Re: [d-i] language selection bad for non English speakers
Samuel Henrique, le sam. 02 mars 2019 12:17:51 +, a ecrit: > > The paging feature was requested so that one can review the > > choices with the speakup reviewing facilities, but it seems > > that for now it brings more harm than good, > > > I don't think I understand the motivation behind the pagination, I don't get > what "can review the > choices with the speakup reviewing facilities" exactly means and its benefit. The speakup screen reader allows to read around in the screen. Instead of waiting for the whole screen to be spoken, you can quickly look through line by line, not waiting for the whole line to be spoken before starting hearing the next line. > Thank you for that, I will forward that to the person who reported it. > Is there something that we can fix it on stable? After testing in Buster, yes. > > The upstream report is > > [1]https://github.com/espeak-ng/espeak-ng/issues/150 , it would probably be > > useful to hint there that we'd like that to be fixed. > > Since the original bug report (linked on the github issue) has almost 5 years > now, I don't have hopes that it will be fixed soon. Indeed. Samuel
Re: [d-i] language selection bad for non English speakers
Hello, > The problem was that right at the start there is a screen to choose the > > language of the installation process and the system installed, with a > list of > > 29 languages, and then the following: > > "Next choices are available with '+' ". > > Actually the "+" is not getting pronounced (see bug #690343) so that > it's really not obvious with speech how to get the subsequent choices. > Oh, I didn't notice that, I thought user was just having problems English understanding. > The paging feature was requested so that one can review the > choices with the speakup reviewing facilities, but it seems > that for now it brings more harm than good, I don't think I understand the motivation behind the pagination, I don't get what "can review the choices with the speakup reviewing facilities" exactly means and its benefit. > so I have disabled > it for now, until #690343 gets fixed. Thank you for that, I will forward that to the person who reported it. Is there something that we can fix it on stable? I ask this because the user had this problem with the 9.8 ISO, and so I think we should change that on stable, otherwise it will still be a problem for the majority of our users, right? > The upstream report is > https://github.com/espeak-ng/espeak-ng/issues/150 , it would probably be > useful to hint there that we'd like that to be fixed. > Since the original bug report (linked on the github issue) has almost 5 years now, I don't have hopes that it will be fixed soon. Thanks, -- Samuel Henrique
Re: [d-i] language selection bad for non English speakers
Hello, Samuel Henrique, le mer. 27 févr. 2019 00:58:04 +, a ecrit: > The problem was that right at the start there is a screen to choose the > language of the installation process and the system installed, with a list of > 29 languages, and then the following: > "Next choices are available with '+' ". Actually the "+" is not getting pronounced (see bug #690343) so that it's really not obvious with speech how to get the subsequent choices. The paging feature was requested so that one can review the choices with the speakup reviewing facilities, but it seems that for now it brings more harm than good, so I have disabled it for now, until #690343 gets fixed. The upstream report is https://github.com/espeak-ng/espeak-ng/issues/150 , it would probably be useful to hint there that we'd like that to be fixed. Samuel
Re: [d-i] language selection bad for non English speakers
On 2/27/19, Cindy-Sue Causey wrote: > On 2/26/19, Samuel Henrique wrote: >> Hello, >> >> I'm just passing along feedback that I received from a Brazilian user who >> could not install Debian using speech synthesis, he was using the latest >> stable ISO (but this should be happening for sometime now). >> >> The problem was that right at the start there is a screen to choose the >> language of the installation process and the system installed, with a >> list >> of 29 languages, and then the following: >> "Next choices are available with '+' ". >> >> He didn't understand the last part and thought there was no Portuguese >> support, as the languages are sorted alphabetically and the 29th one is >> Lithuanian. >> >> Now, my main goal here is to report this so we can have a datapoint. I'm >> not sure about the fixes though as I'm not experienced in accessibility, >> but I would be happy if there was a way to solve this. >> >> The first quickest and dirtiest solution that I see is to just list all >> of >> the languages at once, without paginating it, and thus requiring the user >> to only understand the English translation o the numbers. > > > Would... having something say "M - Z" or "M to Z" (or even both, > perhaps with one in parentheses) along with the '+' help any? > > Just thinking out loud... after pondering for a few seconds. This is a > toughy. You'd have to find something universally translatable for > those very seconds in Time... before Users get in the door to the > language they speak and understand. Additionally.. For it to make sense, it would help if the first page somehow referenced "A - L" or maybe "A - Li" at the top of the list. That would help hint that the rest of the alphabet can be expected to appear further on down... Cindy :) -- Cindy-Sue Causey Talking Rock, Pickens County, Georgia, USA * runs with birdseed *
Re: [d-i] language selection bad for non English speakers
On 2/26/19, Samuel Henrique wrote: > Hello, > > I'm just passing along feedback that I received from a Brazilian user who > could not install Debian using speech synthesis, he was using the latest > stable ISO (but this should be happening for sometime now). > > The problem was that right at the start there is a screen to choose the > language of the installation process and the system installed, with a list > of 29 languages, and then the following: > "Next choices are available with '+' ". > > He didn't understand the last part and thought there was no Portuguese > support, as the languages are sorted alphabetically and the 29th one is > Lithuanian. > > Now, my main goal here is to report this so we can have a datapoint. I'm > not sure about the fixes though as I'm not experienced in accessibility, > but I would be happy if there was a way to solve this. > > The first quickest and dirtiest solution that I see is to just list all of > the languages at once, without paginating it, and thus requiring the user > to only understand the English translation o the numbers. Would... having something say "M - Z" or "M to Z" (or even both, perhaps with one in parentheses) along with the '+' help any? Just thinking out loud... after pondering for a few seconds. This is a toughy. You'd have to find something universally translatable for those very seconds in Time... before Users get in the door to the language they speak and understand. Cindy :) -- Cindy-Sue Causey Talking Rock, Pickens County, Georgia, USA * runs with birdseed *
[d-i] language selection bad for non English speakers
Hello, I'm just passing along feedback that I received from a Brazilian user who could not install Debian using speech synthesis, he was using the latest stable ISO (but this should be happening for sometime now). The problem was that right at the start there is a screen to choose the language of the installation process and the system installed, with a list of 29 languages, and then the following: "Next choices are available with '+' ". He didn't understand the last part and thought there was no Portuguese support, as the languages are sorted alphabetically and the 29th one is Lithuanian. Now, my main goal here is to report this so we can have a datapoint. I'm not sure about the fixes though as I'm not experienced in accessibility, but I would be happy if there was a way to solve this. The first quickest and dirtiest solution that I see is to just list all of the languages at once, without paginating it, and thus requiring the user to only understand the English translation o the numbers. Regards, -- Samuel Henrique
