Re: Please test Macintosh keyboards with xkb-data 0.8-12exp1
On Thu, Sep 07, 2006 at 10:52:05PM +0200, Yannick Roehlly wrote: Yannick Roehlly wrote: On the French layout, the / and @/# keys are swapted. I just noticed that that's the meaning of Since all reports so far complained that LSGT and TLDE keys are swapped, this is now the default. If this breaks your keyboard, please speak up. Exactly ;) Is there an option to revert to the previous layout? You can set model to macintosh_old2, this is a workaround until we find exactly which models need swapped keys. Can you please cat /proc/cpuinfo and send its output? Denis -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Please test Macintosh keyboards with xkb-data 0.8-12exp1
On Fri, 2006-09-08 at 08:46 +0200, Denis Barbier wrote: You can set model to macintosh_old2, this is a workaround until we find exactly which models need swapped keys. Can you please cat /proc/cpuinfo and send its output? FWIW, IIRC this may actually be a kernel issue (its keyboard type detection is incomplete / buggy), so I'm not sure it can be solved at the XKB level without explicit configuration. -- Earthling Michel Dänzer | http://tungstengraphics.com Libre software enthusiast | Debian, X and DRI developer
Re: Please test Macintosh keyboards with xkb-data 0.8-12exp1
On Fri, Sep 08, 2006 at 10:36:14AM +0200, Michel Dänzer wrote: On Fri, 2006-09-08 at 08:46 +0200, Denis Barbier wrote: You can set model to macintosh_old2, this is a workaround until we find exactly which models need swapped keys. Can you please cat /proc/cpuinfo and send its output? FWIW, IIRC this may actually be a kernel issue (its keyboard type detection is incomplete / buggy), so I'm not sure it can be solved at the XKB level without explicit configuration. Do you have any proposal for model names? AFAICT there are 3 keyboard models: - macintosh_old (ADB) - macintosh (keycodes are similar to PC ones) - macbook(ditto, except for 2 keys: TLDE=94 and LSGT=49) My feeling is that macbook name is misleading (because older *book needs it too), and new models all are of this type, so it could be the default. In 0.8-12exp1 I renamed those models into: - macintosh_old (ADB) - macintosh_old2 (keycodes are similar to PC ones) - macintosh (ditto, except for 2 keys: TLDE=94 and LSGT=49) I need help to find good model names, of course macintosh_old2 is only a temporary name to make experiments. Denis -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Please test Macintosh keyboards with xkb-data 0.8-12exp1
On Fri, 2006-09-08 at 11:42 +0200, Denis Barbier wrote: On Fri, Sep 08, 2006 at 10:36:14AM +0200, Michel Dänzer wrote: On Fri, 2006-09-08 at 08:46 +0200, Denis Barbier wrote: You can set model to macintosh_old2, this is a workaround until we find exactly which models need swapped keys. Can you please cat /proc/cpuinfo and send its output? FWIW, IIRC this may actually be a kernel issue (its keyboard type detection is incomplete / buggy), so I'm not sure it can be solved at the XKB level without explicit configuration. Do you have any proposal for model names? I'm not sure a model will cut it either. Here's my recollection of the problem: The hardware keycodes of these keys can be swapped, depending on layout and maybe other factors (IIRC it's about ISO vs. other variants of ADB keyboards). The kernel should detect this and always generate the same PC-style keycodes, but fails to do so in some cases. I think the keyboard type can be deferred from dmesg|grep 'adb devices' but I forget how exactly. So maybe this should be handled via layout/variant/option. Don't take my word for it though; I haven't sacrificed any neurons on this for a couple of years, and my memory is fuzzy. I hope this will help someone else dig out more information though. -- Earthling Michel Dänzer | http://tungstengraphics.com Libre software enthusiast | Debian, X and DRI developer
Re: Please test Macintosh keyboards with xkb-data 0.8-12exp1
Hi Denis, Denis Barbier wrote: You can set model to macintosh_old2, this is a workaround until we find exactly which models need swapped keys. Well, if I do a setxkbmap -rules xorg -model macintosh_old -layout fr -option the window manager dies (but not X) - tested with KDE/Kwin and FVWM. If I change to macintosh_old in xorg.conf, I have the weirdest keymap even seen. ;-) I'd like to show you but with this mapping I can't even do a copy/paste (the only thing I remember is that de @ key gives a m). Can you please cat /proc/cpuinfo and send its output? It's an ibook: processor : 0 cpu : 7447A, altivec supported clock : 599.999000MHz revision: 0.1 (pvr 8003 0101) bogomips: 36.73 timebase: 18432000 platform: PowerMac machine : PowerBook6,5 motherboard : PowerBook6,5 MacRISC3 Power Macintosh detected as : 287 (iBook G4) pmac flags : 001b L2 cache: 512K unified pmac-generation : NewWorld I use the macintosh layout because I have an apple usb keyboard attached and I want the keypad enter to be an enter key. Yannick -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Please test Macintosh keyboards with xkb-data 0.8-12exp1
On Fri, 2006-09-08 at 13:09 +0200, Yannick Roehlly wrote: Denis Barbier wrote: You can set model to macintosh_old2, this is a workaround until we find exactly which models need swapped keys. Well, if I do a setxkbmap -rules xorg -model macintosh_old -layout fr -option the window manager dies (but not X) - tested with KDE/Kwin and FVWM. If I change to macintosh_old in xorg.conf, I have the weirdest keymap even seen. ;-) I'd like to show you but with this mapping I can't even do a copy/paste (the only thing I remember is that de @ key gives a m). macintosh_old2 != macintosh_old macintosh_old is for old kernels that generate ADB keycodes instead of PC-style keycodes. -- Earthling Michel Dänzer | http://tungstengraphics.com Libre software enthusiast | Debian, X and DRI developer
kernel-image-2.6.16-2 on oldworld (success with a small change in config)
Hi! The official debian kernels for powerpc stopped working for me with 2.6.16 (2.6.15 works fine). The 2.6.16 ones fail to mount root fs at boot, which I have reported in bug #366620 I compiled my own 2.6.16 with a minimal change in .config, and that was it, 2.6.16 now boots on my oldworld mac. The needed change in config was the following: (diff against ./boot/config-2.6.16-2-powerpc in the package linux-image-2.6.16-2-powerpc_2.6.16-18_powerpc.deb) 4c4 # Sat Aug 19 00:42:57 2006 --- # Fri Sep 8 09:14:38 2006 772c772 CONFIG_BLK_DEV_IDEDISK=m --- CONFIG_BLK_DEV_IDEDISK=y 2317c2317 CONFIG_EXT2_FS=m --- CONFIG_EXT2_FS=y 2328c2328 CONFIG_FS_MBCACHE=m --- CONFIG_FS_MBCACHE=y I think this shows that there is some problem with loading the proper modules for ide and ext2 from the initrd. As stated in the bugreport of #366620 I have tried both yaird and the other initrd creator. I don't know about the FS_MBCACHE=y thing, that must have been set automatically. Will you consider appling this patch to the config? While it is not the right solution in the long term, it would make oldworld macs run with official debian kernels again (at least the ones with IDE-drives). -- Hans Ekbrand (http://sociologi.cjb.net) [EMAIL PROTECTED] GnuPG key: 1024D/7050614E Fingerprint: 1408 C8D5 1E7D 4C9C C27E 014F 7C2C 872A 7050 614E Learn about secure email at http://www.gnupg.org signature.asc Description: Digital signature
Re: Please test Macintosh keyboards with xkb-data 0.8-12exp1
On 9/8/06, Yannick Roehlly [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hi Denis, Denis Barbier wrote: You can set model to macintosh_old2, this is a workaround until we find exactly which models need swapped keys. Well, if I do a setxkbmap -rules xorg -model macintosh_old -layout fr -option the window manager dies (but not X) - tested with KDE/Kwin and FVWM. If I change to macintosh_old in xorg.conf, I have the weirdest keymap even seen. ;-) I'd like to show you but with this mapping I can't even do a copy/paste (the only thing I remember is that de @ key gives a m). Can you please cat /proc/cpuinfo and send its output? It's an ibook: processor : 0 cpu : 7447A, altivec supported clock : 599.999000MHz revision: 0.1 (pvr 8003 0101) bogomips: 36.73 timebase: 18432000 platform: PowerMac machine : PowerBook6,5 motherboard : PowerBook6,5 MacRISC3 Power Macintosh detected as : 287 (iBook G4) pmac flags : 001b L2 cache: 512K unified pmac-generation : NewWorld I have the same cpuinfo (ibook G4 1.2Ghz 12). I use the macintosh layout because I have an apple usb keyboard attached and I want the keypad enter to be an enter key. My config: --- Section InputDevice Identifier Generic Keyboard Driver kbd Option CoreKeyboard Option XkbRules xorg Option XkbModel ibook Option XkbLayout fr Option XkbOptionslv3:lwin_switch EndSection -- It works fine with ibook's internal keyboard. So maybe your problem is your external usb keyboard. Best regards, Bin Yannick -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
mac keyboards
While we're on the subject of Mac keyboards, something has gone dreadfully wrong with keyboards in sid. I've done this on 2 different machines now, a G4 laptop and a dual G5 workstation: - install etch from a nightly build CD - change the distro from etch to sid in /etc/apt/sources.list - dselect, update, install - reboot voilà, keyboard is dead. It doesn't matter which kernel I boot from (the newer sid one or the previously-working etch one). -- Chris Burdess -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Please test Macintosh keyboards with xkb-data 0.8-12exp1
Good late summer evening, (well, in southern France at least) Bin Zhang wrote: Option XkbModel ibook With the ibook layout, it was working; but I prefer to use the macintosh layout so that the keypad enter behaves as KP_Enter. As Michel pointed at, the problem was that I've half read Denis mail (well, I missed a character). Using the macintosh_old2 layout works fine. My apologies... Does this mean that new Apple keyboards have the @ and the keys inverted? Yannick PS: By the way Denis, just a thought. On MacOs X, the ISO_Level3_shift key is the alt key. With xkb, it's the right alt key, à la PC AltGr. I don't know how good would be the idea to make the alt key ISO_Level3_shift and the apple key Alt_L(R). The advantage is for people switching from MacOS to GNU/Linux keep the same keyboard habits but the problem is in program where the Alt +... shortcuts becomes Apple +... shortcuts. -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: mac keyboards
On Fri, Sep 08, 2006 at 06:32:35PM +0100, Chris Burdess wrote: While we're on the subject of Mac keyboards, something has gone dreadfully wrong with keyboards in sid. I've done this on 2 different machines now, a G4 laptop and a dual G5 workstation: - install etch from a nightly build CD - change the distro from etch to sid in /etc/apt/sources.list - dselect, update, install - reboot voilà, keyboard is dead. It doesn't matter which kernel I boot from (the newer sid one or the previously-working etch one). Can you please file a bugreport against xkb-data with your xorg.conf settings? Denis -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: xkb-data: Help needed for Macintosh keyboards
Hello Denis,
I used xkb-data_0.8-10exp1_all.deb from your tmp directory as described in
your e-mail. First, while everybody in this thread seems to know all the
details about keyboard mapping, I am not so deep into the details. In would
be nice, if some more documentation would be available. The current tree
beneath /home/helge/tmp/xkb/usr/share/X11/xkb has quite some files, so it
is a little bit difficult to find everything out.
First, the relevant part of my xorg.conf:
Section InputDevice
Identifier Laptop Keyboard
# Driver keyboard
Driver kbd
# Option Protocol Standard
Option AutoRepeat 250 30
# Option LeftAltMeta
# Option RightCtl Control
Option XkbModel macintosh
# Option XkbLayout de2
Option XkbLayout de
Option XkbVariantnodeadkeys
# Option XKbOptions nodeadkeys
Option XKbOptions lv3:lwin_switch
EndSection
The XKbOptions line should be boldly mentioned. I just added it during
the tests, and finally the apple keys behave like AltGr as they did in
Sarge (I never heard about this before).
Speaking of Sarge, I already reported my keybord (including picture[1]) with
fixes to Branden back then, see bug #121297 (scan down to find my message,
its dated 15th of November 2004!). To be honest, I stayed with my
de2 layout, but I understood that Branden integrated it into XFree back
then.
I did not do much tests with my current layout, as the main issue now is
to test the new one.
As I understood the bottom row is the most critical one. So on my german
iBook G4 the layout is as follows:
fn ctrl alt apple spaceapple ^ home pg dn end
??37 64 115 65 115 108 100 104102
Control_L ISO_Level3_Shift ISO_Level3_Shift Left DownRight
Alt_LspaceKP_Enter
*109 113 116 65 116 117 97 105103
Control_L Multi_keyMulti_key Home NextEnd
ISO_Level3_Shift space Menu
Note, that home is left without fn, abd similarly pg dn is down, pg up
is up (pg up is above pg dn) and end is right. With fn pressed the
key numbers are as indicated in row *.
First, after issuing setxkbmap -print | xkbcomp - :0 I can finally jump
from and to the console again (i.e. X - console). This is very valuable, as
I work a lot on the console (and the keyboard works perfectly there,
fortunately).
Next I compare both the keyboard on the console and in X. Since the third
level is (almost) not printed on the keyboard an I never use X (but normal
keyboards a lot) I'd like to have the third level as on an ordinary keyboard.
All keys which work as expected are not reported.
Number row without any modifier:
Key between ß and backspace does not respond (expected:')
Number row with Apple key pressed:
2 and 3 ok; but then mixed up,
starting at 5:[]|{}}\
should be (from 7): {[]}\
Qwertz-row, with Apple key pressed:
q - « instead of @ (not necessary, see Apple-y)
plus some other characters I've never used on some other letters. (I
assume, that I don't see the euro sign with Apple-E but ¤ is a font
issue)
Asdf-row, with Apple key pressed:
Some other characters and some double usage (e.g. ß, @, ^, `), now
suprise (on the console most of these are no special character)
Yxcv-row, with Apple key pressed:
Apple-Y is « and Apple-X is » (which unfortunately does not work on
the console), which is great! (Ideally I'd like them swapped, as in
german they are reversed compared to the french/swiss usage)
Some keys also have a new character with Shift-Apple, but I did not check
them systematically.
So in conclusion, I like your new layout. It would be great, if you could
enable an easy possibility to chose between pc-style third level and
macintosh third level.
And please *document the options*, especially how to get the Apply key
to behave als AltGr which I just discovered in your emails by chance. If there
is such documentation (where?), then I missed it.
Btw. the mouse buttons is enable all the time with the follwing entries in
/etc/sysctl.conf:
dev/mac_hid/mouse_button_emulation = 1
dev/mac_hid/mouse_button2_keycode=87
dev/mac_hid/mouse_button3_keycode=88
Unfortunately (but OT here, I guess) double clicking marks far less then
on the console, which is quite anoying. I'd appreciate documentation how
to customize this here as well :-))
I attached the results of the keys pressed both in X and on the
console to this email for reference.
Thanks for your work. If you need additional information please let me
know which.
Greetings
Helge
P.S. For some strange reason, dpkg-reconfigure xserver-xorg refuses
to write a new
Re: xkb-data: Help needed for Macintosh keyboards
Hello Denis,
On Fri, Sep 08, 2006 at 09:35:46PM +0200, Helge Kreutzmann wrote:
Hello Denis,
I used xkb-data_0.8-10exp1_all.deb from your tmp directory as described in
now the same with xkb-data_0.8-12exp1_all.deb
First, after issuing setxkbmap -print | xkbcomp - :0 I can finally jump
from and to the console again (i.e. X - console). This is very valuable, as
I work a lot on the console (and the keyboard works perfectly there,
fortunately).
Valid here as well.
Next I compare both the keyboard on the console and in X. Since the third
level is (almost) not printed on the keyboard an I never use X (but normal
keyboards a lot) I'd like to have the third level as on an ordinary keyboard.
All keys which work as expected are not reported.
Number row without any modifier:
Key between ß and backspace does not respond (expected:')
The leftmost key (next to 1) is instead of ^
Key between ß and backspace does not respond (expected:')
Number row with shift:
The leftmost key (next to 1) is instead of °
Number row with Apple key pressed:
2 and 3 ok; but then mixed up,
starting at 5:[]|{}}\
should be (from 7): {[]}\
This is still the case
Qwertz-row, with Apple key pressed:
q - « instead of @ (not necessary, see Apple-y)
plus some other characters I've never used on some other letters. (I
assume, that I don't see the euro sign with Apple-E but ¤ is a font
issue)
This is still the case.
Asdf-row, with Apple key pressed:
Some other characters and some double usage (e.g. ß, @, ^, `), now
suprise (on the console most of these are no special character)
This is still the case
Yxcv-row, without any modifier:
The lefmost key (next to left shift) is now ^ instead of
Yxcv-row, with shift key:
The lefmost key (next to left shift) is now ° instead of
Yxcv-row, with Apple key pressed:
Apple-Y is « and Apple-X is » (which unfortunately does not work on
the console), which is great! (Ideally I'd like them swapped, as in
german they are reversed compared to the french/swiss usage)
This is still the case
So in conclusion, I like your new layout. It would be great, if you could
enable an easy possibility to chose between pc-style third level and
macintosh third level.
Well, the new one degarded a little, as it swapped the ^/° with the
/ key on my german iBook G4 keyboard
I hope this updated info helps.
Greetings
Helge
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Re: grub2 on powerpc
On Fri, Sep 08, 2006 at 12:15:12AM -0400, Rick Thomas wrote: On Sep 7, 2006, at 7:00 PM, Otavio Salvador wrote: Rick Thomas [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: I made this patch to enable grub2 for powerpc as well, but unfortunately I can't test it (no ppc hardware here). Would anyone like to try it? -- Robert Millan Hi Robert, I'd love to test it. And I have PPC hardware (PowerPC Macs) to test it on. But I'm not a developer. What can I do to help? Basically, you'll need to get d-i source code and grub-installer source code. Build both (the last with the applied patch provided by Robert) and add it in localudebs before build the mini.iso. Burn it on a CD and test. Thanks. But as I said, I'm not a developer (for lack of time -- I have a day job, and I'd like to keep it!) What I can do is test things. If someone who understands Otavio's description of the task is willing to make an .iso that I can burn to a CD, I'll be happy to test it and provide detailed reports on my success or failures. I will build you a netboot image, which include this patched version, this way you can test it. I do believe this will include a mini-iso kind of thing. Friendly, Sven Luther -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: grub2 on powerpc
On Thu, Sep 07, 2006 at 06:40:26PM -0400, Rick Thomas wrote: Hi Robert, I'd love to test it. And I have PPC hardware (PowerPC Macs) to test it on. But I'm not a developer. What can I do to help? Here's a short explanation: - Checkout d-i source. - Apply my patch and build grub-installer udeb. - Put the udeb in installer/build/localudebs, and add it to the cd with: echo grub-installer installer/build/pkg-lists/local - Build a netboot image as normal. - Boot the resulting image in expert mode, and when queried about using grub2 answer Yes. - Check wether it boots (and have a rescue disk at hand!) -- Robert Millan My spam trap is [EMAIL PROTECTED] Note: this address is only intended for spam harvesters. Writing to it will get you added to my black list. -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Please test Macintosh keyboards with xkb-data 0.8-12exp1
On Fri, 2006-09-08 at 19:31 +0200, Yannick Roehlly wrote: PS: By the way Denis, just a thought. On MacOs X, the ISO_Level3_shift key is the alt key. With xkb, it's the right alt key, la PC AltGr. I don't know how good would be the idea to make the alt key ISO_Level3_shift and the apple key Alt_L(R). The advantage is for people switching from MacOS to GNU/Linux keep the same keyboard habits but the problem is in program where the Alt +... shortcuts becomes Apple +... shortcuts. Hem, under osx, to have the |\ etc. you need to press the apple key, not the alt key (on a french keyboard at least). -- Yves-Alexis -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: grub2 on powerpc
Sven Luther escreveu: On Fri, Sep 08, 2006 at 12:15:12AM -0400, Rick Thomas wrote: On Sep 7, 2006, at 7:00 PM, Otavio Salvador wrote: Rick Thomas [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: I made this patch to enable grub2 for powerpc as well, but unfortunately I can't test it (no ppc hardware here). Would anyone like to try it? -- Robert Millan Hi Robert, I'd love to test it. And I have PPC hardware (PowerPC Macs) to test it on. But I'm not a developer. What can I do to help? Basically, you'll need to get d-i source code and grub-installer source code. Build both (the last with the applied patch provided by Robert) and add it in localudebs before build the mini.iso. Burn it on a CD and test. Thanks. But as I said, I'm not a developer (for lack of time -- I have a day job, and I'd like to keep it!) What I can do is test things. If someone who understands Otavio's description of the task is willing to make an .iso that I can burn to a CD, I'll be happy to test it and provide detailed reports on my success or failures. I will build you a netboot image, which include this patched version, this way you can test it. I do believe this will include a mini-iso kind of thing. For some time I have a Beige G3 in my hands, tell me where to find this /iso when it is available ... Fábio Rabelo -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Please test Macintosh keyboards with xkb-data 0.8-12exp1
On 9/9/06, Yves-Alexis Perez [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
On Fri, 2006-09-08 at 19:31 +0200, Yannick Roehlly wrote:
PS: By the way Denis, just a thought. On MacOs X, the
ISO_Level3_shift key
is the alt key. With xkb, it's the right alt key, la PC AltGr. I
don't
know how good would be the idea to make the alt key ISO_Level3_shift
and
the apple key Alt_L(R). The advantage is for people switching from
MacOS to
GNU/Linux keep the same keyboard habits but the problem is in program
where
the Alt +... shortcuts becomes Apple +... shortcuts.
Hem, under osx, to have the |\ etc. you need to press the apple key, not
the alt key (on a french keyboard at least).
No. On my ibook with a french keyboard, under osx, it's alt +... for
| \ ~ {}[] ...
Bin
--
Yves-Alexis
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