asc Description: PGP signature
Re: MiniDebConf Online 28-31 May
> On Thu, May 7, 2020 at 9:07 AM Mini-Debconf Online Content Team < > mba...@gmail.com> wrote: > > == MiniDebConf Online == > > The first ever online Mini-Debconf will be taking place from 28-31 May > 2020, and it wants YOUR submissions to help make it a success! As this is tomorrow, it feels like the wikipage should say which matrix room/IRC channel/jitsi URLs are to be used, at least to get started. Does someone have a plan or should I just make something up? There already seems to be a #DebConf:matrix.org And we already have #debconf on OFTC. And allegedly https://jitsi.debian.social will be used for talks, so I guess it makes sense to use https://jitsi.debian.social/debcamplounge or something for general chat? I'm planning to try some Jangouts vs Jitsi testing and learn how to set-up/configure this stuff. Look forward to some nerding over next few days. Wookey -- Principal hats: Linaro, Debian, Wookware, ARM http://wookware.org/ signature.asc Description: PGP signature
Re: DebConf20 registration is now open (with caveats)
On 2020-05-23 05:46 +0800, Andrew Lee wrote: > As crisis is turning point. According to everyone's feedback. I also believe > to > have the conference in person is not the best option to fight together to the > virus. And I also don't want our DebConf orga team's efforts to be wasted. > > I believe orga team has done their best. We hope we all may work together to > make this year as the first special DebConf ever with revolutionary > arrangement > (online, VR/XR...etc) possible. Large in-person conferences are not just a problem because of the disease risk, but also because they are very high-carbon activities that are increasingly difficult to justify. Lots of organisations have discovered that they can do their meet-ups remotely recently, and I think we should take this opportunity to see if we can too. We should be better at this than most. Experience in other organisations is that all-remote events (i.e. where everyone is remote on the same footing) work a lot better than mixed events where some people are remote and some are there in-person. Obviously events where everyone are in-person work even better, but that's clearly not going to happen this year however things go, and has never been true anyway. So I vote for working on a fully-remote conference this year, if only by way of a trial-run. If it works reasonably well then maybe in future we could have a full in-person conference every 3 or 4 years or so, with remote ones being the annual norm (it would be a hell of a lot easier to organise if nothing else). I realise that's pretty radical, but events like debconf are a significant part of the excessive emissions of many of us, and 2020 is clearly a year for a rethink of many things. Lets not waste the opportunity to rethink debconf. Wookey -- Principal hats: Linaro, Debian, Wookware, ARM http://wookware.org/ signature.asc Description: PGP signature
Re: Announcing the elephant in the room BOF
On 2019-08-02 10:36 -0400, Louis-Philippe Véronneau wrote: > On 19-08-02 08 h 48, Shachar Shemesh wrote: > > > > What I still don't understand regarding that BoF session was why it was > > done > > with no video streaming and no recording. > > That decision made it much harder to participate remotely > I wasn't at DebConf this year, but if I had been, I wouldn't have > participated in that BoF if it had been streamed. This is a useful reminder that as we try to improve remote participation, that is distinct from recording/public streaming and we should design our systems to allow remote connection to unpublished meetings as well as the default streamed/published meetings. Sometimes they get conflated (although less in debian than other organisations). Wookey -- Principal hats: Linaro, Debian, Wookware, ARM http://wookware.org/ signature.asc Description: PGP signature
Re: [DebConf Scedule change] "Let's talk about the elephant in the room" DebConf20 in Israel session
On 2019-07-27 15:01 -0500, Gunnar Wolf wrote: > Wookey dijo [Sat, Jul 27, 2019 at 08:37:57PM +0100]: > Boycotting a DebConf in Israel should have been > done by the interested people when it was still at the bidding level - > It would have not been nice, but it would have been ... Fair. Agreed. But first I heard of this was the anouncement so I wasn't able to to make the point at that time. That's no doubt mostly my own fault for not being on whatever is the right mailing-list, or for not travelling to the relevant debconf. But I am surprised that whoever it does make these choices made this one. I gather that, somewhat ironically, 'closer to Europe' (something I do agree with - it's been 5 years) was part of the decision process, but of course that's not much use for Europeans with the decency not go to Israel: in fact it's worse because now we've nominally ticked 'Europe' for a while again, disadvantaging those Europeans with morals (i.e. acceptable carbon footprints) still further. > Pushing for this political stance now, when our friends have been > working on rearranging their life objectives for the whole year is > just not right. I am quite heartfelt and saddened. I'm sorry that Tzafrir and co are in this awkward position. And yes, unless the Lisbon or India teams are going to leap up and heroically save us from our own dubious choices at the last moment, then I agree it's too late to change now. Wookey -- Principal hats: Linaro, Debian, Wookware, ARM http://wookware.org/ signature.asc Description: PGP signature
Re: [DebConf Scedule change] "Let's talk about the elephant in the room" DebConf20 in Israel session
On 2019-07-27 17:01 +0200, Ansgar wrote: > On Sat, 2019-07-27 at 08:27 -0400, micah anderson wrote: > > Ansgar writes: > > The BDS movement is widely described as antisemitic. Why should we > > > care about it? > > > > No, it is not widely described as antisemitic, it is anti-zionist. There > > is a difference. > > BDS is widely described as antisemitic even when you care about some > difference. Perhaps so, but a big part of the difficulty round this issue is people calling things which aren't (like thinking the settler movement is deeply unjust) 'anti-semitic'. It makes it almost impossible to have a sensible conversation around the subject. Boycotting Israel, or at least settlers, seems sensible to me for the same reasons that it was sensible against South Africa. And holding debconf there seems like a bad plan for the same reason that a lot of bands got abuse for playing Sin City in the 1980s. Wookey -- Principal hats: Linaro, Debian, Wookware, ARM http://wookware.org/ signature.asc Description: PGP signature
Re: Debconf in Israel
On 2019-03-21 17:36 +, Nasir El-Amin wrote: > I haven’t once mentioned Jews. I’ve mentioned Israelis which are citizens of > Israel. There are Jews worldwide especially of the Orthodox that 100% condemn > the existence of Israel. This isn’t a Jew vs Muslim issue. This is a Israel vs > Muslims Isn't it an Isreal vs Palestinians issue? (not all Palestinians are Muslims, or indeed members of any sky-faerie club). > issue and the fact that Israel exists through the theft of land, > genocide, oppression and even blockading of the most basic of humanitarian > supplies. Palestinians die everyday at the hand of Israel. You can’t tip toe > around this issue and say there are Israelis that don’t support what’s > happening that’s not true. Every Israeli supports the theft of land because > they are by their presence on the stolen land complicit in the theft. Every > Israeli is complicit in the genocide to because it’s not some fringe politics > but it is the national political discourse of Israel to treat Palestinians the > way they are treated. > > You can defend Israel or you can be in the right side of history and stand > with > the Palestinians, United Nations, Human Rights Watch, BDS and countless > organizations and human rights officials worldwide who condemn what’s happened > and continues to happen in Israel. > > Israel doesn’t have any right to exist it’s a apartheid and stolen land. Nasir, you are in danger of losing your audience here. You are quite right that Israel is an apartheid state run by terrible people and the Palestinians have been shamefully treated for decades. Decent people should probably boycott it (I say 'probably' because boycotts are double-edged swords). But you go too far by blaming every Israeli citizen for what their state does. I think reasonable people will make a distinction between normal people living in Israel (and quite probably wishing their government didn't persist in making the country an international pariah) and settlers who continue to occupy the West Bank and amplify the oppression, aided by the government. Tzafrir is, so far as I can tell, a perfectly decent bloke, who I hope is embarrased by/ashamed of many of the actions of his country, but it's not right to blame him, in the same way that I'm not responsible for Brexit or further fosil fuel extraction developments in the UK (both fucking stupid policies with which I profoundly disagree, but I'm not going to leave and try to change citizenship because of them- I instead act within the country to try and get better policies). I'm sure quite a lot of DD's agree with your central point, but you need to distinguish between citizens and governments - they are not the same. Failing to do so gets you a listmaster warning, as you have observed. There is an important line there. Wookey -- Principal hats: Linaro, Debian, Wookware, ARM http://wookware.org/ signature.asc Description: PGP signature
Re: Debconf20 will be in...
On 2019-03-21 00:00 +0100, W. Martin Borgert wrote: > On 2019-03-20 21:44, Wookey wrote: > > but cannot be reached in a low-carbon way from the UK SFAICT (no > > trains, no ferries), > > I plan to go by train and ferry. AFAIK, it's possible to go by > train to Ancona, Italy, then ferry to Piraeus, Greece, a short > bus trip to Lavrio, Greece, finally other ferry to Haifa. OK. I did only take a quick look at seat61.com, (https://www.seat61.com/Israel.htm) which is generally gospel, and it said: Ferries to Israel: There are none. Poseidon Lines & Salamis Lines (Greece-Cyprus-Israel) suspended since 2001. UK agent www.viamare.com If that's wrong/out of date, then fair enough - I'll consider joining you, although the political dimension remains 'problematic', at best. There obviously exists a minimum emissions route, but it's still 4-5000km each way for me, however one does it. Wookey -- Principal hats: Linaro, Debian, Wookware, ARM http://wookware.org/ signature.asc Description: PGP signature
Re: Debconf20 will be in...
On 2019-03-20 12:42 -0300, Paulo Henrique de Lima Santana wrote: > > > > But with 9 DDs in India and 500 or so in Europe the location is > > important. DebConf is not only for outreach. It is primarily the Debian > > Developers' conference. And yes, we definitely need more DDs from India. > > And from everywhere else, too. > > If you use numbers of DDs, we will always have DC in Europe :-) True, and there is clearly a balance to be struck between encouraging debian in new areas and optimising travel for existing developers. After 5 years when debconf could only be attended with intercontinental travel by European developers, I'm very happy with a presumption towards Europe next. The state of the climate is such that it's increasingly difficult to justify 2-4 tonnes of emissions just to visit debconf, so I've missed/am missing the last 4. Israel is somewhat closer (0.9 tonne), but cannot be reached in a low-carbon way from the UK SFAICT (no trains, no ferries), never mind the fact that I'd be very unconfortable visiting the place because of the oppression, so I guess that'll make it 5, which is really quite a long time. One thing we could do is take remote attendance more seriously so there was less need to travel thousands of miles. Conferences need to go this way, at least until fuel production is decarbonised, unless we wish to just pretend there is no climate emergency. I'm very happy to help the debconf organisers with that, as a regular remote conference attendee user, and some experience of different tech. We were well ahead of the trend in videoing all talks+questions effectively. I think we should see what we can do to use technology to make effective remote interaction work. Currently there is too much lag on outgoing video (~30seconds?) and no incoming video/audio, so it's pretty-much broadcast-only. > My question is not about DC21 to go or not to go to Europe, but you say > ***now*** that you would like to have it in Europe. > Lets wait to see the bids first. Of course, but a not-europe bid would need to be pretty compelling, and/or we need to make the remote experience a great deal more useful. I must admit, I would have been a _lot_ happier if we'd picked Portugal for 2020, then India in 2021 would not be at all contentious. Israel is a disappointing plan on more than one level. Wookey -- Principal hats: Linaro, Debian, Wookware, ARM http://wookware.org/ signature.asc Description: PGP signature
Re: ♥ Consensus & temperature settings (Re: warmer hacklabs)
On 2018-07-25 22:49 +0800, Thomas Kuiper wrote: > btw I never turn off aircons at night... recooling those walls next day would > take more energy. Physics suggests that this is extremely unlikely to be true, unless there is something very non-linear about the cooling system. Wookey -- Principal hats: Linaro, Debian, Wookware, ARM http://wookware.org/ signature.asc Description: PGP signature
