Re: how long is 'pending'
Neil Williams [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: How long should bugs be tagged pending in advance of an upload? Is it acceptable to tag a bug pending when fixed upstream and the maintainer is confident of an upstream release in under a week? (This is easy for me, I'm also upstream in many cases. :-)) Does it depend on the severity of the bug? Does it depend on the priority of the package? (or the popcon score?) Does it depend on how many bugs are tagged pending for that package? Should the bug be tagged pending as soon as it has been fixed with a local test package, no matter what? I mark bugs as pending when I fixed them in cvs/svn/arch/git/whatever. For me pending means the next upload will have the fix included. Given the time between uploads for minor problems that can be a long time. A pending flag for e.g. a typo that's been there for a month is no big deal imho. MfG Goswin -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: how long is 'pending'
On Wednesday 16 May 2007 12:50, Neil Williams wrote: How long should bugs be tagged pending in advance of an upload? For me pending is a signal to users saying issue has been confirmed, solution is available and will be included with the next upload. It would IMO not be correct to mark a bug pending if it is fixed but not yet been released upstream (unless you plan to upload a fixed version based on current upstream). A relevant question is: how long can you reasonably delay uploading a package that has bugs that are marked pending. That IMO depends on the severity and type of the BR. The general Free Software rule is probably relevant here: release early, release often. But for example, it is not a huge problem to tag translation updates pending and not upload for a longish time. If there are other issues with the package (e.g. needs a new version of a library that's not yet available) that prevent an upload, that should not prevent you from setting a pending tag. Cheers, FJP pgpdLF8WDjJB8.pgp Description: PGP signature
Re: how long is 'pending'
On Wednesday 16 May 2007, Neil Williams wrote: How long should bugs be tagged pending in advance of an upload? To me pending means, a fix is applied and will be in the next upload/release (hence no further triaging needed on this bug). It says nothing about when the upload with the fix will take place -- Cheers, cobaco (aka Bart Cornelis) pgpwUqztPou16.pgp Description: PGP signature
Re: how long is 'pending'
On Wed, 16 May 2007, Neil Williams wrote: How long should bugs be tagged pending in advance of an upload? Time isn't the important metric, in my opinion. The question is whether the maintainer has fixed the bug (or believes they have fixed the bug) in their development environment and the fix will be present in the next upload. Is it acceptable to tag a bug pending when fixed upstream and the maintainer is confident of an upstream release in under a week? (This is easy for me, I'm also upstream in many cases. :-)) Yes. Does it depend on the severity of the bug? No. Does it depend on the priority of the package? (or the popcon score?) No. Does it depend on how many bugs are tagged pending for that package? No. Should the bug be tagged pending as soon as it has been fixed with a local test package, no matter what? Yes. At least in my opinion, the pending tag is useful for the maintainer to prioritize their work on bugs, as well as for other people who are trying to help the maintainer work on their bugs to avoid duplicating work. It says to everyone: I have fixed this bug; don't waste time on it. If a bug is pending for a very long time without an upload, then the maintainer probably should consider uploading more often, but sometimes there are things that keep that from happening. [For instance, debbugs has a lot of bugs which are pending primarily because I have a few more features/bugs which I have to fix before a new version can be released; right now it's held together with too much duct tape and spit for me to even countenance having it in experimental.] Don Armstrong -- One disk to rule them all, One disk to find them. One disk to bring them all and in the darkness grind them. In the Land of Redmond where the shadows lie. -- The Silicon Valley Tarot http://www.donarmstrong.com http://rzlab.ucr.edu -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: how long is 'pending'
Neil Williams [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: How long should bugs be tagged pending in advance of an upload? Is it acceptable to tag a bug pending when fixed upstream and the maintainer is confident of an upstream release in under a week? (This is easy for me, I'm also upstream in many cases. :-)) Does it depend on the severity of the bug? Does it depend on the priority of the package? (or the popcon score?) Does it depend on how many bugs are tagged pending for that package? Should the bug be tagged pending as soon as it has been fixed with a local test package, no matter what? I use pending to indicate fix found, tested, committed to the repository. This means there's no need for anyone to work on it. Whether the upload should be done ASAP or in the next couple of weeks depends on the severity of the bug. Regards, Frank -- Dr. Frank Küster Single Molecule Spectroscopy, Protein Folding @ Inst. f. Biochemie, Univ. Zürich Debian Developer (teTeX/TeXLive)
Re: how long is 'pending'
Frank Küster escreveu: Neil Williams [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: How long should bugs be tagged pending in advance of an upload? Is it acceptable to tag a bug pending when fixed upstream and the maintainer is confident of an upstream release in under a week? (This is easy for me, I'm also upstream in many cases. :-)) Does it depend on the severity of the bug? Does it depend on the priority of the package? (or the popcon score?) Does it depend on how many bugs are tagged pending for that package? Should the bug be tagged pending as soon as it has been fixed with a local test package, no matter what? I use pending to indicate fix found, tested, committed to the repository. This means there's no need for anyone to work on it. Whether the upload should be done ASAP or in the next couple of weeks depends on the severity of the bug. As basically a user and not a developper, when i found a tag pending i expect: - the bug is confirmed - there is a fix - the fix is going to be in the next upload. - next upload can take anykind of time ( time is not a friend of debian, as we all know) Regards, Frank -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: how long is 'pending'
On Wed, 16 May 2007 13:24:07 +0200 Frans Pop [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Wednesday 16 May 2007 12:50, Neil Williams wrote: How long should bugs be tagged pending in advance of an upload? For me pending is a signal to users saying issue has been confirmed, solution is available and will be included with the next upload. That's perfect for me too. It's a bug triage signal, not a time-limited notification. Suits me fine. It would IMO not be correct to mark a bug pending if it is fixed but not yet been released upstream (unless you plan to upload a fixed version based on current upstream). I think that's different if the DD is also upstream. Yes, if the DD is waiting for someone else to make the release, that could be a problem. (Especially with a large project that has slipped out of the 'release early, release often' approach that I share.) If there are other issues with the package (e.g. needs a new version of a library that's not yet available) that prevent an upload, that should not prevent you from setting a pending tag. Thanks to one and all for the quick replies - I think I'd tag this thread as pending at this point. :-) issue is resolved, no further work required unless something really big has been missed by the process so far -- Neil Williams = http://www.data-freedom.org/ http://www.nosoftwarepatents.com/ http://www.linux.codehelp.co.uk/ pgpcbz6Jg1u4O.pgp Description: PGP signature
Re: how long is 'pending'
On Wed, 16 May 2007, Don Armstrong wrote: On Wed, 16 May 2007, Neil Williams wrote: How long should bugs be tagged pending in advance of an upload? Time isn't the important metric, in my opinion. The question is whether the maintainer has fixed the bug (or believes they have fixed the bug) in their development environment and the fix will be present in the next upload. Baring any objections, I'm going to change the blurb that explains the pending tag now to the following: Indicates that the maintainer has fixed the bug (or believes they have fixed the bug) in their development tree and the next upload will include the fix for the bug. to remove the indication that pending means that a fix will necessarily be uploaded soon. Don Armstrong -- More than any other time in history, mankind faces a crossroads. One path leads to despair and utter hopelessness. The other, to total extinction. Let us pray we have the wisdom to choose correctly. -- Woody Allen http://www.donarmstrong.com http://rzlab.ucr.edu -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: how long is 'pending'
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 On Wed, May 16, 2007 at 01:24:07PM +0200, Frans Pop wrote: On Wednesday 16 May 2007 12:50, Neil Williams wrote: How long should bugs be tagged pending in advance of an upload? For me pending is a signal to users saying issue has been confirmed, solution is available and will be included with the next upload. It would IMO not be correct to mark a bug pending if it is fixed but not yet been released upstream (unless you plan to upload a fixed version based on current upstream). A relevant question is: how long can you reasonably delay uploading a package that has bugs that are marked pending. That IMO depends on the severity and type of the BR. The general Free Software rule is probably relevant here: release early, release often. would it be useful for some process to periodically poll the bts for 'pending' tags that are unusually old [ say 1 or 2 months ] and ping the maintainer to remind them if they forget to 'release often'? - -- | .''`. == Debian GNU/Linux == | my web site: | | : :' : The Universal |mysite.verizon.net/kevin.mark/| | `. `' Operating System| go to counter.li.org and | | `-http://www.debian.org/ |be counted! #238656 | | my keyserver: subkeys.pgp.net | my NPO: cfsg.org | |join the new debian-community.org to help Debian! | |___ Unless I ask to be CCd, assume I am subscribed ___| -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- Version: GnuPG v1.4.6 (GNU/Linux) iD8DBQFGSvyCv8UcC1qRZVMRAnm5AJ4uqxeK0cpJF52fAon1YLJ2WLfEogCgnMAp Zy6+a3WlOY2dxtS79bi1nHk= =p6Nd -END PGP SIGNATURE- -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: how long is 'pending'
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 On Wed, May 16, 2007 at 06:01:54AM -0700, Don Armstrong wrote: On Wed, 16 May 2007, Kevin Mark wrote: would it be useful for some process to periodically poll the bts for 'pending' tags that are unusually old [ say 1 or 2 months ] and ping the maintainer to remind them if they forget to 'release often'? I can't imagine a maintainer not being aware of bugs which they have fixed and have marked pending unless they had insane numbers of packages. I know that I personally would discard such a set of automated messages. That said, if it was opt-in or some sort of utility that a developer could run in a cronjob, someone may want it and it wouldn't be offensive to those of us who do not. [I think it's also appropriate for users who are affected by a bug to request that the developer release a fixed package, but that's done manually, not in an automated fashion.] The other idea was for a simple .../pending page on the bts so that folks could quickly see what is about to be fixed. - -- | .''`. == Debian GNU/Linux == | my web site: | | : :' : The Universal |mysite.verizon.net/kevin.mark/| | `. `' Operating System| go to counter.li.org and | | `-http://www.debian.org/ |be counted! #238656 | | my keyserver: subkeys.pgp.net | my NPO: cfsg.org | |join the new debian-community.org to help Debian! | |___ Unless I ask to be CCd, assume I am subscribed ___| -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- Version: GnuPG v1.4.6 (GNU/Linux) iD8DBQFGSwSmv8UcC1qRZVMRAmu4AJ9wb/Ae81RG1b43EUVwXcDziHdOzgCglxIl ZCjg+OWy6TsX8H3paqyV2eU= =2uUV -END PGP SIGNATURE- -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: how long is 'pending'
On Wed, 16 May 2007, Kevin Mark wrote: The other idea was for a simple .../pending page on the bts so that folks could quickly see what is about to be fixed. Just append ;pend-inc=pending-fixed; to your pkgreport.cgi url, like so: http://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/pkgreport.cgi?pkg=debbugs;dist=unstable;pend-inc=pending-fixed Don Armstrong -- Il semble que la perfection soit atteinte non quand il n'y a plus rien a ajouter, mais quand il n'y a plus rien a retrancher. (Perfection is apparently not achieved when nothing more can be added, but when nothing else can be removed.) -- Antoine de Saint-Exupe'ry, Terres des Hommes http://www.donarmstrong.com http://rzlab.ucr.edu -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
