Re: [libreoffice-design] Re: Agenda for the design meeting 2018 Mar/21

[Alex ARNAUD]

Le 21/03/2018 à 17:20, kainz.a a écrit :

You made the UI file with Glade a GUI design app from the gnome project.
It's "cool" but definitly not the way a user can edit the UI. Also the
sidebar items aren't configurable. For now there is no way to edit the
Notebookbar as a LO user. Maybe in the future, ...


OK, I understand better what you mean. Thanks.

Best regards,
Alex.

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Re: [libreoffice-design] Re: Agenda for the design meeting 2018 Mar/21

[kainz.a]

> How the NB will be configurable if not from the UI file? How it is
> generated?
>

You made the UI file with Glade a GUI design app from the gnome project.
It's "cool" but definitly not the way a user can edit the UI. Also the
sidebar items aren't configurable. For now there is no way to edit the
Notebookbar as a LO user. Maybe in the future, ...

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Re: [libreoffice-design] Re: Agenda for the design meeting 2018 Mar/21

[Alex ARNAUD]

Le 21/03/2018 à 14:26, kainz.a a écrit :

As the notebookbar is different implemented then the default and sidebar
layout I don't think it should be default in the near future. Bigest
problem is that when the NB bugs are fixed the NB isn't configurable by the
LO UI.


How the NB will be configurable if not from the UI file? How it is 
generated?


Best regards,
Alex.

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Re: [libreoffice-design] Re: Agenda for the design meeting 2018 Mar/21

[Pedro Rosmaninho]

I thought eventually LO would migrate to GTK3 so Glade would be used by
default?

On Wed, Mar 21, 2018 at 1:26 PM, kainz.a  wrote:

> Hi Pedro,
>
> thanks for the Notebookbar buglist. We have a GSOC Student how will work
> on notebookbar so it's also my dream that notebookbar will be awaiy from
> experimental. My dream would be also 6.1 but I hope it will happen at least
> with 6.2.
>
> As the notebookbar is different implemented then the default and sidebar
> layout I don't think it should be default in the near future. Bigest
> problem is that when the NB bugs are fixed the NB isn't configurable by the
> LO UI.
>
> But I hopen NB will be ready for use in the near future for the people how
> will like it.
>
> I know zereo about coding, but I did the Groupedbar full/compact and
> tabbedbar compact. So you don't need ANY coding experience to join the LO
> design group on telegram or anywhere else. You can make notebookbars
> without coding with the gnome glade app which is a GUI to make the
> notebookbar.
>
> Cheers
> Andreas_K
>

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Re: [libreoffice-design] Re: Agenda for the design meeting 2018 Mar/21

[kainz.a]

Hi Pedro,

thanks for the Notebookbar buglist. We have a GSOC Student how will work on
notebookbar so it's also my dream that notebookbar will be awaiy from
experimental. My dream would be also 6.1 but I hope it will happen at least
with 6.2.

As the notebookbar is different implemented then the default and sidebar
layout I don't think it should be default in the near future. Bigest
problem is that when the NB bugs are fixed the NB isn't configurable by the
LO UI.

But I hopen NB will be ready for use in the near future for the people how
will like it.

I know zereo about coding, but I did the Groupedbar full/compact and
tabbedbar compact. So you don't need ANY coding experience to join the LO
design group on telegram or anywhere else. You can make notebookbars
without coding with the gnome glade app which is a GUI to make the
notebookbar.

Cheers
Andreas_K

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Re: [libreoffice-design] Re: Agenda for the design meeting 2018 Mar/21

[Pedro Rosmaninho]

Guys, I've added a bunch of bugs related to the Notebookbar. Not sure if
there will be any focus in polishing it any further to make it available in
6.1 as a feature and not experimentally (it would be an amazing addition
together with Colibre - 6.1 would make a big splash with the Groupedbar
Full + Colibre as default in Windows - hey, a man can dream).

https://bugs.documentfoundation.org/show_bug.cgi?id=116531
https://bugs.documentfoundation.org/show_bug.cgi?id=116532
https://bugs.documentfoundation.org/show_bug.cgi?id=116533
https://bugs.documentfoundation.org/show_bug.cgi?id=116534
https://bugs.documentfoundation.org/show_bug.cgi?id=116535 --> (this last
one is just an enhancement unrelated with the Notebookbar)

By the way, is the purpose of the Notebookbar to eventually replace the
current UI options? If so, maybe it would be a good idea to replicate the
current Standard Toolbar, Single Toolbar and the Sidebar in the Notebookbar?

Any way, have a good meeting (I can't frequent them - classes at that time
and I know zero about coding).

On Wed, Mar 21, 2018 at 2:43 AM, Joe Brazell  wrote:

> That Colibre set is quite nice, and would definitely be an improvement for
> Windows users.
>
> One area in which LO has been trailing is meeting the latest design
> standards for Windows. The Notebookbar is making good progress and having a
> Windows 10-esque icon theme would be another improvement. I use Breeze as
> it is the most similar to Windows 10, but Colibre would be an improvement.
>
>
>
> I guess I am unfamiliar with how distributing it would work, but I would
> assume making it available ASAP even if not in the LO build, but including
> it in 6.1 may be a good idea.
>
>
>
> *From: *Pedro Rosmaninho 
> *Sent: *Tuesday, March 20, 2018 6:49 PM
> *To: *kainz.a 
> *Cc: *V Stuart Foote ; LibreOffice Design
> 
> *Subject: *Re: [libreoffice-design] Re: Agenda for the design meeting
> 2018 Mar/21
>
>
>
> Well, I totally back Kainz.
>
> Even more so when he says he completed plenty of the icon sets and is
>
> providing support.
>
>
>
> On Tue, Mar 20, 2018 at 9:58 PM, kainz.a  wrote:
>
>
>
> > *Colibre backport for 6.0 to get a bigger audience*
>
> > +1 stuart
>
> >
>
> > backport the zip file for the icon theme would'n be a big deal
>
> > but introduce a new default without a previous release could be an issue.
>
> >
>
> > As already written Colibre follow the icon guidelines from MSO
>
> > and since yesterday Colibre is complete. So now I'll make design fixes
>
> > and when someone find a missing icon, I'll happy to fix it.
>
> >
>
> > *One icon theme for all platforms*
>
> > -1 heiko
>
> >
>
> > In general it's a good idea to have a brand or cooperate design,
>
> > but we have Breeze for KDE/Plasma, Tango for Gnome,
>
> > Elementary for Elementary and Colibre for Windows.
>
> > In addition LibreOffice use also the platform style (gnome, kde, windows)
>
> > so when you want one icon theme, than you should make also only one
> style.
>
> >
>
> > As I wrote I'm not again move icon themes to the extension wepage,
>
> > but than LO should also get a unique design and don't fit each platform
>
> > as much as possible.
>
> >
>
> >
>
> > *Galaxy and Tango*
>
> >
>
> > Galaxy is somewhere "hardcoded" into the code (I don't know where)
>
> > so I'm not sure if it's possible to remove Galaxy.
>
> >
>
> > Tango is unmaintained and fare away from complete.
>
> > I moved the existing tango svg icons to a separate folder so that
>
> > the svg files wasn't shipped any more with the images_tango.zip file
>
> > this reduce the zip file from 8 mb to 1 mb.
>
> >
>
> > *Breeze, Elementary and Colibre*
>
> >
>
> > I updated Elementary icons for 6.0 and now Elementary is finished like
>
> > breeze or colibre. I also maintain all three icon themes. And I think I
> did
>
> > it well in the last years. All three icon themes are made in inkscape so
>
> > all are available in svg and png. And I'll vote for make all three svg
> icon
>
> > themes available in LibreOffice Online.
>
> >
>
> > *Community Vote*
>
> >
>
> > Last time we vote was a disaster (mascot, sorry). I'm again a community
>
> > vote
>
> > cause I don't see a benefit Colibre was designed for Windows 10 and it
>
> > fit's
>
> > what if the community say we want to have Elementary default. I would be
>
> > again this

Re: [libreoffice-design] Re: Agenda for the design meeting 2018 Mar/21

[Pedro Rosmaninho]

Well, I totally back Kainz.
Even more so when he says he completed plenty of the icon sets and is
providing support.

On Tue, Mar 20, 2018 at 9:58 PM, kainz.a  wrote:

> *Colibre backport for 6.0 to get a bigger audience*
> +1 stuart
>
> backport the zip file for the icon theme would'n be a big deal
> but introduce a new default without a previous release could be an issue.
>
> As already written Colibre follow the icon guidelines from MSO
> and since yesterday Colibre is complete. So now I'll make design fixes
> and when someone find a missing icon, I'll happy to fix it.
>
> *One icon theme for all platforms*
> -1 heiko
>
> In general it's a good idea to have a brand or cooperate design,
> but we have Breeze for KDE/Plasma, Tango for Gnome,
> Elementary for Elementary and Colibre for Windows.
> In addition LibreOffice use also the platform style (gnome, kde, windows)
> so when you want one icon theme, than you should make also only one style.
>
> As I wrote I'm not again move icon themes to the extension wepage,
> but than LO should also get a unique design and don't fit each platform
> as much as possible.
>
>
> *Galaxy and Tango*
>
> Galaxy is somewhere "hardcoded" into the code (I don't know where)
> so I'm not sure if it's possible to remove Galaxy.
>
> Tango is unmaintained and fare away from complete.
> I moved the existing tango svg icons to a separate folder so that
> the svg files wasn't shipped any more with the images_tango.zip file
> this reduce the zip file from 8 mb to 1 mb.
>
> *Breeze, Elementary and Colibre*
>
> I updated Elementary icons for 6.0 and now Elementary is finished like
> breeze or colibre. I also maintain all three icon themes. And I think I did
> it well in the last years. All three icon themes are made in inkscape so
> all are available in svg and png. And I'll vote for make all three svg icon
> themes available in LibreOffice Online.
>
> *Community Vote*
>
> Last time we vote was a disaster (mascot, sorry). I'm again a community
> vote
> cause I don't see a benefit Colibre was designed for Windows 10 and it
> fit's
> what if the community say we want to have Elementary default. I would be
> again this vote also if you choose breeze. I like both and I think breeze
> is the most modern icon theme, but it was designed for plasma not for
> windows.
>
> I see a benefit if we involve the community to make colibre better
> to report bugs, ...
>
> *My vote*
>
> I will vote for no change for remove icon themes from the core repository
> and Colibre as default for LibreOffice 6.1
> Backport for LO 6.0 would be fine but no default change in LO 6.0
>
> And sorry I can't participate the design meeting tomorrow.
>
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Re: [libreoffice-design] Re: Agenda for the design meeting 2018 Mar/21

[kainz.a]

*Colibre backport for 6.0 to get a bigger audience*
+1 stuart

backport the zip file for the icon theme would'n be a big deal
but introduce a new default without a previous release could be an issue.

As already written Colibre follow the icon guidelines from MSO
and since yesterday Colibre is complete. So now I'll make design fixes
and when someone find a missing icon, I'll happy to fix it.

*One icon theme for all platforms*
-1 heiko

In general it's a good idea to have a brand or cooperate design,
but we have Breeze for KDE/Plasma, Tango for Gnome,
Elementary for Elementary and Colibre for Windows.
In addition LibreOffice use also the platform style (gnome, kde, windows)
so when you want one icon theme, than you should make also only one style.

As I wrote I'm not again move icon themes to the extension wepage,
but than LO should also get a unique design and don't fit each platform
as much as possible.


*Galaxy and Tango*

Galaxy is somewhere "hardcoded" into the code (I don't know where)
so I'm not sure if it's possible to remove Galaxy.

Tango is unmaintained and fare away from complete.
I moved the existing tango svg icons to a separate folder so that
the svg files wasn't shipped any more with the images_tango.zip file
this reduce the zip file from 8 mb to 1 mb.

*Breeze, Elementary and Colibre*

I updated Elementary icons for 6.0 and now Elementary is finished like
breeze or colibre. I also maintain all three icon themes. And I think I did
it well in the last years. All three icon themes are made in inkscape so
all are available in svg and png. And I'll vote for make all three svg icon
themes available in LibreOffice Online.

*Community Vote*

Last time we vote was a disaster (mascot, sorry). I'm again a community vote
cause I don't see a benefit Colibre was designed for Windows 10 and it fit's
what if the community say we want to have Elementary default. I would be
again this vote also if you choose breeze. I like both and I think breeze
is the most modern icon theme, but it was designed for plasma not for
windows.

I see a benefit if we involve the community to make colibre better
to report bugs, ...

*My vote*

I will vote for no change for remove icon themes from the core repository
and Colibre as default for LibreOffice 6.1
Backport for LO 6.0 would be fine but no default change in LO 6.0

And sorry I can't participate the design meeting tomorrow.

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[libreoffice-design] Re: Agenda for the design meeting 2018 Mar/21

[V Stuart Foote]

The backport now to 6.0 would be to get more eyes on the Icon set. It would
not yet be the default on Windows, but rather  it would give Andreas a
chance to take care of any dark corners of the UI with additional design
before it becomes such--including hopefully support for SVG icons.  And an
ability to better support HighContrast and Color Blind user configurations.

This late feature backport  to 6.0 would be low risk, only adding the icon
packaging and an entry on the Tools -> Options -> View: Icon style  drop
list.

We'd need to promote the new icons with some guidance on testing them to
encourage feedback. With just a bit of effort, we'd be ready to have them
generally accepted as a new Windows default at 6.1 release.





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Re: [libreoffice-design] Re: Agenda for the design meeting 2018 Mar/21

[Pedro Rosmaninho]

> Just for the Windows builds--replacing Tango.
>
> tdf#90194 - Make B̶r̶e̶e̶z̶e̶ Colibre the new default in Windows 10
> 
>
> Design/UX issues are to decide if to back port the icon theme as late
> feature for the LibreOffice 6.0 release; and if to replace Tango as default
> icon theme for Windows builds for the 6.1 release.
>

​Holy crap, that would be awesome!!! :D
I already use a non-official icon set similar to the Office one, but an
official would be amazing. Count me as voting for changing the icon theme
for Windows.

By the way guys, I am sending in attachment an Impress and Powerpoint files
with some feedback about the Notebookbar. Some bugs that I've caught when
trying out the Tabbed Notebookbar and the Groupedbar Full. I know I should
add them to Bugzilla but I didn't have the time to add them, so I am
sending them in attachment to the mailing list. When I have time I'll
create bug reports. :)​

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[libreoffice-design] Re: Agenda for the design meeting 2018 Mar/21

[V Stuart Foote]

Daniel A. Rodriguez wrote
> ...
> Why not elementary?

Elementary is no longer maintained.

Colibre is in current development and  has been themed for LibreOffice
targeting Windows only.   tdf#115867 - Windows 10 icon theme follow MSO
guidelines   


Rosmaninho wrote
> That Colibre icon set is gorgeous!! And it will fit perfectly in Windows
> 10.
> 
> However, will it be the default icon set for Windows only? I don't think
> it
> suits any Linux distro.

Just for the Windows builds--replacing Tango.

tdf#90194 - Make B̶r̶e̶e̶z̶e̶ Colibre the new default in Windows 10
  

Design/UX issues are to decide if to back port the icon theme as late
feature for the LibreOffice 6.0 release; and if to replace Tango as default
icon theme for Windows builds for the 6.1 release.





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