Re: Sparc 6.0.3: multiple Nautilus file manager process after few minutes from fresh install
On Tue, Dec 20, 2011 at 09:23:26AM -0600, Patrick Baggett wrote: http://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=570955 looks like the same problem, for i386/amd64. Reported Feb 2010. Experienced Debianers -- is this good strategy: add more info to that and/or bring it to the forefront? If it matches your symptoms, go ahead and add to that bug report, and mention your architecture. -- 2. That which causes joy or happiness. -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-sparc-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/20111222194407.ga27...@entuzijast.net
Re: Sparc 6.0.3: multiple Nautilus file manager process after few minutes from fresh install
On Sat, Dec 17, 2011 at 11:37:08AM +, Mark Morgan Lloyd wrote: I still hope, that the next Debian release on SPARC will be better. I can't believe, that such a buggy SPARC release as Squeeze was released as stable.. :( Bugs only have a chance of getting fixed if they are reported. Hoping will not make it better. Good bug reports (with patches, if possible) might. Certainly. For sure. No problem. And how long did it take Debian to sort out the known issue that screwed local X on a U1 etc? My understanding is that it /had/ been bug reported, and was generally believed to have been fixed in either the kernel or X, but it quite simply didn't get onto the Lenny CD or into the repositories resulting in a number of people who asked in this ML how to get their machines running and were basically told that they couldn't. I believe I know what but you're talking about, and yes, it wasn't handled perfectly, but *it was handled*, as opposed to the aforementioned bug that's getting reported to the mailing list many months after the release *shrug* I clicked on that UDD link posted in the thread and selected squeeze, and found only one bug report mentioning sparc, and it didn't seem to be about this issue. So, the first step here would be for someone who can describe the symptoms to report this. Quite frankly, I gave up trying to work out detailed fixes for things Nobody's really expecting people to work out detailed fixes, just to report bugs to the BTS. Jurij's sentence above was probably unclear - it's certain that hoping won't make it better, and it's certain good reports might, but the intermediate state - any kind of bug reports - is also much better than nothing. Even if you don't have any idea what's wrong, do report it, because it can help others congregate around the report - it often happens that people google their symptoms, find the bug report, and then some of them contribute something more useful. -- 2. That which causes joy or happiness. -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-sparc-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/20111220104343.ga20...@entuzijast.net
Re: Sparc 6.0.3: multiple Nautilus file manager process after few minutes from fresh install
On Sat, Dec 17, 2011 at 05:22:23PM +, Jurij Smakov wrote: I didn't report this bug even though I ran into it. What is a good place to report them should I find more? The easiest way is [...] http://www.google.com/search?q=how+to+report+a+bug+in+debian The first hit should be sufficiently clear to be useful even to the most timid or unknowing among us. (I would have used lmgtfy.com to illustrate this point in fewer words, but it seemed counterproductive to use a slightly condescending website in this context :) -- 2. That which causes joy or happiness. -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-sparc-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/20111220105029.gb20...@entuzijast.net
Re: Sparc 6.0.3: multiple Nautilus file manager process after few minutes from fresh install
Josip Rodin wrote: Quite frankly, I gave up trying to work out detailed fixes for things Nobody's really expecting people to work out detailed fixes, just to report bugs to the BTS. Jurij's sentence above was probably unclear - it's certain that hoping won't make it better, and it's certain good reports might, but the intermediate state - any kind of bug reports - is also much better than nothing. Even if you don't have any idea what's wrong, do report it, because it can help others congregate around the report - it often happens that people google their symptoms, find the bug report, and then some of them contribute something more useful. I'm happy with that, but I'd suggest that it does need the more experienced user/developers to ride herd on the rest of us, and when somebody has an issue to say one of: * That's a known issue which won't be changed for a good reason, live with it. * That's been reported already. * That's new, report it. The worst possible thing that can happen is for somebody who's got hold of a SPARC-based system and is trying to find out whether it's any use for anything to post a concern, to not get any feedback, and then to find out from Google that the problem was known about several years ago and never fixed. Because that's almost certainly going to be somebody who dumps the architecture, never comes back to it, and tells everybody else that SPARC is dead. -- Mark Morgan Lloyd markMLl .AT. telemetry.co .DOT. uk [Opinions above are the author's, not those of his employers or colleagues] -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-sparc-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/jcq7ct$fi7$1...@pye-srv-01.telemetry.co.uk
Re: Sparc 6.0.3: multiple Nautilus file manager process after few minutes from fresh install
On Tue, Dec 20, 2011 at 02:51:08PM +, Mark Morgan Lloyd wrote: I'm happy with that, but I'd suggest that it does need the more experienced user/developers to ride herd on the rest of us, and when somebody has an issue to say one of: * That's a known issue which won't be changed for a good reason, live with it. * That's been reported already. * That's new, report it. The worst possible thing that can happen is for somebody who's got hold of a SPARC-based system and is trying to find out whether it's any use for anything to post a concern, to not get any feedback, Well, that's unlikely, or at least the prospect of not getting feedback after posting a bug report not any more unlikely compared to the prospect of not getting feedback without posting a bug report :) Let's cross that bridge when we get there. So far I've noticed that bug #525718 has been mentioned in the thread - that one is long closed, and people thought it was fixed back then (i.e. it wasn't unanswered). A new bug report should be opened, and tagged sparc + severity grave, and let's see where it goes :) -- 2. That which causes joy or happiness. -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-sparc-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/20111220151213.ga30...@entuzijast.net
Re: Sparc 6.0.3: multiple Nautilus file manager process after few minutes from fresh install
http://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=570955 looks like the same problem, for i386/amd64. Reported Feb 2010. Experienced Debianers -- is this good strategy: add more info to that and/or bring it to the forefront? Patrick On Tue, Dec 20, 2011 at 9:12 AM, Josip Rodin j...@entuzijast.net wrote: On Tue, Dec 20, 2011 at 02:51:08PM +, Mark Morgan Lloyd wrote: I'm happy with that, but I'd suggest that it does need the more experienced user/developers to ride herd on the rest of us, and when somebody has an issue to say one of: * That's a known issue which won't be changed for a good reason, live with it. * That's been reported already. * That's new, report it. The worst possible thing that can happen is for somebody who's got hold of a SPARC-based system and is trying to find out whether it's any use for anything to post a concern, to not get any feedback, Well, that's unlikely, or at least the prospect of not getting feedback after posting a bug report not any more unlikely compared to the prospect of not getting feedback without posting a bug report :) Let's cross that bridge when we get there. So far I've noticed that bug #525718 has been mentioned in the thread - that one is long closed, and people thought it was fixed back then (i.e. it wasn't unanswered). A new bug report should be opened, and tagged sparc + severity grave, and let's see where it goes :) -- 2. That which causes joy or happiness. -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-sparc-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/20111220151213.ga30...@entuzijast.net
Re: Sparc 6.0.3: multiple Nautilus file manager process after few minutes from fresh install
Josip Rodin wrote: On Tue, Dec 20, 2011 at 02:51:08PM +, Mark Morgan Lloyd wrote: I'm happy with that, but I'd suggest that it does need the more experienced user/developers to ride herd on the rest of us, and when somebody has an issue to say one of: * That's a known issue which won't be changed for a good reason, live with it. * That's been reported already. * That's new, report it. The worst possible thing that can happen is for somebody who's got hold of a SPARC-based system and is trying to find out whether it's any use for anything to post a concern, to not get any feedback, Well, that's unlikely, or at least the prospect of not getting feedback after posting a bug report not any more unlikely compared to the prospect of not getting feedback without posting a bug report :) Let's cross that bridge when we get there. So far I've noticed that bug #525718 has been mentioned in the thread - that one is long closed, and people thought it was fixed back then (i.e. it wasn't unanswered). A new bug report should be opened, and tagged sparc + severity grave, and let's see where it goes :) So who's going to bell the cat then? :-) -- Mark Morgan Lloyd markMLl .AT. telemetry.co .DOT. uk [Opinions above are the author's, not those of his employers or colleagues] -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-sparc-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/jcqmst$p1n$1...@pye-srv-01.telemetry.co.uk
Re: Sparc 6.0.3: multiple Nautilus file manager process after few minutes from fresh install /Ultra 80 running debian
Dirk Dettmann Mailinglisten wrote: Am Freitag, den 16.12.2011, 17:29 + schrieb Mark Morgan Lloyd: Etch on a U60 freezes predictably if you either (a) put a break on the serial port (fixed upstream), (b) run xnest (appears fixed in Lenny) or (c) allow IceApe/IceWeasel to pass a document to OpenOffice (appears fixed in Lenny). The freezing I am talking of ONLY happens to the Ultra 80, my both U60s are running fine with debian. This email comes from a U60 running lenny. The situation is the following: booting U80, logging into gdm, doing nothing -- U80 freezes after a while. We definitely do not have a freeze of that nature on a U80 running Lenny. $ cat /proc/openprom/banner-name Ultra-80 (4 X UltraSPARC-II 450MHz) $ uptime 11:16:11 up 52 days, 7:41, 1 user, load average: 2.03, 1.56, 1.41 That machine has a couple of Creator-3Ds in it. I think the first thing you have to determine is whether the entire machine is locking up or just the GUI: I've seen cases on both U60 and U80 running Etch/Lenny where a local copy of KDE (i.e. a desktop on the machine's own screens, rather than accessed via VNC or remote X) locks up but killing it over SSH fixes things. My suspicion there is a DCOP problem locking up ICE, /possibly/ caused by non-standard tab names in Konsole. -- Mark Morgan Lloyd markMLl .AT. telemetry.co .DOT. uk [Opinions above are the author's, not those of his employers or colleagues] -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-sparc-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/jchucm$oon$1...@pye-srv-01.telemetry.co.uk
Re: Sparc 6.0.3: multiple Nautilus file manager process after few minutes from fresh install
Jurij Smakov wrote: On Fri, Dec 16, 2011 at 04:18:50PM +0100, Alexander Feld wrote: Hi, I would like to ask some assistance about my new install sparc64 debian 6.0.3 in a sun blade 150 Hardware.i having this problem in a nautilus file manager in the below panel, it keeps open and closing (multiple file manager process starting and dying) this in result of 100 percent cpu load, this problem will start in a few minutes after using the fresh new install system. I also got this bug. This is the reason, why I am still using Lenny on my SPARC-systems. The SPARC-version of Squeeze is really buggy and nearly unusable. Other applications have similar problems. For example, Iceweasel segfaults very often and KDE doesn't load the panel. I still hope, that the next Debian release on SPARC will be better. I can't believe, that such a buggy SPARC release as Squeeze was released as stable.. :( Bugs only have a chance of getting fixed if they are reported. This is the second time i fresh install i thought this will disappear if i fresh install again. I install on a DVD disc. I did the ff but doesn't solve the problem: 1. remove reinstall the nautilus package including the gnome dependecies like gnome-core* gnome-desktop* etc 2. remove reinstall the full gnome* package. 3. fresh install twice. 4. reboot multiple times for every steps taken above. I'm sorry, this won't help, the package is buggy. Use Lenny instead and hope, that Wheezy will be better. Hoping will not make it better. Good bug reports (with patches, if possible) might. Certainly. For sure. No problem. And how long did it take Debian to sort out the known issue that screwed local X on a U1 etc? My understanding is that it /had/ been bug reported, and was generally believed to have been fixed in either the kernel or X, but it quite simply didn't get onto the Lenny CD or into the repositories resulting in a number of people who asked in this ML how to get their machines running and were basically told that they couldn't. Quite frankly, I gave up trying to work out detailed fixes for things- which is much more difficult for an outsider than it is for core developers- after I described my hack to get SMP working reliably on an SS1000E and came very close to being flamed by DM who didn't like one of my assumptions. -- Mark Morgan Lloyd markMLl .AT. telemetry.co .DOT. uk [Opinions above are the author's, not those of his employers or colleagues] -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-sparc-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/jchut5$pb9$1...@pye-srv-01.telemetry.co.uk
Re: Sparc 6.0.3: multiple Nautilus file manager process after few minutes from fresh install /Ultra 80 running debian
Am Samstag, den 17.12.2011, 11:28 + schrieb Mark Morgan Lloyd: We definitely do not have a freeze of that nature on a U80 running Lenny. $ cat /proc/openprom/banner-name Ultra-80 (4 X UltraSPARC-II 450MHz) $ uptime 11:16:11 up 52 days, 7:41, 1 user, load average: 2.03, 1.56, 1.41 That machine has a couple of Creator-3Ds in it. I think the first thing you have to determine is whether the entire machine is locking up or just the GUI: I've seen cases on both U60 and U80 running Etch/Lenny where a local copy of KDE (i.e. a desktop on the machine's own screens, rather than accessed via VNC or remote X) locks up but killing it over SSH fixes things. My suspicion there is a DCOP problem locking up ICE, /possibly/ caused by non-standard tab names in Konsole. -- Mark Morgan Lloyd markMLl .AT. telemetry.co .DOT. uk Thank you very much for your hints, I will investigate that. Regards Dirk -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-sparc-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/1324127658.2788.2.ca...@u60lenny.itddhome.de
Re: Sparc 6.0.3: multiple Nautilus file manager process after few minutes from fresh install
On Sat, Dec 17, 2011 at 11:37:08AM +, Mark Morgan Lloyd wrote: Jurij Smakov wrote: On Fri, Dec 16, 2011 at 04:18:50PM +0100, Alexander Feld wrote: Hi, I would like to ask some assistance about my new install sparc64 debian 6.0.3 in a sun blade 150 Hardware.i having this problem in a nautilus file manager in the below panel, it keeps open and closing (multiple file manager process starting and dying) this in result of 100 percent cpu load, this problem will start in a few minutes after using the fresh new install system. I also got this bug. This is the reason, why I am still using Lenny on my SPARC-systems. The SPARC-version of Squeeze is really buggy and nearly unusable. Other applications have similar problems. For example, Iceweasel segfaults very often and KDE doesn't load the panel. I still hope, that the next Debian release on SPARC will be better. I can't believe, that such a buggy SPARC release as Squeeze was released as stable.. :( Bugs only have a chance of getting fixed if they are reported. This is the second time i fresh install i thought this will disappear if i fresh install again. I install on a DVD disc. I did the ff but doesn't solve the problem: 1. remove reinstall the nautilus package including the gnome dependecies like gnome-core* gnome-desktop* etc 2. remove reinstall the full gnome* package. 3. fresh install twice. 4. reboot multiple times for every steps taken above. I'm sorry, this won't help, the package is buggy. Use Lenny instead and hope, that Wheezy will be better. Hoping will not make it better. Good bug reports (with patches, if possible) might. Certainly. For sure. No problem. And how long did it take Debian to sort out the known issue that screwed local X on a U1 etc? My understanding is that it /had/ been bug reported, and was generally believed to have been fixed in either the kernel or X, but it quite simply didn't get onto the Lenny CD or into the repositories resulting in a number of people who asked in this ML how to get their machines running and were basically told that they couldn't. Quite frankly, I gave up trying to work out detailed fixes for things- which is much more difficult for an outsider than it is for core developers- after I described my hack to get SMP working reliably on an SS1000E and came very close to being flamed by DM who didn't like one of my assumptions. I understand and sympathize with your frustration, as I've been in the same boat more than once. The situation with wheezy release, however, is quite simple: there is a list of bugs which release managers consider release-critical (updates and stats are posted weekly on planet.debian.net): http://udd.debian.org/bugs.cgi?release=wheezypatch=pending=security=ignwontfix=upstream=unreproducible=forwarded=claimed=deferred=notmain=ignnotwheezy=ignbase=standard=merged=igndone=outdatedwheezy=outdatedsid=needmig=newerubuntu=fnewer=fnewerval=7rc=1sortby=sourcesorto=asccpopcon=1cseverity=1ctags=1 There are currently 4 sparc-specific bugs there. For each of them I've either provided a fix or what I consider sufficient amount of debugging information for maintainer to do something useful with. If these bugs would get magically fixed overnight, from sparc point of view this would be a green light for release to proceed. Obviously, assuming that those are the only 4 RC bugs affecting sparc would be very naive. But if people do not bother reporting them, we'll never take any action, and release will proceed, again leading to complaints along the lines of I can't believe this buggy stuff was deemed a stable release. And if the port does not have enough users reporting bugs even against the most common desktop environment to the point that it turns out to be hopelessly broken, maybe it's time to consider retiring it. Best regards, -- Jurij Smakov ju...@wooyd.org Key: http://www.wooyd.org/pgpkey/ KeyID: C99E03CC -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-sparc-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/20111217161834.ga4...@wooyd.org
Re: Sparc 6.0.3: multiple Nautilus file manager process after few minutes from fresh install
On Sat, Dec 17, 2011 at 11:37:08 +, Mark Morgan Lloyd wrote: Certainly. For sure. No problem. And how long did it take Debian to sort out the known issue that screwed local X on a U1 etc? My I believe it was broken in squeeze r0, and fixed in r1. I don't have access to sparc hw, and nobody told me it was still broken after r1, so… Cheers, Julien -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-sparc-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/20111217162924.gb24...@radis.cristau.org
Re: Sparc 6.0.3: multiple Nautilus file manager process after few minutes from fresh install
Obviously, assuming that those are the only 4 RC bugs affecting sparc would be very naive. But if people do not bother reporting them, we'll never take any action, and release will proceed, again leading to complaints along the lines of I can't believe this buggy stuff was deemed a stable release. And if the port does not have enough users reporting bugs even against the most common desktop environment to the point that it turns out to be hopelessly broken, maybe it's time to consider retiring it. OK guilty as charged. :) I didn't report this bug even though I ran into it. What is a good place to report them should I find more? Patrick Best regards, -- Jurij Smakov ju...@wooyd.org Key: http://www.wooyd.org/pgpkey/ KeyID: C99E03CC -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-sparc-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/20111217161834.ga4...@wooyd.org I understand and sympathize with your frustration, as I've been in the
Re: Sparc 6.0.3: multiple Nautilus file manager process after few minutes from fresh install
Jurij Smakov wrote: Certainly. For sure. No problem. And how long did it take Debian to sort out the known issue that screwed local X on a U1 etc? My understanding is that it /had/ been bug reported, and was generally believed to have been fixed in either the kernel or X, but it quite simply didn't get onto the Lenny CD or into the repositories resulting in a number of people who asked in this ML how to get their machines running and were basically told that they couldn't. Quite frankly, I gave up trying to work out detailed fixes for things- which is much more difficult for an outsider than it is for core developers- after I described my hack to get SMP working reliably on an SS1000E and came very close to being flamed by DM who didn't like one of my assumptions. I understand and sympathize with your frustration, as I've been in the same boat more than once. The situation with wheezy release, however, is quite simple: there is a list of bugs which release managers consider release-critical (updates and stats are posted weekly on planet.debian.net): http://udd.debian.org/bugs.cgi?release=wheezypatch=pending=security=ignwontfix=upstream=unreproducible=forwarded=claimed=deferred=notmain=ignnotwheezy=ignbase=standard=merged=igndone=outdatedwheezy=outdatedsid=needmig=newerubuntu=fnewer=fnewerval=7rc=1sortby=sourcesorto=asccpopcon=1cseverity=1ctags=1 There are currently 4 sparc-specific bugs there. For each of them I've either provided a fix or what I consider sufficient amount of debugging information for maintainer to do something useful with. If these bugs would get magically fixed overnight, from sparc point of view this would be a green light for release to proceed. Obviously, assuming that those are the only 4 RC bugs affecting sparc would be very naive. But if people do not bother reporting them, we'll never take any action, and release will proceed, again leading to complaints along the lines of I can't believe this buggy stuff was deemed a stable release. And if the port does not have enough users reporting bugs even against the most common desktop environment to the point that it turns out to be hopelessly broken, maybe it's time to consider retiring it. My apologies if I sounded unduly negative, but as you say, it's frustrating. I wonder if I could make a couple of suggestions: i) If somebody experienced with the platform and Debian procedures sees discussion of a reproducible problem, with or without a fix, he should suggest that the originator raise a bug and should specify the URL etc. to do so. Where the OP isn't able to do that but multiple people agree there's a problem, he should consider raising it on their behalf. ii) My involvement with a different project has identified a number of issues caused by operand alignment errors which manifest themselves on both SPARC, (at least some) ARM, and possibly in some cases on x64; one of the reasons I run multiple platforms here is to allow me to distinguish between endianness and alignment errors. It could turn out to be useful if developers for the platforms had some way of coordinating effort. -- Mark Morgan Lloyd markMLl .AT. telemetry.co .DOT. uk [Opinions above are the author's, not those of his employers or colleagues] -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-sparc-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/jcihf1$skh$1...@pye-srv-01.telemetry.co.uk
Re: Sparc 6.0.3: multiple Nautilus file manager process after few minutes from fresh install
On Sat, Dec 17, 2011 at 10:29:59AM -0600, Patrick Baggett wrote: Obviously, assuming that those are the only 4 RC bugs affecting sparc would be very naive. But if people do not bother reporting them, we'll never take any action, and release will proceed, again leading to complaints along the lines of I can't believe this buggy stuff was deemed a stable release. And if the port does not have enough users reporting bugs even against the most common desktop environment to the point that it turns out to be hopelessly broken, maybe it's time to consider retiring it. OK guilty as charged. :) I didn't report this bug even though I ran into it. What is a good place to report them should I find more? The easiest way is to install and use reportbug (sudo apt-get install reportbug). If you know the name of the package to report a bug against, just run 'reportbug package_name' and it will guide you through the process, 'man reportbug' has more details. If you know the name of the binary but not the name of the package it belongs to, you can use 'dpkg -S' command to find it out, for example: jurij@paddy:~$ sudo dpkg -S /usr/bin/nautilus nautilus: /usr/bin/nautilus jurij@paddy:~$ If the binary fails catastrophically (crashes on startup or does not provide even basic functionality you which you would normally expect), the bug should be marked release-critical by setting the severity to 'serious'. Severities are explained in more detail at http://www.debian.org/Bugs/Developer#severities If you encounter a crash due to an unaligned memory access (typically binary terminates with 'Bus error'), you should try and include a gdb backtrace with your report. There is an excellent write-up explaining how to do that: http://wiki.debian.org/HowToGetABacktrace Finally, note that the bugs are only considered release-critical if they affect the version of the package which is currently in 'testing' distribution (current 'testing' will become new 'stable' a.k.a. 'wheezy' with the next release), so it's most useful if you are running a 'testing' system. It is installed by default if you are using the daily/weekly installer builds from http://www.debian.org/devel/debian-installer Best regards, -- Jurij Smakov ju...@wooyd.org Key: http://www.wooyd.org/pgpkey/ KeyID: C99E03CC -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-sparc-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/20111217172223.ga5...@wooyd.org
Re: Sparc 6.0.3: multiple Nautilus file manager process after few minutes from fresh install
On Sat, Dec 17, 2011 at 17:29:24 +0100, Julien Cristau wrote: On Sat, Dec 17, 2011 at 11:37:08 +, Mark Morgan Lloyd wrote: Certainly. For sure. No problem. And how long did it take Debian to sort out the known issue that screwed local X on a U1 etc? My I believe it was broken in squeeze r0, and fixed in r1. I don't have access to sparc hw, and nobody told me it was still broken after r1, so… Meh, I meant lenny, not squeeze. Cheers, Julien -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-sparc-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/20111217172610.gd24...@radis.cristau.org
Re: Sparc 6.0.3: multiple Nautilus file manager process after few minutes from fresh install
On Sat, Dec 17, 2011 at 04:53:51PM +, Mark Morgan Lloyd wrote: Obviously, assuming that those are the only 4 RC bugs affecting sparc would be very naive. But if people do not bother reporting them, we'll never take any action, and release will proceed, again leading to complaints along the lines of I can't believe this buggy stuff was deemed a stable release. And if the port does not have enough users reporting bugs even against the most common desktop environment to the point that it turns out to be hopelessly broken, maybe it's time to consider retiring it. My apologies if I sounded unduly negative, but as you say, it's frustrating. I wonder if I could make a couple of suggestions: i) If somebody experienced with the platform and Debian procedures sees discussion of a reproducible problem, with or without a fix, he should suggest that the originator raise a bug and should specify the URL etc. to do so. Where the OP isn't able to do that but multiple people agree there's a problem, he should consider raising it on their behalf. This is a perfectly reasonable suggestion, in fact that's how it is intended for the system to work. See some recommendations on bug reporting I've just posted in another message in this thread. ii) My involvement with a different project has identified a number of issues caused by operand alignment errors which manifest themselves on both SPARC, (at least some) ARM, and possibly in some cases on x64; one of the reasons I run multiple platforms here is to allow me to distinguish between endianness and alignment errors. It could turn out to be useful if developers for the platforms had some way of coordinating effort. Traditionally, responsibility for figuring out the arch-specific problems lies with the package maintainer, who will contact porters as necessary. On top of that, I'm regularly monitoring the release-critical bug list and will try to at least debug any sparc-specific issues which end up there. Best regards, -- Jurij Smakov ju...@wooyd.org Key: http://www.wooyd.org/pgpkey/ KeyID: C99E03CC -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-sparc-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/20111217173453.ga6...@wooyd.org
Re: Sparc 6.0.3: multiple Nautilus file manager process after few minutes from fresh install
Jurij Smakov wrote: On Sat, Dec 17, 2011 at 04:53:51PM +, Mark Morgan Lloyd wrote: Obviously, assuming that those are the only 4 RC bugs affecting sparc would be very naive. But if people do not bother reporting them, we'll never take any action, and release will proceed, again leading to complaints along the lines of I can't believe this buggy stuff was deemed a stable release. And if the port does not have enough users reporting bugs even against the most common desktop environment to the point that it turns out to be hopelessly broken, maybe it's time to consider retiring it. My apologies if I sounded unduly negative, but as you say, it's frustrating. I wonder if I could make a couple of suggestions: i) If somebody experienced with the platform and Debian procedures sees discussion of a reproducible problem, with or without a fix, he should suggest that the originator raise a bug and should specify the URL etc. to do so. Where the OP isn't able to do that but multiple people agree there's a problem, he should consider raising it on their behalf. This is a perfectly reasonable suggestion, in fact that's how it is intended for the system to work. See some recommendations on bug reporting I've just posted in another message in this thread. I'm tied up for a few days (trial compilations on Solaris which might run into routine server maintenance over the holiday), but as soon as I'm able I'll have another session with Squeeze+KDE. If it's as flaky on a U60 as it was on a U80 I'll kvetch here first to make sure it's not a known or an obvious problem, and possibly to ask for suggestions- for example it's not obvious how to get a useful backtrace out of konsole since it's stripped. Once I'm confident that I'm looking at a real issue and have wrung as much info as possible out of it, I'm happy enough to raise a bug report. However I think that for this sort of thing community involvement is valuable before bugging the developers, simply to make sure that silly mistakes don't cause unnecessary noise in the system. Or at least that's how I work elsewhere, and don't in general get any complaints. I'm not sure to what extent I'm prepared to invest time in testing or [gasp] SID unless other people here make a similar commitment, since I do have other things on my plate- both open source projects and the not insignificant requirement to make some sort of living. ii) My involvement with a different project has identified a number of issues caused by operand alignment errors which manifest themselves on both SPARC, (at least some) ARM, and possibly in some cases on x64; one of the reasons I run multiple platforms here is to allow me to distinguish between endianness and alignment errors. It could turn out to be useful if developers for the platforms had some way of coordinating effort. Traditionally, responsibility for figuring out the arch-specific problems lies with the package maintainer, who will contact porters as necessary. On top of that, I'm regularly monitoring the release-critical bug list and will try to at least debug any sparc-specific issues which end up there. But as ARM gradually pushes into SMP, the developers might find they can use the SPARC community's experience. -- Mark Morgan Lloyd markMLl .AT. telemetry.co .DOT. uk [Opinions above are the author's, not those of his employers or colleagues] -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-sparc-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/jcimj7$72h$1...@pye-srv-01.telemetry.co.uk
Re: Sparc 6.0.3: multiple Nautilus file manager process after few minutes from fresh install
On Fri, 2011-12-16 at 22:50 +0800, jaomadn wrote: Hi, I would like to ask some assistance about my new install sparc64 debian 6.0.3 in a sun blade 150 Hardware.i having this problem in a nautilus file manager in the below panel, it keeps open and closing (multiple file manager process starting and dying) this in result of 100 percent cpu load, this problem will start in a few minutes after using the fresh new install system. This is the second time i fresh install i thought this will disappear if i fresh install again. I install on a DVD disc. I did the ff but doesn't solve the problem: 1. remove reinstall the nautilus package including the gnome dependecies like gnome-core* gnome-desktop* etc 2. remove reinstall the full gnome* package. 3. fresh install twice. 4. reboot multiple times for every steps taken above. Thank God someone else has the same error... I thought I had royally screwed something up, as it was working when I did the initial install, worked after I did at least one apt-get upgrade, and still after I'd put a backport kernel in I then didn't use for a few days, and then the problem started - so I just thought it was me, but didn't have enough time to look at it in any detail, as I had another box that I could use for what I needed (*nix + SCSI) So - Also guilty of not raising a bug, but, as I've described, not top of everyone's list, depending on what they *need* to do :( -- AM -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-sparc-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/1324167557.5655.7.camel@executor
Re: Sparc 6.0.3: multiple Nautilus file manager process after few minutes from fresh install
I had this problem too. I just used XFCE 4 instead, but it isn't a problem specific to SPARC. The fix looked annoying when I read it and I don't really like Gnome anyways... http://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=525718 I think this is what you are looking for. On Fri, Dec 16, 2011 at 8:50 AM, jaomadn jaom...@gmail.com wrote: Hi, I would like to ask some assistance about my new install sparc64 debian 6.0.3 in a sun blade 150 Hardware.i having this problem in a nautilus file manager in the below panel, it keeps open and closing (multiple file manager process starting and dying) this in result of 100 percent cpu load, this problem will start in a few minutes after using the fresh new install system. This is the second time i fresh install i thought this will disappear if i fresh install again. I install on a DVD disc. I did the ff but doesn't solve the problem: 1. remove reinstall the nautilus package including the gnome dependecies like gnome-core* gnome-desktop* etc 2. remove reinstall the full gnome* package. 3. fresh install twice. 4. reboot multiple times for every steps taken above. -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-sparc-REQUEST@lists.**debian.orgdebian-sparc-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/**4eeb5ac9.60...@gmail.comhttp://lists.debian.org/4eeb5ac9.60...@gmail.com
Re: Sparc 6.0.3: multiple Nautilus file manager process after few minutes from fresh install
Hi, I would like to ask some assistance about my new install sparc64 debian 6.0.3 in a sun blade 150 Hardware.i having this problem in a nautilus file manager in the below panel, it keeps open and closing (multiple file manager process starting and dying) this in result of 100 percent cpu load, this problem will start in a few minutes after using the fresh new install system. I also got this bug. This is the reason, why I am still using Lenny on my SPARC-systems. The SPARC-version of Squeeze is really buggy and nearly unusable. Other applications have similar problems. For example, Iceweasel segfaults very often and KDE doesn't load the panel. I still hope, that the next Debian release on SPARC will be better. I can't believe, that such a buggy SPARC release as Squeeze was released as stable.. :( This is the second time i fresh install i thought this will disappear if i fresh install again. I install on a DVD disc. I did the ff but doesn't solve the problem: 1. remove reinstall the nautilus package including the gnome dependecies like gnome-core* gnome-desktop* etc 2. remove reinstall the full gnome* package. 3. fresh install twice. 4. reboot multiple times for every steps taken above. I'm sorry, this won't help, the package is buggy. Use Lenny instead and hope, that Wheezy will be better. Greetings -- Alexander Feld shadow...@fsfe.org -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-sparc-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/20111216161850.97b3ee42.shadow...@fsfe.org
Re: Sparc 6.0.3: multiple Nautilus file manager process after few minutes from fresh install
Alexander Feld wrote: I also got this bug. This is the reason, why I am still using Lenny on my SPARC-systems. The SPARC-version of Squeeze is really buggy and nearly unusable. Other applications have similar problems. For example, Iceweasel segfaults very often and KDE doesn't load the panel. I still hope, that the next Debian release on SPARC will be better. I can't believe, that such a buggy SPARC release as Squeeze was released as stable.. :( I'm sorry, this won't help, the package is buggy. Use Lenny instead and hope, that Wheezy will be better. Interesting: I set up Squeeze (KDE variant) on an Ultra-80 for a colleague a few weeks ago and found that running apt-get killed konsole instantly. At that point I reverted to Lenny and promised him a newer version when I'd had a chance to investigate, it works but he finds IceWeasel etc. somewhat dicey. The system I'm typing on is still Etch, I was slow adopting Lenny due to its having a non-working X server on some hardware. I'm still hoping to get Squeeze onto a spare system at some point, but the real question is this: will reported bugs get fixed, or are the developers so overstressed trying to accommodate new hardware that that's all they've got time for? -- Mark Morgan Lloyd markMLl .AT. telemetry.co .DOT. uk [Opinions above are the author's, not those of his employers or colleagues] -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-sparc-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/jcfqj6$kt9$1...@pye-srv-01.telemetry.co.uk
Re: Sparc 6.0.3: multiple Nautilus file manager process after few minutes from fresh install /Ultra 80 running debian
Hello Mark, Am Freitag, den 16.12.2011, 16:11 + schrieb Mark Morgan Lloyd: ... Interesting: I set up Squeeze (KDE variant) on an Ultra-80 for a colleague a few weeks ago and found that running apt-get killed konsole instantly. At that point I reverted to Lenny and promised him a newer version when I'd had a chance to investigate, it works but he finds IceWeasel etc. somewhat dicey. I tried to run debian on my Ultra 80 for serveral years and versions (woody,etch, lenny,...) and with every version the box freezes after a short time (hours not weeks!) and needs a reboot. So it would be nice to hear from your colleagues experiences with the Ultra 80 running debian. With Solaris the box is running well. Regards Dirk -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-sparc-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/1324053421.2746.9.ca...@u60lenny.itddhome.de
Re: Sparc 6.0.3: multiple Nautilus file manager process after few minutes from fresh install /Ultra 80 running debian
Dirk Dettmann Mailinglisten wrote: Hello Mark, Am Freitag, den 16.12.2011, 16:11 + schrieb Mark Morgan Lloyd: ... Interesting: I set up Squeeze (KDE variant) on an Ultra-80 for a colleague a few weeks ago and found that running apt-get killed konsole instantly. At that point I reverted to Lenny and promised him a newer version when I'd had a chance to investigate, it works but he finds IceWeasel etc. somewhat dicey. I tried to run debian on my Ultra 80 for serveral years and versions (woody,etch, lenny,...) and with every version the box freezes after a short time (hours not weeks!) and needs a reboot. So it would be nice to hear from your colleagues experiences with the Ultra 80 running debian. With Solaris the box is running well. Etch on a U60 freezes predictably if you either (a) put a break on the serial port (fixed upstream), (b) run xnest (appears fixed in Lenny) or (c) allow IceApe/IceWeasel to pass a document to OpenOffice (appears fixed in Lenny). I was reluctant to put Lenny on the desktop after a fairly early update broke graphics on systems such as the U1, I think that eventually got fixed but it took a long time. I've raised various bugs with one project I'm involved with and they've almost all turned out to be alignment issues, typically affecting SPARC, at least some variants of ARM, and sometimes x64. -- Mark Morgan Lloyd markMLl .AT. telemetry.co .DOT. uk [Opinions above are the author's, not those of his employers or colleagues] -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-sparc-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/jcfv5q$u64$1...@pye-srv-01.telemetry.co.uk
Re: Sparc 6.0.3: multiple Nautilus file manager process after few minutes from fresh install
On Fri, Dec 16, 2011 at 04:18:50PM +0100, Alexander Feld wrote: Hi, I would like to ask some assistance about my new install sparc64 debian 6.0.3 in a sun blade 150 Hardware.i having this problem in a nautilus file manager in the below panel, it keeps open and closing (multiple file manager process starting and dying) this in result of 100 percent cpu load, this problem will start in a few minutes after using the fresh new install system. I also got this bug. This is the reason, why I am still using Lenny on my SPARC-systems. The SPARC-version of Squeeze is really buggy and nearly unusable. Other applications have similar problems. For example, Iceweasel segfaults very often and KDE doesn't load the panel. I still hope, that the next Debian release on SPARC will be better. I can't believe, that such a buggy SPARC release as Squeeze was released as stable.. :( Bugs only have a chance of getting fixed if they are reported. This is the second time i fresh install i thought this will disappear if i fresh install again. I install on a DVD disc. I did the ff but doesn't solve the problem: 1. remove reinstall the nautilus package including the gnome dependecies like gnome-core* gnome-desktop* etc 2. remove reinstall the full gnome* package. 3. fresh install twice. 4. reboot multiple times for every steps taken above. I'm sorry, this won't help, the package is buggy. Use Lenny instead and hope, that Wheezy will be better. Hoping will not make it better. Good bug reports (with patches, if possible) might. Best regards, -- Jurij Smakov ju...@wooyd.org Key: http://www.wooyd.org/pgpkey/ KeyID: C99E03CC -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-sparc-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/20111216180855.ga2...@wooyd.org
Re: Sparc 6.0.3: multiple Nautilus file manager process after few minutes from fresh install /Ultra 80 running debian
Am Freitag, den 16.12.2011, 17:29 + schrieb Mark Morgan Lloyd: Etch on a U60 freezes predictably if you either (a) put a break on the serial port (fixed upstream), (b) run xnest (appears fixed in Lenny) or (c) allow IceApe/IceWeasel to pass a document to OpenOffice (appears fixed in Lenny). The freezing I am talking of ONLY happens to the Ultra 80, my both U60s are running fine with debian. This email comes from a U60 running lenny. The situation is the following: booting U80, logging into gdm, doing nothing -- U80 freezes after a while. Regards Dirk -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-sparc-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/1324059820.2746.16.ca...@u60lenny.itddhome.de
Re: Sparc 6.0.3: multiple Nautilus file manager process after few minutes from fresh install
Hi thanks for interest and the links, replies, i think the problem describe in the link is far years ago its 2009 with version of nautilus so old 2.26 and the debian 6.0.3 has nautilus 2.30. I just wonder why this bug still exist since its known for almost 3 years. i Would like to try to downgrade to nautilus 2.24-* since that version describe in the discussion is said to be fix but i dont have a direct connection to the repo. Also in addition i believe its not hardware specific like mention in the reply msgs since i try it also in the sun blade 1000 its the same. i would try to ulta 2 or ultra 5 but i guess its all the same. Its been 3 days circumventing this problem i wonder if i try some desktop manager since downgrading in lenny version describe in some message reply will take me another day for downloading the installer. In my surprise installing LXDE since its available in the DVD installer package has pretty solve my problem im running the LXDE session manager and it less consume CPU so i guess gnome will be scrap, I am also enlightened on this problem in gnome since im a gnome user for ubuntu almost 3 years now. So i guess its true about other reply also in mail about debian sparc is so buggy its not fit for stable version. So i had this question in mind. 1. Is debian sparc gnome manager is a bit a problem or maybe im looking the wrong direction. 2. How about gnome for x86 i386 and amd64 does the same buggy or just gnome for sparc. 3. Does LXDE required or some components of the gnome required to functions lxde manager( as an example how about specific application), im planning to remove the gnome desktop manager) 4. What are the advantage or dis-advantage using LXDE or GNOME except for its lighter CPU on LXDE As this experience im enlighted on using other Lighter desktop manager, Thanks for the interest and replies. On Friday, 16 December, 2011 11:12 PM, Patrick Baggett wrote: I had this problem too. I just used XFCE 4 instead, but it isn't a problem specific to SPARC. The fix looked annoying when I read it and I don't really like Gnome anyways... http://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=525718 I think this is what you are looking for. On Fri, Dec 16, 2011 at 8:50 AM, jaomadn jaom...@gmail.com mailto:jaom...@gmail.com wrote: Hi, I would like to ask some assistance about my new install sparc64 debian 6.0.3 in a sun blade 150 Hardware.i having this problem in a nautilus file manager in the below panel, it keeps open and closing (multiple file manager process starting and dying) this in result of 100 percent cpu load, this problem will start in a few minutes after using the fresh new install system. This is the second time i fresh install i thought this will disappear if i fresh install again. I install on a DVD disc. I did the ff but doesn't solve the problem: 1. remove reinstall the nautilus package including the gnome dependecies like gnome-core* gnome-desktop* etc 2. remove reinstall the full gnome* package. 3. fresh install twice. 4. reboot multiple times for every steps taken above. -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-sparc-requ...@lists.debian.org mailto:debian-sparc-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org mailto:listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/4eeb5ac9.60...@gmail.com
