Re: Bug#786980: heimdahl: german package translation misleading

[Don Armstrong]

On Sat, 10 Oct 2015, Holger Levsen wrote:
> On Freitag, 9. Oktober 2015, Holger Wansing wrote:
> > Andrei POPESCU  wrote:
> > > On Du, 04 oct 15, 13:08:04, Holger Levsen wrote:
> > > > so there is no way to track bugs in translated package descriptions?
> > > > That would be really sad.
> > > 
> > > I'm not aware of any, but then I'm also not familiar with the DDTP.
> > Wouldn't it be possible to deploy an usertag for that?
> 
> asking owner@... or do you have any other advice how to track bugs in 
> translated package descriptions?

I don't have a problem with the BTS being used, but it needs buy in from
the people actually doing the translation(s).

If a psuedopackage works, we can configure that.


-- 
Don Armstrong  http://www.donarmstrong.com

Re: Bug#786980: heimdahl: german package translation misleading

[Holger Wansing]

Hi,

Andrei POPESCU  wrote:
> On Sb, 10 oct 15, 10:22:27, Holger Levsen wrote:
> > 
> > I don't wanna translate. I have seen a severe bug in a package description 
> > translation which I would like to report (so that it get's tracked and 
> > fixed 
> > eventually), as it's misleading to the users. So I filed the bug against 
> > the 
> > package, which was closed as the description translation is not part of the 
> > package.
> > 
> > The translation of that package description  is still buggy, now what to do?
> 
> The DDTP wiki page acknowledges that it is missing bug tracking, but 
> considering that it hasn't seen much development in recent years and 
> what other infrastructure is available *now* the best thing I can think 
> of are pseudo-packages for each language team, e.g.

+1 for pseudo-packages

Even if it's a better workflow to just fix the issues you find in a
package description, instead of filing a bug, there will still be the 
possibility that people, who are not active in the Debian project, 
find issues in a package description. 
Having a proper place for them to report such issues would be good.

Of course, if has to be documented at some prominent place, so that normal 
users know, where to report issues in package descriptions.




Regards
Holger

-- 

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Re: Bug#786980: heimdahl: german package translation misleading

[Holger Levsen]

Hi Brian,

On Samstag, 10. Oktober 2015, Brian May wrote:
> On 2015-10-10 09:34, Holger Levsen wrote:
> > asking owner@... or do you have any other advice how to track bugs in
> > translated package descriptions?
> 
> Has anyone tried contacting the DDTP?
> 
> See https://wiki.debian.org/DDTP
> 
> In particular, the following might be applicable:
> 
> "If you like to translate a debian description send a mail to the ddts
> with the subject 'GET de 2' to pd...@ddtp.debian.net (replace 'de' with
> your requested language code). After this you get a mail with a
> attachement of two untranslated package descriptions. Translate this
> file and send it back as atachement."

I don't wanna translate. I have seen a severe bug in a package description 
translation which I would like to report (so that it get's tracked and fixed 
eventually), as it's misleading to the users. So I filed the bug against the 
package, which was closed as the description translation is not part of the 
package.

The translation of that package description  is still buggy, now what to do?


cheers,
Holger




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Re: Bug#786980: heimdahl: german package translation misleading

[Holger Levsen]

Hi,

On Samstag, 10. Oktober 2015, Helge Kreutzmann wrote:
> I did this quite frequently in the past and I would suggest fixing it
> this way (if it still works) instead of trying to find a way how to
> tag the bug.

filing (such) a bug takes less than a minute, fixing a translation of three 
sentences usually takes a lot more than 5min, rather 10-15min, and I'm out of 
time, so I will rather not do anything. Sorry.


cheers,
Holger


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Re: Bug#786980: heimdahl: german package translation misleading

[Helge Kreutzmann]

Hello Martin,
On Sat, Oct 10, 2015 at 11:02:07AM +0200, Martin Eberhard Schauer wrote:
> >> See https://wiki.debian.org/DDTP
> >>
> >> In particular, the following might be applicable:
> >>
> >> "If you like to translate a debian description send a mail to the ddts
> >> with the subject 'GET de 2' to pd...@ddtp.debian.net (replace 'de' with
> >> your requested language code). After this you get a mail with a
> >> attachement of two untranslated package descriptions. Translate this
> >> file and send it back as atachement."
> > I did this quite frequently in the past and I would suggest fixing it
> > this way (if it still works) instead of trying to find a way how to
> > tag the bug.
> 
> The wiki is not really helpful here. With 'GET de 2' one will get
> some random descriptions. The DDTP documentation in general should
> be reviewed and updated. The transfer from the package source to
> the DDTP and from there to the FTP archive is somewhere in the dark.
> After the release it usually takes month to modify and restart the
> responsible scripts.

Sorry for beeing imprecise. You can (could?) get specific translations
by e-mail with DDTP. Of course, you can also use the web interface
(which I simply find more cumbersome, as I do all my other translation
on the console/by e-mail).

Greetings

  Helge

-- 
  Dr. Helge Kreutzmann deb...@helgefjell.de
   Dipl.-Phys.   http://www.helgefjell.de/debian.php
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Re: Bug#786980: heimdahl: german package translation misleading

[Martin Eberhard Schauer]

Helge Kreutzmann wrote:

Hello,
On Sat, Oct 10, 2015 at 04:43:57PM +1100, Brian May wrote:

On 2015-10-10 09:34, Holger Levsen wrote:


asking owner@... or do you have any other advice how to track bugs in
translated package descriptions?

Has anyone tried contacting the DDTP?

See https://wiki.debian.org/DDTP

In particular, the following might be applicable:

"If you like to translate a debian description send a mail to the ddts
with the subject 'GET de 2' to pd...@ddtp.debian.net (replace 'de' with
your requested language code). After this you get a mail with a
attachement of two untranslated package descriptions. Translate this
file and send it back as atachement."

I did this quite frequently in the past and I would suggest fixing it
this way (if it still works) instead of trying to find a way how to
tag the bug.

Greetings

Helge

Re: Bug#786980: heimdahl: german package translation misleading

[Martin Eberhard Schauer]

Sorry, in the first mail I missed to paste the prepared answer.

>> See https://wiki.debian.org/DDTP
>>
>> In particular, the following might be applicable:
>>
>> "If you like to translate a debian description send a mail to the ddts
>> with the subject 'GET de 2' to pd...@ddtp.debian.net (replace 'de' with
>> your requested language code). After this you get a mail with a
>> attachement of two untranslated package descriptions. Translate this
>> file and send it back as atachement."
> I did this quite frequently in the past and I would suggest fixing it
> this way (if it still works) instead of trying to find a way how to
> tag the bug.

The wiki is not really helpful here. With 'GET de 2' one will get
some random descriptions. The DDTP documentation in general should
be reviewed and updated. The transfer from the package source to
the DDTP and from there to the FTP archive is somewhere in the dark.
After the release it usually takes month to modify and restart the
responsible scripts.

Better visit
https://ddtp.kleptog.org/ddtss/index.cgi/de,
go to
"Fetch specific description",
enter the name of the package
and mark "Force fetching even if not untranslated".

Or go to
http://ddtp.kleptog.org/ddt.cgi?package=$description
to download the appropriate file and prepare an
UTF-8 encoded translation file. The translation has to start with
"Description-de.UTF-8:".

I have pulled heimdal-client into the DDTP and changed the first
paragraph. One can vote for the change at

https://ddtp.kleptog.org/ddtss/index.cgi/de/forreview/heimdal-clients?167073 

Re: Bug#786980: heimdahl: german package translation misleading

[Helge Kreutzmann]

Hello Holger,
On Sat, Oct 10, 2015 at 10:39:03AM +0200, Holger Levsen wrote:
> On Samstag, 10. Oktober 2015, Helge Kreutzmann wrote:
> > I did this quite frequently in the past and I would suggest fixing it
> > this way (if it still works) instead of trying to find a way how to
> > tag the bug.
> 
> filing (such) a bug takes less than a minute, fixing a translation of three 
> sentences usually takes a lot more than 5min, rather 10-15min, and I'm out of 
> time, so I will rather not do anything. Sorry.

Well, of course that is your choice. But since those bugs are probably
not fixed (because maintainers cannot fix them (they do not speak the language
usually) and translators won't find them) you can also save those 5
minutes.

I would suggest simply sending the problematic translation by e-mail
to debian-l10n-german and hope that some translator who also works on
package translations will pick it up. This has the greatest chances of
getting the fix applied.

(And when I used the e-mail interface, the most time consuming task
was the actual fixing, so for trivial fixes I would be < 5 min
usually, but not consecutively, as of course I had to wait for the
e-mail to appear).

Greetings

Helge

-- 
  Dr. Helge Kreutzmann deb...@helgefjell.de
   Dipl.-Phys.   http://www.helgefjell.de/debian.php
64bit GNU powered gpg signed mail preferred
   Help keep free software "libre": http://www.ffii.de/


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Re: Bug#786980: heimdahl: german package translation misleading

[Andrei POPESCU]

On Sb, 10 oct 15, 10:22:27, Holger Levsen wrote:
> 
> I don't wanna translate. I have seen a severe bug in a package description 
> translation which I would like to report (so that it get's tracked and fixed 
> eventually), as it's misleading to the users. So I filed the bug against the 
> package, which was closed as the description translation is not part of the 
> package.
> 
> The translation of that package description  is still buggy, now what to do?

The DDTP wiki page acknowledges that it is missing bug tracking, but 
considering that it hasn't seen much development in recent years and 
what other infrastructure is available *now* the best thing I can think 
of are pseudo-packages for each language team, e.g.

Kind regards,
Andrei
-- 
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Offtopic discussions among Debian users and developers:
http://lists.alioth.debian.org/mailman/listinfo/d-community-offtopic
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Re: Bug#786980: heimdahl: german package translation misleading

[Helge Kreutzmann]

Hello,
On Sat, Oct 10, 2015 at 04:43:57PM +1100, Brian May wrote:
> On 2015-10-10 09:34, Holger Levsen wrote: 
> 
> > asking owner@... or do you have any other advice how to track bugs in 
> > translated package descriptions?
> 
> Has anyone tried contacting the DDTP? 
> 
> See https://wiki.debian.org/DDTP 
> 
> In particular, the following might be applicable: 
> 
> "If you like to translate a debian description send a mail to the ddts
> with the subject 'GET de 2' to pd...@ddtp.debian.net (replace 'de' with
> your requested language code). After this you get a mail with a
> attachement of two untranslated package descriptions. Translate this
> file and send it back as atachement." 

I did this quite frequently in the past and I would suggest fixing it
this way (if it still works) instead of trying to find a way how to
tag the bug.

Greetings

   Helge

-- 
  Dr. Helge Kreutzmann deb...@helgefjell.de
   Dipl.-Phys.   http://www.helgefjell.de/debian.php
64bit GNU powered gpg signed mail preferred
   Help keep free software "libre": http://www.ffii.de/


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Re: Bug#786980: heimdahl: german package translation misleading

[Holger Wansing]

Hi,

Andrei POPESCU  wrote:
> On Du, 04 oct 15, 13:08:04, Holger Levsen wrote:
> > 
> > so there is no way to track bugs in translated package descriptions? That 
> > would be really sad.
> 
> I'm not aware of any, but then I'm also not familiar with the DDTP.

Wouldn't it be possible to deploy an usertag for that?


My 5 cents

Holger
-- 

Created with Sylpheed 3.5.0 under
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Re: Bug#786980: heimdahl: german package translation misleading

[Holger Levsen]

Hi,

On Sonntag, 4. Oktober 2015, Andrei POPESCU wrote:
> > the package description reads
> > 
> >  Heimdal is a free implementation of Kerberos 5 that aims to be
> >  compatible with MIT Kerberos.
> > 
> > which is translated to German as
> > 
> >  Heimdal ist eine freie Implementierung von Kerberos 5, die mit MIT
> >  Kerberos kompatibel sein soll.
> > 
> > which means something else, roughly "that it should be compatible" (but
> > probably is not).
> > 
> > Better:
> >  Heimdal ist eine freie Implementierung von Kerberos 5, die
> >  Kompatibilität mit MIT Kerberos anstrebt.
> 
> Translations of the package description are not under control of the
> package maintainer, closing.

sigh. 

so there is no way to track bugs in translated package descriptions? That 
would be really sad.
 
> Andrei (just one of the people looking after bugs reported against
> unknown packages)

thanks for caring!


cheers,
Holger




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Re: Bug#786980: heimdahl: german package translation misleading

[Andrei POPESCU]

On Mi, 27 mai 15, 13:57:08, Holger Levsen wrote:
> package: heimdahl
> severity: minor
> x-debbugs-cc: debian-l10n-german@lists.debian.org
> 
> Hi,
> 
> the package description reads 
> 
>  Heimdal is a free implementation of Kerberos 5 that aims to be
>  compatible with MIT Kerberos.
> 
> which is translated to German as
> 
>  Heimdal ist eine freie Implementierung von Kerberos 5, die mit MIT
>  Kerberos kompatibel sein soll.
> 
> which means something else, roughly "that it should be compatible" (but 
> probably is not).
> 
> Better:
> 
>  Heimdal ist eine freie Implementierung von Kerberos 5, die Kompatibilität
>  mit MIT Kerberos anstrebt.

Translations of the package description are not under control of the 
package maintainer, closing.

Kind regards,
Andrei (just one of the people looking after bugs reported against 
unknown packages)
-- 
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Offtopic discussions among Debian users and developers:
http://lists.alioth.debian.org/mailman/listinfo/d-community-offtopic
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Re: Bug#786980: heimdahl: german package translation misleading

[Andrei POPESCU]

On Du, 04 oct 15, 13:08:04, Holger Levsen wrote:
> 
> so there is no way to track bugs in translated package descriptions? That 
> would be really sad.

I'm not aware of any, but then I'm also not familiar with the DDTP.

Kind regards,
Andrei
-- 
http://wiki.debian.org/FAQsFromDebianUser
Offtopic discussions among Debian users and developers:
http://lists.alioth.debian.org/mailman/listinfo/d-community-offtopic
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Bug#786980: heimdahl: german package translation misleading

[Holger Levsen]

package: heimdahl
severity: minor
x-debbugs-cc: debian-l10n-german@lists.debian.org

Hi,

the package description reads 

 Heimdal is a free implementation of Kerberos 5 that aims to be
 compatible with MIT Kerberos.

which is translated to German as

 Heimdal ist eine freie Implementierung von Kerberos 5, die mit MIT
 Kerberos kompatibel sein soll.

which means something else, roughly that it should be compatible (but 
probably is not).

Better:

 Heimdal ist eine freie Implementierung von Kerberos 5, die Kompatibilität
 mit MIT Kerberos anstrebt.


cheers,
Holger


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