Re: Getting planetapache back

[Phil Steitz]

On 5/30/16 6:12 PM, Phil Steitz wrote:
> The blog aggregator that used to be serve from
> http://planet.apache.org/ is now defunct.  It was running from
> minotaur, the old p.a.o box and as minotaur is being prepared for
> retirement, the service has been shut down.  There are links to this
> service scattered throughout the apache web site, most notably [1],
> which includes instructions on how committers can get their blogs
> syndicated.  We should either get the service restored or clean up
> all of the links to it.  I like using the service, so I would like
> to see it restored.
>
> I will take a shot at getting it running if I can get help getting a
> VM or host somewhere to set it up on and DNS set up to point to it. 
> Any suggestions on where to put it?

Sorry, forgot the reference
[1] http://www.apache.org/dev/committer-blogs
>
> Phil
>
>

Getting planetapache back

[Phil Steitz]

The blog aggregator that used to be serve from
http://planet.apache.org/ is now defunct.  It was running from
minotaur, the old p.a.o box and as minotaur is being prepared for
retirement, the service has been shut down.  There are links to this
service scattered throughout the apache web site, most notably [1],
which includes instructions on how committers can get their blogs
syndicated.  We should either get the service restored or clean up
all of the links to it.  I like using the service, so I would like
to see it restored.

I will take a shot at getting it running if I can get help getting a
VM or host somewhere to set it up on and DNS set up to point to it. 
Any suggestions on where to put it?

Phil

Re: ombudsman@ (was Encouraging More Women to Participate on Apache Projects?)

[Mark Thomas]

On 30/05/2016 18:30, Ross Gardler wrote:
> Yes. Thanks to everyone working this out.

Done. Thanks Marvin.

The next step is to expand the list of contacts. The call for volunteers
was made on the private members@ mailing list so, in keeping with the
ASF policy of not copying information from a private list to a public
one, I won't list those volunteers here. What I will do is pass the list
to Ross for him to review. Once reviewed, I'll check with each of the
volunteers to make sure they are happy being listed as a PoC and, if
they are, get them added.

It was suggested that each listed volunteer should include a link to a
picture and a brief bio. Any concerns or objections? If not, can I
suggest that the volunteers create
https://home.apache.org/~availid/coc.html and we link to that?

Mark

> From: Mark Thomas
> Sent: Monday, May 30, 2016 1:53 AM
> To: dev@community.apache.org
> Subject: Re: ombudsman@ (was Encouraging More Women to Participate on Apache 
> Projects?)
> 
> 
> 
> On 29/05/2016 23:07, Ross Gardler wrote:
>> For the record I do have training in counselling. Its fairly lightweight and 
>> basically boils down to knowing how to respond and when to escalate to a 
>> specialist.
> 
> Ross,
> 
> There looks to be general agreement that archiving abuse reports is a
> bad idea. On the grounds that handling these is a president@ function,
> are you happy for Marvin's patch to be applied where you are listed with
> your @a.o email as the only volunteer (and a note that the list is
> expected to be expanded shortly)?
> 
> Assuming you are OK with this, we can get this done and then discuss
> expanding that list of volunteers and some of the other improvements
> that have been suggested.
> 
> Mark
> 
> 
> 
>>
>> Sent from my Windows 10 phone
>>
>> From: Ross Gardler
>> Sent: Sunday, May 29, 2016 3:06 PM
>> To: Joseph Schaefer; 
>> dev@community.apache.org
>> Cc: Joseph Schaefer
>> Subject: RE: ombudsman@ (was Encouraging More Women to Participate on Apache 
>> Projects?)
>>
>>
>> Yes its positive and I've supported it every step, including stating 
>> whatever folks decide is best.  I'm just saying that the kind of reporting 
>> you hope for is unlikely to materialize.
>>
>>
>>
>> Sent from my Windows 10 phone
>>
>>
>>
>> From: Joseph Schaefer
>> Sent: Sunday, May 29, 2016 12:03 PM
>> To: dev@community.apache.org
>> Cc: Joseph Schaefer
>> Subject: Re: ombudsman@ (was Encouraging More Women to Participate on Apache 
>> Projects?)
>>
>>
>>
>> So whittling down the access to this information from 600 odd members to a 
>> handful of people isn't a positive step Ross?  We can certainly debate the 
>> necessity for an ombudsman alias but that has little to do with the benefits 
>> of having a collaborative team of people to deal with this.
>>
>> Keep in mind Ross that your own expertise in this matter is limited to your 
>> own direct experiences- we as an org have absolutely no insight into how 
>> well you have done in this capacity.  Again we should look at the facts like 
>> retainment and satisfaction of the reporter- what we're doing isn't enough 
>> if the person just winds up walking away from the asf post hoc.
>>
>> The org has not paid for your training in this matter, and your business 
>> training from dealing with sexual harassment issues at work does not 
>> directly translate because there are no employees here at the asf.  Trust 
>> me, I've sat through those same dull meetings myself- it's more about what 
>> not to do to avoid a federal case being filed against the company.
>>
>> I too have some experiences dealing with other students being sexually 
>> harassed by their professors, so I'm not particularly ignorant of the 
>> surrounding issues as to why complaints are filed to whom and what sorts of 
>> remedies are typically desired.  In my capacity as graduate student 
>> representative, despite having a very close relationship with the department 
>> chair I never came across a reporter willing to authorize me to share their 
>> report with the chair.  They always wanted to keep it informal and low key- 
>> at best I was asked to confront the professor in question that I was aware 
>> of what was going on with an anonymous person.
>>
>> What I'm suggesting is that these volunteers discuss directly with the 
>> reporters the options available, and that includes every level of 
>> escalation, even to other ombudsman.  This doesn't seem particularly 
>> difficult to grasp, and allows a less experienced volunteer to usher in 
>> advice and support from the rest of the team.
>>
>> Sent from my iPhone
>>
>>> On May 29, 2016, at 2:41 PM, Ross Gardler  
>>> 

RE: ombudsman@ (was Encouraging More Women to Participate on Apache Projects?)

[Ross Gardler]

Yes. Thanks to everyone working this out.



Sent from my Windows 10 phone



From: Mark Thomas
Sent: Monday, May 30, 2016 1:53 AM
To: dev@community.apache.org
Subject: Re: ombudsman@ (was Encouraging More Women to Participate on Apache 
Projects?)



On 29/05/2016 23:07, Ross Gardler wrote:
> For the record I do have training in counselling. Its fairly lightweight and 
> basically boils down to knowing how to respond and when to escalate to a 
> specialist.

Ross,

There looks to be general agreement that archiving abuse reports is a
bad idea. On the grounds that handling these is a president@ function,
are you happy for Marvin's patch to be applied where you are listed with
your @a.o email as the only volunteer (and a note that the list is
expected to be expanded shortly)?

Assuming you are OK with this, we can get this done and then discuss
expanding that list of volunteers and some of the other improvements
that have been suggested.

Mark



>
> Sent from my Windows 10 phone
>
> From: Ross Gardler
> Sent: Sunday, May 29, 2016 3:06 PM
> To: Joseph Schaefer; 
> dev@community.apache.org
> Cc: Joseph Schaefer
> Subject: RE: ombudsman@ (was Encouraging More Women to Participate on Apache 
> Projects?)
>
>
> Yes its positive and I've supported it every step, including stating whatever 
> folks decide is best.  I'm just saying that the kind of reporting you hope 
> for is unlikely to materialize.
>
>
>
> Sent from my Windows 10 phone
>
>
>
> From: Joseph Schaefer
> Sent: Sunday, May 29, 2016 12:03 PM
> To: dev@community.apache.org
> Cc: Joseph Schaefer
> Subject: Re: ombudsman@ (was Encouraging More Women to Participate on Apache 
> Projects?)
>
>
>
> So whittling down the access to this information from 600 odd members to a 
> handful of people isn't a positive step Ross?  We can certainly debate the 
> necessity for an ombudsman alias but that has little to do with the benefits 
> of having a collaborative team of people to deal with this.
>
> Keep in mind Ross that your own expertise in this matter is limited to your 
> own direct experiences- we as an org have absolutely no insight into how well 
> you have done in this capacity.  Again we should look at the facts like 
> retainment and satisfaction of the reporter- what we're doing isn't enough if 
> the person just winds up walking away from the asf post hoc.
>
> The org has not paid for your training in this matter, and your business 
> training from dealing with sexual harassment issues at work does not directly 
> translate because there are no employees here at the asf.  Trust me, I've sat 
> through those same dull meetings myself- it's more about what not to do to 
> avoid a federal case being filed against the company.
>
> I too have some experiences dealing with other students being sexually 
> harassed by their professors, so I'm not particularly ignorant of the 
> surrounding issues as to why complaints are filed to whom and what sorts of 
> remedies are typically desired.  In my capacity as graduate student 
> representative, despite having a very close relationship with the department 
> chair I never came across a reporter willing to authorize me to share their 
> report with the chair.  They always wanted to keep it informal and low key- 
> at best I was asked to confront the professor in question that I was aware of 
> what was going on with an anonymous person.
>
> What I'm suggesting is that these volunteers discuss directly with the 
> reporters the options available, and that includes every level of escalation, 
> even to other ombudsman.  This doesn't seem particularly difficult to grasp, 
> and allows a less experienced volunteer to usher in advice and support from 
> the rest of the team.
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
>> On May 29, 2016, at 2:41 PM, Ross Gardler  wrote:
>>
>> I don’t think you’ll see that benefit. Privacy and safety from repudiation 
>> is a critical factor. You don't get that with a group sharing experiences 
>> and reports. In some cases I have agreed never to reveal the fact a 
>> complaint was made. That’s why I have only provided estimated counts. I 
>> don’t want to go back and count (in fact I don’t even keep the emails in 
>> some cases).
>>
>>
>>
>> I'm not saying a group is bad, more choice is good. All I'm saying is that 
>> the primary goal of this focused activity is to deal with the specifics and 
>> thus extracting generalities in small numbers and non-specific summaries of 
>> unique situations is not so helpful.
>>
>>
>>
>> A more important goal, in the foundation rather than individual sense, is to 
>> deal with the root cause and make the approach being discussed 

Re: Encouraging Diversity - Update 1

[Ted Dunning]

Sharan,

One possible explanation of an under-representation problem (assuming we
have one ... you point out rightly that we should measure first) is that
*other* factors have given the impression that open source communities are
unfriendly.

For instance, I could imagine that the recent Gamergate hullabaloo might
cause a (mis)perception that open source projects are like that. Or it
could be other communities are tarring us with their brush.

This would lead to something very much like what some people are claiming
is the situation, that is that ASF communities are plenty welcoming and
friendly but we still wind up with lots less participation than you might
otherwise expect.

I can't say that this *is* the case, but it might be a possible mechanism
to keep an eye out for.



On Mon, May 30, 2016 at 1:27 PM, Sharan Foga  wrote:

> Hi Everyone
>
> A quick update following on from my thread about encouraging women to
> participate in ASF projects.
>
> I've contacted a few women's groups but not everyone has replied. Full
> details are on the wiki page I've setup.
>
> https://cwiki.apache.org/confluence/display/COMDEV/Diversity+Strategy+Ideas
>
>
> I'll be doing some follow up this week if I don't hear anything.
>
> A big thank you to Tamao who connected me to her contact at Hackbright. As
> she mentioned in her previous post, Hackbright are looking into open source
> programs and partnerships so the ASF could be a very good fit. We have a
> call planned for 16^th June.
>
> Also on the wiki page – I've started drafting some ideas about a general
> high level diversity strategy with a mission statement and some deliverable
> outcomes. From that I've tried to take it down another level to think about
> what we would need to deliver that outcome.
>
> One thing that keeps recurring is that we don't know what diversity we
> have now so will need to perform some kind of survey to measure it. A short
> survey seems an easy answer to the problem so will see if I can put
> together a draft.
>
> Anyway – this is where I've got to at the moment so any feedback,
> comments, ideas welcome.
>
> Thanks
> Sharan
>
>
>

Encouraging Diversity - Update 1

[Sharan Foga]

Hi Everyone

A quick update following on from my thread about encouraging women to 
participate in ASF projects.


I've contacted a few women's groups but not everyone has replied. Full 
details are on the wiki page I've setup.


https://cwiki.apache.org/confluence/display/COMDEV/Diversity+Strategy+Ideas


I'll be doing some follow up this week if I don't hear anything.

A big thank you to Tamao who connected me to her contact at Hackbright. 
As she mentioned in her previous post, Hackbright are looking into open 
source programs and partnerships so the ASF could be a very good fit. We 
have a call planned for 16^th June.


Also on the wiki page – I've started drafting some ideas about a general 
high level diversity strategy with a mission statement and some 
deliverable outcomes. From that I've tried to take it down another level 
to think about what we would need to deliver that outcome.


One thing that keeps recurring is that we don't know what diversity we 
have now so will need to perform some kind of survey to measure it. A 
short survey seems an easy answer to the problem so will see if I can 
put together a draft.


Anyway – this is where I've got to at the moment so any feedback, 
comments, ideas welcome.


Thanks
Sharan

Re: ombudsman@ (was Encouraging More Women to Participate on Apache Projects?)

[Mark Thomas]

On 29/05/2016 23:07, Ross Gardler wrote:
> For the record I do have training in counselling. Its fairly lightweight and 
> basically boils down to knowing how to respond and when to escalate to a 
> specialist.

Ross,

There looks to be general agreement that archiving abuse reports is a
bad idea. On the grounds that handling these is a president@ function,
are you happy for Marvin's patch to be applied where you are listed with
your @a.o email as the only volunteer (and a note that the list is
expected to be expanded shortly)?

Assuming you are OK with this, we can get this done and then discuss
expanding that list of volunteers and some of the other improvements
that have been suggested.

Mark



> 
> Sent from my Windows 10 phone
> 
> From: Ross Gardler
> Sent: Sunday, May 29, 2016 3:06 PM
> To: Joseph Schaefer; 
> dev@community.apache.org
> Cc: Joseph Schaefer
> Subject: RE: ombudsman@ (was Encouraging More Women to Participate on Apache 
> Projects?)
> 
> 
> Yes its positive and I've supported it every step, including stating whatever 
> folks decide is best.  I'm just saying that the kind of reporting you hope 
> for is unlikely to materialize.
> 
> 
> 
> Sent from my Windows 10 phone
> 
> 
> 
> From: Joseph Schaefer
> Sent: Sunday, May 29, 2016 12:03 PM
> To: dev@community.apache.org
> Cc: Joseph Schaefer
> Subject: Re: ombudsman@ (was Encouraging More Women to Participate on Apache 
> Projects?)
> 
> 
> 
> So whittling down the access to this information from 600 odd members to a 
> handful of people isn't a positive step Ross?  We can certainly debate the 
> necessity for an ombudsman alias but that has little to do with the benefits 
> of having a collaborative team of people to deal with this.
> 
> Keep in mind Ross that your own expertise in this matter is limited to your 
> own direct experiences- we as an org have absolutely no insight into how well 
> you have done in this capacity.  Again we should look at the facts like 
> retainment and satisfaction of the reporter- what we're doing isn't enough if 
> the person just winds up walking away from the asf post hoc.
> 
> The org has not paid for your training in this matter, and your business 
> training from dealing with sexual harassment issues at work does not directly 
> translate because there are no employees here at the asf.  Trust me, I've sat 
> through those same dull meetings myself- it's more about what not to do to 
> avoid a federal case being filed against the company.
> 
> I too have some experiences dealing with other students being sexually 
> harassed by their professors, so I'm not particularly ignorant of the 
> surrounding issues as to why complaints are filed to whom and what sorts of 
> remedies are typically desired.  In my capacity as graduate student 
> representative, despite having a very close relationship with the department 
> chair I never came across a reporter willing to authorize me to share their 
> report with the chair.  They always wanted to keep it informal and low key- 
> at best I was asked to confront the professor in question that I was aware of 
> what was going on with an anonymous person.
> 
> What I'm suggesting is that these volunteers discuss directly with the 
> reporters the options available, and that includes every level of escalation, 
> even to other ombudsman.  This doesn't seem particularly difficult to grasp, 
> and allows a less experienced volunteer to usher in advice and support from 
> the rest of the team.
> 
> Sent from my iPhone
> 
>> On May 29, 2016, at 2:41 PM, Ross Gardler  wrote:
>>
>> I don’t think you’ll see that benefit. Privacy and safety from repudiation 
>> is a critical factor. You don't get that with a group sharing experiences 
>> and reports. In some cases I have agreed never to reveal the fact a 
>> complaint was made. That’s why I have only provided estimated counts. I 
>> don’t want to go back and count (in fact I don’t even keep the emails in 
>> some cases).
>>
>>
>>
>> I'm not saying a group is bad, more choice is good. All I'm saying is that 
>> the primary goal of this focused activity is to deal with the specifics and 
>> thus extracting generalities in small numbers and non-specific summaries of 
>> unique situations is not so helpful.
>>
>>
>>
>> A more important goal, in the foundation rather than individual sense, is to 
>> deal with the root cause and make the approach being discussed here 
>> unnecessary.
>>
>>
>>
>> Sent from my Windows 10 phone
>>
>>
>>
>> From: Joseph Schaefer
>> Sent: Sunday, May 29, 2016 10:56 AM
>> To: dev@community.apache.org
>> Subject: Re: ombudsman@ (was Encouraging More