Re: New Apache Cassandra Group on LinkedIn
I think that is a fair perspective based on the history of this project. I'm not ready to give up on trying to figure it out though. I worry about the Cassandra project being isolated when it's really not true. If there is a clear policy on something like a retweet with clear intentions and within established guidelines, I feel this is possible. 1. A retweet is not an endorsement and is simply for awareness of the community at large. 2. Back to basics. If the project or product follows ASF trademark then it is good to go. "powered By Apache Cassandra" etc 3. Content that doesn't adhere to trademark rules is ignored (and possibly flagged by the PMC for a follow-up) Incentivize the good behaviors and show a thriving ecosystem. Disincentivize the bad behaviors and help bring more into compliance. Patrick On Mon, Mar 14, 2022 at 10:19 AM Eric Evans wrote: > > > On Wed, Mar 9, 2022 at 12:39 PM Patrick McFadin > wrote: > >> I'm not sure if they can merge groups but from what I'm reading that >> wouldn't work either. What I'm seeing is a desire to not "promote vendors" >> which I believe is working against the project's self-interest. LinkedIn is >> the perfect place to do it. The allergic reaction the project has taken for >> vendors has made our ecosystem look weak when that's not really the case. >> Temporal, Prometheus, Feast, Orkes (to just name a few) all have Cassandra >> integrations but you would never know that by looking at any official >> Cassandra communication because ecosystem == vendor == bad. The result is >> that Cassandra looks like an island that will never help this project grow. >> > > The problem comes when you try to balance being informative versus > (creating the impression of )advocacy, while being fair and equitable. > We've been here, done this, and were never able to walk these lines in a > way that satisfied a consensus. It's not worth it IMO. > > >> >> On Wed, Mar 9, 2022 at 9:20 AM Jeremy Hanna >> wrote: >> >>> Is it possible to ask someone at linkedin to merge the groups together >>> so that it's managed by the PMC but with the explicit permission of the >>> people running the other group? In the past, I know that Twitter does >>> things like that in terms of handles and followers. Is that a desirable >>> outcome? >>> >>> On Mar 9, 2022, at 11:00 AM, Benjamin Lerer wrote: >>> >>> Hi Patrick, >>> Thanks for reaching out. Effectively the discussion has happened between >>> the PMC members. >>> To explain the context, we wanted to have an official group on Linkedin >>> to publish news about the project as we do through the @cassandra handler >>> on Twitter. We wanted a group that was vendor independent and focused on >>> Apache Cassandra and its ecosystem. >>> To be fully transparent, we had no idea that you were in charge of the >>> Apache Cassandra Users group as it appears managed by Lynn Bender and >>> Joanna Kapel. The group also appears to promote different vendors which is >>> something that we wanted to avoid. >>> Having to post things under Lynn's name was also an issue for us as we >>> wished the merits to go to the right persons. >>> >>> Now, I am sure that we can work out some solution that will benefit the >>> community. :-) >>> >>> Le mer. 9 mars 2022 à 15:56, Patrick McFadin a >>> écrit : >>> >>>> I feel like this needs to be a discussion held on the public mailing >>>> list. I have been running the Apache Cassandra Users group on LinkedIn for >>>> years after taking it over from Lynn Bender. >>>> https://www.linkedin.com/groups/3803052/ >>>> >>>> We have over 7500 members and had its ups and downs but it's been >>>> pretty consistent as a professional resource on LinkedIn. I'm not sure what >>>> there is to gain by creating competing groups. If we need more managers in >>>> the group that's fine but somebody just needed to ask. It's clear that this >>>> discussion happened somewhere else and this was just an announcement. >>>> >>>> Patrick >>>> >>>> On Thu, Mar 3, 2022 at 3:41 AM Benjamin Lerer >>>> wrote: >>>> >>>>> Hi everybody, >>>>> >>>>> We just created a new Apache Cassandra group on LinkedIn ( >>>>> https://www.linkedin.com/groups/9159443/). >>>>> >>>>> This group will be managed by our community and will respect vendor >>>>> neutrality. >>>>> Do not hesitate to join and share your experiences or blog posts with >>>>> us :-) >>>>> >>>> >>>
Re: New Apache Cassandra Group on LinkedIn
On Wed, Mar 9, 2022 at 12:39 PM Patrick McFadin wrote: > I'm not sure if they can merge groups but from what I'm reading that > wouldn't work either. What I'm seeing is a desire to not "promote vendors" > which I believe is working against the project's self-interest. LinkedIn is > the perfect place to do it. The allergic reaction the project has taken for > vendors has made our ecosystem look weak when that's not really the case. > Temporal, Prometheus, Feast, Orkes (to just name a few) all have Cassandra > integrations but you would never know that by looking at any official > Cassandra communication because ecosystem == vendor == bad. The result is > that Cassandra looks like an island that will never help this project grow. > The problem comes when you try to balance being informative versus (creating the impression of )advocacy, while being fair and equitable. We've been here, done this, and were never able to walk these lines in a way that satisfied a consensus. It's not worth it IMO. > > On Wed, Mar 9, 2022 at 9:20 AM Jeremy Hanna > wrote: > >> Is it possible to ask someone at linkedin to merge the groups together so >> that it's managed by the PMC but with the explicit permission of the people >> running the other group? In the past, I know that Twitter does things like >> that in terms of handles and followers. Is that a desirable outcome? >> >> On Mar 9, 2022, at 11:00 AM, Benjamin Lerer wrote: >> >> Hi Patrick, >> Thanks for reaching out. Effectively the discussion has happened between >> the PMC members. >> To explain the context, we wanted to have an official group on Linkedin >> to publish news about the project as we do through the @cassandra handler >> on Twitter. We wanted a group that was vendor independent and focused on >> Apache Cassandra and its ecosystem. >> To be fully transparent, we had no idea that you were in charge of the >> Apache Cassandra Users group as it appears managed by Lynn Bender and >> Joanna Kapel. The group also appears to promote different vendors which is >> something that we wanted to avoid. >> Having to post things under Lynn's name was also an issue for us as we >> wished the merits to go to the right persons. >> >> Now, I am sure that we can work out some solution that will benefit the >> community. :-) >> >> Le mer. 9 mars 2022 à 15:56, Patrick McFadin a >> écrit : >> >>> I feel like this needs to be a discussion held on the public mailing >>> list. I have been running the Apache Cassandra Users group on LinkedIn for >>> years after taking it over from Lynn Bender. >>> https://www.linkedin.com/groups/3803052/ >>> >>> We have over 7500 members and had its ups and downs but it's been pretty >>> consistent as a professional resource on LinkedIn. I'm not sure what there >>> is to gain by creating competing groups. If we need more managers in the >>> group that's fine but somebody just needed to ask. It's clear that this >>> discussion happened somewhere else and this was just an announcement. >>> >>> Patrick >>> >>> On Thu, Mar 3, 2022 at 3:41 AM Benjamin Lerer wrote: >>> >>>> Hi everybody, >>>> >>>> We just created a new Apache Cassandra group on LinkedIn ( >>>> https://www.linkedin.com/groups/9159443/). >>>> >>>> This group will be managed by our community and will respect vendor >>>> neutrality. >>>> Do not hesitate to join and share your experiences or blog posts with >>>> us :-) >>>> >>> >>
Re: New Apache Cassandra Group on LinkedIn
I really like Melissa's idea of having a company instead for higher visibility and members not having to join a group to see the activity. It also makes it easy to tag the company in posts and get more engagement that way. Cheers!
Re: New Apache Cassandra Group on LinkedIn
I agree there should be an official LinkedIn page for the project hosted by the community. It's an easy way for people to stay current. If the goal of the new LinkedIn page is to publicly and broadly share what the Cassandra community is doing, one solution would be to change the new Cassandra page from a "group" page to a "company" page. Company pages show all posts publicly by default, and admins don't have to manage requests to join. Anyone can "follow" the page and see/share the posts -- while only allowing community admins to publish. This would also require less care and feeding from community admins. (What I don't know if it's easy to "convert" a group page to company or if it requires starting from scratch.) Then, admins of the existing "group" page could repost any/all items from the community page to keep people informed. This solution could help both pages achieve their goals of spreading the word about Cassandra. On Wed, Mar 9, 2022 at 10:39 AM Patrick McFadin wrote: > I'm not sure if they can merge groups but from what I'm reading that > wouldn't work either. What I'm seeing is a desire to not "promote vendors" > which I believe is working against the project's self-interest. LinkedIn is > the perfect place to do it. The allergic reaction the project has taken for > vendors has made our ecosystem look weak when that's not really the case. > Temporal, Prometheus, Feast, Orkes (to just name a few) all have Cassandra > integrations but you would never know that by looking at any official > Cassandra communication because ecosystem == vendor == bad. The result is > that Cassandra looks like an island that will never help this project grow. > > On Wed, Mar 9, 2022 at 9:20 AM Jeremy Hanna > wrote: > >> Is it possible to ask someone at linkedin to merge the groups together so >> that it's managed by the PMC but with the explicit permission of the people >> running the other group? In the past, I know that Twitter does things like >> that in terms of handles and followers. Is that a desirable outcome? >> >> On Mar 9, 2022, at 11:00 AM, Benjamin Lerer wrote: >> >> Hi Patrick, >> Thanks for reaching out. Effectively the discussion has happened between >> the PMC members. >> To explain the context, we wanted to have an official group on Linkedin >> to publish news about the project as we do through the @cassandra handler >> on Twitter. We wanted a group that was vendor independent and focused on >> Apache Cassandra and its ecosystem. >> To be fully transparent, we had no idea that you were in charge of the >> Apache Cassandra Users group as it appears managed by Lynn Bender and >> Joanna Kapel. The group also appears to promote different vendors which is >> something that we wanted to avoid. >> Having to post things under Lynn's name was also an issue for us as we >> wished the merits to go to the right persons. >> >> Now, I am sure that we can work out some solution that will benefit the >> community. :-) >> >> Le mer. 9 mars 2022 à 15:56, Patrick McFadin a >> écrit : >> >>> I feel like this needs to be a discussion held on the public mailing >>> list. I have been running the Apache Cassandra Users group on LinkedIn for >>> years after taking it over from Lynn Bender. >>> https://www.linkedin.com/groups/3803052/ >>> >>> We have over 7500 members and had its ups and downs but it's been pretty >>> consistent as a professional resource on LinkedIn. I'm not sure what there >>> is to gain by creating competing groups. If we need more managers in the >>> group that's fine but somebody just needed to ask. It's clear that this >>> discussion happened somewhere else and this was just an announcement. >>> >>> Patrick >>> >>> On Thu, Mar 3, 2022 at 3:41 AM Benjamin Lerer wrote: >>> >>>> Hi everybody, >>>> >>>> We just created a new Apache Cassandra group on LinkedIn ( >>>> https://www.linkedin.com/groups/9159443/). >>>> >>>> This group will be managed by our community and will respect vendor >>>> neutrality. >>>> Do not hesitate to join and share your experiences or blog posts with >>>> us :-) >>>> >>> >> -- Melissa Logan (she/her) Principal, Constantia.io LinkedIn <https://www.linkedin.com/in/mklogan/> | Twitter <https://twitter.com/Melissa_B2B>
Re: New Apache Cassandra Group on LinkedIn
I'm not sure if they can merge groups but from what I'm reading that wouldn't work either. What I'm seeing is a desire to not "promote vendors" which I believe is working against the project's self-interest. LinkedIn is the perfect place to do it. The allergic reaction the project has taken for vendors has made our ecosystem look weak when that's not really the case. Temporal, Prometheus, Feast, Orkes (to just name a few) all have Cassandra integrations but you would never know that by looking at any official Cassandra communication because ecosystem == vendor == bad. The result is that Cassandra looks like an island that will never help this project grow. On Wed, Mar 9, 2022 at 9:20 AM Jeremy Hanna wrote: > Is it possible to ask someone at linkedin to merge the groups together so > that it's managed by the PMC but with the explicit permission of the people > running the other group? In the past, I know that Twitter does things like > that in terms of handles and followers. Is that a desirable outcome? > > On Mar 9, 2022, at 11:00 AM, Benjamin Lerer wrote: > > Hi Patrick, > Thanks for reaching out. Effectively the discussion has happened between > the PMC members. > To explain the context, we wanted to have an official group on Linkedin to > publish news about the project as we do through the @cassandra handler on > Twitter. We wanted a group that was vendor independent and focused on > Apache Cassandra and its ecosystem. > To be fully transparent, we had no idea that you were in charge of the > Apache Cassandra Users group as it appears managed by Lynn Bender and > Joanna Kapel. The group also appears to promote different vendors which is > something that we wanted to avoid. > Having to post things under Lynn's name was also an issue for us as we > wished the merits to go to the right persons. > > Now, I am sure that we can work out some solution that will benefit the > community. :-) > > Le mer. 9 mars 2022 à 15:56, Patrick McFadin a > écrit : > >> I feel like this needs to be a discussion held on the public mailing >> list. I have been running the Apache Cassandra Users group on LinkedIn for >> years after taking it over from Lynn Bender. >> https://www.linkedin.com/groups/3803052/ >> >> We have over 7500 members and had its ups and downs but it's been pretty >> consistent as a professional resource on LinkedIn. I'm not sure what there >> is to gain by creating competing groups. If we need more managers in the >> group that's fine but somebody just needed to ask. It's clear that this >> discussion happened somewhere else and this was just an announcement. >> >> Patrick >> >> On Thu, Mar 3, 2022 at 3:41 AM Benjamin Lerer wrote: >> >>> Hi everybody, >>> >>> We just created a new Apache Cassandra group on LinkedIn ( >>> https://www.linkedin.com/groups/9159443/). >>> >>> This group will be managed by our community and will respect vendor >>> neutrality. >>> Do not hesitate to join and share your experiences or blog posts with us >>> :-) >>> >> >
Re: New Apache Cassandra Group on LinkedIn
Is it possible to ask someone at linkedin to merge the groups together so that it's managed by the PMC but with the explicit permission of the people running the other group? In the past, I know that Twitter does things like that in terms of handles and followers. Is that a desirable outcome? > On Mar 9, 2022, at 11:00 AM, Benjamin Lerer wrote: > > Hi Patrick, > Thanks for reaching out. Effectively the discussion has happened between the > PMC members. > To explain the context, we wanted to have an official group on Linkedin to > publish news about the project as we do through the @cassandra handler on > Twitter. We wanted a group that was vendor independent and focused on Apache > Cassandra and its ecosystem. > To be fully transparent, we had no idea that you were in charge of the Apache > Cassandra Users group as it appears managed by Lynn Bender and Joanna Kapel. > The group also appears to promote different vendors which is something that > we wanted to avoid. > Having to post things under Lynn's name was also an issue for us as we wished > the merits to go to the right persons. > > Now, I am sure that we can work out some solution that will benefit the > community. :-) > > Le mer. 9 mars 2022 à 15:56, Patrick McFadin <mailto:pmcfa...@gmail.com>> a écrit : > I feel like this needs to be a discussion held on the public mailing list. I > have been running the Apache Cassandra Users group on LinkedIn for years > after taking it over from Lynn Bender. > https://www.linkedin.com/groups/3803052/ > <https://www.linkedin.com/groups/3803052/> > > We have over 7500 members and had its ups and downs but it's been pretty > consistent as a professional resource on LinkedIn. I'm not sure what there is > to gain by creating competing groups. If we need more managers in the group > that's fine but somebody just needed to ask. It's clear that this discussion > happened somewhere else and this was just an announcement. > > Patrick > > On Thu, Mar 3, 2022 at 3:41 AM Benjamin Lerer <mailto:ble...@apache.org>> wrote: > Hi everybody, > > We just created a new Apache Cassandra group on LinkedIn > (https://www.linkedin.com/groups/9159443/ > <https://www.linkedin.com/groups/9159443/>). > > This group will be managed by our community and will respect vendor > neutrality. > Do not hesitate to join and share your experiences or blog posts with us :-)
Re: New Apache Cassandra Group on LinkedIn
Hi Patrick, Thanks for reaching out. Effectively the discussion has happened between the PMC members. To explain the context, we wanted to have an official group on Linkedin to publish news about the project as we do through the @cassandra handler on Twitter. We wanted a group that was vendor independent and focused on Apache Cassandra and its ecosystem. To be fully transparent, we had no idea that you were in charge of the Apache Cassandra Users group as it appears managed by Lynn Bender and Joanna Kapel. The group also appears to promote different vendors which is something that we wanted to avoid. Having to post things under Lynn's name was also an issue for us as we wished the merits to go to the right persons. Now, I am sure that we can work out some solution that will benefit the community. :-) Le mer. 9 mars 2022 à 15:56, Patrick McFadin a écrit : > I feel like this needs to be a discussion held on the public mailing list. > I have been running the Apache Cassandra Users group on LinkedIn for years > after taking it over from Lynn Bender. > https://www.linkedin.com/groups/3803052/ > > We have over 7500 members and had its ups and downs but it's been pretty > consistent as a professional resource on LinkedIn. I'm not sure what there > is to gain by creating competing groups. If we need more managers in the > group that's fine but somebody just needed to ask. It's clear that this > discussion happened somewhere else and this was just an announcement. > > Patrick > > On Thu, Mar 3, 2022 at 3:41 AM Benjamin Lerer wrote: > >> Hi everybody, >> >> We just created a new Apache Cassandra group on LinkedIn ( >> https://www.linkedin.com/groups/9159443/). >> >> This group will be managed by our community and will respect vendor >> neutrality. >> Do not hesitate to join and share your experiences or blog posts with us >> :-) >> >
Re: New Apache Cassandra Group on LinkedIn
I feel like this needs to be a discussion held on the public mailing list. I have been running the Apache Cassandra Users group on LinkedIn for years after taking it over from Lynn Bender. https://www.linkedin.com/groups/3803052/ We have over 7500 members and had its ups and downs but it's been pretty consistent as a professional resource on LinkedIn. I'm not sure what there is to gain by creating competing groups. If we need more managers in the group that's fine but somebody just needed to ask. It's clear that this discussion happened somewhere else and this was just an announcement. Patrick On Thu, Mar 3, 2022 at 3:41 AM Benjamin Lerer wrote: > Hi everybody, > > We just created a new Apache Cassandra group on LinkedIn ( > https://www.linkedin.com/groups/9159443/). > > This group will be managed by our community and will respect vendor > neutrality. > Do not hesitate to join and share your experiences or blog posts with us > :-) >
New Apache Cassandra Group on LinkedIn
Hi everybody, We just created a new Apache Cassandra group on LinkedIn ( https://www.linkedin.com/groups/9159443/). This group will be managed by our community and will respect vendor neutrality. Do not hesitate to join and share your experiences or blog posts with us :-)
