Bug#377011: dhcp3-server: include option to avoid starting the server on install
_ http://redirect.gimas.net/?n=M0906xIE8_MSN4 Internet Explorer 8 jetzt für MSN - kostenlos! -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-bugs-dist-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org
Bug#377011: dhcp3-server: include option to avoid starting the server on install
Hi folks, On Mon, Jan 14, 2008 at 11:55:51AM -0500, Eloy Paris wrote: [Adding Steve Langasek to his discussion since I know he can provide valuable technical advise here.] On Mon, Jan 14, 2008 at 12:41:21AM +0100, Toni Mueller wrote: On Mon, 14.01.2008 at 06:56:40 +1000, Andrew Pollock [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Well I think that goes against the general behaviour of Debian packages that are servers. The general logic seems to be that if you want a server package installed, you want it running. I think you'll find that most servers are started in the postinst. I beg to disagree. Many daemons already have such things in their default scripts. A quick sample on one of my computers show these packages to have something like a start switch in their default script: 4ss, amule, apache2, avahi-daemon, bittorrent, bluetooth, cfengine2, cryptdisks, dbus, distcc, exim4, fetchmail, firehol, libzvbi0, lighttpd, mdadm, nfs-common, oidentd, partimaged, pound, rrdcollect, rsync, setkey, smartmontools, snmpd, uml-utilities. This may be not a complete survey, but it shows that having such a facility is far from being uncommon. Sadly, yes, it's far from being uncommon; but it's really a crude workaround for the lack of a user-friendly interface for manipulating runlevel policies in Debian (by manipulating the /etc/rcX.d links; probably not using policy-rc.d, since sysvinit itself doesn't use invoke-rc.d when changing runlevels). Personally, I fear that the more of these /etc/default/foo options are added, the less likely it is that we'll ever get sane runlevel editing. I believe the current accepted way to prevent services/daemons/servers from starting at boot time is to manipulate the /etc/rcX.d links. I've seen some packages remove /etc/default/package support recently. I do agree that people may not want to run a server even if they have the server package installed. However, having the init script source /etc/default/package is not the correct way to go. Yes, quite agreed. What I personally do to prevent servers from starting at boot time is something along the lines of: # cd /etc/rc2.d # move S20samba K20samba # cd /etc/rc3.d # move S20samba K20samba etc. After doing this any future invocations of invoke-rc.d will not mess with my preferences. Right. My recommendation is that we close this bug since adding logic to the init script to not start based on configuration in /etc/default/package is not the way to go based on what I am seeing. FWIW, the Technical Committee recently ruled on this precise question on another package; this is bug #412976, which I see we never fully closed out on the TC side since the bug wasn't formally assigned to us (whee, we're so good), but at any rate the voting record can be found at http://lists.debian.org/debian-ctte/2007/12/msg00026.html ff. and was a 4:1 vote upholding the maintainer's decision not to implement a start flag in /etc/default/$package. That said, if any of you felt this was an important itch to scratch, I would love to see someone lead discussion on and implement a sane front-end to the rc.d symlink handling so we could solve this once for all packages. Cheers, -- Steve Langasek Give me a lever long enough and a Free OS Debian Developer to set it on, and I can move the world. Ubuntu Developerhttp://www.debian.org/ [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Bug#377011: dhcp3-server: include option to avoid starting the server on install
[Adding Steve Langasek to his discussion since I know he can provide valuable technical advise here.] Hi Toni, Andrew, On Mon, Jan 14, 2008 at 12:41:21AM +0100, Toni Mueller wrote: On Mon, 14.01.2008 at 06:56:40 +1000, Andrew Pollock [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Well I think that goes against the general behaviour of Debian packages that are servers. The general logic seems to be that if you want a server package installed, you want it running. I think you'll find that most servers are started in the postinst. I beg to disagree. Many daemons already have such things in their default scripts. A quick sample on one of my computers show these packages to have something like a start switch in their default script: 4ss, amule, apache2, avahi-daemon, bittorrent, bluetooth, cfengine2, cryptdisks, dbus, distcc, exim4, fetchmail, firehol, libzvbi0, lighttpd, mdadm, nfs-common, oidentd, partimaged, pound, rrdcollect, rsync, setkey, smartmontools, snmpd, uml-utilities. This may be not a complete survey, but it shows that having such a facility is far from being uncommon. I think the correct way to achieve what you're asking for is via a policy script for invoke-rc.d -v, please? I believe the current accepted way to prevent services/daemons/servers from starting at boot time is to manipulate the /etc/rcX.d links. I've seen some packages remove /etc/default/package support recently. I do agree that people may not want to run a server even if they have the server package installed. However, having the init script source /etc/default/package is not the correct way to go. What I personally do to prevent servers from starting at boot time is something along the lines of: # cd /etc/rc2.d # move S20samba K20samba # cd /etc/rc3.d # move S20samba K20samba etc. After doing this any future invocations of invoke-rc.d will not mess with my preferences. The invoke-rc.d policy that Andrew mentioned probably accomplishes the same in a more intelligent way but I have never played with it. You should be able to figure it out by reading invoke-rc.d's man page. My recommendation is that we close this bug since adding logic to the init script to not start based on configuration in /etc/default/package is not the way to go based on what I am seeing. Do we have agreement? Cheers, Eloy.- -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Bug#377011: dhcp3-server: include option to avoid starting the server on install
tags 377011 + wontfix thanks On Mon, Jan 14, 2008 at 12:41:21AM +0100, Toni Mueller wrote: Hi Andrew, On Mon, 14.01.2008 at 06:56:40 +1000, Andrew Pollock [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Well I think that goes against the general behaviour of Debian packages that are servers. The general logic seems to be that if you want a server package installed, you want it running. I think you'll find that most servers are started in the postinst. I beg to disagree. Many daemons already have such things in their default scripts. A quick sample on one of my computers show these packages to have something like a start switch in their default script: 4ss, amule, apache2, avahi-daemon, bittorrent, bluetooth, cfengine2, cryptdisks, dbus, distcc, exim4, fetchmail, firehol, libzvbi0, lighttpd, mdadm, nfs-common, oidentd, partimaged, pound, rrdcollect, rsync, setkey, smartmontools, snmpd, uml-utilities. This may be not a complete survey, but it shows that having such a facility is far from being uncommon. I think the correct way to achieve what you're asking for is via a policy script for invoke-rc.d -v, please? man invoke-rc.d Here's a quick example of how you can get what you want without having to touch anything else: Put this in /usr/sbin/policy-rc.d: ===BEGIN EXAMPLE=== #!/bin/sh case $1 in dhcp3-server) exit 101 ;; esac ===END EXAMPLE=== You can extend this for other daemons you don't wish to have started. I will continue with making the postinst script not bother trying to start the server if the /etc/dhcp3/dhcpd.conf is the one that shipped in the package, as there isn't a lot of point in doing so. regards Andrew signature.asc Description: Digital signature
Bug#377011: dhcp3-server: include option to avoid starting the server on install
On Sat, Jan 12, 2008 at 11:36:47AM +0100, Toni Mueller wrote: Hi Andrew, On Sat, 12.01.2008 at 06:08:23 +1000, Andrew Pollock [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Would refusing the start if the md5sum/sha1sum of /etc/dhcp3/dhcpd.conf was the same as the one shipped in the package be too outlandish? I think that this would not solve the problem because I also want to not start the server in some other cases. By having an option in /etc/default/dhcp3-server, you also shift the blame to the individual administrator w/o jumping through obscure hoops with checksums and whatnot. Well I think that goes against the general behaviour of Debian packages that are servers. The general logic seems to be that if you want a server package installed, you want it running. I think you'll find that most servers are started in the postinst. I think the correct way to achieve what you're asking for is via a policy script for invoke-rc.d regards Andrew signature.asc Description: Digital signature
Bug#377011: dhcp3-server: include option to avoid starting the server on install
Hi Andrew, On Mon, 14.01.2008 at 06:56:40 +1000, Andrew Pollock [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Well I think that goes against the general behaviour of Debian packages that are servers. The general logic seems to be that if you want a server package installed, you want it running. I think you'll find that most servers are started in the postinst. I beg to disagree. Many daemons already have such things in their default scripts. A quick sample on one of my computers show these packages to have something like a start switch in their default script: 4ss, amule, apache2, avahi-daemon, bittorrent, bluetooth, cfengine2, cryptdisks, dbus, distcc, exim4, fetchmail, firehol, libzvbi0, lighttpd, mdadm, nfs-common, oidentd, partimaged, pound, rrdcollect, rsync, setkey, smartmontools, snmpd, uml-utilities. This may be not a complete survey, but it shows that having such a facility is far from being uncommon. I think the correct way to achieve what you're asking for is via a policy script for invoke-rc.d -v, please? Best, --Toni++ -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Bug#377011: dhcp3-server: include option to avoid starting the server on install
Hi Andrew, On Sat, 12.01.2008 at 06:08:23 +1000, Andrew Pollock [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Would refusing the start if the md5sum/sha1sum of /etc/dhcp3/dhcpd.conf was the same as the one shipped in the package be too outlandish? I think that this would not solve the problem because I also want to not start the server in some other cases. By having an option in /etc/default/dhcp3-server, you also shift the blame to the individual administrator w/o jumping through obscure hoops with checksums and whatnot. Kind Regards, --Toni++ -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Bug#377011: dhcp3-server: include option to avoid starting the server on install
On Tue, Jun 06, 2006 at 01:36:43PM +0200, Toni Mueller wrote: Package: dhcp3-server Version: 3.0.4-2 Severity: wishlist Hello, I'd like to have an option, preferably in debconf, to avoid starting the DHCP server after installation, which is usually before configuration. Other methods of implementation that spring to my mind are perusing /etc/defaults/dhcp3-server, a lock file in /etc/dhcp3, or installing the default server config file with an extension '.dist' and check if a real config file exists in the init.d script, before actually starting the daemon. Would refusing the start if the md5sum/sha1sum of /etc/dhcp3/dhcpd.conf was the same as the one shipped in the package be too outlandish? regards Andrew signature.asc Description: Digital signature
Bug#377011: dhcp3-server: include option to avoid starting the server on install
Package: dhcp3-server Version: 3.0.4-2 Severity: wishlist Hello, I'd like to have an option, preferably in debconf, to avoid starting the DHCP server after installation, which is usually before configuration. Other methods of implementation that spring to my mind are perusing /etc/defaults/dhcp3-server, a lock file in /etc/dhcp3, or installing the default server config file with an extension '.dist' and check if a real config file exists in the init.d script, before actually starting the daemon. Best, --Toni++ -- System Information: Debian Release: testing/unstable APT prefers unstable APT policy: (500, 'unstable') Architecture: i386 (i686) Shell: /bin/sh linked to /bin/bash Kernel: Linux 2.4.27-2-686-smp Locale: LANG=C, LC_CTYPE=C (charmap=ANSI_X3.4-1968) Versions of packages dhcp3-server depends on: ii debconf [debconf-2.0] 1.4.72 Debian configuration management sy ii debianutils 2.15.4 Miscellaneous utilities specific t ii dhcp3-common 3.0.4-2Common files used by all the dhcp3 ii libc6 2.3.6-6GNU C Library: Shared libraries dhcp3-server recommends no packages. -- debconf information: * dhcp3-server/new_auth_behavior: dhcp3-server/interfaces: dhcp3-server/new_next-server_behaviour: dhcp3-server/config_warn: -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
