[libreoffice-design] Re: [libreoffice-design] Logo proposal without TDF line
Hi Rick, sorry for replying late - but at the moment all I can do is marking the mails I want to reply and reply later on... Hi, all new friends, I agree with Nik. On the other hand, I'm very impressed with he work that has been done in such a short time. We will have to discuss the logo topic in quite a short time - but at the moment it was necessary to come up with something people can use. (you probably read my latest mails on the logo). I'm new here and I've followed this mailing list for a while to get an idea of how the collaboration is done. Welcome to our team! You already did the second step: Not only reading, but posting on the list. Great! We know that our structure is far away from being optimized with regards to new contributors, so please bare with us and ask, if there is anything you don't understand. If you want to, you might write down your experience with our team and put it on the wiki (you already know about it?) for future newbies. You might propose improvements to our workflow as well... Did you follow Christoph's Kick-off effort? You'll see that we are heading towards the basic decisions in LibreOffice design. A short presentation: I'm a designer and project manager. I work on Mac, Windows and Linux, but my major platform is design. I've never participated in open source development before, but I've worked with open source scripts/programs in many projects for years. Our team is (probably) different from most of the OS development areas, because - we aren't developers - we work collaboratively instead of merging different patches to dedicated topics - we think our work influences the entire community - we have a lot of fun (okay - the last two points might fit to other teams as well ;-) ) i would be happy if a can contribute and help. I'm sure you will be able to help us - just read the mails sent here and jump in whenever you like to... Best regards Bernhard -- Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to design+h...@libreoffice.org List archive: http://listarchives.libreoffice.org/www/design/ *** All posts to this list are publicly archived for eternity ***
Re: [libreoffice-design] Re: [libreoffice-design] Logo proposal without TDF line
Hi Bernhard!, all! On 2/6/2011 9:06 AM, Dr. Bernhard Dippold wrote: I'm sorry I keep bringing this up, but I think it's necessary to discuss and plan for this. Most people will see our logo before they even try the software. We might lose them before we even shake their hand. You really think that we lose most of our possible customers because of our poor logo? I didn't think it would be *that* bad... Best regards Bernhard =) You're right, probably a gross over-exaggeration. But here's an interesting (well, kinda boring actually) story; At the end of last semester, one of our students asked me how to go deeper than simple web-dev. He wanted PHP. I opened up Eclipse and Netbeans homepages and told him these 2 were the bees-knees. I expected he would opt for Eclipse because they had a better (not usability-wise) website (wasn't always the case, that). He said Hmmm, I'll give this (Netbeans) a try and I asked him out of curiosity, why not eclipse?. He said; Their logo looks like it was made in a high-school design competition... That made me smile. Such a simple, uneducated choice huh? but who here is not guilty of having judged a book by it's cover? Sadly, almost all my books have nice covers. I'm not really ashamed, that's the power of good Design. -Nik -- Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to design+h...@libreoffice.org List archive: http://listarchives.libreoffice.org/www/design/ *** All posts to this list are publicly archived for eternity ***
Re: [libreoffice-design] Re: [libreoffice-design] Logo proposal without TDF line
Hi Bernhard, I'm sorry to appear a bit disruptive, but I think that the changes concerning the logo already address some parts of the community branding. Although I'm happy if we can further refine our branding, I fear that such changes lead to a bit confusion ... I've already seen a lot of Material created for the trade fairs (shirts, banner, pens, lanyards, ...) being affected of such changes. Moreover, blogger and press already use the given material ... so I am a bit doubtful concerning any change at the moment. Thus, if there are issues to combine the document symbol with the rest of the graphic items, would it be helpful to just foucs on the text LibreOffice and a subline? If we need something neat, why not play with the triangle that may be added somewhere - it can also be considered to be a (current) key visual. What do you think? Cheers, Christoph Am Sonntag, den 06.02.2011, 13:44 +0100 schrieb Bernhard Dippold: Hi Nik, all, here my ideas: Dr. Bernhard Dippold schrieb: Hi Nik, all, sorry for not replying earlier, but... Nik wrote: [...] If we were feeling adventurous, I think small changes could really improve the look of the current logo; (refer to R05) *http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/File:LibOlogo_reconfigs03.jpg* - Clip the L so it is cut by the same gap which slices the paper icon: for continuation. Good idea - even if I don't think we should do the same with the b2 as in R06. I've already tried to reduce the distance between symbol and L even more by extending the green corner to the L - not really a valid idea, but you might get what I mean, when I'll upload the draft tomorrow (today only mail access). http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/File:LibO_Logo_idea.png Still with the darker grey, no consistency in borders, distance between symbol and corner still to be improved and many other things... I'd like to see the symbol as integrated part of the logo - and with less difference in height between symbol and text, allowing the text to be readable in smaller scales too. I prefer b) very much over a), because the corner becomes too large and I like optical illusion (negative visualization of the upper part of the L), but I wanted to show you both. Best regards Bernhard -- Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to design+h...@libreoffice.org List archive: http://listarchives.libreoffice.org/www/design/ *** All posts to this list are publicly archived for eternity ***
Re: [libreoffice-design] Re: [libreoffice-design] Logo proposal without TDF line
Hi all, I totally forgot to mention ... The LibO banners Cor brought to the FOSDEM were based on our installer images and just looked *amazing* - so although we talk about some issues, the quality was just great. There was even a person who came and asked to get one of those simple printouts after the FOSDEM. Moreover, I got some feedback by one core developer who really liked the clean design of the current splash screen :-) Cheers, Christoph Am Montag, den 07.02.2011, 22:34 +0100 schrieb Christoph Noack: Hi Bernhard, I'm sorry to appear a bit disruptive, but I think that the changes concerning the logo already address some parts of the community branding. Although I'm happy if we can further refine our branding, I fear that such changes lead to a bit confusion ... I've already seen a lot of Material created for the trade fairs (shirts, banner, pens, lanyards, ...) being affected of such changes. Moreover, blogger and press already use the given material ... so I am a bit doubtful concerning any change at the moment. Thus, if there are issues to combine the document symbol with the rest of the graphic items, would it be helpful to just foucs on the text LibreOffice and a subline? If we need something neat, why not play with the triangle that may be added somewhere - it can also be considered to be a (current) key visual. What do you think? Cheers, Christoph Am Sonntag, den 06.02.2011, 13:44 +0100 schrieb Bernhard Dippold: Hi Nik, all, here my ideas: Dr. Bernhard Dippold schrieb: Hi Nik, all, sorry for not replying earlier, but... Nik wrote: [...] If we were feeling adventurous, I think small changes could really improve the look of the current logo; (refer to R05) *http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/File:LibOlogo_reconfigs03.jpg* - Clip the L so it is cut by the same gap which slices the paper icon: for continuation. Good idea - even if I don't think we should do the same with the b2 as in R06. I've already tried to reduce the distance between symbol and L even more by extending the green corner to the L - not really a valid idea, but you might get what I mean, when I'll upload the draft tomorrow (today only mail access). http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/File:LibO_Logo_idea.png Still with the darker grey, no consistency in borders, distance between symbol and corner still to be improved and many other things... I'd like to see the symbol as integrated part of the logo - and with less difference in height between symbol and text, allowing the text to be readable in smaller scales too. I prefer b) very much over a), because the corner becomes too large and I like optical illusion (negative visualization of the upper part of the L), but I wanted to show you both. Best regards Bernhard -- Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to design+h...@libreoffice.org List archive: http://listarchives.libreoffice.org/www/design/ *** All posts to this list are publicly archived for eternity ***
Re: [libreoffice-design] Re: [libreoffice-design] Logo proposal without TDF line
On 02/07/2011 03:48 PM, Christoph Noack wrote: Hi Jeff, yes, all the material is available. Just being curious, what do you intend to do? Thanks, Christoph Here's the relevant thread: http://www.mail-archive.com/design@libreoffice.org/msg00747.html -- Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to design+h...@libreoffice.org List archive: http://listarchives.libreoffice.org/www/design/ *** All posts to this list are publicly archived for eternity ***
Re: [libreoffice-design] Re: [libreoffice-design] Logo proposal without TDF line
On Mon, 2011-02-07 at 15:52 -0700, Jeff Chimene wrote: On 02/07/2011 03:48 PM, Christoph Noack wrote: Hi Jeff, yes, all the material is available. Just being curious, what do you intend to do? Thanks, Christoph Here's the relevant thread: http://www.mail-archive.com/design@libreoffice.org/msg00747.html Hi Jeff, Here is a pdf file that should work for the 5' x 2.5' banner http://oucv.org/libreoffice/banner_60inx30in.pdf //drew -- Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to design+h...@libreoffice.org List archive: http://listarchives.libreoffice.org/www/design/ *** All posts to this list are publicly archived for eternity ***
Re: [libreoffice-design] Re: [libreoffice-design] Logo proposal without TDF line
On Mon, 2011-02-07 at 18:59 -0500, drew wrote: On Mon, 2011-02-07 at 15:52 -0700, Jeff Chimene wrote: On 02/07/2011 03:48 PM, Christoph Noack wrote: Hi Jeff, yes, all the material is available. Just being curious, what do you intend to do? Thanks, Christoph Here's the relevant thread: http://www.mail-archive.com/design@libreoffice.org/msg00747.html Hi Jeff, Here is a pdf file that should work for the 5' x 2.5' banner http://oucv.org/libreoffice/banner_60inx30in.pdf and here is 35 x 20 http://oucv.org/libreoffice/banner_35inx20in.pdf Both files are set for 75 dpi Thanks -- Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to design+h...@libreoffice.org List archive: http://listarchives.libreoffice.org/www/design/ *** All posts to this list are publicly archived for eternity ***
Re: [libreoffice-design] Re: [libreoffice-design] Logo proposal without TDF line
Hi Jeff, Here is a pdf file that should work for the 5' x 2.5' banner http://oucv.org/libreoffice/banner_60inx30in.pdf and here is 35 x 20 http://oucv.org/libreoffice/banner_35inx20in.pdf Both files are set for 75 dpi Sorry for one more mail on this: - you can find the svg files in the same location just change the file descriptor. Just export to pdf from inkscape if you need to make a change. [I did make one last change to each so check that you clear you cache before grabbing the pdf files] Drew -- Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to design+h...@libreoffice.org List archive: http://listarchives.libreoffice.org/www/design/ *** All posts to this list are publicly archived for eternity ***
Re: [libreoffice-design] Re: [libreoffice-design] Logo proposal without TDF line
On 02/07/2011 05:24 PM, drew wrote: Hi Jeff, Here is a pdf file that should work for the 5' x 2.5' banner http://oucv.org/libreoffice/banner_60inx30in.pdf and here is 35 x 20 http://oucv.org/libreoffice/banner_35inx20in.pdf Both files are set for 75 dpi Sorry for one more mail on this: - you can find the svg files in the same location just change the file descriptor. Just export to pdf from inkscape if you need to make a change. [I did make one last change to each so check that you clear you cache before grabbing the pdf files] Drew OK I'll look at them now. Bernhard: are you following this thread? -- Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to design+h...@libreoffice.org List archive: http://listarchives.libreoffice.org/www/design/ *** All posts to this list are publicly archived for eternity ***
[libreoffice-design] Re: [libreoffice-design] Logo proposal without TDF line
Hi Nik, all, sorry for not replying earlier, but... Nik wrote: [... skipping the short version - too much to reply inline... Hi Bernhard! I know I told you I'd be busy with my research but you keep raising interesting topics that lure me back! =) Should I say I'm sorry? Only if this activities here reduce the quality of your main work, your private life, your sleep quality or any other more important task. ;-) OK - I'm very glad that you're here! :-) Besides, some /*very*/ important stuff is being decided right now, that if I miss out on, I know it will never get changed again. That is the way of Open-Source huh? like a big machine on rails that can only go forward, not back =) Of course it can - but it cost's nearly as much as in the corporate world. (Sometimes money, but more credibility, consistency and fun...) On 1/31/2011 9:12 AM, Bernhard Dippold wrote: Do you think we can present this logo (or something similar) to the Steering Committee as our Design Team proposal for an official logo of LibreOffice for external use? Comments? Critics? Improvements? If the possibility of /small/ changes are possible to the logo in this context, can we take this opportunity to address some if its shortcomings? I didn't talk to the Steering Committee on this question, but I think we can. [...] It wouldn't entail major changes, but the longer we trudge on with an interim logo, the more certain I become that it will remain the *only* logo tried. At least for some time. The point is that some people want to use a logo for representing LibreOffice outside the community now. So we are restricted in time, but not as much to avoid any discussion on improvement. We just shouldn't need more than one or wo weeks to come to a final version. [...] R03 is what I would recommend, I think the gap could decrease and because the letter L has a good corner effect, it perfectly juxtaposes the icon when aligned. This way, the entire arrangement would look like one visual block which is what you want; White space /around/ the logo, rather than /between/. I support this standing - we don't need as much space between the parts of the logo. [...] If we were feeling adventurous, I think small changes could really improve the look of the current logo; (refer to R05) *http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/File:LibOlogo_reconfigs03.jpg* - Clip the L so it is cut by the same gap which slices the paper icon: for continuation. Good idea - even if I don't think we should do the same with the b2 as in R06. I've already tried to reduce the distance between symbol and L even more by extending the green corner to the L - not really a valid idea, but you might get what I mean, when I'll upload the draft tomorrow (today only mail access). - Lighten the colours to mid-grey instead of dark-grey, this will still print well and compliments the green better. The lighter grey looks more friendly, but there are some drawbacks, we need to keep in mind: 1. Reproduction of grey tones are problematic on prints, the lighter the color is, the more differ prints on different printers. 2. Contrast to the background will be reduced, thus leading to a even more restrictive Branding Guideline (keep the white background of the logo). I think the positive aspects of the lighter grey are more important - I just wanted to mention. Your green gradient introduces a new green tone different from the existing green branding colors (I didn't compare - it's just my impression). Especially with the next point this becomes important: - Colour the broken corner of the paper icon to create a focal point that leads the eye through the logo I like the colored corner. It integrates the symbol with the text and adds a visible distinction from the TDF symbol by keeping it's relationship. But with your new gradient the general impression of the green moves towards yellow. I would like to avoid modifying the Initial Branding Colors before we work on the Community Branding. I'm not sure giving the members logos is the entire solution because it just creates many logo variations. I think creating badges for community members with a non-TDF logo /attached/ will send the right message without diluting the brand. I don't mind if they are logos or logos with badges. But we are on the same side: Being allowed to use a visible reference proving that someone belongs to an LibO Team is a positive motivation. Because it suggests affiliation without suggesting ownership. I think Charles mentioned this in an Email to the Design list (I've CC'ed him), I was really excited by the prospect of making team badges, but because I'm short on time, I've only got roughs (plenty of glitches). I thought the topic could wait, but these are related things. I still think that they have some more time. Before anybody can use them, it is necessary to create rules about their usage (who is allowed to use
