Re: unusable examples in apckages ...
On Sat, Jun 03, 2000 at 01:17:08PM -0300, Nicolás Lichtmaier wrote: Well, in the mlgtk package i maintain, i have the Makefile gunzipping the needed file automatically, and make clean gziping them again. (i also have a make clean in the example dir during prerm, so dpkg will remove the correct files). I think something such as that is a good solution, since the files can still be installed gzipped, and only someone who wants to test them will unzip this, thus using less space in /usr ... No. We must not encourage users to work in /usr/... . I even think that having those files unuseable is good for that, it makes users copy them elsewhere. Well, /usr/share/... is read only for the user anyway, so he will need to copy them over to /tmp or his work directory anytway. Once this is done he should only need to type make or ./configure. Or else the way of use the example should be written in some kind of how_to_use ... Friendly, Sven LUTHER
Re: unusable examples in apckages ...
Well, in the mlgtk package i maintain, i have the Makefile gunzipping the needed file automatically, and make clean gziping them again. (i also have a make clean in the example dir during prerm, so dpkg will remove the correct files). I think something such as that is a good solution, since the files can still be installed gzipped, and only someone who wants to test them will unzip this, thus using less space in /usr ... No. We must not encourage users to work in /usr/... . I even think that having those files unuseable is good for that, it makes users copy them elsewhere.
unusable examples in apckages ...
Hello, ... i don't know if this is the right place to speak about this, so if i am wrong, please direct me to the right place. I noticed that various packages include (specially -dev packages) includes examples in the /usr/share/doc/package directory. Often this examples will just be copies of the directory in the source tree, which is totally unusable once installed. It is unusable, because the example directory makes the assumption that the directory is in the source tree, and uses files from the upper directory to compile (example is libsdl1.0-dev, install it and go to the /usr/share/doc/libsdl1.0-dev/examples/test directory, and try to build that). Also often the above mentioned exampels comes not yet passed trough automake/autoconf and friends, which could hinder not a few users to make use of them. Thus i think it would be nice that something like the following becomes debian policy : -- if a package contains examples that need to be compiled, they must be in such a state in the package that the user can just copy the directory to its home directory (or /tmp/ or wherever) and build the examples with no more hassle than typing ./configure and/or make. -- You can have a look at the mlgtk package to see one package that conforms to the above mentioned rule. it is found at /usr/share/doc/mlgtk/examples and even uncompress the files when building, and decompress them when doing make clean, leaving the package in a neat state (well dpkg handles badly when you change a xxx.gz file by a xxx file.). Please cc any mail to me, as i don't read this mailing list. Friendly, Svne LUTHER
Re: unusable examples in apckages ...
-- if a package contains examples that need to be compiled, they must be in such a state in the package that the user can just copy the directory to its home directory (or /tmp/ or wherever) and build the examples with no more hassle than typing ./configure and/or make. -- Perhaps gunzip * should be added to that list.
Re: unusable examples in apckages ...
On Tue, May 30, 2000 at 11:58:58AM +0200, Sven LUTHER wrote: I noticed that various packages include (specially -dev packages) includes examples in the /usr/share/doc/package directory. Often this examples will just be copies of the directory in the source tree, which is totally unusable once installed. Erm, so file bugs against the appropriate packages. Has this been unsuccessful? Cheers, aj -- Anthony Towns [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://azure.humbug.org.au/~aj/ I don't speak for anyone save myself. GPG encrypted mail preferred. ``We reject: kings, presidents, and voting. We believe in: rough consensus and working code.'' -- Dave Clark pgpzPNndSAv8i.pgp Description: PGP signature
Re: unusable examples in apckages ...
On Tue, May 30, 2000 at 08:17:46AM -0300, Nicolás Lichtmaier wrote: -- if a package contains examples that need to be compiled, they must be in such a state in the package that the user can just copy the directory to its home directory (or /tmp/ or wherever) and build the examples with no more hassle than typing ./configure and/or make. -- Perhaps gunzip * should be added to that list. Well, in the mlgtk package i maintain, i have the Makefile gunzipping the needed file automatically, and make clean gziping them again. (i also have a make clean in the example dir during prerm, so dpkg will remove the correct files). I think something such as that is a good solution, since the files can still be installed gzipped, and only someone who wants to test them will unzip this, thus using less space in /usr ... Friendly, Sven LUTHER
Re: unusable examples in apckages ...
On Tue, May 30, 2000 at 09:22:25PM +1000, Anthony Towns wrote: On Tue, May 30, 2000 at 11:58:58AM +0200, Sven LUTHER wrote: I noticed that various packages include (specially -dev packages) includes examples in the /usr/share/doc/package directory. Often this examples will just be copies of the directory in the source tree, which is totally unusable once installed. Erm, so file bugs against the appropriate packages. Has this been unsuccessful? I just filled a bug against libsdl1.0-dev, but i think there are lots of package with this kind of problem (gtkglarea i think too) and maintianer are maybe not aware of this. Also i have right now not the time to look at all packages, and see if the examples are buildable, and report a bug if not. Could a check for this be included in lintian maybe ? Friendly, Svne LUTHER
Re: unusable examples in apckages ...
On Tue, May 30, 2000 at 11:58:58AM +0200, Sven LUTHER wrote: -- if a package contains examples that need to be compiled, they must be in such a state in the package that the user can just copy the directory to its home directory (or /tmp/ or wherever) and build the examples with no more hassle than typing ./configure and/or make. -- You are saying that every (source) example/ directory requires a Makefile? Please don't CC me. I'm on this mailing list. -- %%% Antti-Juhani Kaijanaho % [EMAIL PROTECTED] % http://www.iki.fi/gaia/ %%%
Re: unusable examples in apckages ...
On Tue, May 30, 2000 at 02:01:55PM +0200, Sven LUTHER wrote: not every user is aware of all that needs done to use a -dev package, that is what the examples are for, and they should be useable by the user. Not all such examples are for -dev packages. -- %%% Antti-Juhani Kaijanaho % [EMAIL PROTECTED] % http://www.iki.fi/gaia/ %%%
Re: unusable examples in apckages ...
Sven LUTHER [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: -- if a package contains examples that need to be compiled, they must be in such a state in the package that the user can just copy the directory to its home directory (or /tmp/ or wherever) and build the examples with no more hassle than typing ./configure and/or make. -- I think must is too strong for this; it's a good requirement, but I think it should be a should. (Note that if this becomes a must, the easiest way to bring a package into compliance is just to remove any examples. I'd rather have it as should because I'd rather see uncompilable examples (I could at least read the source code) than no examples at all.) Carl Witty p.s. I am not a Debian developer.
Re: unusable examples in apckages ...
On Tue, May 30, 2000 at 12:27:59PM -0700, Carl R. Witty wrote: (Note that if this becomes a must, the easiest way to bring a package into compliance is just to remove any examples. I'd rather have it as should because I'd rather see uncompilable examples (I could at least read the source code) than no examples at all.) This is exactly what I've done with the latest gtkglarea packages. The README.Debian listed compile flags that could have been used to compile the examples (simple things with no build dependencies), but there were a number of bug reports about being unable to type make, so I've deleted them and recommended apt-get source gtkglarea4-dev instead. This has some advantages over putting the examples in the -dev: it goes in the archive once rather than architectures+1 times, it doesn't occupy space where it isn't needed (the -dev.deb is smaller), it builds in it's native hierarchy (not some debian-specific hack), and source files are uncompressed and owned by the installing user, not root. And it's very easy to do for both the maintainer and the user - easier than cp -r /usr/doc/package/examples package-examples ; gunzip -r package-examples anyway.
