Re: Re: Proposal: SystemD.pushers/forcers be physically beaten as revenge.
After ***forcing*** users to use libav instead of ffmpeg in debian therefore making it to stuck with outdated fork istead of rapidly developing original it's too late to talk about freedom.. Gosh, we are not forcing you to use libav, we just considered it better at the time a decision had to be made. If you care that much about ffmpeg, then get your lazy ass up and help getting it packaged instead of spamming on debian-devel. As long as you don't actively contribute to Debian yourself and try to introduce changes to your liking, you will have to deal with other people's preferences. It's like that and that's the way it is... - Fabian -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-devel-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/1392284932.15213.4.camel@kff50
Re: Proposal: SystemD.pushers/forcers be physically beaten as revenge.
After ***forcing*** users to use libav instead of ffmpeg in debian therefore making it to stuck with outdated fork istead of rapidly developing original it's too late to talk about freedom..-- Sergey Krasnikov
Re: Proposal: SystemD.pushers/forcers be physically beaten as revenge.
On Thu, Feb 13, 2014 at 08:00:56AM +0400, Сергей Красников wrote: After ***forcing*** users to use libav instead of ffmpeg in debian therefore making it to stuck with outdated fork istead of rapidly developing original it's too late to talk about freedom.. https://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=729203 -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-devel-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/20140213045605.ga22...@scru.org
Re: Proposal: SystemD.pushers/forcers be physically beaten as revenge.
Clint Adams cl...@debian.org writes: On Thu, Feb 13, 2014 at 08:00:56AM +0400, Сергей Красников wrote: After ***forcing*** users to use libav instead of ffmpeg in debian therefore making it to stuck with outdated fork istead of rapidly developing original it's too late to talk about freedom.. https://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=729203 Ow, that bug. Ow. I don't have anywhere *near* enough information about the background, situation, and software involved to even hazard a guess as to the best approach. But ow. -- Russ Allbery (r...@debian.org) http://www.eyrie.org/~eagle/ -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-devel-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/87a9dv7emc@windlord.stanford.edu
Re: Proposal: SystemD.pushers/forcers be physically beaten as revenge.
On Tue, Feb 11, 2014 at 02:46:13PM -0500, Maas Verri wrote: The people, such as Adrian, who are pushing systemd as the one and only init system for debian should be physically harmed. You are way out of line. -- Antti-Juhani Kaijanaho, Jyväskylä, Finland http://antti-juhani.kaijanaho.fi/newblog/ http://www.flickr.com/photos/antti-juhani/ -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-devel-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/20140211201106.gc3...@kukkavihko.kaijanaho.fi
Re: Proposal: SystemD.pushers/forcers be physically beaten as revenge.
Hi, Maas Verri: Proposal: SystemD pushers/forcers be physically beaten as revenge. In some (if not most) jurisdictions, this email would be enough to earn you a stern talking-to by the local police and/or public prosecutor. Please refrain from sending further hate mails. Thank you. -- -- Matthias Urlichs signature.asc Description: Digital signature
Re: Proposal: SystemD.pushers/forcers be physically beaten as revenge.
On Tue, Feb 11, 2014 at 02:46:13PM -0500, Maas Verri wrote: Proposal: SystemD pushers/forcers be physically beaten as revenge. It *should* go without saying, but I want to make it clear that as an upstart developer, I find this message reprehensible and absolutely unacceptable. I have technical disagreements with those who support systemd, but that's all they are - technical disagreements. Anyone who holds the above view is not welcome in the Debian community. The only reason this message, and others like it, have found their way to the Debian mailing lists is because people who are *not* accountable to our community, but decide they have an axe to grind, are very hard to keep out of our mailing lists. (And thank you to our listmasters for their ongoing efforts in this regard.) -- Steve Langasek Give me a lever long enough and a Free OS Debian Developer to set it on, and I can move the world. Ubuntu Developerhttp://www.debian.org/ slanga...@ubuntu.com vor...@debian.org signature.asc Description: Digital signature
Re: Proposal: SystemD.pushers/forcers be physically beaten as revenge.
On Tue, Feb 11, 2014 at 02:46:13PM -0500, Maas Verri wrote: Proposal: SystemD pushers/forcers be physically beaten as revenge. This is, of course, absolutely intolerable. Regardless of how strongly you might feel about any technical issue within Debian, resorting to threats of any kind of violence is unacceptable. In any sensible jurisdiction it's not a question of good taste versus bad taste, or freedom of speech versus censorship: threats of violence are unambiguously illegal. It is possible that Maas Verri is trolling, and does not intend the threats to be taken seriously. It doesn't matter. They are just as unacceptable. Normally, I ignore trolls when I can, or attempt to deal with them by getting listmasters involved, out of the public eye. Trolls crave attention, and responding in public is giving them what they want. However, sometimes the transgressions are too severe to be ignored, and thus I'll climb on my soap box to declare that this is one of those cases. This is NOT OK. Anybody who thinks threats, or insults, or defamation, is a good way to express their disappointment or disagreement is wrong. They should step away from the computer until they have calmed down enough to be courteous and constructive. We have, in Debian, debated the question of what init system to use for over two years now. When I describe it as a vigorous debate, I'm attempting to use the under-statement that my current tea-loving country of residence is famous for. The debate has consumed a lot of time, energy, and goodwill. Emotions are still running high, nerves are still raw and exposed, and this means that a lot of people react more forcefully than they otherwise would. Everyone needs to take this into account. Try hard not to annoy others, and if you're annoyed, try hard to get past that before responding to anyone about anything. This is for all topics, not just the init system. It's clear to me that we are, as a group, much more irritable about everything and less trusting of each other than we were a year ago. We've had the technical committee make a decision. It might still be overturned by a General Resolution, but it's not too early to start re-building the trust between Debian contributors. We have to trust each other to have good intentions, even if we sometimes disagree with each other about what are sensible goals to aim for, or the methods of achieving the goals. Once the decision is made, those who didn't like the chosen solution need to deal with the fact that they lost the quarrel. Holding grudges, keeping the fight alive, or otherwise not accepting the decision is only making things worse. It'll make it harder to continue to collaborate on Debian in the future. It'll make it harder to achieve peace and emotional and mental balance. It'll make it harder to have fun. We, the Debian project, can't let that happen. Fun is serious business for us: without it we can't get anything much done. Some concrete things all of us can do to make this better: * Stop discussing init systems. No, really. Everything's been said already, probably many, many times. Anything you say is likely to irritate or anger someone. There will be a time when init systems are a safe topic to discuss again, but it'll take a while. * Go meet other Debian contributors in person, be it at Debconf 14, a Debian sprint, a user group, or an unrelated event where some of happen to be. If necessary, organise something. Have tea, beer, or food with them, or just chat about anything except init systems. Wear a t-shirt saying I don't want to talk about Debian and init systems, but I'm interested in backups. * Remember what made Debian fun for you, and do that for a while. Fix a bug. Upload a new version of a package. Write a missing manual page. Translate a web page. Design a new theme for a Debian desktop. Teach someone to make packages. * Find your local Finnish community gathering and achieve a high-score in the https://wiki.debian.org/HugAFinn game. The person with the highest score between now and the time the last talk at Debconf 14 wins. (Some of the above suggestions are not entirely serious.) -- http://www.cafepress.com/trunktees -- geeky funny T-shirts http://gtdfh.branchable.com/ -- GTD for hackers -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-devel-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/20140211213411.GU5029@holywood
Re: Proposal: SystemD.pushers/forcers be physically beaten as revenge.
On Tue, Feb 11, 2014 at 01:18:57PM -0800, Steve Langasek wrote: On Tue, Feb 11, 2014 at 02:46:13PM -0500, Maas Verri wrote: Proposal: SystemD pushers/forcers be physically beaten as revenge. It *should* go without saying, but I want to make it clear that as an upstart developer, I find this message reprehensible and absolutely unacceptable. I have technical disagreements with those who support systemd, but that's all they are - technical disagreements. It's just one person creating a bunch of accounts. Not to be taken seriously. -- Regards, Olav -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-devel-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/20140211215832.ga29...@bkor.dhs.org
Re: Proposal: SystemD.pushers/forcers be physically beaten as revenge.
On 02/11/2014 11:46 AM, Maas Verri wrote: Proposal: SystemD pushers/forcers be physically beaten as revenge. The people, such as Adrian, who are pushing systemd as the one and only init system for debian should be physically harmed. Are you aware that saying let's physically beat systemd pushers has the same weight than excuse me, but I do not agree because of blah, or possibly even less? You're barely doing something useful (if anything *at all*). After comments like that, this is simple: nobody will change their decisions (for whatever init system) after a comment of yours now because you have just shown you are nothing but a troll and can't be taken seriously. Most will just ignore you now. -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-devel-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/52fab17c.4080...@alvarezp.ods.org
Re: Proposal: SystemD.pushers/forcers be physically beaten as revenge.
+---+ .:\:\:/:/:. | PLEASE DO NOT |:.:\:\:/:/:.: | FEED THE TROLLS | :=.' - - '.=: | | '=(\ 9 9 /)=' | Thank you, | ( (_) ) | Management | /`-vvv-'\ +---+ / \ | |@@@ / /|,|\ \ | |@@@ /_// /^\ \\_\ @x@@x@| | |/ WW( ( ) )WW \/| |\| __\,,\ /,,/__ \||/ | | | (__Y__) /\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\//\/\\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\ == -- ciao, Marco signature.asc Description: Digital signature
Re: Proposal: SystemD.pushers/forcers be physically beaten as revenge.
+1 On Feb 11, 2014 7:09 PM, Marco d'Itri m...@linux.it wrote: +---+ .:\:\:/:/:. | PLEASE DO NOT |:.:\:\:/:/:.: | FEED THE TROLLS | :=.' - - '.=: | | '=(\ 9 9 /)=' | Thank you, | ( (_) ) | Management | /`-vvv-'\ +---+ / \ | |@@@ / /|,|\ \ | |@@@ /_// /^\ \\_\ @x@@x@| | |/ WW( ( ) )WW \/| |\| __\,,\ /,,/__ \||/ | | | (__Y__) /\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\//\/\\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\ == -- ciao, Marco
Re: Proposal: SystemD.pushers/forcers be physically beaten as revenge.
2014-02-11 15:16 GMT-04:30 Maas Verri maas.ve...@aim.com: Proposal: SystemD pushers/forcers be physically beaten as revenge. The people, such as Adrian, who are pushing systemd as the one and only init system for debian should be physically harmed. They are wresting from all of us a nice unix like OS, they argue against choice and if they have their way the systemv scripts will be removed, and other non-systemd inits will not be allowed. . This is top-down dictatorship. This is how the systemd people operate. Go to any of their discussions. They say they are trying to help debian. This is similar to how the church in the middle ages helped men's souls, by burning them alive or torturing them. Debian exists for people, it is not a religion. It is not a sculpture. The systemd pushers/forcers say they are trying to improve debian by forcing one choice of init on all of us (especially Adrian). Debian exists not for itself, but for all of us. Adrian and the other systemd pushers are trying to take debian away from us and make it suitable only for them and their users (ie their citizens subjects people they rule over). Those of us who do not want systemd, but instead want to keep an low profile, low attack surface, proven, reliable, resolute, simple init need to do something if we wish to keep a unix like option for debian linux. Since the systemders are using the debian process to overrule choice and freedom, some other method will be needed to keep them from implementing their goal of having systemd as the only init system for debian. I think we will have to physically attack the exclusive systemd people. Words do not phase them. Arguments are useless. They dismiss everything and declare themselves victorious. They corrupt the process and always seek to remove choice and freedom and use every kind of metaphore to accomplish that. I simply want to beable to continue to use what I have used thus-far. I am sure many system admins would like the same. . Adrian and other systemd pushers are not apt to allow that. They need to be physically restrained or beaten untill they come to a different conclusion or enter a state where they are no longer capable of coming to any conclusions. We owe them nothing, but they seek to own us or remove us from debian, and linux in general. We should fight back. In any way that is expedient. Ladies and gentlemen, we have a neo-Hittler between us. That high level of oratory has this character, and not to mention its peaceful solutions to reach the objectives that arises. One moment, it's just a troll more, so...don't care. -- Dios en su Cielo, todo bien en la Tierra *** -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-devel-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/caggkdumtbjg1rnmgjdrivecpsjxezbaccppjnsaxkjp2is2...@mail.gmail.com
