Bug#914915: mmdebstrap: Please make it possible to bootstrap w/ or w/o merged /usr
On Lu, 13 sep 21, 12:00:19, Johannes Schauer Marin Rodrigues wrote: > Hi, > > I'm removing Guillem from CC. I don't think his input is relevant here and I > am > quite certain that this topic just makes his day worse. Ok. > Quoting Andrei POPESCU (2021-09-13 11:50:04) > > In the meantime it appears the project wide decision is to go for the /usr > > merged via symlinks approach and the debootstrap default was changed, so > > this > > report is relevant again. > > > > Please at least provide the means for mmdebstrap users to create a > > merged-via-symlinks /usr layout, even if you consider the default should > > stay > > as it is. > > you have the following options to create a merged-/usr-via-symlinks chroot > using mmdebstrap: > > a) completely manually: > > --setup-hook='for d in bin sbin lib; do ln -s usr/$d "$1/$d"; mkdir -p > "$1/usr/$d"; done' My first instinct would have been to do the `mkdir` before `ln`, but I'm guessing it doesn't really matter ;) > b) using the debootstrap method: > > --setup-hook=/usr/share/mmdebstrap/hooks/setup00-merged-usr.sh > > the path will change in the next upload and then the following will work: > > --setup-hook=/usr/share/mmdebstrap/hooks/merged-usr/setup00.sh > > or: > > --hook-dir=/usr/share/mmdebstrap/hooks/merged-usr Ok. > c) using the usrmerge package: > > --include=usrmerge Well, I'm using mmdebstrap (or debootstrap) also to avoid installing too many package, but it's good to have this option documented. > The next upload of mmdebstrap will document all of this. I'm just waiting for > the resolution of #993946 before I do the next upload. Sure. Kind regards, Andrei -- http://wiki.debian.org/FAQsFromDebianUser signature.asc Description: PGP signature
Bug#914915: mmdebstrap: Please make it possible to bootstrap w/ or w/o merged /usr
Control: reopen -1 ! [the BTS doesn't accept mail to archived bugs, apologies for the noise] On Vi, 07 dec 18, 00:25:46, Johannes Schauer wrote: > On Wed, 28 Nov 2018 16:45:27 +0100 Guillem Jover wrote: > > This package defaults to bootstrapping a Debian system with the > > hackish merged /usr via symlinks, but it provides no way to disable > > that. It would be nice if it had an option to select either mode > > explicitly, say some --[no-]whatever option. > > When I started writing mmdebstrap, one of my major motivations was to provide > a > tool that uses as little magic as possible and instead relies on the > information from the packages themselves for everything. That's also why the > force-script-chrootless mode is so high on my priority list for mmdebstrap. > Thus I think it would be best to not enable/disable merged /usr by using > command line arguments (mmdebstrap tries to use only very few of those) but > instead by selecting which packages to install -- that is assuming that Debian > will not switch to merged /usr by default. This brings me to another point: > right now it seems that building source packages in a merged /usr environment > is able to create buggy packages that don't work on a non-merged system. > Additionally, there seems to be no consensus about the why, how and when of > merged /usr yet. Lastly I only added merged /usr by default because it was the > default of debootstrap at the time when I implemented the code. > > Given all these arguments, I just disabled merged /usr completely in this > commit: > > https://gitlab.mister-muffin.de/josch/mmdebstrap/commit/97d273aaf6ada19f496ba75d907ee64b0a75 > > This seems to be a sensible default for now because it doesn't taint source > packages built within and it's also the current default of Debian testing and > debootstrap. > > Since this bug is about allowing to choose whether one wants a system with or > without merged /usr I will leave this bug report open until a project wide > decision about it has been made. Hello, In the meantime it appears the project wide decision is to go for the /usr merged via symlinks approach and the debootstrap default was changed, so this report is relevant again. Please at least provide the means for mmdebstrap users to create a merged-via-symlinks /usr layout, even if you consider the default should stay as it is. Thank you, Andrei -- http://wiki.debian.org/FAQsFromDebianUser signature.asc Description: PGP signature
Bug#914915: mmdebstrap: Please make it possible to bootstrap w/ or w/o merged /usr
Hi, I'm removing Guillem from CC. I don't think his input is relevant here and I am quite certain that this topic just makes his day worse. Quoting Andrei POPESCU (2021-09-13 11:50:04) > In the meantime it appears the project wide decision is to go for the /usr > merged via symlinks approach and the debootstrap default was changed, so this > report is relevant again. > > Please at least provide the means for mmdebstrap users to create a > merged-via-symlinks /usr layout, even if you consider the default should stay > as it is. you have the following options to create a merged-/usr-via-symlinks chroot using mmdebstrap: a) completely manually: --setup-hook='for d in bin sbin lib; do ln -s usr/$d "$1/$d"; mkdir -p "$1/usr/$d"; done' b) using the debootstrap method: --setup-hook=/usr/share/mmdebstrap/hooks/setup00-merged-usr.sh the path will change in the next upload and then the following will work: --setup-hook=/usr/share/mmdebstrap/hooks/merged-usr/setup00.sh or: --hook-dir=/usr/share/mmdebstrap/hooks/merged-usr c) using the usrmerge package: --include=usrmerge The next upload of mmdebstrap will document all of this. I'm just waiting for the resolution of #993946 before I do the next upload. Thanks! cheers, josch signature.asc Description: signature
Bug#914915: mmdebstrap: Please make it possible to bootstrap w/ or w/o merged /usr
Hi! On Fri, 2018-12-07 at 00:25:46 +0100, Johannes Schauer wrote: > On Wed, 28 Nov 2018 16:45:27 +0100 Guillem Jover wrote: > > This package defaults to bootstrapping a Debian system with the > > hackish merged /usr via symlinks, but it provides no way to disable > > that. It would be nice if it had an option to select either mode > > explicitly, say some --[no-]whatever option. > > When I started writing mmdebstrap, one of my major motivations was to provide > a > tool that uses as little magic as possible and instead relies on the > information from the packages themselves for everything. That's also why the > force-script-chrootless mode is so high on my priority list for mmdebstrap. > Thus I think it would be best to not enable/disable merged /usr by using > command line arguments (mmdebstrap tries to use only very few of those) but > instead by selecting which packages to install -- that is assuming that Debian > will not switch to merged /usr by default. This brings me to another point: > right now it seems that building source packages in a merged /usr environment > is able to create buggy packages that don't work on a non-merged system. > Additionally, there seems to be no consensus about the why, how and when of > merged /usr yet. Lastly I only added merged /usr by default because it was the > default of debootstrap at the time when I implemented the code. > > Given all these arguments, I just disabled merged /usr completely in this > commit: > > https://gitlab.mister-muffin.de/josch/mmdebstrap/commit/97d273aaf6ada19f496ba75d907ee64b0a75 Perfect, thanks! > This seems to be a sensible default for now because it doesn't taint source > packages built within and it's also the current default of Debian testing and > debootstrap. Right, I find defaulting to merged-/usr-via-symlinks to be a terrible default, because it's an irreversible process that is done w/o collaboration from at least dpkg, and the user can always install the usrmerge hack at any point in time. (I need to send a longer mail to d-d, but meh.) > Since this bug is about allowing to choose whether one wants a system with or > without merged /usr I will leave this bug report open until a project wide > decision about it has been made. Well, from my side, I find this outcome fully satisfactory, because as mentioned above, the user can always install the usrmerge hack. So, I'd say you could just close it with any upload including that change. [ I was initially considering to file another report, to request disabling this by default, but my energy on this subject had already been fully drained. :( ] Thanks, Guillem
Bug#914915: mmdebstrap: Please make it possible to bootstrap w/ or w/o merged /usr
On Wed, 28 Nov 2018 16:45:27 +0100 Guillem Jover wrote: > This package defaults to bootstrapping a Debian system with the > hackish merged /usr via symlinks, but it provides no way to disable > that. It would be nice if it had an option to select either mode > explicitly, say some --[no-]whatever option. When I started writing mmdebstrap, one of my major motivations was to provide a tool that uses as little magic as possible and instead relies on the information from the packages themselves for everything. That's also why the force-script-chrootless mode is so high on my priority list for mmdebstrap. Thus I think it would be best to not enable/disable merged /usr by using command line arguments (mmdebstrap tries to use only very few of those) but instead by selecting which packages to install -- that is assuming that Debian will not switch to merged /usr by default. This brings me to another point: right now it seems that building source packages in a merged /usr environment is able to create buggy packages that don't work on a non-merged system. Additionally, there seems to be no consensus about the why, how and when of merged /usr yet. Lastly I only added merged /usr by default because it was the default of debootstrap at the time when I implemented the code. Given all these arguments, I just disabled merged /usr completely in this commit: https://gitlab.mister-muffin.de/josch/mmdebstrap/commit/97d273aaf6ada19f496ba75d907ee64b0a75 This seems to be a sensible default for now because it doesn't taint source packages built within and it's also the current default of Debian testing and debootstrap. Since this bug is about allowing to choose whether one wants a system with or without merged /usr I will leave this bug report open until a project wide decision about it has been made. Thanks! cheers, josch signature.asc Description: signature
Bug#914915: mmdebstrap: Please make it possible to bootstrap w/ or w/o merged /usr
Package: mmdebstrap Version: 0.3.0-10 Severity: important Hi! This package defaults to bootstrapping a Debian system with the hackish merged /usr via symlinks, but it provides no way to disable that. It would be nice if it had an option to select either mode explicitly, say some --[no-]whatever option. Thanks, Guillem
