Re: Computer with Debian preinstalled
In message [EMAIL PROTECTED], Michael Bode [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes Hi, I'm planning to sell PCs with a preinstalled Debian system. This in itself should not be problematic, I guess. But do I have to handle sources? GPL section 3 requires me to either include all sources of the installed GPL binaries or give a written offer to ship the sources on CD/DVD/whatever media. Is that correct, or is it ok to say 'look, it's Debian on that machine, go to debian.org for the sources'? What are other people who sell PCs with preinstalled Debian doing? If you're selling PCs as a business, YOU CAN'T say go to debian.org (or you might be able to but you're taking a massive risk!) If I give a PC with Debian pre-installed to a friend, I can say go to Debian.org because I'm covered by the non-commercial bit. But if you're a business, then YOU are liable to provide the source. If the download site goes away and you haven't made a copy, you're sunk. You have legal obligations and you can't meet them. You're in deep doodoo if someone calls you on them. So you NEED to make a copy. And once you've done that, you might as well burn a CD/DVD for every PC you sell. If you do that, then when they come to you saying I demand my copy of the source that the GPL says you have to give me, you can say you got it with the PC. If you've lost it, tough luck. Not that I'd advise being that harsh to your customers, but at least you can legally say shove off without being in breach of the licence (good customer relations says you should say okay, I'll burn you another copy :-) Cheers, Wol -- Anthony W. Youngman - [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Computer with Debian preinstalled
On Fri, Jun 15, 2007 at 07:17:44PM +0100, Anthony W. Youngman wrote: If you're selling PCs as a business, YOU CAN'T say go to debian.org (or you might be able to but you're taking a massive risk!) If I give a PC with Debian pre-installed to a friend, I can say go to Debian.org because I'm covered by the non-commercial bit. If you are talking about the GPLv2, I'll have to disagree. You are only covered by clause 3c when you have received the promise for source code as of 3b. But since Debian offers you access to copy the source code by the same designated place as the binary you copied, it has distributed you the source code as of 3a. Some people usually mirror only binaries and they are distributing as of 3b. I still usually recommend these people to include sources. If they do not have enough storage, they should remove some binaries. This way they are protected. That is the same recommendation you and some other people just did to this case. If you can't provide source code whithin three years of last distributing the binaries, you are in a bad situation. Cheers, Wol -- Anthony W. Youngman - [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Computer with Debian preinstalled
[EMAIL PROTECTED] schrieb/wrote: I think the most practical solution would be to write an offer saying To obtain the source code for the software on your system, send $5 to cover postage and media costs to Michael Bode, insert address. You can also obtain the source code online... list instructions for downloading sources. Just saying 'download the sources' does not meet the requirements of GPLv2. Writing an offer means that you won't have to worry about it until someone actually requests it. That's a bad idea. What if the download site goes away after, say, 30 months and only then someone makes a request because he was unable to download it from the net? It you haven't wasted any thought on archiving the sources, you have a reason to be worried then. Claus -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Computer with Debian preinstalled
Don Armstrong [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: We can't really give you legal advice, but if I were you, I'd include with the computer media containing the binary packages that you've installed along with the corresponding source code. Ok, I will probably include a CD with the sources, because this is going to be some kind of 'embedded' PC with a reduced (i.e. no typical desktop) system and only a CF card and no hard disk or optical drive. -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Computer with Debian preinstalled
Michael Bode [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Ok, I will probably include a CD with the sources, because this is going to be some kind of 'embedded' PC with a reduced (i.e. no typical desktop) system and only a CF card and no hard disk or optical drive. That's the simplest way to satisfy the GPL unambiguously in that type of distribution, yes. Good luck with your endeavour. -- \I installed a skylight in my apartment. The people who live | `\ above me are furious! -- Steven Wright | _o__) | Ben Finney -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Computer with Debian preinstalled
Hi, I'm planning to sell PCs with a preinstalled Debian system. This in itself should not be problematic, I guess. But do I have to handle sources? GPL section 3 requires me to either include all sources of the installed GPL binaries or give a written offer to ship the sources on CD/DVD/whatever media. Is that correct, or is it ok to say 'look, it's Debian on that machine, go to debian.org for the sources'? What are other people who sell PCs with preinstalled Debian doing? Thanks in advance. -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Computer with Debian preinstalled
Hi, On 6/2/07, Michael Bode [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hi, I'm planning to sell PCs with a preinstalled Debian system. This in itself should not be problematic, I guess. But do I have to handle sources? GPL section 3 requires me to either include all sources of the installed GPL binaries or give a written offer to ship the sources on CD/DVD/whatever media. Is that correct, or is it ok to say 'look, it's Debian on that machine, go to debian.org for the sources'? What are other people who sell PCs with preinstalled Debian doing? Thanks in advance. I think the most practical solution would be to write an offer saying To obtain the source code for the software on your system, send $5 to cover postage and media costs to Michael Bode, insert address. You can also obtain the source code online... list instructions for downloading sources. Just saying 'download the sources' does not meet the requirements of GPLv2. Writing an offer means that you won't have to worry about it until someone actually requests it. -- Andrew Donnellan ajdlinuxATgmailDOTcom (primary)ajdlinuxATexemailDOTcomDOTau (secure) http://andrewdonnellan.com http://ajdlinux.wordpress.com [EMAIL PROTECTED] hkp://subkeys.pgp.net 0x5D4C0C58 http://linux.org.auhttp://debian.org Get free rewards - http://ezyrewards.com/?id=23484 Spammers only === [EMAIL PROTECTED] === -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Computer with Debian preinstalled
On Sat, 02 Jun 2007, Michael Bode wrote: I'm planning to sell PCs with a preinstalled Debian system. This in itself should not be problematic, I guess. But do I have to handle sources? GPL section 3 requires me to either include all sources of the installed GPL binaries or give a written offer to ship the sources on CD/DVD/whatever media. Is that correct, or is it ok to say 'look, it's Debian on that machine, go to debian.org for the sources'? What are other people who sell PCs with preinstalled Debian doing? We can't really give you legal advice, but if I were you, I'd include with the computer media containing the binary packages that you've installed along with the corresponding source code. Alternatively, you could just have the source code present on the machine itself if you didn't provide media at all. Using a written offer for source is also possible, but it means that you have to keep around the source code for three years; by including it with the computer, you can ship it and forget it. [This is one reason why Debian has the source code for all of main on the same servers that the binary packages are served from.] Don Armstrong -- Dropping non-free would set us back at least, what, 300 packages? It'd take MONTHS to make up the difference, and meanwhile Debian users will be fleeing to SLACKWARE. And what about SHAREHOLDER VALUE? -- Matt Zimmerman in [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.donarmstrong.com http://rzlab.ucr.edu -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
