Re: [OSM-dev] Spam in Users' Diaries and Users' Pages
Mostly likely we will wind up adding a moderation queue and moderating new users first few diary entries. I don't have any developer experience with it but Akismet[1] seems to work quite well on Wordpress and we seem to get the same kind of spam I regularly see in my Wordpress spam queue. They seem to be focused solely on blogs and especially Wordpress blogs but they have an API[2]. They also have Non-profit plans[3] but they require links to wordpress.com and akismet.com on every page. Would that be an option? I don't know any but I'm sure there are alternatives to Akismet out there. Cheers, Lars [1] http://akismet.com/ [2] http://akismet.com/development/api/ [3] http://akismet.com/buy/non-profit/ ___ dev mailing list dev@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/dev
Re: [OSM-dev] Spam in Users' Diaries and Users' Pages
What about a default filter for the main page that only shows people who have x number of edits. Or allow people who are established user to approve or vote on new entries from new people. I think there should be a way to report spam effectively, that would be the best solution. mike On Mon, Mar 15, 2010 at 2:21 PM, Eugene Alvin Villar sea...@gmail.comwrote: Hi guys, The spam on users' diaries and users' pages is getting quite annoying. Some user just now flooded the main diary page with drug ads. Using rel=nofollow is apparently not much of a deterrent. I think one really effective way of dealing with this is to reject addition of a user description or a diary entry if the user is quite new and has no OSM edits yet. This would correspond to the Wikipedia user without the autoconfirmed bit set yet. What do you guys think? (Then again, it may be that the sysads can currently handle the volume now so this change in the site software is not needed.) Eugene (osm:seav) ___ dev mailing list dev@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/dev ___ dev mailing list dev@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/dev
Re: [OSM-dev] Spam in Users' Diaries and Users' Pages
On 16/03/10 11:33, Lars Francke wrote: I don't have any developer experience with it but Akismet[1] seems to work quite well on Wordpress and we seem to get the same kind of spam I regularly see in my Wordpress spam queue. They seem to be focused solely on blogs and especially Wordpress blogs but they have an API[2]. They also have Non-profit plans[3] but they require links to wordpress.com and akismet.com on every page. Would that be an option? I don't know any but I'm sure there are alternatives to Akismet out there. I already looked at Akismet but as you say, we would have to pay unless we counted as a non-profit and then we would have to put links everywhere. Tom -- Tom Hughes (t...@compton.nu) http://compton.nu/ ___ dev mailing list dev@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/dev
Re: [OSM-dev] Spam in Users' Diaries and Users' Pages
On 16 March 2010 11:43, Tom Hughes t...@compton.nu wrote: I already looked at Akismet but as you say, we would have to pay unless we counted as a non-profit and then we would have to put links everywhere. Could Mollom[1] be an option? I'm not sure we really fit into the 'small community site' any more, but that free option does allow up to 100 posts a day, which would probably be ok for the diary entries at least, and perhaps a good portion of user page edits. [1] http://mollom.com/pricing Cheers, Dan -- Dan Karran d...@karran.net www.dankarran.com ___ dev mailing list dev@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/dev
Re: [OSM-dev] Spam in Users' Diaries and Users' Pages
On 16 March 2010 11:58, Matt Williams li...@milliams.com wrote: Mollom is an alternative to Akismet but it suffers the same problems. Otherwise SpamAssassin should mostly do the trick. There is also http://defensio.com/ which is free during beta. Although depending on the interpretation we might fit under the free personal use critieria. / Grant ___ dev mailing list dev@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/dev
Re: [OSM-dev] Spam in Users' Diaries and Users' Pages
Hi, On some sites I mange, there are lists of suspicious words/markup. If there are too many of these in the post (call it a spam score), then they are sent to a 'please confirm you are human', where an anti-bot code must be entered before the post is allowed. Andy ___ dev mailing list dev@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/dev
Re: [OSM-dev] Spam in Users' Diaries and Users' Pages
Why don't you set up your own (non-standard) challenge, some kind of: Here are 6 pictures, select those two that show a stop-sign. You could permutate the pictures, kind of signs and filenames randomly. Other than some kind of mathematical challenge (like in the wiki) this would be somehow related to our subject. You probably could also ask which picture would you tag as a track?, but maybe that's not always clear without ambiguity... ;) /al ___ dev mailing list dev@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/dev
Re: [OSM-dev] Spam in Users' Diaries and Users' Pages
On Tue, Mar 16, 2010 at 9:04 AM, Andreas Labres l...@lab.at wrote: Why don't you set up your own (non-standard) challenge, some kind of: Here are 6 pictures, select those two that show a stop-sign. I get the impression that the people posting spam are actually humans going through the process relatively manually. I would rather see an interim solution of having flag as spam links on every diary page (and in the RSS) and then a bunch of moderators to take care of heavily-flagged items. I volunteer to be one of these moderators. This involves some work on the website, but it's free (money wise at least) and the best solution I see for the post/spam volume we have. ___ dev mailing list dev@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/dev
Re: [OSM-dev] Spam in Users' Diaries and Users' Pages
Andy Deakin schrieb: Hi, On some sites I mange, there are lists of suspicious words/markup. If there are too many of these in the post (call it a spam score), then they are sent to a 'please confirm you are human', where an anti-bot code must be entered before the post is allowed. I like the ideas about the pictures to be identified by Andreas and your spam-score idea, but also the moderation. I also volunteer for mod duty since someone would have to do it. -- Dirk-Lüder Deelkar Kreie Bremen - 53.0901°N 8.7868°E signature.asc Description: OpenPGP digital signature ___ dev mailing list dev@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/dev
Re: [OSM-dev] Spam in Users' Diaries and Users' Pages
Hi, Ian Dees wrote: I would rather see an interim solution of having flag as spam links on every diary page (and in the RSS) and then a bunch of moderators to take care of heavily-flagged items. I volunteer to be one of these moderators. Can't we do something that is more related to our core business. Maybe track them down using GeoIP and then mark their home location on the map (Spammer lives HERE ) ;-) Bye Frederik ___ dev mailing list dev@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/dev
Re: [OSM-dev] Spam in Users' Diaries and Users' Pages
On 16 March 2010 14:18, Frederik Ramm frede...@remote.org wrote: Hi, Ian Dees wrote: I would rather see an interim solution of having flag as spam links on every diary page (and in the RSS) and then a bunch of moderators to take care of heavily-flagged items. I volunteer to be one of these moderators. Can't we do something that is more related to our core business. Maybe track them down using GeoIP and then mark their home location on the map (Spammer lives HERE ) ;-) I like this idea. It would even be better with a fully working reversegeocoding implementation so we can send them mails. A few years ago, they did something similar with the free AOL cd that have been distributed :) Emilie Laffray ___ dev mailing list dev@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/dev
Re: [OSM-dev] Spam in Users' Diaries and Users' Pages
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 Tom Hughes wrote: On 15/03/10 13:21, Eugene Alvin Villar wrote: I think one really effective way of dealing with this is to reject addition of a user description or a diary entry if the user is quite new and has no OSM edits yet. This would correspond to the Wikipedia user without the autoconfirmed bit set yet. The first thing a new user is (hopefully) going to do is add a description - we actually deposit them on the settings page when they confirm their account precisely to encourage that. But we need not make that description or their diary entries visible to other users until they have gained some reputation on the site - presumably by making map edits. Once they become a trusted member, their description and all of their diary appears as normal. There are 2 approaches to this: * Document clearly that their info is hidden until they reach a certain level of well-known-ness, because of spam problems. * Make it look to them like their spamming is working, at least until they log out. If you want to be sneaky about it, you could make them show up to their own IP address. The idea being that if they think it is working, they will not try to work around the safeguards, e.g. by making trivial edits or even random bad edits to get enough reputation. Robert (Jamie) Munro -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- Version: GnuPG v1.4.8 (Darwin) Comment: Using GnuPG with Mozilla - http://enigmail.mozdev.org/ iEYEARECAAYFAkugGDAACgkQz+aYVHdncI3NgwCgkjCc3xJ1DxQyCeBnfvwwW/3Z T3kAoKH2dqywl/HKLQGRzB+I/J7G8k0T =6Wui -END PGP SIGNATURE- ___ dev mailing list dev@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/dev
Re: [OSM-dev] Spam in Users' Diaries and Users' Pages
On 17 March 2010 09:45, Robert (Jamie) Munro rjmu...@arjam.net wrote: But we need not make that description or their diary entries visible to other users until they have gained some reputation on the site - presumably by making map edits. This is a dangerous path, it's too easy for these spammers to then add garbage to the map data as well, not just the diary/user information, I think forcibly moderating the first few comments and/or requiring approval before their information is displayed is a much better idea. ___ dev mailing list dev@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/dev
Re: [OSM-dev] Spam in Users' Diaries and Users' Pages
On 16 March 2010 17:33, John Smith deltafoxtrot...@gmail.com wrote: On 17 March 2010 09:45, Robert (Jamie) Munro rjmu...@arjam.net wrote: But we need not make that description or their diary entries visible to other users until they have gained some reputation on the site - presumably by making map edits. This is a dangerous path, it's too easy for these spammers to then add garbage to the map data as well, not just the diary/user information, I think forcibly moderating the first few comments and/or requiring approval before their information is displayed is a much better idea. It's also important to repeat the argument that people post diary entries without ever editing the map. OpenStreetMap is no longer just for mappers. I see the best solution to be a moderation queue for the first 1-3 posts. If x number of previously passed members mark your 3 posts as okay, they become visible and you pass the test. The moderation queue could also serve as a place to see new users and help them out (as I like to do from time to time). I think it would be best to avoid having a select moderation group, but rather crowd source the moderation to any user that has passed the test. I also like the OSM-related photo question, but only for the potential humor factor (with only one correct answer shown and the wrong answers being very obvious to a human). Which of these photos is a mapper in trouble? - correct one is a photo of Andy and his bike in a tangle, a car crashed into a lamp post, or an empty battery symbol on a GPS screen. Where is a fun place to be? - correct answer is some people holding an OSM banner, a pub table full of geeks on computers, wrong answer is a canyon (bad GPS signal). What would you tag as smooth=good? - A babies bottom or a rock. -- Gregory o...@livingwithdragons.com http://www.livingwithdragons.com ___ dev mailing list dev@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/dev
[OSM-dev] Spam in Users' Diaries and Users' Pages
Hi guys, The spam on users' diaries and users' pages is getting quite annoying. Some user just now flooded the main diary page with drug ads. Using rel=nofollow is apparently not much of a deterrent. I think one really effective way of dealing with this is to reject addition of a user description or a diary entry if the user is quite new and has no OSM edits yet. This would correspond to the Wikipedia user without the autoconfirmed bit set yet. What do you guys think? (Then again, it may be that the sysads can currently handle the volume now so this change in the site software is not needed.) Eugene (osm:seav) ___ dev mailing list dev@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/dev
Re: [OSM-dev] Spam in Users' Diaries and Users' Pages
Correction: ... reject addition of a user description or a diary entry *with a link or a URL*... This is to reduce false positives. On Mon, Mar 15, 2010 at 9:21 PM, Eugene Alvin Villar sea...@gmail.comwrote: Hi guys, The spam on users' diaries and users' pages is getting quite annoying. Some user just now flooded the main diary page with drug ads. Using rel=nofollow is apparently not much of a deterrent. I think one really effective way of dealing with this is to reject addition of a user description or a diary entry if the user is quite new and has no OSM edits yet. This would correspond to the Wikipedia user without the autoconfirmed bit set yet. What do you guys think? (Then again, it may be that the sysads can currently handle the volume now so this change in the site software is not needed.) Eugene (osm:seav) -- http://vaes9.codedgraphic.com ___ dev mailing list dev@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/dev
Re: [OSM-dev] Spam in Users' Diaries and Users' Pages
On 15/03/10 13:21, Eugene Alvin Villar wrote: I think one really effective way of dealing with this is to reject addition of a user description or a diary entry if the user is quite new and has no OSM edits yet. This would correspond to the Wikipedia user without the autoconfirmed bit set yet. The first thing a new user is (hopefully) going to do is add a description - we actually deposit them on the settings page when they confirm their account precisely to encourage that. (Then again, it may be that the sysads can currently handle the volume now so this change in the site software is not needed.) I think it probably is reaching the point where we need to do something, but I'm still considering exactly what - they're aren't really any brilliant solutions unfortunately. Mostly likely we will wind up adding a moderation queue and moderating new users first few diary entries. Tom -- Tom Hughes (t...@compton.nu) http://compton.nu/ ___ dev mailing list dev@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/dev
