Re: Future of Ivy and IvyDE

[Gary Gregory]

I was a long-time Ant + Ivy and IvyDE. At work, we finally switched one of
our products to Maven. We have at least one other product that still uses
Ant + Ivy, I'm not sure what that team operates as an IDE.

>From my POV, you can't effectively and sanely develop using Ivy *without*
IDE support, in our case, that was Eclipse and IvyDE.

Gary



On Mon, Aug 28, 2023 at 9:23 AM Stefan Bodewig  wrote:

> Hi
>
> sorry for my bad timing sending out an email and then being unbale to
> answer for days. This is not what I intended.
>
> Let me try to answer what I've seen so far. And I'll try to keep my
> personal opinion out this time.
>
> It is pretty obvious Ivy is used today and maybe even loved by
> some. This is great for any project.
>
> As is probably true with all volunteer based open source projects people
> come and go as their interests and focus change.
>
> In the case of Ivy this unfortunately means it is not maintained well
> today and this is not going to change with the current set of Ant
> developers. All of us work on Ant in our spare time and we've picked
> developing Ant for several different reasons - none of these reasons
> seem to apply to Ivy for anybody of us.
>
> It is not my intention to kill Ivy. Not at all. But if maintenance of
> Ivy is left with the current set of Ant developers this is what is
> likely going to happen, eventually.
>
> It just seemed to be fair to inform Ivy's users about the current
> state.
>
> Cheers
>
> Stefan
>

Re: [VOTE] Release Apache Ant 1.10.14 based on RC1

[Gary Gregory]

Sounds good!

Thank you,
Gary


From: Jaikiran Pai 
Sent: Wednesday, August 16, 2023 8:57:09 PM
To: Ant Developers List ; Gary Gregory 
; Ant Users List 
Subject: Re: [VOTE] Release Apache Ant 1.10.14 based on RC1

EXTERNAL EMAIL




Hello Gary,

Yes, that allow.class which was introduced in 1.10.13 is no longer part
of Ant 1.10.14. I think, as you note, adding it to the release notes
sounds like the right thing, since a couple of projects had specifically
run into issue with that class. I'll update the release note after the
voting completes (won't create a new RC for that).

-Jaikiran

On 16/08/23 6:42 pm, Gary Gregory wrote:
> (AFK) Does this remove the class file in the root of the ant-launcher jar 
> which caused JPMS issues? If so, it might be worth mentioning in the release 
> noyes.
>
> Gary
>
> 
> From: Jaikiran Pai 
> Sent: Wednesday, August 16, 2023 8:35:22 AM
> To: u...@ant.apache.org ; dev@ant.apache.org 
> 
> Subject: [VOTE] Release Apache Ant 1.10.14 based on RC1
>
> EXTERNAL EMAIL
>
>
>
>
> Hello everyone,
>
> I've created RC1 release candidate for Ant 1.10.14 release:
>
> git tag: ANT_1.10.14_RC1
>
> on commit: 53f19eccf49acf526415997046dca5a5135b0e8f
>
> tarballs: 
> https://dist.apache.org/repos/dist/dev/ant/<https://dist.apache.org/repos/dist/dev/ant><https://dist.apache.org/repos/dist/dev/ant<https://dist.apache.org/repos/dist/dev/ant>>
>
> revision: 63474
>
> Maven artifacts:
> https://repository.apache.org/content/repositories/orgapacheant-1057<https://repository.apache.org/content/repositories/orgapacheant-1057><https://repository.apache.org/content/repositories/orgapacheant-1057<https://repository.apache.org/content/repositories/orgapacheant-1057>>
>
>
> Apart from regular bug fixes, this 1.10.14 release has crucial changes
> around Ant's usage of Java SecurityManager. Many of you will be aware
> that Java 17 deprecated (for removal) the use of SecurityManager. Java
> 18 then disallowed setting SecurityManager at runtime, by default. Ant
> internally sets a SecurityManager at runtime to prevent System.exit()
> calls from within tasks, from killing the JVM in which Ant process is
> running. In Ant 1.10.13, we tried to keep using the SecurityManager
> internally for a few more releases in Ant, to facilitate projects to use
> Ant without requiring (major) changes to their build. The workarounds we
> put in place in Ant 1.10.13 were brittle and complex and although we had
> hoped they won't break user builds, they did end up breaking several
> builds. Ultimately, these workarounds for usage of SecurityManager are
> no longer feasible or adding value.
>
> As such, this 1.10.14 release of Ant will no longer use (or set) Java
> SecurityManager when running on Java versions 18 and higher. This has
> implications for projects using Ant. Specifically, if any of the build
> tasks (for example the "", "" or "" tasks)
> or libraries used in those tasks are calling System.exit() or
> Runtime.exit() and aren't forking a new JVM, then when running on Java
> 18 and higher, they may notice that the Ant JVM process gets killed.
> Such builds are recommended to either not call
> System.exit()/Runtime.exit() or use the "fork=true" option in relevant
> tasks (wherever appropriate).
>
> Furthermore, the usage of "" type when running on Java 18
> and higher is no longer supported. More details are available in the
> manual of that type 
> https://dist.apache.org/repos/dist/dev/ant/manual/<https://dist.apache.org/repos/dist/dev/ant/manual><https://dist.apache.org/repos/dist/dev/ant/manual<https://dist.apache.org/repos/dist/dev/ant/manual>>.
>
> The complete set of changes in this release are noted in
> https://dist.apache.org/repos/dist/dev/ant/RELEASE-NOTES-1.10.14.html<https://dist.apache.org/repos/dist/dev/ant/RELEASE-NOTES-1.10.14.html><https://dist.apache.org/repos/dist/dev/ant/RELEASE-NOTES-1.10.14.html<https://dist.apache.org/repos/dist/dev/ant/RELEASE-NOTES-1.10.14.html>>.
>
> Please do give this proposed release version a try against whichever
> Java runtime versions you plan to use it against (this version requires
> a minimum of Java 8 runtime, like any other Ant 1.10.x versions). Even
> if you don't vote, if you do run into issues, please report back - it
> takes time to create Ant releases, so catching any blocker issues (like
> some of which we saw after Ant 1.10.13 was released) early will help fix
> them sooner.
>
> This vote will be open for at least 72 hours and close no earlier than
> 19th August 2023 12 PM.
>
> -Jaikiran
>
>
> ---

Re: [VOTE] Release Apache Ant 1.10.14 based on RC1

[Gary Gregory]

(AFK) Does this remove the class file in the root of the ant-launcher jar which 
caused JPMS issues? If so, it might be worth mentioning in the release noyes.

Gary


From: Jaikiran Pai 
Sent: Wednesday, August 16, 2023 8:35:22 AM
To: u...@ant.apache.org ; dev@ant.apache.org 

Subject: [VOTE] Release Apache Ant 1.10.14 based on RC1

EXTERNAL EMAIL




Hello everyone,

I've created RC1 release candidate for Ant 1.10.14 release:

git tag: ANT_1.10.14_RC1

on commit: 53f19eccf49acf526415997046dca5a5135b0e8f

tarballs: 
https://dist.apache.org/repos/dist/dev/ant/

revision: 63474

Maven artifacts:
https://repository.apache.org/content/repositories/orgapacheant-1057


Apart from regular bug fixes, this 1.10.14 release has crucial changes
around Ant's usage of Java SecurityManager. Many of you will be aware
that Java 17 deprecated (for removal) the use of SecurityManager. Java
18 then disallowed setting SecurityManager at runtime, by default. Ant
internally sets a SecurityManager at runtime to prevent System.exit()
calls from within tasks, from killing the JVM in which Ant process is
running. In Ant 1.10.13, we tried to keep using the SecurityManager
internally for a few more releases in Ant, to facilitate projects to use
Ant without requiring (major) changes to their build. The workarounds we
put in place in Ant 1.10.13 were brittle and complex and although we had
hoped they won't break user builds, they did end up breaking several
builds. Ultimately, these workarounds for usage of SecurityManager are
no longer feasible or adding value.

As such, this 1.10.14 release of Ant will no longer use (or set) Java
SecurityManager when running on Java versions 18 and higher. This has
implications for projects using Ant. Specifically, if any of the build
tasks (for example the "", "" or "" tasks)
or libraries used in those tasks are calling System.exit() or
Runtime.exit() and aren't forking a new JVM, then when running on Java
18 and higher, they may notice that the Ant JVM process gets killed.
Such builds are recommended to either not call
System.exit()/Runtime.exit() or use the "fork=true" option in relevant
tasks (wherever appropriate).

Furthermore, the usage of "" type when running on Java 18
and higher is no longer supported. More details are available in the
manual of that type 
https://dist.apache.org/repos/dist/dev/ant/manual/.

The complete set of changes in this release are noted in
https://dist.apache.org/repos/dist/dev/ant/RELEASE-NOTES-1.10.14.html.

Please do give this proposed release version a try against whichever
Java runtime versions you plan to use it against (this version requires
a minimum of Java 8 runtime, like any other Ant 1.10.x versions). Even
if you don't vote, if you do run into issues, please report back - it
takes time to create Ant releases, so catching any blocker issues (like
some of which we saw after Ant 1.10.13 was released) early will help fix
them sooner.

This vote will be open for at least 72 hours and close no earlier than
19th August 2023 12 PM.

-Jaikiran


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