Re: [RFC] Possibility for a beta release in Febuary
On Wednesday 16 January 2008, Otavio Salvador wrote: Felipe Augusto van de Wiel (faw) [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Should we add anything special for D-I Guide/Manual? I think it's not need. Don't you think it would be nice to have a version of the installation guide in testing and on the CDs that matches the version of the installer you're releasing? So yes, I definitely _do_ think there should be a string freeze and call for translations for the manual as well, and an upload timed so that it can reach testing before CD images are built. signature.asc Description: This is a digitally signed message part.
Re: [RFC] Possibility for a beta release in Febuary
Otavio Salvador wrote: For testing migration we also need the aglomeration packages to be uploaded. Daniel, when do you plan to upload them? sorry for the late answer.. the modules should be all ready, except the lme part needs an update from waldi. hoping to upload rsn. -- Address:Daniel Baumann, Burgunderstrasse 3, CH-4562 Biberist Email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Internet: http://people.panthera-systems.net/~daniel-baumann/ -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [RFC] Possibility for a beta release in Febuary
Christian Perrier [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: And, anyway, given that your changes mostly add a feature rather than modify an existing one and that we had no report about it to be broken. Given also that *you* are well known for good testing, I'd vote for activation. Second that too. Please Frans, let's enable them. -- O T A V I OS A L V A D O R - E-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] UIN: 5906116 GNU/Linux User: 239058 GPG ID: 49A5F855 Home Page: http://otavio.ossystems.com.br - Microsoft sells you Windows ... Linux gives you the whole house. -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [RFC] Possibility for a beta release in Febuary
On Wednesday 16 January 2008, Otavio Salvador wrote: Christian Perrier [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: And, anyway, given that your changes mostly add a feature rather than modify an existing one and that we had no report about it to be broken. Given also that *you* are well known for good testing, I'd vote for activation. Second that too. Please Frans, let's enable them. I was already working on it. Committed now (with an extra bunch of new strings just to annoy Christian). signature.asc Description: This is a digitally signed message part.
Re: [RFC] Possibility for a beta release in Febuary
Quoting Otavio Salvador ([EMAIL PROTECTED]): I have personally not done string freezes for Beta releases, basically because that is all it is and there is just no necessity to have translations at 100%. That said, I doubt it matters very much as it's not all that likely there will be any string changes. I would not let it complicate the planning though. Ack. I talked to Christian when I started to think about it and he suggested a freeze. No objetion from me to drop this step and add it for beta2. Christian, since translator aren't so active and we hadn't so many changes lately, what you think about dropping it for this, and maybe beta2 too? I would still appreciate a soft string freeze which could start immediately to avoid clutteing the planning too much. soft string freeze, in my opinion, just means please ask before changing strings and discuss the changes before they're applied, that's all. Note that apt-setup currently has some strings that are not yet marked as translatable and that some further string changes will be needed in apt-setup. Not sure if that should be done before or after the Beta. Right. As you've spot above, we might relax it for the beta and keep it working. If it gets too near for release, we can keep the other changes (string changes) to after the Beta. We should then activate these strings ASAP. Actually, we should have activated them a while ago signature.asc Description: Digital signature
Re: [RFC] Possibility for a beta release in Febuary
On Monday 14 January 2008, Christian Perrier wrote: Note that apt-setup currently has some strings that are not yet marked as translatable and that some further string changes will be needed in apt-setup. Not sure if that should be done before or after the Beta. Right. As you've spot above, we might relax it for the beta and keep it working. If it gets too near for release, we can keep the other changes (string changes) to after the Beta. We should then activate these strings ASAP. Actually, we should have activated them a while ago It was delayed because I could not upload apt-setup. I still think they should only be activated after some more people have actually tried installing from multiple CDs and we know they are OK. So: please test! signature.asc Description: This is a digitally signed message part.
Re: [RFC] Possibility for a beta release in Febuary
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 On 11-01-2008 10:33, Otavio Salvador wrote: [...] ,[ Proposed timeline for beta1 release ] | Starts at: 2/1/2007 | | DateWhat happens | 2/1/2007string freeze starts | 2/11/2007 mass upload of translation updates | 2/11/2007 kernel, modules and their udebs hitted testing | 2/12/2007 mass migration of udebs | 2/13/2007 debian-installer is uploaded | 2/15/2007 daily images are changed to use lenny installer | 2/17/2007 test of images starts | 2/23/2007 final image builds | 2/25/2007 release | Releases at:2/25/2007 | Needed days:24 ` [...] I'd like to know about what other members think about it? Should we add anything special for D-I Guide/Manual? Kind regards, - -- Felipe Augusto van de Wiel (faw) Debian. Freedom to code. Code to freedom! -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- Version: GnuPG v1.4.6 (GNU/Linux) Comment: Using GnuPG with Mozilla - http://enigmail.mozdev.org iD8DBQFHjUSvCjAO0JDlykYRAswvAKC0gDxU9n9zGOCA4JUvMgi0zBO6SACgrs5/ 8/A6KxqHtD2QNy0A+brcpBY= =tIKw -END PGP SIGNATURE- -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [RFC] Possibility for a beta release in Febuary
Felipe Augusto van de Wiel (faw) [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: On 11-01-2008 10:33, Otavio Salvador wrote: [...] ,[ Proposed timeline for beta1 release ] | Starts at: 2/1/2007 | | Date What happens | 2/1/2007 string freeze starts | 2/11/2007 mass upload of translation updates | 2/11/2007 kernel, modules and their udebs hitted testing | 2/12/2007 mass migration of udebs | 2/13/2007 debian-installer is uploaded | 2/15/2007 daily images are changed to use lenny installer | 2/17/2007 test of images starts | 2/23/2007 final image builds | 2/25/2007 release | Releases at: 2/25/2007 | Needed days: 24 ` [...] I'd like to know about what other members think about it? Should we add anything special for D-I Guide/Manual? I think it's not need. I'll update the timeline and also finish to prepare few things and then propose a new one ... so we can probably announce it. But I've didn't get what could be added to Guide/Manual about it. -- O T A V I OS A L V A D O R - E-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] UIN: 5906116 GNU/Linux User: 239058 GPG ID: 49A5F855 Home Page: http://otavio.ossystems.com.br - Microsoft sells you Windows ... Linux gives you the whole house. -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [RFC] Possibility for a beta release in Febuary
Quoting Frans Pop ([EMAIL PROTECTED]): It was delayed because I could not upload apt-setup. I still think they should only be activated after some more people have actually tried installing from multiple CDs and we know they are OK. So: please test! Frankly, given the pretty low level of participation I've seen in -boot in recent months, I somehow doubt that many will do the tests you suggest. And, anyway, given that your changes mostly add a feature rather than modify an existing one and that we had no report about it to be broken. Given also that *you* are well known for good testing, I'd vote for activation. OK, we're warned: there could be changes to strings. So, I won't whine about them, promise made..:-)... As two strings were just added to partman-target to deal with funky choices by the users (good idea, btw), such as mounting /bin on a separate FSI think this is the perfect tim to activate the new strings in apt-setup. -- signature.asc Description: Digital signature
Re: [RFC] Possibility for a beta release in Febuary
Sven Luther [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: On Sat, Jan 12, 2008 at 06:00:14PM -0200, Otavio Salvador wrote: Sven Luther [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: On Fri, Jan 11, 2008 at 10:33:10AM -0200, Otavio Salvador wrote: -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 Hello folks, I'm starting to get more free time to be able to work on Debian again and I'd like to discuss the possibility of we release a beta1 in late Fabuary. Will that one have an upgraded kernel (probably a 2.6.24 one) at least as an option, as was originally planned ? Not decided yet but probably not. It'll depends of kernel aglomeration packages be ready and then we can think about it, but not before. BTW, the 2.6.24 kernel will boot on the efika without any patches, and i have only a very minimal config file modification to enable 2.6.24 kernel to boot on the efika. No new image created or anything. I'd suggest you to report a bug with that change so we can get it discussed/commited ASAP. The only missing patch is the one for module sound support, but we could eventually build this one as external module. Not idea, but hey. I think it should be send upstream so Debian Kernel team can backport it later. -- O T A V I OS A L V A D O R - E-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] UIN: 5906116 GNU/Linux User: 239058 GPG ID: 49A5F855 Home Page: http://otavio.ossystems.com.br - Microsoft sells you Windows ... Linux gives you the whole house. -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [RFC] Possibility for a beta release in Febuary
Frans Pop [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Below are a lot of comments intended to help make this schedule work, not as criticisms. Thanks! Let's work! On Friday 11 January 2008, Otavio Salvador wrote: Bellow goes the proposed timeline. It is a bit hard to really comment on this timeline as it does not really contain any info on the work do be done to make it happen. It is really just a bare timeline. I do know one thing: if you wait until Feb 1 to actually start working on the release, the schedule is not going to be possible. I'd expect an overrun of at least 2 weeks, but more likely a month or more. Basically, the schedule itself is fine, but to make it actally work, you have to start _now_. Yes. A lot of things to be done. I know it. I just don't think we're too far from a beta release, in overwall quality of installer. | Date What happens | 2/1/2007 string freeze starts I have personally not done string freezes for Beta releases, basically because that is all it is and there is just no necessity to have translations at 100%. That said, I doubt it matters very much as it's not all that likely there will be any string changes. I would not let it complicate the planning though. Ack. I talked to Christian when I started to think about it and he suggested a freeze. No objetion from me to drop this step and add it for beta2. Christian, since translator aren't so active and we hadn't so many changes lately, what you think about dropping it for this, and maybe beta2 too? ... Note that apt-setup currently has some strings that are not yet marked as translatable and that some further string changes will be needed in apt-setup. Not sure if that should be done before or after the Beta. Right. As you've spot above, we might relax it for the beta and keep it working. If it gets too near for release, we can keep the other changes (string changes) to after the Beta. ... | 2/11/2007 kernel, modules and their udebs hitted testing 2.6.23 is quite old already. In fact, 2.6.24 is very close to release. I would suggest contacting the kernel team to see when they think a migration to testing would be possible (I don't see any real blockers ATM, except for the meta packages) and to make the switch to 2.6.23 ASAP for D-I if a migration to testing soon looks possible. Yes. I've pondering about it too. For testing migration we also need the aglomeration packages to be uploaded. Daniel, when do you plan to upload them? | 2/12/2007 mass migration of udebs This is where this release is most at risk. You really should start migrating _now_, especially for non-D-I udebs! The reason is that a quite a few packages are badly out of sync [2] and that needs to be fixed before you can release. You should also start now to reduce the risk of udebs being caught in transitions at the moment when you would like to migrate them. [3] is HUGE at the moment and you really need to get that reduced as much as possible. Simple udebs that we control ourselves and that don't have difficult dependencies can be done at this date. Anything else should be done ASAP. Ack. I'll prepare a list for all udebs that can migrate and start checking each one today. Note that Jeroen has mostly done udeb migrations in the past, but I don't know if he's available (haven't seen him much recently). If not, that could be an additional challenge. You should also inform the RMs at some point that all unblocks for udebs will need explicit D-I RM approval again. My idea is to inform them after 01/21/2007. I was planning to check pending changes on svn and upload all possible ones (and ask involved people to handle the most critical ones) before doing it. ... | 2/17/2007 test of images starts | 2/23/2007 final image builds | 2/25/2007 release You should probably already start preparing the list of changes for the release mail. Even though it may not seem that way, there have been a _lot_ of changes that deserve to be mentioned. I've created a wiki page[1] to we all start to collect those information and start to prepare the announcement draft. 1. http://wiki.debian.org/DebianInstaller/ReleaseAnnounce -- O T A V I OS A L V A D O R - E-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] UIN: 5906116 GNU/Linux User: 239058 GPG ID: 49A5F855 Home Page: http://otavio.ossystems.com.br - Microsoft sells you Windows ... Linux gives you the whole house. -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [RFC] Possibility for a beta release in Febuary
Sven Luther [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: On Fri, Jan 11, 2008 at 10:33:10AM -0200, Otavio Salvador wrote: -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 Hello folks, I'm starting to get more free time to be able to work on Debian again and I'd like to discuss the possibility of we release a beta1 in late Fabuary. Will that one have an upgraded kernel (probably a 2.6.24 one) at least as an option, as was originally planned ? Not decided yet but probably not. It'll depends of kernel aglomeration packages be ready and then we can think about it, but not before. -- O T A V I OS A L V A D O R - E-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] UIN: 5906116 GNU/Linux User: 239058 GPG ID: 49A5F855 Home Page: http://otavio.ossystems.com.br - Microsoft sells you Windows ... Linux gives you the whole house. -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [RFC] Possibility for a beta release in Febuary
Below are a lot of comments intended to help make this schedule work, not as criticisms. On Friday 11 January 2008, Otavio Salvador wrote: Bellow goes the proposed timeline. It is a bit hard to really comment on this timeline as it does not really contain any info on the work do be done to make it happen. It is really just a bare timeline. I do know one thing: if you wait until Feb 1 to actually start working on the release, the schedule is not going to be possible. I'd expect an overrun of at least 2 weeks, but more likely a month or more. Basically, the schedule itself is fine, but to make it actally work, you have to start _now_. | DateWhat happens | 2/1/2007string freeze starts I have personally not done string freezes for Beta releases, basically because that is all it is and there is just no necessity to have translations at 100%. That said, I doubt it matters very much as it's not all that likely there will be any string changes. I would not let it complicate the planning though. What _does_ need to be done is to announce the schedule on the d-i18n list [1] so that translators are aware a release is in preparation so that they can update their translations if they want to. Maybe Christian will want to coordinate that. Note that apt-setup currently has some strings that are not yet marked as translatable and that some further string changes will be needed in apt-setup. Not sure if that should be done before or after the Beta. | 2/11/2007 mass upload of translation updates That is definitely a good idea, although I have ignored minor translation changes for Beta releases. 100% upload is really not needed, 90-95% is more than good enough. | 2/11/2007 kernel, modules and their udebs hitted testing 2.6.23 is quite old already. In fact, 2.6.24 is very close to release. I would suggest contacting the kernel team to see when they think a migration to testing would be possible (I don't see any real blockers ATM, except for the meta packages) and to make the switch to 2.6.23 ASAP for D-I if a migration to testing soon looks possible. | 2/12/2007 mass migration of udebs This is where this release is most at risk. You really should start migrating _now_, especially for non-D-I udebs! The reason is that a quite a few packages are badly out of sync [2] and that needs to be fixed before you can release. You should also start now to reduce the risk of udebs being caught in transitions at the moment when you would like to migrate them. [3] is HUGE at the moment and you really need to get that reduced as much as possible. Simple udebs that we control ourselves and that don't have difficult dependencies can be done at this date. Anything else should be done ASAP. Note that Jeroen has mostly done udeb migrations in the past, but I don't know if he's available (haven't seen him much recently). If not, that could be an additional challenge. You should also inform the RMs at some point that all unblocks for udebs will need explicit D-I RM approval again. | 2/13/2007 debian-installer is uploaded | 2/15/2007 daily images are changed to use lenny installer This is about netinst/businesscard CDs. Note that this is basically only asking Steve to change a symlink. There is another change that needs to be made this time: builds for weekly CD images will need to be switched from using daily D-I images and sid udebs to using lenny images and udebs. | 2/17/2007 test of images starts | 2/23/2007 final image builds | 2/25/2007 release You should probably already start preparing the list of changes for the release mail. Even though it may not seem that way, there have been a _lot_ of changes that deserve to be mentioned. Cheers, FJP [1] For example: http://lists.debian.org/debian-i18n/2006/06/msg00187.html [2] http://ftp-master.debian.org/~jeroen/d-i.out [3] http://merkel.debian.org/~joeyh/d-i/testing-summary.html signature.asc Description: This is a digitally signed message part.
Re: [RFC] Possibility for a beta release in Febuary
On Sunday 13 January 2008, Frans Pop wrote: | 2/12/2007 mass migration of udebs You should also inform the RMs at some point that all unblocks for udebs will need explicit D-I RM approval again. You may also need to coordinate or at least keep an eye on some packages that are not strictly D-I. For example: tasksel (2.70) will break desktop installs if it migrates before xserver-xorg (1:7.3+10). And as xorg is much more likely to be caught up in a transition than tasksel is... signature.asc Description: This is a digitally signed message part.
