Public Domain again
http://opensource.org/faq#public-domain http://opensource.org/faq#cc0 Public domain is not a license, its meaning depends on the country you're in. What if that country applies laws that violate DFSG ? Please enlighten me. Jérémy. -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-legal-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/510a78e2.4070...@melix.org
Re: Public Domain again
Jérémy. Public domain is not a license, its meaning depends on the country you're in. What if that country applies laws that violate DFSG ? Please enlighten me. Why? Does this affect any software that you're packaging? Short answer: any software in that country is not free software, but the bug is with the country's legal system, not Debian. Hope that helps, -- MJR/slef My Opinion Only: see http://people.debian.org/~mjr/ Please follow http://www.uk.debian.org/MailingLists/#codeofconduct -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-legal-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/e1u0z95-00073q...@bletchley.towers.org.uk
Re: Public Domain again
On 31/01/2013 19:45, MJ Ray wrote: Jérémy. Public domain is not a license, its meaning depends on the country you're in. What if that country applies laws that violate DFSG ? Please enlighten me. Why? Does this affect any software that you're packaging? Not particularly. Some packages i can see sometimes have public domain files in them. Short answer: any software in that country is not free software, but the bug is with the country's legal system, not Debian. Will you still be uploading to main, if one day it becomes illegal in your own country ? Jérémy. -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-legal-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/510abe44.9090...@melix.org
Re: Public Domain again
Jérémy Lal kapo...@melix.org writes: Will you still be uploading to main, if one day it becomes illegal in your own country ? Are you taking a poll? Or is there particular interest in MJ Ray's answer? What is the actual issue you're addressing with starting this thread? -- \ “Think for yourselves and let others enjoy the privilege to do | `\ so too.” —Voltaire, _Essay On Tolerance_ | _o__) | Ben Finney -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-legal-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/7w7gmt2e2x@benfinney.id.au
Re: Public Domain again
On 31/01/2013 23:16, Ben Finney wrote: Jérémy Lal kapo...@melix.org writes: Will you still be uploading to main, if one day it becomes illegal in your own country ? Are you taking a poll? Or is there particular interest in MJ Ray's answer? No. What is the actual issue you're addressing with starting this thread? My issue is that i don't understand how public domain is DFSG, and the consequence is that i cannot handle it properly in debian packages. For example, reading [0]: When the License field in a paragraph has the short name public-domain, the remaining lines of the field must explain exactly what exemption the corresponding files for that paragraph have from default copyright restrictions. This debian/copyright paragraph doesn't follow that requirement : Files: * License: public-domain How can i tell it's a mistake if i can't explain what's wrong ? Jérémy. [0] http://www.debian.org/doc/packaging-manuals/copyright-format/1.0/#public-domain -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-legal-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/510b043a.7060...@melix.org
Re: Public Domain again
On Fri, 01 Feb 2013, Jérémy Lal wrote: My issue is that i don't understand how public domain is DFSG, If a work can actually be placed into the public domain, then that usually means that it has no copyright, and therefore automatically satisfies the DFSG so long as there is source. In countries where this isn't the case,[1] then it may not, but Debian has never claimed to be able to work around all countries broken legal systems. Beyond that, I'm afraid I'm unable to follow what you're asking for, exactly. Don Armstrong -- Some pirates achieved immortality by great deeds of cruelty or daring-do. Some achieved immortality by amassing great wealth. But the captain had long ago decided that he would, on the whole, prefer to achieve immortality by not dying. -- Terry Pratchet _The Color of Magic_ http://www.donarmstrong.com http://rzlab.ucr.edu -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-legal-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/20130201002521.gn30...@teltox.donarmstrong.com
Re: Public Domain again
On Thu, Jan 31, 2013 at 04:25:21PM -0800, Don Armstrong wrote: On Fri, 01 Feb 2013, Jérémy Lal wrote: My issue is that i don't understand how public domain is DFSG, If a work can actually be placed into the public domain, then that usually means that it has no copyright, and therefore automatically satisfies the DFSG so long as there is source. In countries where this isn't the case,[1] then it may not, but Debian has never claimed to be able to work around all countries broken legal systems. Beyond that, I'm afraid I'm unable to follow what you're asking for, exactly. Don Armstrong In addition, I'd like to note that's what CC0 is for, really. It has some neat fall-back clauses that trigger in the event a jurisdiction doesn't allow for public domain works as such, and also releases database rights[1] which some other public domain dedications may not :) -- Some pirates achieved immortality by great deeds of cruelty or daring-do. Some achieved immortality by amassing great wealth. But the captain had long ago decided that he would, on the whole, prefer to achieve immortality by not dying. -- Terry Pratchet _The Color of Magic_ http://www.donarmstrong.com http://rzlab.ucr.edu -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-legal-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/20130201002521.gn30...@teltox.donarmstrong.com Cheers, Paul [1]: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Database_right -- .''`. Paul Tagliamonte paul...@debian.org : :' : Proud Debian Developer `. `'` 4096R / 8F04 9AD8 2C92 066C 7352 D28A 7B58 5B30 807C 2A87 `- http://people.debian.org/~paultag signature.asc Description: Digital signature
Re: Public Domain again
On 01/02/2013 01:25, Don Armstrong wrote: On Fri, 01 Feb 2013, Jérémy Lal wrote: My issue is that i don't understand how public domain is DFSG, If a work can actually be placed into the public domain Does this mean there are cases where the work cannot actually be placed into the public domain ? To be practical, are these files all right to be listed as 'public-domain' in debian/copyright : * without copyright notice * with a short notice 'There is no licence for this, I don't care what you do with it' * without copyright notice, and an explicit 'this code is under public domain' * the same as above, but with a copyright name year next to it, (i made that last example, to be sure i get it) then that usually means that it has no copyright, and therefore automatically satisfies the DFSG so long as there is source. In countries where this isn't the case,[1] then it may not, but Debian has never claimed to be able to work around all countries broken legal systems. Beyond that, I'm afraid I'm unable to follow what you're asking for, exactly. I would have been clearer by asking an answer about the examples above... Sorry for the noise. Jérémy. -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-legal-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/510b149a.2080...@melix.org
Re: Public Domain again
On Fri, Feb 01, 2013 at 02:04:26AM +0100, Jérémy Lal wrote: On 01/02/2013 01:25, Don Armstrong wrote: On Fri, 01 Feb 2013, Jérémy Lal wrote: My issue is that i don't understand how public domain is DFSG, If a work can actually be placed into the public domain Does this mean there are cases where the work cannot actually be placed into the public domain ? In *most* jurisdictions, it appears to not be possible for a copyright holder to release their work into the public domain. That's why CC0 exists as a workaround, to make a pseudo-public domain dedication of a work. Works that are genuinely in the public domain (because they are old enough, or because they were produced under circumstances which do not result in copyright attaching to the work in the first place) are definitely DFSG-free. They also have *no* license, because there is no one you need to ask permission from! To be practical, are these files all right to be listed as 'public-domain' in debian/copyright : * without copyright notice Yes; * with a short notice 'There is no licence for this, I don't care what you do with it' no (this is not a statement that it's in the public domain, and there is no license implies no permission is actually granted); * without copyright notice, and an explicit 'this code is under public domain' yes, provided this is true; * the same as above, but with a copyright name year next to it, (i made that last example, to be sure i get it) no, because these are contradictory statements. Public domain means *the absence of copyright*. If someone is claiming the work to both be in public domain and covered by copyright, they have failed to understand and we must assume the work is under copyright with no license grant. Hope that helps, -- Steve Langasek Give me a lever long enough and a Free OS Debian Developer to set it on, and I can move the world. Ubuntu Developerhttp://www.debian.org/ slanga...@ubuntu.com vor...@debian.org signature.asc Description: Digital signature
Re: Public Domain again
On Fri, Feb 01, 2013 at 02:04:26AM +0100, Jérémy Lal wrote: To be practical, are these files all right to be listed as 'public-domain' in debian/copyright : * without copyright notice Not public domain. Copyrighted without license. If the author hasn't stated anything, then the work is copyrighted. * with a short notice 'There is no licence for this, I don't care what you do with it' Not public domain. Copyrighted without license. The part There is no licence for this explicitly states that there is no license, although the part I don't care what you do with it somewhat sounds like a license. * without copyright notice, and an explicit 'this code is under public domain' This looks like a work in the public domain. * the same as above, but with a copyright name year next to it, (i made that last example, to be sure i get it) Not public domain. Copyrighted with a statement that could be interpreted as a license. The author apparently meant to allow anyone to use the work as if it were in the public domain. Regards, Bart Martens -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-legal-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/20130201060414.gb28...@master.debian.org
