Re: RealPlayer audio streams
* Hans Ekbrand h...@sociologi.cjb.net [2009-01-26 22:47:12 CET]: On Sun, Jan 25, 2009 at 10:12:09PM +0100, Gerfried Fuchs wrote: * Hans Ekbrand hans.ekbr...@sociology.gu.se [2009-01-22 15:19:14 CET]: On Thu, Jan 22, 2009 at 02:24:34PM +0100, Bin Zhang wrote: You can use mplayer and mozilla-mplayer (debian packages). You need realmedia codecs. Two options for installing the codecs: - run /usr/share/mplayer/scripts/binary_codecs.sh install - install Linux PPC 20071007 codecs in your /usr/lib/codecs from http://www1.mplayerhq.hu/design7/dload.html You'll need installing the package libstdc++.so.5. Both of these, are not-the-debian-way. Says who? The binary_codecs.sh script infact _is_ the Debian way. Generally, running install scripts is *not* the debian way, apt-get is. I don't know the details in this particular case. Generally, apt-get is used where it is *possible*. If you don't know the details in this particular case why it's not possible within the Debian project to offer this then please don't comment on it. Why not just apt-get from www.debian-multimedia.org? Because that's not-the-debian-way. Maybe not in your contry, but maybe in countries that does not acknowledge software patents. I don't now your particular situation, but this is my guess. The legal impacts with debian-multimedia is not only with respect to software patents, but also in parts ignoring conflicting license parts and should be checked by its users on a package by package basis; making people believe that debian-multimedia is something that should be used lightly is a quite ignorant and selfish approach because it might not have an impact in your country. And most importantly: debian-multimedia != debian, even in your country. The current definition of non-free in Debian is, AFAIK, adopted to fit citizens in countries which acknowledge software patents. YK wrong here, unfortunately. In countries which does not acknowledge software patents, some software which is in www.debian-multimedia.org is Free software. That's the point: _some_ software. Perhaps you remember that debian once had a section named non-us which where provided to non-us users (and by servers located outside US). I am well aware of the history, thanks. But legal impacts aren't directly comparable to the the encryption==weapon export regulations. My point here is that software patents impose the same kind of restriction I never talked about software patents, but thanks for putting words in my mouth. :) Now, I haven't checked all the details of the mplayer package provided by www.debian-multimedia.org, but I thought mplayer was GPL, isn't it? mplayer itself is, that's why it's also in the main Debian pool, which you might have missed? So long. :) Rhonda -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-powerpc-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org
Re: RealPlayer audio streams
Benjamin Cama wrote: Hi, I don't want to sound too pedantic, bit I'd like to precise some things : Le mardi 27 janvier 2009 à 14:28 +0930, Mike Hore a écrit : Anyway, kplayer is happily handling real streams, MP3 and WMP with no problem. Hey, I'm not a purist, I just like to get the job done, any way that works :-) It's not about being a purist, it's just about not breaking the law. By using this software, you put yourself in an illegal position in your country, and I don't know why some people find it exciting to break the law (a famous example in our computer world being by using software they've obtained illegally), but that's not my case. OK, point taken. Actually I have no idea what Australia's position is on software patents, and I don't really want to bother finding out. But thank you for pointing out that the problem isn't an issue of purity, whatever that is, but legality. ... I am not telling you not to use these software, on the contrary ! I think that you're just being reminded, by using this repository, that your act is condemned in some place like yours, because of these laws. Yes, I'm happy to be reminded that there might be a legality issue. Then it's up to me where I go from there. And I think you should care, so that you can better fight these rules that hinders you from lawfully using some of the free-software that come with Debian. Yes, I care, at least if the patent is stupid. I'm not against intellectual property protection as such, but I know some patents, granted by judges with no IT experience, are very strange, let's say. Cheers, Mike. --- Mike Horemike_h...@aapt.net.au --- -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-powerpc-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org
Re: RealPlayer audio streams
Hi, I don't want to sound too pedantic, bit I'd like to precise some things : Le mardi 27 janvier 2009 à 14:28 +0930, Mike Hore a écrit : Anyway, kplayer is happily handling real streams, MP3 and WMP with no problem. Hey, I'm not a purist, I just like to get the job done, any way that works :-) It's not about being a purist, it's just about not breaking the law. By using this software, you put yourself in an illegal position in your country, and I don't know why some people find it exciting to break the law (a famous example in our computer world being by using software they've obtained illegally), but that's not my case. I am fortunate enough to live in a country (France) where software patents are not recognized valid (well, appart from the schizophrenia of the European Patent Office accepting software patent applications although they're not valid according to the law), but I don't like the way some people want any work of thought to be patented in a lot of countries. Maybe Europe is coming next. Debian and a lot of FOSS projects/people don't like it too but try to play fair and show the people that in some country their work may be illegal. They show that some stupid law make them and their users be at risk of some legal action. I am not telling you not to use these software, on the contrary ! I think that you're just being reminded, by using this repository, that your act is condemned in some place like yours, because of these laws. And I think you should care, so that you can better fight these rules that hinders you from lawfully using some of the free-software that come with Debian. Regards, benjamin -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-powerpc-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org
Re: RealPlayer audio streams
On Sun, Jan 25, 2009 at 10:12:09PM +0100, Gerfried Fuchs wrote: * Hans Ekbrand hans.ekbr...@sociology.gu.se [2009-01-22 15:19:14 CET]: On Thu, Jan 22, 2009 at 02:24:34PM +0100, Bin Zhang wrote: You can use mplayer and mozilla-mplayer (debian packages). You need realmedia codecs. Two options for installing the codecs: - run /usr/share/mplayer/scripts/binary_codecs.sh install - install Linux PPC 20071007 codecs in your /usr/lib/codecs from http://www1.mplayerhq.hu/design7/dload.html You'll need installing the package libstdc++.so.5. Both of these, are not-the-debian-way. Says who? The binary_codecs.sh script infact _is_ the Debian way. Generally, running install scripts is *not* the debian way, apt-get is. I don't know the details in this particular case. Why not just apt-get from www.debian-multimedia.org? Because that's not-the-debian-way. Maybe not in your contry, but maybe in countries that does not acknowledge software patents. I don't now your particular situation, but this is my guess. But when it comes to non-free stuff one has to jump through hoops anyway. The current definition of non-free in Debian is, AFAIK, adopted to fit citizens in countries which acknowledge software patents. In countries which does not acknowledge software patents, some software which is in www.debian-multimedia.org is Free software. Perhaps you remember that debian once had a section named non-us which where provided to non-us users (and by servers located outside US). This infrastructure for distributing free software was created in order to get around the US export restrictions for strong crypto. Without it, Debian would not have been able to provide the same software for all users, since Debian when would have (in some cases) exported the strong crypto software from US to users in other countries, which the export restrictions did not allow. My point here is that software patents impose the same kind of restriction, it only applies in some contries, so Debian could set up servers in the countries that does not acknowledge software patents, and the citizens of these countries could benefit from this Free software. I live in Sweden, which does not acknowledge software patents, and therefore it would be perfectly legal for Debian to have ftp.se.debian.org provide me - and everyone else who is a citizen (and is living in) a country which does not acknowledge software patents - nice GPL software which would have been protected by software patents in some other countries. In my eyes, www.debian-multimedia.org is such a service. The only thing that I miss is that the packages is complied and signed by the normal debian maintainers and built on a official debian machine, and that Debian officially acknowledge these packages as part of Debian. Now, I haven't checked all the details of the mplayer package provided by www.debian-multimedia.org, but I thought mplayer was GPL, isn't it? If it is, then why do you call it non-free stuff? Isn't that a way of framing the issue that accepts the idea of software patents? Kind regards, -- Hans Ekbrand (http://sociologi.cjb.net) h...@sociologi.cjb.net GPG Fingerprint: 1408 C8D5 1E7D 4C9C C27E 014F 7C2C 872A 7050 614E signature.asc Description: Digital signature
Re: RealPlayer audio streams
Hans Ekbrand wrote: On Sun, Jan 25, 2009 at 10:12:09PM +0100, Gerfried Fuchs wrote: * Hans Ekbrand hans.ekbr...@sociology.gu.se [2009-01-22 15:19:14 CET]: On Thu, Jan 22, 2009 at 02:24:34PM +0100, Bin Zhang wrote: You can use mplayer and mozilla-mplayer (debian packages). You need realmedia codecs. Two options for installing the codecs: - run /usr/share/mplayer/scripts/binary_codecs.sh install - install Linux PPC 20071007 codecs in your /usr/lib/codecs from http://www1.mplayerhq.hu/design7/dload.html You'll need installing the package libstdc++.so.5. Both of these, are not-the-debian-way. Says who? The binary_codecs.sh script infact _is_ the Debian way. Generally, running install scripts is *not* the debian way, apt-get is. I don't know the details in this particular case. Why not just apt-get from www.debian-multimedia.org? Because that's not-the-debian-way. Maybe not in your contry, but maybe in countries that does not acknowledge software patents. I don't now your particular situation, but this is my guess. Hi folks, I'm in Australia which I think does acknowledge software patents but I don't really know, or even care, frankly. But just for the record, www.debian-multimedia.org did the job for me. All I did was add that line to my sources.list file, use SPM to select kplayer and everything it depends on, and apply the updates. I think that's pretty much equivalent to using apt-get, but SPM supposedly handles dependencies a bit better? Anyway, kplayer is happily handling real streams, MP3 and WMP with no problem. Hey, I'm not a purist, I just like to get the job done, any way that works :-) Cheers, Mike. --- Mike Horemike_h...@aapt.net.au --- -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-powerpc-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org
Re: RealPlayer audio streams
On Fri, Jan 23, 2009 at 02:02:07PM +0930, Mike Hore wrote: [...] OK, it's good news. Everything's working! I can go to a web site with a RealPlayer stream, open it and specify kplayer as the helper app, and it plays. So it seems that any needed powerpc codecs must have been installed by the installation process from www.debian-multimedia-org. Thanks for reporting back. It's good to know that my recommendation works. -- Hans Ekbrand (http://sociologi.cjb.net) h...@sociologi.cjb.net GPG Fingerprint: 1408 C8D5 1E7D 4C9C C27E 014F 7C2C 872A 7050 614E signature.asc Description: Digital signature
Re: RealPlayer audio streams
Hans Ekbrand wrote: On Fri, Jan 23, 2009 at 02:02:07PM +0930, Mike Hore wrote: [...] OK, it's good news. Everything's working! I can go to a web site with a RealPlayer stream, open it and specify kplayer as the helper app, and it plays. So it seems that any needed powerpc codecs must have been installed by the installation process from www.debian-multimedia-org. Thanks for reporting back. It's good to know that my recommendation works. Yes, and I notice it's using various different codecs for the different sites I've checked. Certainly real and mp3 and Windows Media (not sure those 2 are different) but whatever, any site I've checked has worked. Thanks! Cheers, Mike. --- Mike Horemike_h...@aapt.net.au --- -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-powerpc-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org
Re: RealPlayer audio streams
Hi Hans, On Thu, Jan 22, 2009 at 10:32:05AM +0930, Mike Hore wrote: [...] Now, never satisfied, I want to get streaming audio from sites that only provide RealPlayer or WMP formats! These are proprietary, and so not supported by Helix. Helix kindly tells me I need to download RealPlayer 11, but of course when I look there I find that while Linux packages are available in RPM or DEB formats, it's x86 only (as usual). Perhaps mplayer from the repository http://www.debian-multimedia.org can handle those? Yes, maybe, and I had a look there the other day, but I'm too much of a Linux newbie to be able to figure out what everything means. I don't really want to tackle compiling from source, and whether or not I do that, I don't really know where to go with it, like how to run it or make it work with Helix or whatever. I need some simple instructions and I don't seem to be able to find them anywhere. Cheers, Mike. --- Mike Horemike_h...@aapt.net.au --- -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-powerpc-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org
Re: RealPlayer audio streams
Hi, On Thu, Jan 22, 2009 at 2:02 AM, Mike Hore mike_h...@aapt.net.au wrote: Mike Hore wrote: Now my next question is another newbie question -- I want to try to run the Helix audio player, so I've downloaded the latest PPC build hxplay-11.1.1.1404-linux-powerpc64 The problem is, I don't really know what to do next. I've uncompressed it into a directory helix in my home directory, and there's a whole lot of stuff there including a Bin directory with an executable file called setup that I guess I'm supposed to run, but I can't run it from there, and don't know either where to put it or how to change my paths or whatever it is so I can run it from the command line. Sorry for asking such basic questions... OK, I got it figured out. I checked my $PATH variable and found I needed to either move the helix stuff into e.g. /usr/bin, or else on the command line just type the complete path to the setup prog. This worked, and I got Helix installed. Now, never satisfied, I want to get streaming audio from sites that only provide RealPlayer or WMP formats! These are proprietary, and so not supported by Helix. Helix kindly tells me I need to download RealPlayer 11, but of course when I look there I find that while Linux packages are available in RPM or DEB formats, it's x86 only (as usual). You can use mplayer and mozilla-mplayer (debian packages). You need realmedia codecs. Two options for installing the codecs: - run /usr/share/mplayer/scripts/binary_codecs.sh install - install Linux PPC 20071007 codecs in your /usr/lib/codecs from http://www1.mplayerhq.hu/design7/dload.html You'll need installing the package libstdc++.so.5. Regards, Bin Any suggestions? (Apart from switching to Intel, which I won't ever ever do) Cheers, Mike. --- Mike Horemike_h...@aapt.net.au --- -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-powerpc-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-powerpc-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org
Re: RealPlayer audio streams
On Thu, Jan 22, 2009 at 05:47:09PM +0930, Mike Hore wrote: Hi Hans, On Thu, Jan 22, 2009 at 10:32:05AM +0930, Mike Hore wrote: [...] Now, never satisfied, I want to get streaming audio from sites that only provide RealPlayer or WMP formats! These are proprietary, and so not supported by Helix. Helix kindly tells me I need to download RealPlayer 11, but of course when I look there I find that while Linux packages are available in RPM or DEB formats, it's x86 only (as usual). Perhaps mplayer from the repository http://www.debian-multimedia.org can handle those? Yes, maybe, and I had a look there the other day, but I'm too much of a Linux newbie to be able to figure out what everything means. I don't really want to tackle compiling from source No need to, www.debian-multimedia.org provides binary debian packages. [...] I need some simple instructions and I don't seem to be able to find them anywhere. You could try, as root: echo deb http://www.debian-multimedia.org lenny main /etc/apt/sources.list apt-get update apt-get install mplayer -- Note that I use Debian version 5.0 Linux sqlserver 2.6.26-1-powerpc #1 Sat Jan 10 14:00:38 CET 2009 ppc GNU/Linux Hans Ekbrand (http://sociologi.cjb.net) h...@sociologi.cjb.net GPG Fingerprint: 1408 C8D5 1E7D 4C9C C27E 014F 7C2C 872A 7050 614E signature.asc Description: Digital signature
Re: RealPlayer audio streams
On Thu, Jan 22, 2009 at 02:24:34PM +0100, Bin Zhang wrote: You can use mplayer and mozilla-mplayer (debian packages). You need realmedia codecs. Two options for installing the codecs: - run /usr/share/mplayer/scripts/binary_codecs.sh install - install Linux PPC 20071007 codecs in your /usr/lib/codecs from http://www1.mplayerhq.hu/design7/dload.html You'll need installing the package libstdc++.so.5. Both of these, are not-the-debian-way. Why not just apt-get from www.debian-multimedia.org? -- Note that I use Debian version 5.0 Linux sqlserver 2.6.26-1-powerpc #1 Sat Jan 10 14:00:38 CET 2009 ppc GNU/Linux Hans Ekbrand (http://sociologi.cjb.net) h...@sociologi.cjb.net GPG Fingerprint: 1408 C8D5 1E7D 4C9C C27E 014F 7C2C 872A 7050 614E signature.asc Description: Digital signature
Re: RealPlayer audio streams
Hi, On Thu, Jan 22, 2009 at 3:19 PM, Hans Ekbrand hans.ekbr...@sociology.gu.se wrote: On Thu, Jan 22, 2009 at 02:24:34PM +0100, Bin Zhang wrote: You can use mplayer and mozilla-mplayer (debian packages). You need realmedia codecs. Two options for installing the codecs: - run /usr/share/mplayer/scripts/binary_codecs.sh install - install Linux PPC 20071007 codecs in your /usr/lib/codecs from http://www1.mplayerhq.hu/design7/dload.html You'll need installing the package libstdc++.so.5. Both of these, are not-the-debian-way. Why not just apt-get from www.debian-multimedia.org? Using mplayer from debian or from www.debian-multimedia.org on powerpc doesn't matter. The problem here is the lack of RealMedia Codecs in debian's repositories because they are not free. So the question is how to install thes codecs. Debian's mplayer package includes a script /usr/share/mplayer/scripts/binary_codecs.sh for helping installing realmedia codecs. I don't know how the package mplayer from www.debian-multimedia.org installs these codecs. (On my amd64 laptop, I use mplayer + w64codecs from www.debian-multimedia.org) These codecs need the package libstdc++.so.5 to work. Best regards, Bin -- Note that I use Debian version 5.0 Linux sqlserver 2.6.26-1-powerpc #1 Sat Jan 10 14:00:38 CET 2009 ppc GNU/Linux Hans Ekbrand (http://sociologi.cjb.net) h...@sociologi.cjb.net GPG Fingerprint: 1408 C8D5 1E7D 4C9C C27E 014F 7C2C 872A 7050 614E -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- Version: GnuPG v1.4.9 (GNU/Linux) iEYEARECAAYFAkl4gGAACgkQfCyHKnBQYU5E5ACgrgOCu2VrqSelP1F6fVIxorp2 GhQAoM/GFS7LjxjnikUpApD2rXXkEUIb =tijI -END PGP SIGNATURE- -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-powerpc-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org
Re: RealPlayer audio streams
Hi, Le Thursday 22 January 2009 17:26:17 Bin Zhang, vous avez écrit : On Thu, Jan 22, 2009 at 3:19 PM, Hans Ekbrand hans.ekbr...@sociology.gu.se wrote: Both of these, are not-the-debian-way. Why not just apt-get from www.debian-multimedia.org? Hans, are you even sure that these codecs are packaged on www.debian-multimedia.org for powerpc ? I could find the packages w64codecs and w32codecs for amd64 and i386 respectively, but nothing similar for powerpc. It seems to me that the script in debian's official package is the simplest way to get the codecs. Best regards, Cédric -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-powerpc-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org
Re: RealPlayer audio streams
Hans Ekbrand wrote: On Thu, Jan 22, 2009 at 02:24:34PM +0100, Bin Zhang wrote: You can use mplayer and mozilla-mplayer (debian packages). You need realmedia codecs. Two options for installing the codecs: - run /usr/share/mplayer/scripts/binary_codecs.sh install - install Linux PPC 20071007 codecs in your /usr/lib/codecs from http://www1.mplayerhq.hu/design7/dload.html You'll need installing the package libstdc++.so.5. Both of these, are not-the-debian-way. Why not just apt-get from www.debian-multimedia.org? Hi Hans and Bin, Last night I added the path to debian-multimedia in my /etc/apt/sources.list, then used Synaptic rather than apt-get but this should be equivalent. So now I've installed mplayer and also kplayer which looks interesting (I'm running KDE). I won't have time to try them out till later today but I'll let you know how I go. I guess I'll find out if I need the codecs and follow Bin's advice to get them if it turns out I need them. Thanks for the help! Cheers, Mike. --- Mike Horemike_h...@aapt.net.au --- -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-powerpc-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org
Re: RealPlayer audio streams
I wrote: Hi Hans and Bin, Last night I added the path to debian-multimedia in my /etc/apt/sources.list, then used Synaptic rather than apt-get but this should be equivalent. So now I've installed mplayer and also kplayer which looks interesting (I'm running KDE). I won't have time to try them out till later today but I'll let you know how I go. I guess I'll find out if I need the codecs and follow Bin's advice to get them if it turns out I need them. Thanks for the help! OK, it's good news. Everything's working! I can go to a web site with a RealPlayer stream, open it and specify kplayer as the helper app, and it plays. So it seems that any needed powerpc codecs must have been installed by the installation process from www.debian-multimedia-org. Cheers, Mike. --- Mike Horemike_h...@aapt.net.au --- -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-powerpc-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org
Re: RealPlayer audio streams
On Thu, Jan 22, 2009 at 10:32:05AM +0930, Mike Hore wrote: [...] Now, never satisfied, I want to get streaming audio from sites that only provide RealPlayer or WMP formats! These are proprietary, and so not supported by Helix. Helix kindly tells me I need to download RealPlayer 11, but of course when I look there I find that while Linux packages are available in RPM or DEB formats, it's x86 only (as usual). Perhaps mplayer from the repository http://www.debian-multimedia.org can handle those? -- Note that I use Debian version 5.0 Linux sqlserver 2.6.26-1-powerpc #1 Sat Jan 10 14:00:38 CET 2009 ppc GNU/Linux Hans Ekbrand (http://sociologi.cjb.net) h...@sociologi.cjb.net GPG Fingerprint: 1408 C8D5 1E7D 4C9C C27E 014F 7C2C 872A 7050 614E signature.asc Description: Digital signature
