Bug#273323: doc-debian: please ship typesettable version of social contract and dfsg documents
Hi, Thanks for participating in this discussion. I guess the way forward is to ship a /usr/share/doc/doc-debian/README file with instructions on the various ways as posted here on how to get typesettable versions. (Or anybody has better ideas?) Anyway, I'll try to get to that. (As always: patches welcome :) Bye, Joost PS: and on my todo list is shipping the Debian flyers as a Debian package, in order to improve discoverability of https://debian.pages.debian.net/debian-flyers/ and https://salsa.debian.org/debian/debian-flyers .
Bug#273323: doc-debian: please ship typesettable version of social contract and dfsg documents
On Fri, Sep 10, 2021 at 09:05:34AM +0200, Gerardo Ballabio wrote: > Diederik de Haas wrote: > > But then the question becomes: what is the authoritative version? > > Was the Social Contract approved by a General Resolution? > > If so, then the authoritative version is the text that appeared in the > GR ballot. Aha. Good point. As far as I know, here it is: https://lists.debian.org/debian-vote/2004/04/msg00038.html signature.asc Description: PGP signature
Bug#273323: doc-debian: please ship typesettable version of social contract and dfsg documents
Diederik de Haas wrote: > But then the question becomes: what is the authoritative version? Was the Social Contract approved by a General Resolution? If so, then the authoritative version is the text that appeared in the GR ballot. Gerardo
Bug#273323: doc-debian: please ship typesettable version of social contract and dfsg documents
On donderdag 9 september 2021 05:56:17 CEST Paul Wise wrote: > On Wed, Sep 8, 2021 at 1:11 PM Diederik de Haas wrote: > > But then the question becomes: what is the authoritative version? > > The other copies of it (in doc-debian and the doc directory of the > Debian apt archive) are all copied/built from the version on the > website. Thank you. Until you pointed out otherwise, I assumed the .txt version was the original/ authoritative version. > > Given that, is it wise to have the WML version as the > > authoritative one? > > At some point the website may switch from WML to something else but it > will be a lot of work to achieve. I should've made it explicit in my previous mail that I solely meant the Social Contract and didn't mean/intend to suggest the whole website should be in a different format. Cheers, Diederik signature.asc Description: This is a digitally signed message part.
Bug#273323: doc-debian: please ship typesettable version of social contract and dfsg documents
On Wed, Sep 8, 2021 at 1:11 PM Diederik de Haas wrote: > But then the question becomes: what is the authoritative version? The other copies of it (in doc-debian and the doc directory of the Debian apt archive) are all copied/built from the version on the website. https://salsa.debian.org/ddp-team/doc-debian/blob/master/doc-debian/debian/README.source https://salsa.debian.org/ddp-team/doc-debian/blob/master/doc-debian/doc/social-contract.wml https://deb.debian.org/debian/doc/ > Given that, is it wise to have the WML version as the > authoritative one? At some point the website may switch from WML to something else but it will be a lot of work to achieve. > Pandoc supports various input formats, but I didn't see WML. You could convert to HTML and use that as Pandoc input. -- bye, pabs https://wiki.debian.org/PaulWise
Bug#273323: doc-debian: please ship typesettable version of social contract and dfsg documents
On woensdag 8 september 2021 09:22:11 CEST Gard Spreemann wrote: > there should perhaps be an authoritative version of the text, > from which PDF, whatever-printable, HTML, etc. can be generated I think that's a good idea. But then the question becomes: what is the authoritative version? I get the impression that https://www.debian.org/social_contract is (often?) seen as *the* version. But that page is generated from https://salsa.debian.org/webmaster-team/webwml/-/blob/master/english/social_contract.wml The homepage for wml according to the wml package is https://www.shlomifish.org/open-source/projects/website-meta-language/ which mentions "which is an old offline preprocessor for HTML and XHTML which is sophisticated but quirky and slow" and the linked GitHub repo has the following in its about section: "An old offline HTML preprocessor (which can be used for static site generation), written in Perl and C that is still maintained for legacy reasons, but probably not recommended for new sites." Given that, is it wise to have the WML version as the authoritative one? Pandoc supports various input formats, but I didn't see WML. It does support DocBook and Joost did provide a patch which contains a DocBook version of the Social Contract (converted from the WML version btw) OTOH, it feels like I'm WAY overthinking this ;-P Cheers, Diederik signature.asc Description: This is a digitally signed message part.
Bug#273323: doc-debian: please ship typesettable version of social contract and dfsg documents
Diederik de Haas writes: > I only looked at the pdf and it's a very nice start, thanks! > > […] Thanks for the feedback. Daniel Lange's email made me think that there should perhaps be an authoritative version of the text, from which PDF, whatever-printable, HTML, etc. can be generated (using for example pandoc)? -- Gard signature.asc Description: PGP signature
Bug#273323: doc-debian: please ship typesettable version of social contract and dfsg documents
On dinsdag 7 september 2021 14:58:59 CEST Elena ``of Valhalla'' Grandi wrote: > On 2021-09-06 at 22:58:54 +0200, Diederik de Haas wrote: > > I wanted to print the Debian Social Contract, which turned out to be WAY > > more difficult then I expected and then it should be. > > [...] > > Then I went looking for a PDF version and didn't find anything. > > There is a PDF version in the Debian Flyers website: > https://debian.pages.debian.net/debian-flyers/ > > only English, French and Italian are currently available, but the > sources used to generate that PDF are on > https://salsa.debian.org/debian/debian-flyers > > would this be useful? > > (I agree that making this easier to discover would be a good idea) That looks nice! So yes, that is useful :-) I wasn't aware of that site before, so discoverability can and should be improved. Cheers, Diederik signature.asc Description: This is a digitally signed message part.
Bug#273323: doc-debian: please ship typesettable version of social contract and dfsg documents
On 2021-09-06 at 22:58:54 +0200, Diederik de Haas wrote: > I wanted to print the Debian Social Contract, which turned out to be WAY > more difficult then I expected and then it should be. > [...] > Then I went looking for a PDF version and didn't find anything. There is a PDF version in the Debian Flyers website: https://debian.pages.debian.net/debian-flyers/ only English, French and Italian are currently available, but the sources used to generate that PDF are on https://salsa.debian.org/debian/debian-flyers would this be useful? (I agree that making this easier to discover would be a good idea) -- Elena ``of Valhalla'' signature.asc Description: PGP signature
Bug#273323: doc-debian: please ship typesettable version of social contract and dfsg documents
On dinsdag 7 september 2021 11:26:15 CEST Gard Spreemann wrote: > Diederik de Haas writes: > > I wanted to print the Debian Social Contract, which turned out to be WAY > > more difficult then I expected and then it should be. > > ... > > Are any of these helpful? I'm happy to do more iterations – perhaps > using LuaLaTeX and better fonts? This is so far just rushed lunch-work: > > https://nonempty.org/~gspr/social.tex > > https://nonempty.org/~gspr/social.pdf I only looked at the pdf and it's a very nice start, thanks! Couple of remarks, all in my opinion of course: - I don't know if there is or should be different versions based on paper size (A4 vs US Letter). - I like to have a header which is repeated on all pages and a footer which says "Page X of Y", so you know those (currently 3) pages belong together and know the sequence and how large it is in total. In my LO Writer attempt, I had "Debian Social Contract" on the first page as header and "Debian Free Software Guidelines (DFSG)" on second, but I squeezed things to fit in those 2 pages. Probably not worth aiming for. *If* there is an official location for the Social Contract, like https://www.debian.org/social_contract then I'd like to have that in the page header or footer as well. - it's not in f.e. the web page, but I'd suggest the "Supersedes Version 1.0 ..." on a new line. This prevent the case where '1997' is on a line on it's own. It's all in 1 line on my printed version, but I decreased margins. (Whether version history should be part of the document itself is a separate matter, so I'll leave that aside) - the header "Debian will remain 100% free"* (f.e.) should be on its own line and I prefer it to be in "bold" or something like that to visually make a distinction between the header and the text. - ideally an item of the Social Contract should fully on 1 page. The amount of white space on especially the first page is quite high and if that gets reduced, item 4 should fit on the first page as well. The amount of white space at the bottom of the pages seems rather high as well. It doesn't bug me, but if you want/need some extra lines to put text in, you could squeeze some from that. But not too much as some printers may then run into issues ;-) It's possibly hard to realize this in a general case, but I assume doable for this specific document. - the last part after "Example Licenses" is formatted differently on the website from the rest of the Social Contract and that seems correct. The first paragraph gives some history. The 2nd shows a link between The Open Source Definition and the Social Contract. The 3rd looks like a kind of license? (without making it explicit; but also outside the scope of this bug) Cheers, Diederik *) when copying from the pdf the spaces around '100%' vanished, resulting in 'remain100%free' signature.asc Description: This is a digitally signed message part.
Bug#273323: doc-debian: please ship typesettable version of social contract and dfsg documents
Diederik de Haas writes: > I wanted to print the Debian Social Contract, which turned out to be WAY > more difficult then I expected and then it should be. > > So I went to https://www.debian.org/social_contract and wanted to print > that. Apparently there isn't a print stylesheet for it, so if you print > that, you also get 'Blog', 'Micronews', 'Planet' and a search box. > Of course I didn't mind the Debian logo. > The last page (of the print preview) shows that it's available in a whole > bunch of languages, which is good, but undesirable for a print version. > And then you get a bunch of links, also undesirable for a print version. > > Then I went looking for a PDF version and didn't find anything. > > I did find a 'social-contract.txt.gz' (why compressed?), but that's > missing any form of nice formatting (that the webpage does have). > I did try 'zcat ' and editing that in > LibreOffice Writer, but apparently I've lost my skills in office > programs, so I bailed on that. Are any of these helpful? I'm happy to do more iterations – perhaps using LuaLaTeX and better fonts? This is so far just rushed lunch-work: https://nonempty.org/~gspr/social.tex https://nonempty.org/~gspr/social.pdf -- Gard signature.asc Description: PGP signature
Bug#273323: doc-debian: please ship typesettable version of social contract and dfsg documents
Package: doc-debian Version: 6.5 Followup-For: Bug #273323 X-Debbugs-Cc: debian-proj...@lists.debian.org -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA256 I wanted to print the Debian Social Contract, which turned out to be WAY more difficult then I expected and then it should be. So I went to https://www.debian.org/social_contract and wanted to print that. Apparently there isn't a print stylesheet for it, so if you print that, you also get 'Blog', 'Micronews', 'Planet' and a search box. Of course I didn't mind the Debian logo. The last page (of the print preview) shows that it's available in a whole bunch of languages, which is good, but undesirable for a print version. And then you get a bunch of links, also undesirable for a print version. Then I went looking for a PDF version and didn't find anything. I did find a 'social-contract.txt.gz' (why compressed?), but that's missing any form of nice formatting (that the webpage does have). I did try 'zcat ' and editing that in LibreOffice Writer, but apparently I've lost my skills in office programs, so I bailed on that. I ended up using a Firefox addon (Print Edit WE) to strip all the things I didn't need. That still didn't give me an option to have - - 1 page with the Social Contract and - - 1 page with the Debian Free Software Guidelines (I also lost the Debian logo, but that may be a PEBKAC issue) It doesn't have to be a 2 page document, but that seems kind of nice. It really shouldn't be this hard to print the most essential document of the Debian Project. It was surprising (and a bit disappointing) that there isn't a nicely formatted printable document/PDF available. So hereby my +1 to getting this bug fixed. Cheers, Diederik - -- System Information: Debian Release: bookworm/sid APT prefers unstable-debug APT policy: (500, 'unstable-debug'), (500, 'testing-debug'), (500, 'unstable'), (500, 'testing'), (101, 'experimental'), (1, 'experimental-debug') Architecture: amd64 (x86_64) Foreign Architectures: arm64 Kernel: Linux 5.10.0-8-amd64 (SMP w/16 CPU threads) Locale: LANG=en_US.UTF-8, LC_CTYPE=en_US.UTF-8 (charmap=UTF-8), LANGUAGE=en_US Shell: /bin/sh linked to /bin/dash Init: systemd (via /run/systemd/system) LSM: AppArmor: enabled doc-debian depends on no packages. Versions of packages doc-debian recommends: ii debian-faq 10.1 Versions of packages doc-debian suggests: ii firefox [www-browser] 88.0.1-1 ii firefox-esr [www-browser] 78.13.0esr-1 ii ghostscript [postscript-viewer] 9.53.3~dfsg-7+b1 ii konqueror [www-browser] 4:21.08.0-1 ii okular [postscript-viewer] 4:21.08.0-1 ii qpdfview-ps-plugin [postscript-viewer] 0.4.18-5 ii qutebrowser [www-browser] 2.3.1-1 ii w3m [www-browser] 0.5.3+git20210102-6 - -- no debconf information -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- iHUEARYIAB0WIQT1sUPBYsyGmi4usy/XblvOeH7bbgUCYTaBAwAKCRDXblvOeH7b bt67AP9BUY8KDSj0YMWMbwkBQS8SVcvR19de+lz6FPQX/HHnVgD8Dhffl9+ikEZn ob3WraENDf4xMZTMSqGJf0kB8X+8YQU= =v0jd -END PGP SIGNATURE-
