Bug#555743: source package descriptions: subtsvars are not enough
On Tue, Mar 02, 2010 at 11:05:14AM +0100, Raphael Hertzog wrote:
It would be nice to have support for a Description field in the source
stanza of debian/control.
So, beside a few notable exceptions, the thread has a bit drifted to a
set of appreciations on the idea of using substvars to factorize out
common parts of package descriptions. I agree it is a nice idea, but it
is not something we need specific support for (unless I'm missing some
glitch we can use it right now) and has several shortcomings:
- Most importantly: it does not solve the infrastructure problem,
i.e. it does not encode properly the source package description so
that it becomes part of package _metadata_. This means that all
infrastructure parts (the PTS, DDPO, UDD, potentially the BTS) are
still at square 0: they don't know where to find a source package
description.
IOW: it is a cool hack for package maintainers, but it is a hack that
gets resolved at package build time and then vanishes.
- It is not standardized: substvars are set via custom commands in
debian/rules and there are thousands ways of setting them. When
opening a random source package, one would not know where exactly to
look for the common part of source package description. Nor an
automated tool can extract it.
To fix that, it seems to me that the most reasonable solution advanced
in the thread is to add a proper Description field to source package
stanzas. Then, in addition, we can setup an automatic substvar, whose
content is the source description, that can then be used in package
description stanzas to interpolate the source description.
The obvious drawback is that Sources file will increase in size. Given
that the size will be small compared to Packages file, I personally
don't see it as a showstopper.
The appreciation that translators expressed wrt factorizing out text
from binary package description still applies to this proposal.
Cheers.
--
Stefano Zacchiroli -o- PhD in Computer Science \ PostDoc @ Univ. Paris 7
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Bug#555743: source package descriptions: subtsvars are not enough
On Wed, 10 Mar 2010, Stefano Zacchiroli wrote: - It is not standardized: substvars are set via custom commands in debian/rules and there are thousands ways of setting them. When opening a random source package, one would not know where exactly to look for the common part of source package description. Nor an automated tool can extract it. You completely misparsed my answer/suggestion. My suggestion is to follow your advice, add a Description field in the source part of debian/control, let it flow in the .dsc and Sources _AND_ modify dpkg-gencontrol so that you can use new default substitution variables to reuse the source description elsewhere. There would be no need for any custom command in debian/rules. To fix that, it seems to me that the most reasonable solution advanced in the thread is to add a proper Description field to source package stanzas. Then, in addition, we can setup an automatic substvar, whose content is the source description, that can then be used in package description stanzas to interpolate the source description. That's precisely what I have been suggesting. Cheers, -- Raphaël Hertzog Like what I do? Sponsor me: http://ouaza.com/wp/2010/01/05/5-years-of-freexian/ My Debian goals: http://ouaza.com/wp/2010/01/09/debian-related-goals-for-2010/ -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-bugs-dist-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org
Bug#555743: source package descriptions: subtsvars are not enough
On Wed, Mar 10, 2010 at 01:58:21PM +0100, Raphael Hertzog wrote:
You completely misparsed my answer/suggestion. My suggestion is to follow
Sorry for not having been clear: I did not misunderstood your
suggestion, in fact ...
To fix that, it seems to me that the most reasonable solution advanced
in the thread is to add a proper Description field to source package
... the implicit subject here is you, I took your suggestion as the most
reasonable one (and yes, I should have made the subject explicit). If
everybody else on the thread is on the same line ... even better :-)
So, do we have a roadmap of what should be changed so that we can keep
track of this?
Cheers.
--
Stefano Zacchiroli -o- PhD in Computer Science \ PostDoc @ Univ. Paris 7
z...@{upsilon.cc,pps.jussieu.fr,debian.org} -- http://upsilon.cc/zack/
Dietro un grande uomo c'è ..| . |. Et ne m'en veux pas si je te tutoie
sempre uno zaino ...| ..: | Je dis tu à tous ceux que j'aime
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Bug#555743: source package descriptions: subtsvars are not enough
Hello, 2010/3/10 Stefano Zacchiroli z...@debian.org: The obvious drawback is that Sources file will increase in size. Given that the size will be small compared to Packages file, I personally don't see it as a showstopper. Would Packages file size decrease applying your suggestion? Is there any chance to use this change to shrink Packages file size? Regards, -- Héctor Orón -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-bugs-dist-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org
Bug#555743: source package descriptions: subtsvars are not enough
On Wed, Mar 10, 2010 at 02:31:10PM +0100, Hector Oron wrote:
Would Packages file size decrease applying your suggestion?
Is there any chance to use this change to shrink Packages file size?
No, this proposal is completely orthogonal to that (and IMO should
remain so): we're talking about changing source package metadata which
do not belong to Packages and are not necessarily downloaded by users.
Cheers.
--
Stefano Zacchiroli -o- PhD in Computer Science \ PostDoc @ Univ. Paris 7
z...@{upsilon.cc,pps.jussieu.fr,debian.org} -- http://upsilon.cc/zack/
Dietro un grande uomo c'è ..| . |. Et ne m'en veux pas si je te tutoie
sempre uno zaino ...| ..: | Je dis tu à tous ceux que j'aime
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Bug#555743: source package descriptions: subtsvars are not enough
[Stefano Zacchiroli] To fix that, it seems to me that the most reasonable solution advanced in the thread is to add a proper Description field to source package stanzas. Then, in addition, we can setup an automatic substvar, whose content is the source description, that can then be used in package description stanzas to interpolate the source description. Yes, I think pretty much everyone agrees that this would be the most reasonable approach. I wonder if, in addition (or perhaps instead of the above), it is useful to have a substvar for just the _first paragraph_ of the source Description. What I'm thinking about is a short blurb you want to copy into all your binary packages, but perhaps there is _more_ information you also want to put in the source Description, which it wouldn't be useful to copy everywhere. In particular, I do think a single paragraph should always be sufficient for copying into a binary Description. We don't want those things to get too long! The question then is, might it be useful to have a longer description in the source package? I do not know. Perhaps this additional information always belongs instead in the diff.tar.gz somewhere, like debian/source.README. -- Peter Samuelson | org-tld!p12n!peter | http://p12n.org/ -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-bugs-dist-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org
