Re: Debian Installer 7.0 Beta1 release
On Mon, 2012-08-06 at 12:36 +0200, Julien Cristau wrote: On Mon, Aug 6, 2012 at 10:45:31 +0100, Sam Morris wrote: IIRC I built mesa with 3.0. I'll take a look at the patches. I also just realised that I didn't run the X server with LD_LIBRARY_PATH set... is that a problem, or is it just the clients that need the llvmpipe libGL.so.1? Sorry for the dumb question, but my understanding of how all the different bits of mesa/dri fit together is rather poor... Should be enough to run the session with LIBGL_ALWAYS_SOFTWARE=1. Cheers, Julien I've now had some time to test this out. Currently gnome-shell is not usable with llvmpipe: 1. The screen flickers when switching between applications, or when entering/leaving overview mode. The flickering is between the correct screen contents and a copy of the old screen contents. For instance, while typing this message I go into overview mode. I then click on Evolution's composer window, and the composer comes to the front. However, after the animation finishes, only the composer's text entry area is visible; the rest of the screen still displays the overview mode. The other applications are still present, however, as clicking where I know the windows are placed causes them to flicker to the foreground. The applications themselves seem functional, but it'such impossible to actually use them. This behaviour does not show up if I use gnome-shell's screen recording feature to make a movie. I took a grainy movie with my phone however; you can see it at http://youtu.be/synr-avC0WA. 2. There is a small but noticeable delay between an event occurring (e.g., pressing a key on the keyboard, or moving the mouse) and the screen being updated. Worse, the delay is variable (hold down a key while gedit has the focus and characters appear at an uneven rate). This may be another aspect of whatever is causing the first issue. 3. The mouse pointer continually warps to the top-left corner of the screen, triggering the overview mode at random. This is a bug in the evdev input driver, filed as http://bugs.debian.org/688860. I can try building mesa with LLVM 3.1, and/or try some of the patches at http://pkgs.fedoraproject.org/cgit/mesa.git/tree/?h=f17 or http://pkgs.fedoraproject.org/cgit/mesa.git/tree/?h=f18 if you think they will help. Regards, -- Sam Morris s...@robots.org.uk -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-devel-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/1348674100.7012.13.ca...@leela.office.red-redemption.com
Re: Debian Installer 7.0 Beta1 release
On Sun, Aug 5, 2012 at 12:54:16 +, Sam Morris wrote: I figured it out. The instructions at http://www.mesa3d.org/ llvmpipe.html seem to work. I had some difficulty getting LD_LIBRARY_PATH to stick, however... setting it from a script in /etc/X11/ Xsession.d doesn't work as it's reset by the time I log in. Eventually I logged in to a virtual console, set the variable, fired up X by hand and ran gnome-shell. The result is very buggy. I don't know if that's because mesa 8.0.4 (or one of its build dependencies) is too old, or whether something is being built wrong. A few things I can think of: - f17 seems to build against llvm 3.0, we use 2.9 - there's a few patches in http://pkgs.fedoraproject.org/cgit/mesa.git/tree/?h=f17 if updating llvm isn't enough. I'd be interested in the results. Cheers, Julien signature.asc Description: Digital signature
Re: Debian Installer 7.0 Beta1 release
On Mon, 2012-08-06 at 10:26 +0200, Julien Cristau wrote: On Sun, Aug 5, 2012 at 12:54:16 +, Sam Morris wrote: I figured it out. The instructions at http://www.mesa3d.org/ llvmpipe.html seem to work. I had some difficulty getting LD_LIBRARY_PATH to stick, however... setting it from a script in /etc/X11/ Xsession.d doesn't work as it's reset by the time I log in. Eventually I logged in to a virtual console, set the variable, fired up X by hand and ran gnome-shell. The result is very buggy. I don't know if that's because mesa 8.0.4 (or one of its build dependencies) is too old, or whether something is being built wrong. A few things I can think of: - f17 seems to build against llvm 3.0, we use 2.9 - there's a few patches in http://pkgs.fedoraproject.org/cgit/mesa.git/tree/?h=f17 if updating llvm isn't enough. I'd be interested in the results. Cheers, Julien IIRC I built mesa with 3.0. I'll take a look at the patches. I also just realised that I didn't run the X server with LD_LIBRARY_PATH set... is that a problem, or is it just the clients that need the llvmpipe libGL.so.1? Sorry for the dumb question, but my understanding of how all the different bits of mesa/dri fit together is rather poor... -- Sam Morris s...@robots.org.uk -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-devel-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/1344246331.175519.2.ca...@leela.office.red-redemption.com
Re: Debian Installer 7.0 Beta1 release
On Mon, Aug 6, 2012 at 10:45:31 +0100, Sam Morris wrote: IIRC I built mesa with 3.0. I'll take a look at the patches. I also just realised that I didn't run the X server with LD_LIBRARY_PATH set... is that a problem, or is it just the clients that need the llvmpipe libGL.so.1? Sorry for the dumb question, but my understanding of how all the different bits of mesa/dri fit together is rather poor... Should be enough to run the session with LIBGL_ALWAYS_SOFTWARE=1. Cheers, Julien signature.asc Description: Digital signature
tasksel is everybody's business (was: Re: Debian Installer 7.0 Beta1 release)
Quoting Ben Hutchings (b...@decadent.org.uk): I believe joeysel now selects Xfce as the default desktop. ^^^ I think this is a bit unfair. OK, Joey's change from GNOME to XFCE hasn't really been discussed, admitedly, and there is room for some debate. But, please notice that 99,9% of the development cycle, nobody cares about tasksel and what ends up in default installs. And basically, 2-3 people take care of tasksel. Then, when the release is coming, we see plenty of good souls with plenty of advices about how the default Debian install should look like. So, it's kinda hard to imply, as I have read here or there in the recent days, since Joey did his very provocative change, that tasksel is a one man's job with someone taking his own decisions without any discussion. No offense intended at you, BenI'm just reacting to your pun joke. I wish all this (and the current hard time Cyril had in releasing D-I) makes everybody aware of the very very bad shape of the D-I team nowadays. signature.asc Description: Digital signature
Re: Debian Installer 7.0 Beta1 release
[ mail-followup-to: -publicity ] On Sat, Aug 04, 2012 at 12:03:49PM +0200, Cyril Brulebois wrote: The Debian Installer team is pleased to announce the first beta release of the installer for Debian 7.0 Wheezy. Great! Feedback for this release = We need your help to find bugs and further improve the installer, so please try it. Installer CDs, other media and everything else you will need are available at our web site. Given that we're targeting users with this kind of request for help, it'd be wise to also send out a press release / -news item, because we get to a larger user public via those channels. Dear press/publicity team, is any kind soul available to draft a press release to that end? (everybody is willing to help joining -publicity, of course!) Cheers. PS yes, I've seen that this beta release is a draft item for the next DPN issue, but a dedicated press release is still warranted, imho -- Stefano Zacchiroli . . . . . . . z...@upsilon.cc . . . . o . . . o . o Maître de conférences . . . . . http://upsilon.cc/zack . . . o . . . o o Debian Project Leader . . . . . . @zack on identi.ca . . o o o . . . o . « the first rule of tautology club is the first rule of tautology club » signature.asc Description: Digital signature
Re: Debian Installer 7.0 Beta1 release
Le samedi 04 août 2012 à 20:41 +0200, Cyril Brulebois a écrit : If one enabled “3D acceleration” in the VM config, Gnome 3 shows up in normal mode; if one didn't, it shows up in fallback mode (one can see Gallium llvmpipe as graphic driver in the gnome system properties, instead of Chromium). BTW if you think llvmpipe is ready in squeeze, we can add it to the whitelist too. -- .''`. Josselin Mouette : :' : `. `' `- -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-devel-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/1344155875.4874.9.camel@tomoe
Re: Debian Installer 7.0 Beta1 release
Le dimanche 05 août 2012 à 10:37 +0200, Josselin Mouette a écrit : BTW if you think llvmpipe is ready in squeeze, we can add it to the whitelist too. I mean in wheezy of course. -- .''`. Josselin Mouette : :' : `. `' `- -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-devel-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/1344155979.4874.10.camel@tomoe
Re: Debian Installer 7.0 Beta1 release
Ben Hutchings b...@decadent.org.uk (05/08/2012): On Sat, 2012-08-04 at 23:45 +0200, Bernd Zeimetz wrote: So we require 3d acceleration for a default install? I think what you'll see without it is a one-time warning. I could be wrong since I haven't done a fresh installation yet. That is correct: one-time warning only. For those who care, or would want to avoid this for the first login of their numerous users, that seems to be happening on the gnome-session side [gnome-session/gsm-manager.c:possibly_show_fallback_dialog()], and stored in dconf: [org/gnome/gnome-session] show-fallback-warning=false So the “false” value can be “preseeded” this way: dconf write /org/gnome/gnome-session/show-fallback-warning false Mraw, KiBi. signature.asc Description: Digital signature
Re: Debian Installer 7.0 Beta1 release
Josselin Mouette j...@debian.org (05/08/2012): Le dimanche 05 août 2012 à 10:37 +0200, Josselin Mouette a écrit : BTW if you think llvmpipe is ready in squeeze, we can add it to the whitelist too. I mean in wheezy of course. From a one-minute test within virtualbox w/o 3D acceleration, and with llvmpipe taken out of the blacklist, I don't think this is a good idea. (Glitches/flickering everywhere…) Mraw, KiBi. signature.asc Description: Digital signature
Re: Debian Installer 7.0 Beta1 release
On Sat, 04 Aug 2012 20:16:32 +0200, Josselin Mouette wrote: Le samedi 04 août 2012 à 18:28 +0100, Ben Hutchings a écrit : This is expected in the absence of 3D acceleration, which is not yet supported in qemu so far as I know. VirtualBox is supposed to support it, but a standard installation presumably won't pull in the necessary paravirtual drivers in the guest. At least with squeeze, this used to work, so I don’t see why it wouldn’t anymore. However I don’t know whether the vbox paravirtualized drivers are whitelisted in gnome-session-check-accelerated. The string Chromium is not listed in /usr/share/gnome-session/hardware- compatibility, so the VirtualBox guest additions are neither white nor blacklisted. However, in my experience, gnome-shell 3.4 is unusable on VirtualBox. I filed a bug with the details at https://www.virtualbox.org/ ticket/9581. In case it matters, I use Debian on two desktops, both inside VirtualBox VMs running on top of Windows 7 x64. Both systems have ATI graphics cards (one a Radeon HD 4980, and the other a Radeon HD 5850). OTOH, the software rendering in both the Fedora 17 and GNOME 3.4 Live CDs works perfectly inside VirtualBox (well, at least for a few minutes of testing). In both cases the renderer is reported as Gallium 0.4 on llvmpipe (LLVM 0x300). However, these Live CDs do not include the VirtualBox guest additions, and I have no idea how to enable Gallium on Debian, so I can't test on my regular VM that has VirtualBox's regular 2d acceleration set up. If someone can point me in the right direction then I'll test it right now! -- Sam -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-devel-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/pan.2012.08.05.10.58...@robots.org.uk
Re: Debian Installer 7.0 Beta1 release
On Sun, 05 Aug 2012 10:58:24 +, Sam Morris wrote: On Sat, 04 Aug 2012 20:16:32 +0200, Josselin Mouette wrote: Le samedi 04 août 2012 à 18:28 +0100, Ben Hutchings a écrit : This is expected in the absence of 3D acceleration, which is not yet supported in qemu so far as I know. VirtualBox is supposed to support it, but a standard installation presumably won't pull in the necessary paravirtual drivers in the guest. At least with squeeze, this used to work, so I don’t see why it wouldn’t anymore. However I don’t know whether the vbox paravirtualized drivers are whitelisted in gnome-session-check-accelerated. The string Chromium is not listed in /usr/share/gnome-session/hardware- compatibility, so the VirtualBox guest additions are neither white nor blacklisted. However, in my experience, gnome-shell 3.4 is unusable on VirtualBox. I filed a bug with the details at https://www.virtualbox.org/ ticket/9581. In case it matters, I use Debian on two desktops, both inside VirtualBox VMs running on top of Windows 7 x64. Both systems have ATI graphics cards (one a Radeon HD 4980, and the other a Radeon HD 5850). OTOH, the software rendering in both the Fedora 17 and GNOME 3.4 Live CDs works perfectly inside VirtualBox (well, at least for a few minutes of testing). In both cases the renderer is reported as Gallium 0.4 on llvmpipe (LLVM 0x300). However, these Live CDs do not include the VirtualBox guest additions, and I have no idea how to enable Gallium on Debian, so I can't test on my regular VM that has VirtualBox's regular 2d acceleration set up. If someone can point me in the right direction then I'll test it right now! I figured it out. The instructions at http://www.mesa3d.org/ llvmpipe.html seem to work. I had some difficulty getting LD_LIBRARY_PATH to stick, however... setting it from a script in /etc/X11/ Xsession.d doesn't work as it's reset by the time I log in. Eventually I logged in to a virtual console, set the variable, fired up X by hand and ran gnome-shell. The result is very buggy. I don't know if that's because mesa 8.0.4 (or one of its build dependencies) is too old, or whether something is being built wrong. -- Sam -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-devel-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/pan.2012.08.05.12.54...@robots.org.uk
Re: Debian Installer 7.0 Beta1 release
On Sat, 4 Aug 2012 20:41:31 +0200 Cyril Brulebois k...@debian.org wrote: A virtualbox host environment would be detected automatically, and the following packages would get installed in that case: virtualbox-guest-dkms virtualbox-guest-utils virtualbox-guest-x11 virtualbox-ose-guest-x11 $ dpkg-query -W virtualbox-guest-dkms virtualbox-guest-utils virtualbox-guest-x11 virtualbox-ose-guest-x11 virtualbox-guest-dkms4.1.18-dfsg-1 virtualbox-guest-utils 4.1.18-dfsg-1 virtualbox-guest-x11 4.1.18-dfsg-1 virtualbox-ose-guest-x11 4.1.18-dfsg-1 If one enabled “3D acceleration” in the VM config, Gnome 3 shows up in normal mode 3D acceleration is enabled for this VM but GNOME3 doesn't work for me. I have tried simply rebooting the VM (to simulate someone adding relevant hardware to a desktop PC) and I've tried re-running the installer. No change, no support. Lenovo Thinkpad T410. I did once have GNOME3 running on this machine outside a VM, so the hardware is capable of providing 3D acceleration - indeed, it was the user experience of using 3D which turned me off GNOME3 in the first place. Sorry, but my display is 2D and all the software pretence in the world isn't going to suddenly make it 3D. ; if one didn't, it shows up in fallback mode (one can see Gallium llvmpipe as graphic driver in the gnome system properties, instead of Chromium). Still got Gallium llvmpipe listed. -- Neil Williams = http://www.linux.codehelp.co.uk/ pgpRPvRxdffE9.pgp Description: PGP signature
Re: Debian Installer 7.0 Beta1 release
On 08/06/2012 01:59 AM, Neil Williams wrote: On Sat, 4 Aug 2012 20:41:31 +0200 Cyril Brulebois k...@debian.org wrote: A virtualbox host environment would be detected automatically, and the following packages would get installed in that case: virtualbox-guest-dkms virtualbox-guest-utils virtualbox-guest-x11 virtualbox-ose-guest-x11 $ dpkg-query -W virtualbox-guest-dkms virtualbox-guest-utils virtualbox-guest-x11 virtualbox-ose-guest-x11 virtualbox-guest-dkms 4.1.18-dfsg-1 virtualbox-guest-utils 4.1.18-dfsg-1 virtualbox-guest-x11 4.1.18-dfsg-1 virtualbox-ose-guest-x11 4.1.18-dfsg-1 If one enabled “3D acceleration” in the VM config, Gnome 3 shows up in normal mode 3D acceleration is enabled for this VM but GNOME3 doesn't work for me. Same experience here. Thomas -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-devel-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/501f310a.8070...@debian.org
Re: Debian Installer 7.0 Beta1 release
On Sat, 4 Aug 2012 12:03:49 +0200 Cyril Brulebois k...@debian.org wrote: The Debian Installer team is pleased to announce the first beta release of the installer for Debian 7.0 Wheezy. It always makes the release seem closer when there's a beta of d-i to play with. :-) Thanks for getting this working. Feedback for this release = We need your help to find bugs and further improve the installer, so please try it. Installer CDs, other media and everything else you will need are available at our web site. I tried in a standard VM (Debian package from sid) with a complete default netinst i386 install. The installer worked flawlessly but GNOME3 had a problem: GNOME3 Failed to Load Unfortunately GNOME3 failed to start properly and started in the fallback mode. This most likely means your system (graphics hardware or driver) is not capable of delivering the full GNOME 3 experience. That's going to make testing Wheezy CD images annoying. Anyone else see this problem? I tried logging in under GNOME and GNOME Classic - the warning didn't show again but the UI didn't show any visible change, it appears that only fallback/classic is available. Can someone using GNOME3 in Wheezy verify that this is expected behaviour? So the beta of d-i looks good - more testing to follow. -- Neil Williams = http://www.linux.codehelp.co.uk/ pgpCa8xKCvfcR.pgp Description: PGP signature
Re: Debian Installer 7.0 Beta1 release
On Sat, 2012-08-04 at 17:15 +0100, Neil Williams wrote: [...] I tried in a standard VM (Debian package from sid) with a complete default netinst i386 install. The installer worked flawlessly but GNOME3 had a problem: GNOME3 Failed to Load Unfortunately GNOME3 failed to start properly and started in the fallback mode. This most likely means your system (graphics hardware or driver) is not capable of delivering the full GNOME 3 experience. That's going to make testing Wheezy CD images annoying. Anyone else see this problem? I tried logging in under GNOME and GNOME Classic - the warning didn't show again but the UI didn't show any visible change, it appears that only fallback/classic is available. Can someone using GNOME3 in Wheezy verify that this is expected behaviour? This is expected in the absence of 3D acceleration, which is not yet supported in qemu so far as I know. VirtualBox is supposed to support it, but a standard installation presumably won't pull in the necessary paravirtual drivers in the guest. Ben. So the beta of d-i looks good - more testing to follow. -- Ben Hutchings Experience is directly proportional to the value of equipment destroyed. - Carolyn Scheppner signature.asc Description: This is a digitally signed message part
Re: Debian Installer 7.0 Beta1 release
Le samedi 04 août 2012 à 18:28 +0100, Ben Hutchings a écrit : This is expected in the absence of 3D acceleration, which is not yet supported in qemu so far as I know. VirtualBox is supposed to support it, but a standard installation presumably won't pull in the necessary paravirtual drivers in the guest. At least with squeeze, this used to work, so I don’t see why it wouldn’t anymore. However I don’t know whether the vbox paravirtualized drivers are whitelisted in gnome-session-check-accelerated. -- .''`. Josselin Mouette : :' : `. `' `- -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-devel-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/1344104192.4874.7.camel@tomoe
Re: Debian Installer 7.0 Beta1 release
Ben Hutchings b...@decadent.org.uk (04/08/2012): On Sat, 2012-08-04 at 17:15 +0100, Neil Williams wrote: [...] I tried in a standard VM (Debian package from sid) with a complete default netinst i386 install. The installer worked flawlessly but GNOME3 had a problem: GNOME3 Failed to Load Unfortunately GNOME3 failed to start properly and started in the fallback mode. This most likely means your system (graphics hardware or driver) is not capable of delivering the full GNOME 3 experience. That's going to make testing Wheezy CD images annoying. Anyone else see this problem? I tried logging in under GNOME and GNOME Classic - the warning didn't show again but the UI didn't show any visible change, it appears that only fallback/classic is available. Can someone using GNOME3 in Wheezy verify that this is expected behaviour? This is expected in the absence of 3D acceleration, which is not yet supported in qemu so far as I know. VirtualBox is supposed to support it, but a standard installation presumably won't pull in the necessary paravirtual drivers in the guest. A virtualbox host environment would be detected automatically, and the following packages would get installed in that case: virtualbox-guest-dkms virtualbox-guest-utils virtualbox-guest-x11 virtualbox-ose-guest-x11 If one enabled “3D acceleration” in the VM config, Gnome 3 shows up in normal mode; if one didn't, it shows up in fallback mode (one can see Gallium llvmpipe as graphic driver in the gnome system properties, instead of Chromium). Mraw, KiBi. signature.asc Description: Digital signature
Re: Debian Installer 7.0 Beta1 release
On Sat, 2012-08-04 at 20:16 +0200, Josselin Mouette wrote: Le samedi 04 août 2012 à 18:28 +0100, Ben Hutchings a écrit : This is expected in the absence of 3D acceleration, which is not yet supported in qemu so far as I know. VirtualBox is supposed to support it, but a standard installation presumably won't pull in the necessary paravirtual drivers in the guest. At least with squeeze, this used to work, so I don’t see why it wouldn’t anymore. Cyril Brulebois says that they are automatically installed in a standard installation under VBox. However I don’t know whether the vbox paravirtualized drivers are whitelisted in gnome-session-check-accelerated. Nor I; I have never used VBox myself. Ben. -- Ben Hutchings Experience is directly proportional to the value of equipment destroyed. - Carolyn Scheppner signature.asc Description: This is a digitally signed message part
Re: Debian Installer 7.0 Beta1 release
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA256 On 08/04/2012 07:28 PM, Ben Hutchings wrote: On Sat, 2012-08-04 at 17:15 +0100, Neil Williams wrote: That's going to make testing Wheezy CD images annoying. Anyone else see this problem? I tried logging in under GNOME and GNOME Classic - the warning didn't show again but the UI didn't show any visible change, it appears that only fallback/classic is available. Can someone using GNOME3 in Wheezy verify that this is expected behaviour? This is expected in the absence of 3D acceleration, which is not yet supported in qemu so far as I know. VirtualBox is supposed to support it, but a standard installation presumably won't pull in the necessary paravirtual drivers in the guest. So we require 3d acceleration for a default install? I think that is even more insane than what recent windows versions require. Can we please have a sane default desktop for people with older hardware? Maybe just chosen in d-i, depending on the hardware. - -- Bernd ZeimetzDebian GNU/Linux Developer http://bzed.dehttp://www.debian.org GPG Fingerprint: ECA1 E3F2 8E11 2432 D485 DD95 EB36 171A 6FF9 435F -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- Version: GnuPG v1.4.12 (GNU/Linux) Comment: Using GnuPG with Mozilla - http://enigmail.mozdev.org/ iQIcBAEBCAAGBQJQHZd8AAoJEOs2Fxpv+UNfONkQAJXIO7gws3NwYI3x36UxlNo3 +U111NtubrylcBIR5SEk5C6H61orvjn7MejduUPK3sjNl1WGb/wNzn/9AStZvYzz YkDeE9LqMFluwR3//oNGzDc2Y4ult9UbJsSTp4C9Z+MtcLZGsJA8j//Wqx9SnS/4 kvPGz+oGXmljhtzrkEnbmt/zgyurVXK5tY772yR2hk38t/uBKyqthM4mj03/pFU7 xvayHQXiC5o9HyWP16vNZayU/dVQnJF8g2zkd7Nt/LyDkXsSQW3G6uNc3vgNmLXy ZhxayljnBo4jtPVnq6jQHCpls3mX2Ta6V406f2YRHnVyLI+YK+7g2wLxYtPT1Iz5 uECVjg+FjlFCYgwbilA0Me0iQZswcE9cLzlUuIqN5QvdBRFP7RZgJoMxa5vyqFY4 oA+zHI3f849TYcuQxAD9UobKSYmHKSow6gVm8p4R9dC/Qb/j7zJVEg3+0Hs57srG yKrFPcd8Nk3F5UDgflDJsE3GWI3gQLkq8+u8aw7Coz4mKElg+9NGEfA0OLaDjVZm 0xfHqtNepXIzajpIe3622GlshD73/yJwjo51fTaQByULZC51QJcr8MSTYaFJVuee rObvByN+USUaM91pCTnZ6l9x5EWRrxEgzt/SvSB0GW5jcz6nCSxATjdqIK6mqwqz 1zlatvCCh6tAk0TE6beY =dFL8 -END PGP SIGNATURE- -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-devel-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/501d97f5.9050...@bzed.de
Re: Debian Installer 7.0 Beta1 release
On Sat, Aug 4, 2012 at 3:45 PM, Bernd Zeimetz wrote: So we require 3d acceleration for a default install? I think that is even more insane than what recent windows versions require. Can we please have a sane default desktop for people with older hardware? Maybe just chosen in d-i, depending on the hardware. http://lists.debian.org/20120803190614.ga4...@mraw.org -- bye, pabs http://wiki.debian.org/PaulWise -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-devel-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/caktje6ezyzkraxhp9lyy9vd39a_x_utfpdmrsmszn89+xup...@mail.gmail.com
Re: Debian Installer 7.0 Beta1 release
On Sat, 2012-08-04 at 23:45 +0200, Bernd Zeimetz wrote: On 08/04/2012 07:28 PM, Ben Hutchings wrote: On Sat, 2012-08-04 at 17:15 +0100, Neil Williams wrote: That's going to make testing Wheezy CD images annoying. Anyone else see this problem? I tried logging in under GNOME and GNOME Classic - the warning didn't show again but the UI didn't show any visible change, it appears that only fallback/classic is available. Can someone using GNOME3 in Wheezy verify that this is expected behaviour? This is expected in the absence of 3D acceleration, which is not yet supported in qemu so far as I know. VirtualBox is supposed to support it, but a standard installation presumably won't pull in the necessary paravirtual drivers in the guest. So we require 3d acceleration for a default install? I think what you'll see without it is a one-time warning. I could be wrong since I haven't done a fresh installation yet. I think that is even more insane than what recent windows versions require. 3D acceleration recommended, but with a fallback mode available? Isn't that exactly the same? Can we please have a sane default desktop for people with older hardware? Maybe just chosen in d-i, depending on the hardware. I believe joeysel now selects Xfce as the default desktop. Ben. -- Ben Hutchings Computers are not intelligent. They only think they are. signature.asc Description: This is a digitally signed message part
Re: Debian Installer 7.0 Beta1 release
On 08/05/2012 05:45 AM, Bernd Zeimetz wrote:
So we require 3d acceleration for a default install? I think that is
even more
insane than what recent windows versions require. Can we please have a
sane
default desktop for people with older hardware? Maybe just chosen in d-i,
depending on the hardware.
GNOME3 defaults are indeed insane, but nobody forces you to use GNOME3.
Also, Debian isn't at fault, we aren't the upstream for GNOME3, we just
happen
to support it.
The only thing I don't like is that d-i (or should I say tasksel?) hides
which
desktop will be installed when you select Graphical environment. IMO, a
sane default would be something like: Graphical environment using
${whatever} desktop. Has this been considered? Or has this changed
already since last time I tried?
Thomas
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