Re: Community building advice
Hi Rich Thanks for sharing. It's a great initiative. I'm sharing your concerns. As discussed yesterday, I think it's important for the mentors to educate/emphasize on committer/PPMC meaning and what should be the "bar". As we know some projects have committership bar pretty high (I don't like this, personally I would rather recommend the committer ship bar should be fairly low, whereas the PMC membership bar should be fairly high), to avoid frustration and keep motivation high, I would suggest to these projects to send thank/encouragement message to the contributors. It's a pity we are potentially losing contributors just because we are not able to say thank and encourage them. Some projects (like Apache Beam) send this kind of encouragement message, and I like this. Regards JB On Tue, Oct 31, 2023 at 3:47 PM wrote: > > Hi, folks, > > As discussed various times on Slack, I am planning to create some > concrete, practical advice to our project communities about how to grow > their developer communities. I've put a bullet list here - > https://community.apache.org/communitybuilding/ - and will be > developing that over the coming year (I hope). > > I have become more than a little concerned about trends that I'm seeing > across the Foundation: Super-high committer bars with no real > justification; Ignoring contributors, who then eventually go away in > frustration; Off-list discussions that are then never discussed in the > view of the community; Committer/PMC elections influenced by company > affiliation/role rather than by public discussion. I am hoping that we > can address some of these by education, and by having "official" pages > that we can point to when projects are learning how to be ASF > projects. > > Yes, some of this happens in the Incubator. My concern is post- > incubator, when the decision-makers on the project arrives post- > incubator, and so don't benefit from that experience. A second- > generation problem, you might say. > > Anyways, as always, I welcome and appreciate your participation in > writing this stuff, and in organizing it. > > Thanks. > > --Rich > > - > To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@community.apache.org > For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@community.apache.org > - To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@community.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@community.apache.org
Re: Community building advice
Hi Rich, Thanks a lot for starting this thread and driving this effort. I'm glad to offer help and join the force if it can have an umbrella issue/ticket that we can go into the concrete subtasks. So far, I share some common feelings as you described above: * Super-high committer bars even trade committer titles with certain effort (25 PR = committer; this can encourage speculation instead of collaboration, and generally, the PMC will later find that the newly elected committers vanished since "the trade is finished"). * Committer/PMC elections influenced by company affiliation/role rather than by public discussion - Yes, of course. It may indicate another problem with the ability to say no and how we build such an environment. Besides, emphasizing the importance of a project's vision may also help since an OSS community exists to solve a specific range of problems. Without a clear definition of the vision, a project is at high risk to continue. Also, this can be a rectification for thinking too tightly of so-called "no code contributions". All the sentences I use above can be associated with one or more concrete real stories. I don't know if we use this story directly (vs. anonymously) in the advice page. Best, tison. 于2023年10月31日周二 22:47写道： > Hi, folks, > > As discussed various times on Slack, I am planning to create some > concrete, practical advice to our project communities about how to grow > their developer communities. I've put a bullet list here - > https://community.apache.org/communitybuilding/ - and will be > developing that over the coming year (I hope). > > I have become more than a little concerned about trends that I'm seeing > across the Foundation: Super-high committer bars with no real > justification; Ignoring contributors, who then eventually go away in > frustration; Off-list discussions that are then never discussed in the > view of the community; Committer/PMC elections influenced by company > affiliation/role rather than by public discussion. I am hoping that we > can address some of these by education, and by having "official" pages > that we can point to when projects are learning how to be ASF > projects. > > Yes, some of this happens in the Incubator. My concern is post- > incubator, when the decision-makers on the project arrives post- > incubator, and so don't benefit from that experience. A second- > generation problem, you might say. > > Anyways, as always, I welcome and appreciate your participation in > writing this stuff, and in organizing it. > > Thanks. > > --Rich > > - > To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@community.apache.org > For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@community.apache.org > >
Community building advice
Hi, folks, As discussed various times on Slack, I am planning to create some concrete, practical advice to our project communities about how to grow their developer communities. I've put a bullet list here - https://community.apache.org/communitybuilding/ - and will be developing that over the coming year (I hope). I have become more than a little concerned about trends that I'm seeing across the Foundation: Super-high committer bars with no real justification; Ignoring contributors, who then eventually go away in frustration; Off-list discussions that are then never discussed in the view of the community; Committer/PMC elections influenced by company affiliation/role rather than by public discussion. I am hoping that we can address some of these by education, and by having "official" pages that we can point to when projects are learning how to be ASF projects. Yes, some of this happens in the Incubator. My concern is post- incubator, when the decision-makers on the project arrives post- incubator, and so don't benefit from that experience. A second- generation problem, you might say. Anyways, as always, I welcome and appreciate your participation in writing this stuff, and in organizing it. Thanks. --Rich - To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@community.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@community.apache.org
Re: [PR] Community building advice (comdev-site)
rbowen merged PR #139: URL: https://github.com/apache/comdev-site/pull/139 -- This is an automated message from the Apache Git Service. To respond to the message, please log on to GitHub and use the URL above to go to the specific comment. To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@community.apache.org For queries about this service, please contact Infrastructure at: us...@infra.apache.org - To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@community.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@community.apache.org
[PR] Community building advice (comdev-site)
rbowen opened a new pull request, #139: URL: https://github.com/apache/comdev-site/pull/139 As discussed on the dev list, I plan to write a series of practical docs about how to grow and retain community in an Apache project. -- This is an automated message from the Apache Git Service. To respond to the message, please log on to GitHub and use the URL above to go to the specific comment. To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@community.apache.org For queries about this service, please contact Infrastructure at: us...@infra.apache.org - To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@community.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@community.apache.org
