external optical drives not showing up in the Journal
Hey everyone, I was experimenting with an external optical drive connected via USB today and while it I had no trouble accessing it via the shell (well, at least after a friend helped me out) I was a bit surprised that it didn't show up in the Journal. When I connect my USB thumbdrive it shows up all right, I can copy/paste, view its contents, unmount, etc. Now I was wondering whether there are any plans to also integrate external optical drives like that? I think it might make sense in some situations, especially where contents might already be available in the form of optical media. Thanks in advance, Christoph ___ Devel mailing list Devel@lists.laptop.org http://lists.laptop.org/listinfo/devel
Re: external optical drives not showing up in the Journal
Hi Christoph, On Tue, 2007-10-16 at 14:45 +0200, Christoph Derndorfer wrote: Hey everyone, I was experimenting with an external optical drive connected via USB today and while it I had no trouble accessing it via the shell (well, at least after a friend helped me out) I was a bit surprised that it didn't show up in the Journal. When I connect my USB thumbdrive it shows up all right, I can copy/paste, view its contents, unmount, etc. Now I was wondering whether there are any plans to also integrate external optical drives like that? I think it might make sense in some situations, especially where contents might already be available in the form of optical media. It should have worked, but I have only tested with usb sticks, usb camera and sd cards. Could you please enter a ticket in trac about this defect and attach the output of lshal while the optical drive is plugged in? Thanks a lot! Tomeu ___ Devel mailing list Devel@lists.laptop.org http://lists.laptop.org/listinfo/devel
Re: slightly long and detailed proposal for documentation-translation workflow
Good points. The OLPC is designed around collaboration. The model really works well where every child in a class has his/her own laptop, uses it in and out of school, and lives in close enough proximity to other class members to make the Mesh work. In class one kid discovers how to do something and teaches the other kids (and teachers as well). In an address at Harvard Law, Negroponte said something like: People ask me who is going to teach the teachers to teach the children how to use the XOs --- and I wonder what planet are they on? ... A child who gets one through G1G1 in isolation will not be able to fully benefit from collaboration and thus, along with parent/tutor, would definately benefit from user documentation in lieu of help from others in class. Likewise, the Carlos Slims approach of putting them in Mexican libraries. If G1G1 goes big-time in November, you can sure bet that there will be OLPC for Dummies books, etc. by Christmas. On 10/15/07, Todd Kelsey [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I am amazed and inspired by all the wonderful projects and activities that have arisen from the laptop project -- and though I was skeptical at first, I have also come to appreciate the constructivist approach to education; I didn't get it until I came to appreciate the notion of allowing children to come to aha moments on their own. The fact that children do fine without manuals at the present level of interaction is a testament to the design of the computer and the philosophy behind it. As generation xo grows older, I think they will want to get deeper into the systems, and as they do, I think they will want more information, and I'd like to help make that freely available. I think a user manual or documentation will be more helpful for adult learners who will end up participating in the laptop community, and who would find it helpful to have something to refer to. Perhaps users could learn many things simply by exploring, and yet they might appreciate having something to turn to. Other people may not have personal possession of a laptop, but would be interested in learning how they could support the project. Some people who order the laptops through www.xogiving.org will get frustrated with the laptop if they have no resources to turn to, and I'd like to help them have fun. I think the idea of encouraging children to help each other learn is wonderful; I also appreciate the principle of inclusiveness, and I think that one way to be inclusive is to address various learning styles. On 10/15/07, Steve Fullerton [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hi Ed and all, I fully appreciate the detail. However, IMHO I think that there is some re-thinking required re: the traditional user documentation. The core of the OLPC (literally one laptop per child; the model does not work as well if there is not possession of a laptop for each child) is that of collaboration. One child learning something and then teaching his/her classmates. OLPC machines are not meant to be used in isolation. You could actually make a credible argument that user manuals are bad for the project. The highly intuitive design of Sugar and the experience of the pilots bears this out. The children seem to do just great without manuals, discovery is enhanced, and many of the constructionist ideals are realized. What do you think? On 10/15/07, Ed Trager [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hi, Michael, Just a few comments for consideration by everyone: ... Doc writing conventions: Some linguistic research has been done on simplified English as a subset of English to use for low-level learners, and I think that it might be a good place to look for ways to simplify the source_docs. But just thinking intuitively, I have cooked up the following suggestions in order to generate discussion: * Pronouns. o Use the first-person singular pronoun I to represent the author of the docs, o the second-person singular pronoun you to represent the reader of the docs, and o the first-person plural pronoun we to represent the OLPC project. o Examples. We have designed a screen that switches to black-and-white to conserve energy. I will explain how to switch your screen to black-and-white. First, you press the X button on your keyboard Because we want the docs to be easily translated and easily understood, the tone should be personal, using I for the voice of the writer. This will be easier for amateur translators to translate and easier for younger readers to understand. This will also help the writer avoid the passive construction, which is very difficult for some non-native English speakers to understand. I agree completely that the English passive construction should be avoided at all times. I mostly agree with your suggestion
Re: slightly long and detailed proposal for documentation-translation workflow
At the current rate of XO software churn, any printed book will be obsolete/inaccurate before the ink is dry. Todd Kelsey wrote: I have been struggling with my literary agent and trying to knock someone over the head with a wet noodle into realizing that there *will* be a market for a book, and trying to suggest going with an e-book, with editorial support from a publisher, put it on amazon, develop the whole thing in a robust authoring cms so updates and multilingual versions can be easily made. one publisher responded with fear, blah blah blah, and I made an attempt to provide rationales (including insights from Wikinomics, which has helped me to be able to articulate some of the value propositions), but I'm 2 degrees away from throwing in the towel, and inviting whoever wants to join me in making a multimodal community book. then maybe when the publishers wake up they could license it and use their distribution channels to put it in stores. I don't know if the publishers realize how cool the little green xo is as a way for people to get acquainted with Linux. Ok I'm throwing in the towel. We could call it the Hitchhiker's Guide to the Laptop. I don't care what the title is. The community could name it, write it. If anyone is interested in helping learners who desire a book to get acquainted with the very wonderful work you are doing, please feel free to get in touch. Maybe the proceeds from the book could go towards a series of laptop libraries where the laptops could be checked out by kids. I guess in the same time it took to write this email I could have written a wiki page. On 10/16/07, *Steve Fullerton* [EMAIL PROTECTED] mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Good points. The OLPC is designed around collaboration. The model really works well where every child in a class has his/her own laptop, uses it in and out of school, and lives in close enough proximity to other class members to make the Mesh work. In class one kid discovers how to do something and teaches the other kids (and teachers as well). In an address at Harvard Law, Negroponte said something like: People ask me who is going to teach the teachers to teach the children how to use the XOs --- and I wonder what planet are they on? ... A child who gets one through G1G1 in isolation will not be able to fully benefit from collaboration and thus, along with parent/tutor, would definately benefit from user documentation in lieu of help from others in class. Likewise, the Carlos Slims approach of putting them in Mexican libraries. If G1G1 goes big-time in November, you can sure bet that there will be OLPC for Dummies books, etc. by Christmas. On 10/15/07, *Todd Kelsey * [EMAIL PROTECTED] mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I am amazed and inspired by all the wonderful projects and activities that have arisen from the laptop project -- and though I was skeptical at first, I have also come to appreciate the constructivist approach to education; I didn't get it until I came to appreciate the notion of allowing children to come to aha moments on their own. The fact that children do fine without manuals at the present level of interaction is a testament to the design of the computer and the philosophy behind it. As generation xo grows older, I think they will want to get deeper into the systems, and as they do, I think they will want more information, and I'd like to help make that freely available. I think a user manual or documentation will be more helpful for adult learners who will end up participating in the laptop community, and who would find it helpful to have something to refer to. Perhaps users could learn many things simply by exploring, and yet they might appreciate having something to turn to. Other people may not have personal possession of a laptop, but would be interested in learning how they could support the project. Some people who order the laptops through www.xogiving.org http://www.xogiving.org will get frustrated with the laptop if they have no resources to turn to, and I'd like to help them have fun. I think the idea of encouraging children to help each other learn is wonderful; I also appreciate the principle of inclusiveness, and I think that one way to be inclusive is to address various learning styles. On 10/15/07, *Steve Fullerton* [EMAIL PROTECTED] mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hi Ed and all, I fully appreciate the detail. However, IMHO I think that there is some re-thinking required re: the traditional user documentation. The core of the OLPC (literally
Re: slightly long and detailed proposal for documentation-translation workflow
heh, I totally agree, but this doesn't mean that there isn't a market for a book like that (unfortunately!). Apart from the fact that some people feel disabled without a book, there still is *not* a user-friendly introduction on how to use the laptop (let alone how it works) and I doubt that there will be one anytime soon because OLPC's primary mission is not to sell the XO in the US market. However, I'm afraid that OLPC will have to deal with user support! I hate to say this but there were already a couple of people visiting the lab, asking about where to buy the laptops and whether they're good for their needs. Pol Mitch Bradley wrote: At the current rate of XO software churn, any printed book will be obsolete/inaccurate before the ink is dry. Todd Kelsey wrote: I have been struggling with my literary agent and trying to knock someone over the head with a wet noodle into realizing that there *will* be a market for a book, and trying to suggest going with an e-book, with editorial support from a publisher, put it on amazon, develop the whole thing in a robust authoring cms so updates and multilingual versions can be easily made. one publisher responded with fear, blah blah blah, and I made an attempt to provide rationales (including insights from Wikinomics, which has helped me to be able to articulate some of the value propositions), but I'm 2 degrees away from throwing in the towel, and inviting whoever wants to join me in making a multimodal community book. then maybe when the publishers wake up they could license it and use their distribution channels to put it in stores. I don't know if the publishers realize how cool the little green xo is as a way for people to get acquainted with Linux. Ok I'm throwing in the towel. We could call it the Hitchhiker's Guide to the Laptop. I don't care what the title is. The community could name it, write it. If anyone is interested in helping learners who desire a book to get acquainted with the very wonderful work you are doing, please feel free to get in touch. Maybe the proceeds from the book could go towards a series of laptop libraries where the laptops could be checked out by kids. I guess in the same time it took to write this email I could have written a wiki page. On 10/16/07, *Steve Fullerton* [EMAIL PROTECTED] mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Good points. The OLPC is designed around collaboration. The model really works well where every child in a class has his/her own laptop, uses it in and out of school, and lives in close enough proximity to other class members to make the Mesh work. In class one kid discovers how to do something and teaches the other kids (and teachers as well). In an address at Harvard Law, Negroponte said something like: People ask me who is going to teach the teachers to teach the children how to use the XOs --- and I wonder what planet are they on? ... A child who gets one through G1G1 in isolation will not be able to fully benefit from collaboration and thus, along with parent/tutor, would definately benefit from user documentation in lieu of help from others in class. Likewise, the Carlos Slims approach of putting them in Mexican libraries. If G1G1 goes big-time in November, you can sure bet that there will be OLPC for Dummies books, etc. by Christmas. On 10/15/07, *Todd Kelsey * [EMAIL PROTECTED] mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I am amazed and inspired by all the wonderful projects and activities that have arisen from the laptop project -- and though I was skeptical at first, I have also come to appreciate the constructivist approach to education; I didn't get it until I came to appreciate the notion of allowing children to come to aha moments on their own. The fact that children do fine without manuals at the present level of interaction is a testament to the design of the computer and the philosophy behind it. As generation xo grows older, I think they will want to get deeper into the systems, and as they do, I think they will want more information, and I'd like to help make that freely available. I think a user manual or documentation will be more helpful for adult learners who will end up participating in the laptop community, and who would find it helpful to have something to refer to. Perhaps users could learn many things simply by exploring, and yet they might appreciate having something to turn to. Other people may not have personal possession of a laptop, but would be interested in learning how they could support the project. Some people who order the laptops through www.xogiving.org http://www.xogiving.org will get frustrated with the laptop if
Re: slightly long and detailed proposal for documentation-translation workflow
fyi val scarlata and i went back through material to try and make something more user friendly. she scanned through wiki and assembled various links as good cop, then I played bad cop to try and control scope, she had a documentation party with a couple of students to assemble material -- and now three tech writers who have volunteered are working very much on trying to make it user friendly (and extensible to incorporate software flux, and adaptable into various languages). There is a proto google doc that anyone who is interested is welcome to view, join in, or if you email me i'll send a pdf. haven't had time to situate in wiki yet. I saw marklogic do very nice work with x-query allowing people to self-assemble their own books on the fly. i think this is how safari u. does things. kind of like alacarte ebooks. it would be cool if flowr foundation (open source x-query) could help put something like that together. but that would be porsche -- it would be nice just to have a scalable system period -- and that's what we're working on. On 10/16/07, Polychronis Ypodimatopoulos [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: heh, I totally agree, but this doesn't mean that there isn't a market for a book like that (unfortunately!). Apart from the fact that some people feel disabled without a book, there still is *not* a user-friendly introduction on how to use the laptop (let alone how it works) and I doubt that there will be one anytime soon because OLPC's primary mission is not to sell the XO in the US market. However, I'm afraid that OLPC will have to deal with user support! I hate to say this but there were already a couple of people visiting the lab, asking about where to buy the laptops and whether they're good for their needs. Pol Mitch Bradley wrote: At the current rate of XO software churn, any printed book will be obsolete/inaccurate before the ink is dry. Todd Kelsey wrote: I have been struggling with my literary agent and trying to knock someone over the head with a wet noodle into realizing that there *will* be a market for a book, and trying to suggest going with an e-book, with editorial support from a publisher, put it on amazon, develop the whole thing in a robust authoring cms so updates and multilingual versions can be easily made. one publisher responded with fear, blah blah blah, and I made an attempt to provide rationales (including insights from Wikinomics, which has helped me to be able to articulate some of the value propositions), but I'm 2 degrees away from throwing in the towel, and inviting whoever wants to join me in making a multimodal community book. then maybe when the publishers wake up they could license it and use their distribution channels to put it in stores. I don't know if the publishers realize how cool the little green xo is as a way for people to get acquainted with Linux. Ok I'm throwing in the towel. We could call it the Hitchhiker's Guide to the Laptop. I don't care what the title is. The community could name it, write it. If anyone is interested in helping learners who desire a book to get acquainted with the very wonderful work you are doing, please feel free to get in touch. Maybe the proceeds from the book could go towards a series of laptop libraries where the laptops could be checked out by kids. I guess in the same time it took to write this email I could have written a wiki page. On 10/16/07, *Steve Fullerton* [EMAIL PROTECTED] mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Good points. The OLPC is designed around collaboration. The model really works well where every child in a class has his/her own laptop, uses it in and out of school, and lives in close enough proximity to other class members to make the Mesh work. In class one kid discovers how to do something and teaches the other kids (and teachers as well). In an address at Harvard Law, Negroponte said something like: People ask me who is going to teach the teachers to teach the children how to use the XOs --- and I wonder what planet are they on? ... A child who gets one through G1G1 in isolation will not be able to fully benefit from collaboration and thus, along with parent/tutor, would definately benefit from user documentation in lieu of help from others in class. Likewise, the Carlos Slims approach of putting them in Mexican libraries. If G1G1 goes big-time in November, you can sure bet that there will be OLPC for Dummies books, etc. by Christmas. On 10/15/07, *Todd Kelsey * [EMAIL PROTECTED] mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I am amazed and inspired by all the wonderful projects and activities that have arisen from the laptop project -- and though I was skeptical at first, I have also come to appreciate the constructivist approach to education; I didn't get it
Re: keyboard layout image license
On 10/15/07, Simon McVittie [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Debian's criticisms of the Creative Commons Attribution license (and derivatives) as a Free Software license can be found here: http://people.debian.org/~evan/ccsummary.html That's for version 2.0. Version's 3 and 2.5 have dealt a lot with these kind of criticism and attempted to fix the problems. I'd say most of the problems should be fixed by now. It's also a bad idea to recommend a Creative Commons license without explicitly specifying which one Yes. Creative Commons recommends stating something similar to This work is under the Creative Commons Attribution 3.0 License, and then add the link to the license if it's a digital thing, or display the send a letter to CC to get a copy of license if it's non-digital. Attribution is akin to new BSD or MIT. Attribution-ShareAlike is more like the GPL. NC or ND should not be used here. -Ivo ___ Devel mailing list Devel@lists.laptop.org http://lists.laptop.org/listinfo/devel
Re: Devel Digest, Vol 20, Issue 22
From: Ed Trager [EMAIL PROTECTED] So while I have no objection to simple English which will be easily understood by younger learners of the language, we must also be sure that we do not proscribe an incorrect idea regarding the usage of the pronoun you in imperative sentences in English. I understand completely and agree. My examples were forced and hastily-chosen. I wanted the use of the second person to be clear in my explanation, and I made the mistake of making it too clear. That is what happens when one concentrates on form over effect. I was not thinking that the docs would repeat you all the time. But in many other languages (perhaps most other languages?) we would not use possessive pronouns here at all. All of these English yours, if translated quite directly into foreign languages, results in very annoying and unnatural sounding texts in my experience. So I would advise we try to fix the English from the start by avoiding unecessary invocations of possessive pronouns, especially your: I will explain how to switch the screen to black-and-white. First, press the X button on the keyboard Writing to accommodate a particular target language would not be wise because there are many target languages and many differences. These kind of adjustments would have to be made by the translator. That being said, I agree with you that omitting the possessive would introduce the less misleading information, so it would be best to leave it out. The examples above are just as easy to understand and less wordy. ___ Devel mailing list Devel@lists.laptop.org http://lists.laptop.org/listinfo/devel
Re: Devel Digest, Vol 20, Issue 22
From: Steve Fullerton [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: slightly long and detailed proposal for documentation-translation workflow I fully appreciate the detail. However, IMHO I think that there is some re-thinking required re: the traditional user documentation. The core of ... The highly intuitive design of Sugar and the experience of the pilots bears this out. The children seem to do just great without manuals, discovery is enhanced, and many of the constructionist ideals are realized. What do you think? I seem to have been working under a misconception. I thought that the manuals were mainly intended for teachers and local educators who might be trained to do some low-level support. The language should be comprehensible by younger children because the manual will be the teacher's main reference, and we can assume that the manual language will find its way into the teacher-speak. Docs are definitely necessary for educators, since they will not have time to discover, and since they are responsible for getting the children going with XO. Don't you agree? ___ Devel mailing list Devel@lists.laptop.org http://lists.laptop.org/listinfo/devel
Re: New lurker! :-)
Running activities in the jhbuild (sugar-emulator) environment on Ubuntu is going to be tough. We've not done much to support running Sugar on distros other than Fedora 7. That could be an interesting project, but certainly it would require you to upgrade at least to something like Feisty to get most of the support packages needed by Sugar. The doku in wiki.l.o about running Sugar native in ubuntu gutsy worked very well for me. So, Ed you might want to try that. ___ Devel mailing list Devel@lists.laptop.org http://lists.laptop.org/listinfo/devel
Joyride package log
I made a little script to list package changes between joyride builds: http://dev.laptop.org/~bert/joyride-pkgs Enjoy! - Bert - ___ Devel mailing list Devel@lists.laptop.org http://lists.laptop.org/listinfo/devel
Announcing firmware Q2D01
http://wiki.laptop.org/go/OLPC_Firmware_q2d01 This is the release for the mass production build. ___ Devel mailing list Devel@lists.laptop.org http://lists.laptop.org/listinfo/devel
Re: [sugar] Joyride package log
Go Bert! Can you please publish this script so we can see if we can include it directly in the build process? Thanks, Michael On Wed, Oct 17, 2007 at 02:01:23AM +0200, Bert Freudenberg wrote: I made a little script to list package changes between joyride builds: http://dev.laptop.org/~bert/joyride-pkgs Enjoy! - Bert - ___ Sugar mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.laptop.org/listinfo/sugar ___ Devel mailing list Devel@lists.laptop.org http://lists.laptop.org/listinfo/devel
Test Process Sprint Details
Dear @sugar and @devel, Our first Test Process Sprint is currently scheduled to start at 2:00 PM, EDT. The sprint will be conducted on IRC in #olpc-meeting and perhaps by conference call. Everything will be documented on http://wiki.laptop.org/go/Test_process_sprint and on pages linked to from that page. (People with other good ideas on how to collaborate tomorrow should write them up on that page.) Bugs will be filed in Trac for ideas we decide to pursue. Questions? Yours, Michael P.S. - People who are local to Cambridge, MA, are welcome to join us in our office on the 10th floor of 1 Cambridge Center, conveniently located next to the Kendall Square T stop on the Red Line. (See http://ln-s.net/CIX for a map). When you arrive, the building's desk-person will call us to verify that you are expected and we'll send someone down to greet you. Finally, we'll provide (or collectively seek out) dinner sometime between 6:00 PM and 8:00 PM so that the discussion can continue uninterrupted for those who are able to stay. ___ Devel mailing list Devel@lists.laptop.org http://lists.laptop.org/listinfo/devel
Re: slightly long and detailed proposal for documentation-translation workflow
On 10/15/07, Ed Trager [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: translate and easier for younger readers to understand. This will also help the writer avoid the passive construction, which is very difficult for some non-native English speakers to understand. I agree completely that the English passive construction should be avoided at all times. You mean: I agree completely that *one* should avoid the English passive construction at all times. Don't you? --scott -- ( http://cscott.net/ ) ___ Devel mailing list Devel@lists.laptop.org http://lists.laptop.org/listinfo/devel
[Fwd: [msgs] Teach anything you want!]
Not sure if this is relevant, but maybe someone would like to showcase the XO there? I may have an hour or two to spare on that weekend, but no more than that. Please forward freely and let me know. Pol Original Message Subject:[msgs] Teach anything you want! Date: Tue, 16 Oct 2007 19:10:52 -0400 (EDT) From: Catherine Havasi [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] I know a lot of people in the lab teach for Splash - which is a one weekend program where you can teach a class on anything you want to high school and middle school students in the Boston area. It's a very low time commitment opportunity and is a lot of fun. Email me with questions. - Catherine --- Are you interested in things? Then inflict your interests on high school students by teaching Splash 2007! Splash is a weekend-long program on November 17-18 where you can teach ANYTHING you want to high school students. Quantum mechanics, speaker building, origami, duct tape design, tissue engineering...everything is fair game. Your class can be as large or as small as you want and can last anywhere from 1-5 hours. Just register your class, and you're free to delve into your favorite topics with bright high school students from all over the area. If you're not sure what to teach, come to the ESP office (W20-467) at 6pm on wednesday; we'll have a group brainstorming session. For more information, go to esp.mit.edu, then register your Splash class BY OCTOBER 20th at http://esp.mit.edu/teach/Splash/2007/teacherreg/. See you there! Stephanie Bachar ___ msgs mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] ___ Devel mailing list Devel@lists.laptop.org http://lists.laptop.org/listinfo/devel
