Re: VIM features
Wichert Akkerman declaimed: Previously Caleb Shay wrote: I second this. For example, at the bottom of /etc/vim/vimrc there are several lines commented out as they cause vim to behave a lot different from regular vi. However, as was pointed out below, vim is NOT the default vi when you install, so why not enable some more of it's better features. Because I'm not willing to for several reasons: 1. every time I enable a feature that makes vim a bit more unlike vi I get multiple bugreports 2. vim is very well documented, if people want to try any of its features they can trivially enable them themselves 3. which features you want enabled is a very personal choice, one that I am not willing to make for users. So I'll always pick the choice that makes vim more like stock vi. This keeps things consistent and prevents endless debates. I don't at all mind having a vimrc file with lines commented out that the user can enable. Note that this is the strategy for bash. What would be helpful is a README.Debian file in /usr/doc/vim that alerts the user to the existence of /etc/vim/vimrc and its nice set of potential customizations. I had overlooked the vim stuff in /etc, but I have learned to check the /usr/doc directory. -- Paul Mackinney | Another look at Sept 11 [EMAIL PROTECTED] | http://www.copvcia.com/
Re: VIM features
On 01-Jan-02, 18:06 (CST), Steve Greenland [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Also, vim is higher precedence than nvi. Ack. That's no longer true. Sorry. Steve
Re: VIM features
Previously Paul Mackinney wrote: What would be helpful is a README.Debian file in /usr/doc/vim that alerts the user to the existence of /etc/vim/vimrc and its nice set of potential customizations. I had overlooked the vim stuff in /etc, but I have learned to check the /usr/doc directory. Feel free to write one :) Wichet. -- _ /[EMAIL PROTECTED] This space intentionally left occupied \ | [EMAIL PROTECTED]http://www.liacs.nl/~wichert/ | | 1024D/2FA3BC2D 576E 100B 518D 2F16 36B0 2805 3CB8 9250 2FA3 BC2D |
Re: VIM features
On Tue, Jan 01, 2002 at 02:56:58PM -0800, Caleb Shay wrote: I second this. For example, at the bottom of /etc/vim/vimrc there are several lines commented out as they cause vim to behave a lot different from regular vi. However, as was pointed out below, vim is NOT the default vi when you install, so why not enable some more of it's better features. After all, to make vim the alternative to vi you have to manually use update-alternatives. If you've gone through the trouble to do that you are obviously a vim user, not a vi user, so you WANT those features. Actually, vim does install as an alternative for vi. At less priority than nvi obviously since nvi is more pure. It used to install itself as like priority 100 for both that and /usr/bin/editor. Neither of those were terribly good things, and I am glad to see that they've changed since potato. -- Joseph Carter [EMAIL PROTECTED] Now I'll take over the world Change the Social Contract? BWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA. -- Branden Robinson pgpbKVMhVVig0.pgp Description: PGP signature
Re: VIM features
In article [EMAIL PROTECTED], Eduard Bloch [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I would like to see more user feedback on Debian's settings of the VIM editor. Currently, two important features are disabled in the default configurations: Syntax highlighting and special intending schemes. The question is: why? Because it's *EVIL* (hello Wichert ;) ) Wichert, would it be possible to only enable the line-wrapping auto-inserting syntax-highlighting coffee-making mode when vim is invoked as vim and leave it out when invoked as vi ? Mike.
Re: VIM features
Previously Miquel van Smoorenburg wrote: Because it's *EVIL* (hello Wichert ;) ) Ook gelukkig nieuwjaar Miquel :) Wichert, would it be possible to only enable the line-wrapping auto-inserting syntax-highlighting coffee-making mode when vim is invoked as vim and leave it out when invoked as vi ? Right now they're only enabled for a few specific filetypes (word-wrapping for emails for example). I doubt it's possible to figure out how vim is invoked in the scripts and change behaviour on that. Wichert. -- _ /[EMAIL PROTECTED] This space intentionally left occupied \ | [EMAIL PROTECTED]http://www.liacs.nl/~wichert/ | | 1024D/2FA3BC2D 576E 100B 518D 2F16 36B0 2805 3CB8 9250 2FA3 BC2D |
Re: VIM features
On Wed, 2 Jan 2002 12:40:11 +0100 Wichert Akkerman [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Right now they're only enabled for a few specific filetypes (word-wrapping for emails for example). I doubt it's possible to figure out how vim is invoked in the scripts and change behaviour on that. Is it not possible to create a vi wrapper script which contains something like the following? #!/bin/bash vim -C $@ regards, junichi
Re: VIM features
Previously Junichi Uekawa wrote: Is it not possible to create a vi wrapper script which contains something like the following? That doesn't make any difference since that is implied when you invoke vim as vi. Wichert. -- _ /[EMAIL PROTECTED] This space intentionally left occupied \ | [EMAIL PROTECTED]http://www.liacs.nl/~wichert/ | | 1024D/2FA3BC2D 576E 100B 518D 2F16 36B0 2805 3CB8 9250 2FA3 BC2D |
Re: VIM features
On Wed, 2 Jan 2002, Wichert Akkerman wrote: Previously Junichi Uekawa wrote: Is it not possible to create a vi wrapper script which contains something like the following? That doesn't make any difference since that is implied when you invoke vim as vi. Bah. But you know how does he mean. :) from that script you can check if it is invoked as vim/vi and maybe you can use the specific conf file. or whatever. -- VWOL Tamas SZERB [EMAIL PROTECTED] GPG public key: http://people.debian.org/~toma/gpgkey-toma.asc
Re: VIM features
Previously Eduard Bloch wrote: NOTE: this is not a start of a new holy war. I do not ask for giving vim's alternatives-entry a higher priority or so. I just want to use all VIM's features when I initially install it, without looking into my big config to enable intending or editing the vimrc file to enable highlighting. debian-devel is the wrong forum for this, debian-user would be much better. Wichert. -- _ /[EMAIL PROTECTED] This space intentionally left occupied \ | [EMAIL PROTECTED]http://www.liacs.nl/~wichert/ | | 1024D/2FA3BC2D 576E 100B 518D 2F16 36B0 2805 3CB8 9250 2FA3 BC2D |
Re: VIM features
On Tue, Jan 01, 2002 at 01:54:15PM +0100, Eduard Bloch wrote: | Hello, | | I would like to see more user feedback on Debian's settings of the | VIM editor. Currently, two important features are disabled in the | default configurations: Syntax highlighting and special intending | schemes. The question is: why? I think you'll have to ask the package maintainer about that. ([EMAIL PROTECTED]). | Some (influent) people want to make VIM behave as the normal vi. | But does this make sense? It does, depending on the environment. If many users of a system have used normal vi for a long time, and you want to convince them to install vim instead, it better behave the way they expect. You can, of course, configure it as you like while the other users stick with the traditional behavior. | VIM is either installed as the default | vi, nor does it have more priority in the alternatives entry. | Additionaly, many packages suggest nvi, so it is often installed as the | first vi editor and people often do not come in touch with vim. In this environment perhaps it doesn't make sense to default to compatibility settings. | NOTE: this is not a start of a new holy war. I do not ask for giving | vim's alternatives-entry a higher priority or so. I just want to use all | VIM's features when I initially install it, without looking into my | big config to enable intending or editing the vimrc file to enable | highlighting. My .vimrc is big enough already with autocommands for various filetypes and the like. I move it around with me to whichever systems I use, so for me it is not a big deal. -D -- A Microsoft Certified System Engineer is to information technology as a McDonalds Certified Food Specialist is to the culinary arts. Michael Bacarella commenting on the limited value of certification.
Re: VIM features
[EMAIL PROTECTED] (dman) writes: It does, depending on the environment. If many users of a system have used normal vi for a long time, and you want to convince them to install vim instead, it better behave the way they expect. Why do people insist on installing 'vim' as 'vi'? It isn't vi, and while I'm sure it's a perfectly reasonable editor, I've found if fairly disconcerting when I've stumbled onto a system where vim was masquerading as vi. Why not just install it as 'vim', use it as 'vim', and be happy? Bdale
Re: VIM features
Previously Bdale Garbee wrote: Why do people insist on installing 'vim' as 'vi'? It isn't vi, and while I'm sure it's a perfectly reasonable editor, I've found if fairly disconcerting when I've stumbled onto a system where vim was masquerading as vi. Why not just install it as 'vim', use it as 'vim', and be happy? Because vim is a perfectly normal vi if you invoke it as vi and use a standard configuration such as the Debian package tries to use. If it's not vi compatible in any way that is a bug and I would like to know about it. Wichert. -- _ /[EMAIL PROTECTED] This space intentionally left occupied \ | [EMAIL PROTECTED]http://www.liacs.nl/~wichert/ | | 1024D/2FA3BC2D 576E 100B 518D 2F16 36B0 2805 3CB8 9250 2FA3 BC2D |
Re: VIM features
I second this. For example, at the bottom of /etc/vim/vimrc there are several lines commented out as they cause vim to behave a lot different from regular vi. However, as was pointed out below, vim is NOT the default vi when you install, so why not enable some more of it's better features. After all, to make vim the alternative to vi you have to manually use update-alternatives. If you've gone through the trouble to do that you are obviously a vim user, not a vi user, so you WANT those features. Cheers, Caleb Shay On Tue, 2002-01-01 at 04:54, Eduard Bloch wrote: Hello, I would like to see more user feedback on Debian's settings of the VIM editor. Currently, two important features are disabled in the default configurations: Syntax highlighting and special intending schemes. The question is: why? Some (influent) people want to make VIM behave as the normal vi. But does this make sense? VIM is either installed as the default vi, nor does it have more priority in the alternatives entry. Additionaly, many packages suggest nvi, so it is often installed as the first vi editor and people often do not come in touch with vim. NOTE: this is not a start of a new holy war. I do not ask for giving vim's alternatives-entry a higher priority or so. I just want to use all VIM's features when I initially install it, without looking into my big config to enable intending or editing the vimrc file to enable highlighting. Gruss/Regards, Eduard. -- Computer sind nicht logisch, Windows98 auch nicht und beides zusammen, NaJaaa Mirko @ NBCGIGA 13.7.1999 signature.asc Description: This is a digitally signed message part
Re: VIM features
Previously Caleb Shay wrote: I second this. For example, at the bottom of /etc/vim/vimrc there are several lines commented out as they cause vim to behave a lot different from regular vi. However, as was pointed out below, vim is NOT the default vi when you install, so why not enable some more of it's better features. Because I'm not willing to for several reasons: 1. every time I enable a feature that makes vim a bit more unlike vi I get multiple bugreports 2. vim is very well documented, if people want to try any of its features they can trivially enable them themselves 3. which features you want enabled is a very personal choice, one that I am not willing to make for users. So I'll always pick the choice that makes vim more like stock vi. This keeps things consistent and prevents endless debates. Also, please keep this thread on debian-user instead of debian-devel, since the choice directly affects the user experience and is not related to Debian development. Wichert. -- _ /[EMAIL PROTECTED] This space intentionally left occupied \ | [EMAIL PROTECTED]http://www.liacs.nl/~wichert/ | | 1024D/2FA3BC2D 576E 100B 518D 2F16 36B0 2805 3CB8 9250 2FA3 BC2D |
Re: VIM features
Caleb Shay wrote: However, as was pointed out below, vim is NOT the default vi when you install, Only true if you install nvi (or some other higher-precedence vi clone), which isn't required. (g)vim is the only vi-like editor I have installed. Craig
Re: VIM features
On 01-Jan-02, 17:22 (CST), Craig Dickson [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Caleb Shay wrote: However, as was pointed out below, vim is NOT the default vi when you install, Only true if you install nvi (or some other higher-precedence vi clone), which isn't required. (g)vim is the only vi-like editor I have installed. Then you've gone out of your way to make it so. Nvi is standard, vim is optional. Also, vim is higher precedence than nvi. Steve
