Re: GNU config (config.sub/guess) is now GPLv3 with additional permission
On Fri, May 31, 2013 at 03:08:59PM -0700, Josh Triplett wrote: On Fri, May 31, 2013 at 06:44:00PM -0300, Henrique de Moraes Holschuh wrote: Upstream has changed the license to GPLv3. It has an additional permission to negate any viral effects, but it only applies to packages that include a configuration script generated by GNU autoconf. [...] Here is the new license text for config.sub and config.guess: [...] As a special exception to the GNU General Public License, if you distribute this file as part of a program that contains a configuration script generated by Autoconf, you may include it under the same distribution terms that you use for the rest of that program. This Exception is an additional permission under section 7 of the GNU General Public License, version 3 (GPLv3). Interesting choice of wording. Read literally (generated by Autoconf), this would mean that the exception only applies when you distribute config.guess or config.sub as part of a source distribution that includes the generated configure, not just the input configure.ac. Which should be the case for most source distributions, but it still seems interesting. And on the flip side, you could also trivially satisfy this by including a generated configure script that doesn't actually get used. In any case, this seems like something we could easily scan for with lintian or with any of the automatic whole-archive source scanning tools: just look for a source package that contains config.sub or config.guess but does *not* contain a configure script (or whose configure script does not contain Generated by GNU Autoconf in its first few lines). - Josh Triplett When the source does not come with a configure script, which usualy means debain/rules then runs autoreconf or the like, doesn't it make sense to also rely on autotools-dev and NOT ship the config.sub/geuss at all? The choice to ship one but not the other seems to me to be a bit stupid. Esspecially since config.sub/guess are much easier replacable. So yes, please do scan for this. Seems worthwile even without the legal mubo jumbo. MfG Goswin -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-devel-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/20130604123009.GD17877@frosties
Re: GNU config (config.sub/guess) is now GPLv3 with additional permission
* Henrique de Moraes Holschuh: The above covers the vast majority of packages, as it is very rare for any build system to need config.sub or config.guess and _not_ use GNU autoconf. The exception does not require that the configuration script generated by Autoconf is actually used for anything (not even calling config.sub or config.guess), so it trivially extends to any package regardless of licensing: As a special exception to the GNU General Public License, if you distribute this file as part of a program that contains a configuration script generated by Autoconf, you may include it under the same distribution terms that you use for the rest of that program. This Exception is an additional permission under section 7 of the GNU General Public License, version 3 (GPLv3). -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-devel-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/8738t1h5uc@mid.deneb.enyo.de
Re: GNU config (config.sub/guess) is now GPLv3 with additional permission
On Fri, May 31, 2013 at 06:44:00PM -0300, Henrique de Moraes Holschuh wrote: Upstream has changed the license to GPLv3. It has an additional permission to negate any viral effects, but it only applies to packages that include a configuration script generated by GNU autoconf. [...] Here is the new license text for config.sub and config.guess: [...] As a special exception to the GNU General Public License, if you distribute this file as part of a program that contains a configuration script generated by Autoconf, you may include it under the same distribution terms that you use for the rest of that program. This Exception is an additional permission under section 7 of the GNU General Public License, version 3 (GPLv3). Interesting choice of wording. Read literally (generated by Autoconf), this would mean that the exception only applies when you distribute config.guess or config.sub as part of a source distribution that includes the generated configure, not just the input configure.ac. Which should be the case for most source distributions, but it still seems interesting. And on the flip side, you could also trivially satisfy this by including a generated configure script that doesn't actually get used. In any case, this seems like something we could easily scan for with lintian or with any of the automatic whole-archive source scanning tools: just look for a source package that contains config.sub or config.guess but does *not* contain a configure script (or whose configure script does not contain Generated by GNU Autoconf in its first few lines). - Josh Triplett -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-devel-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/20130531220859.GB12303@jtriplet-mobl1
Re: GNU config (config.sub/guess) is now GPLv3 with additional permission
On Fri, 31 May 2013, Josh Triplett wrote: On Fri, May 31, 2013 at 06:44:00PM -0300, Henrique de Moraes Holschuh wrote: Upstream has changed the license to GPLv3. It has an additional permission to negate any viral effects, but it only applies to packages that include a configuration script generated by GNU autoconf. [...] Here is the new license text for config.sub and config.guess: [...] As a special exception to the GNU General Public License, if you distribute this file as part of a program that contains a configuration script generated by Autoconf, you may include it under the same distribution terms that you use for the rest of that program. This Exception is an additional permission under section 7 of the GNU General Public License, version 3 (GPLv3). Interesting choice of wording. Read literally (generated by Indeed. Autoconf), this would mean that the exception only applies when you distribute config.guess or config.sub as part of a source distribution that includes the generated configure, not just the input configure.ac. Which should be the case for most source distributions, but it still seems interesting. And on the flip side, you could also trivially satisfy this by including a generated configure script that doesn't actually get used. Yes. It is not exactly an watertight wording. I expect this license might be further updated to correct these points, it is not like we don't have to update config.sub/guess at least once an year... So I advise people to stick to the obvious intention behind the license change, which is that GNU config is to be used by GPLv3 packages and also by packages that use GNU autoconf/automake regardless of their license. In any case, this seems like something we could easily scan for with lintian or with any of the automatic whole-archive source scanning tools: just look for a source package that contains config.sub or config.guess but does *not* contain a configure script (or whose configure script does not contain Generated by GNU Autoconf in its first few lines). I will file a bug report with upstream to the effect that the license should allow distribution under a different license in any case where GNU autoconf or GNU automake is used, even if the configuration scripts have not been generated yet. -- One disk to rule them all, One disk to find them. One disk to bring them all and in the darkness grind them. In the Land of Redmond where the shadows lie. -- The Silicon Valley Tarot Henrique Holschuh -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-devel-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/2013053137.ga15...@khazad-dum.debian.net
Re: GNU config (config.sub/guess) is now GPLv3 with additional permission
Josh Triplett j...@joshtriplett.org writes:
On Fri, May 31, 2013 at 06:44:00PM -0300, Henrique de Moraes Holschuh wrote:
Upstream has changed the license to GPLv3. It has an additional
permission to negate any viral effects, but it only applies to
packages that include a configuration script generated by GNU
autoconf.
[...]
Here is the new license text for config.sub and config.guess:
[...]
As a special exception to the GNU General Public License, if you
distribute this file as part of a program that contains a
configuration script generated by Autoconf, you may include it under
the same distribution terms that you use for the rest of that
program. This Exception is an additional permission under section 7
of the GNU General Public License, version 3 (GPLv3).
Interesting choice of wording. Read literally (generated by
Autoconf), this would mean that the exception only applies when you
distribute config.guess or config.sub as part of a source distribution
that includes the generated configure, not just the input configure.ac.
Which should be the case for most source distributions, but it still
seems interesting.
I suspect that most distributions that don't include the generated
configure script also don't include config.{sub,guess} and rely on
autoreconf to copy those files in from some system location.
Also, it's worth noting that config.{sub,guess} are standalone shell
scripts that are invoked as independent programs, and are not linked into
or included in any other work in all their usages of which I'm aware, so
the change of license has very little effect. Given that they are shell
scripts, they are their own source code, so as far as I can tell all the
requirements of the GPLv3 are trivially satisfied even if you include them
as part of the build system of entirely non-free software provided that
you include a copy of the GPLv3 somewhere.
I have a hard time imagining any situation in which this licensing change
has any practical impact.
--
Russ Allbery (r...@debian.org) http://www.eyrie.org/~eagle/
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Re: GNU config (config.sub/guess) is now GPLv3 with additional permission
* Henrique de Moraes Holschuh h...@hmh.eng.br, 2013-05-31, 18:44: As a special exception to the GNU General Public License, if you distribute this file as part of a program that contains a configuration script generated by Autoconf, you may include it under the same distribution terms that you use for the rest of that program. So I can distribute this file under the terms of GPLv2, but only if $something. What about §6 of said license? (“You may not impose any further restrictions on the recipients' exercise of the rights granted herein.”) -- Jakub Wilk -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-devel-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/20130531223114.ga8...@jwilk.net
Re: GNU config (config.sub/guess) is now GPLv3 with additional permission
Jakub Wilk jw...@debian.org writes:
* Henrique de Moraes Holschuh h...@hmh.eng.br, 2013-05-31, 18:44:
As a special exception to the GNU General Public License, if you
distribute this file as part of a program that contains a configuration
script generated by Autoconf, you may include it under the same
distribution terms that you use for the rest of that program.
So I can distribute this file under the terms of GPLv2, but only if
$something. What about §6 of said license? (“You may not impose any
further restrictions on the recipients' exercise of the rights granted
herein.”)
My understanding of the way this license provision works is that if you do
$something, you are permitted to relicense the file. Once you've
relicensed the file, the new license is in effect and you can forget about
the old license entirely, even if you stop doing $something. I think
that's the only way this *can* make sense, since the receipient of your
pure-GPLv2 distribution can reuse everything in that distribution under
the terms of the GPLv2; if they couldn't, then you wouldn't *actually* be
includ[ing] it under the same distribution terms that you use for the
rest of that program.
That does seem to make the condition here pointless. I don't see any
reason why I couldn't include these scripts in a package licensed under
the Expat license, distribute that package, declare that I am accepting
this condition and distributing the config.{guess,sub} files under the
Expat license, and then take them from that distribution and do anything I
wish with them that satisfies the minimal terms of the Expat license since
I now have Expat-licensed versions of the files.
In other words, I don't get why the FSF didn't just use their standard
all-permissive license in the first place, like they do for the generated
configure script, since I think this trivially reduces to that.
It would be interesting to hear the opinion of FSF legal counsel on the
above.
--
Russ Allbery (r...@debian.org) http://www.eyrie.org/~eagle/
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Re: GNU config (config.sub/guess) is now GPLv3 with additional permission
On Fri, May 31, 2013 at 07:22:37PM -0300, Henrique de Moraes Holschuh wrote: On Fri, 31 May 2013, Josh Triplett wrote: On Fri, May 31, 2013 at 06:44:00PM -0300, Henrique de Moraes Holschuh wrote: Upstream has changed the license to GPLv3. It has an additional permission to negate any viral effects, but it only applies to packages that include a configuration script generated by GNU autoconf. [...] Here is the new license text for config.sub and config.guess: [...] As a special exception to the GNU General Public License, if you distribute this file as part of a program that contains a configuration script generated by Autoconf, you may include it under the same distribution terms that you use for the rest of that program. This Exception is an additional permission under section 7 of the GNU General Public License, version 3 (GPLv3). Interesting choice of wording. Read literally (generated by Indeed. Autoconf), this would mean that the exception only applies when you distribute config.guess or config.sub as part of a source distribution that includes the generated configure, not just the input configure.ac. Which should be the case for most source distributions, but it still seems interesting. And on the flip side, you could also trivially satisfy this by including a generated configure script that doesn't actually get used. Yes. It is not exactly an watertight wording. I expect this license might be further updated to correct these points, it is not like we don't have to update config.sub/guess at least once an year... So I advise people to stick to the obvious intention behind the license change, which is that GNU config is to be used by GPLv3 packages and also by packages that use GNU autoconf/automake regardless of their license. Of course; I didn't intend to suggest taking advantage of that interesting loophole, just that it existed. In any case, this seems like something we could easily scan for with lintian or with any of the automatic whole-archive source scanning tools: just look for a source package that contains config.sub or config.guess but does *not* contain a configure script (or whose configure script does not contain Generated by GNU Autoconf in its first few lines). I will file a bug report with upstream to the effect that the license should allow distribution under a different license in any case where GNU autoconf or GNU automake is used, even if the configuration scripts have not been generated yet. If that happens, the automated check could then also not warn about packages containing configure.ac or configure.in. Still seems worth doing, though. - Josh Triplett -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-devel-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/20130531224503.GB12741@jtriplet-mobl1
Re: GNU config (config.sub/guess) is now GPLv3 with additional permission
On Sat, 01 Jun 2013, Jakub Wilk wrote: * Henrique de Moraes Holschuh h...@hmh.eng.br, 2013-05-31, 18:44: As a special exception to the GNU General Public License, if you distribute this file as part of a program that contains a configuration script generated by Autoconf, you may include it under the same distribution terms that you use for the rest of that program. So I can distribute this file under the terms of GPLv2, but only if $something. What about §6 of said license? (“You may not impose any further restrictions on the recipients' exercise of the rights granted herein.”) Well, the $something is you don't change the build system to stop using autoconf while still retaining config.sub or config.guess. I am not sure it matters at all (clearly upstream seems to think that it should/might), but I'd be very hard pressed to think that $something is enough to be a problem for GPLv2. -- One disk to rule them all, One disk to find them. One disk to bring them all and in the darkness grind them. In the Land of Redmond where the shadows lie. -- The Silicon Valley Tarot Henrique Holschuh -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-devel-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/20130531224607.gb15...@khazad-dum.debian.net
