Re: [Sugar-devel] seeking help to enable nepali keyboard input for XO-4
Hi all, We are planning on ordering the next lot of XO-4s and I need some suggestions on which keyboard model to choose -membrane or hard/clicky one. We had membrane one for our first lot and keyboard switching was very convenient on that model. One reason not to choose hard/clicky one is that it doesn't have key for language switching ( correct me if I am wrong) -I have one spanish hard/clicky and it doesn't have that key - key 56 at http://wiki.laptop.org/go/OLPC_Keyboard_layouts. Hard/Clicky on the other hard is more convenient while typing. Please suggest. -Basanta On Wed, Nov 13, 2013 at 10:01 PM, Daniel Drake d...@laptop.org wrote: On Tue, Nov 12, 2013 at 10:14 PM, Basanta Shrestha basanta.shres...@olenepal.org wrote: Amazingly changing the manufacturing data didn't do the job but changing /etc/sysconfig/keyboard did. Wow! Now I have Nepali input system. Thank you all. Now I need to find a place to change default locale to ne_NP, so that the default interface is in Nepali. There is an option to do this in manufacturing data but it would be better if it can be done using file. If all you want to do is change default keyboard and language, you can avoid doing any manufacturing data changes, and just do the [base] olpc-os-builder configuration I mentioned in my last email. Daniel ___ Devel mailing list Devel@lists.laptop.org http://lists.laptop.org/listinfo/devel
Re: [Sugar-devel] seeking help to enable nepali keyboard input for XO-4
On Mon, Jun 16, 2014 at 01:54:19PM +0545, Basanta Shrestha wrote: Hi all, We are planning on ordering the next lot of XO-4s and I need some suggestions on which keyboard model to choose -membrane or hard/clicky one. I think it is great to seek input from the community, but don't forget to ask your OLPC contact for help as well. We had membrane one for our first lot and keyboard switching was very convenient on that model. One reason not to choose hard/clicky one is that it doesn't have key for language switching ( correct me if I am wrong) -I have one spanish hard/clicky and it doesn't have that key - key 56 at http://wiki.laptop.org/go/OLPC_Keyboard_layouts. Yes, that's a good reason not to choose the mechanical keyboard; you would have to customise your operating system build again, to add a key combination for keyboard language switch. If the cost of customising is too high, you should order membrane keyboard. I don't know the relative costs of the keyboards, and their replacement rates, but it might be factored in to your decision. You identified the lack of language switch key in this same thread on sugar-devel@ back in November 2013, from which I'll draw some status: Walter says use a key combination: http://lists.sugarlabs.org/archive/sugar-devel/2013-November/045724.html And says that customisation will be needed: http://lists.sugarlabs.org/archive/sugar-devel/2013-November/045800.html Then you suggest alt+space: http://lists.sugarlabs.org/archive/sugar-devel/2013-November/045807.html Daniel Drake says to use olpc-os-builder: http://lists.sugarlabs.org/archive/sugar-devel/2013-November/045851.html And you asked about the alt+space: http://lists.sugarlabs.org/archive/sugar-devel/2013-November/045857.html But the thread dried up on that subject because the units you received had a membrane keyboard, not a mechanical keyboard. I think you need to change the xkb files, but I'm not sure. Do you have a mechanical keyboard you can test with? If not, you'll have to get someone else to do this. Hard/Clicky on the other hard is more convenient while typing. Please suggest. I don't understand why you think it is more convenient. To me the keyboards are equally convenient for an inexperienced child. Perhaps you intended to mention some characteristic? -- James Cameron http://quozl.linux.org.au/ ___ Devel mailing list Devel@lists.laptop.org http://lists.laptop.org/listinfo/devel
Re: [Sugar-devel] seeking help to enable nepali keyboard input for XO-4
James, Do we have any data re the mechanical reliability/durability/repairability of the hard/clicky keyboards? We do know that although there were some issues with membrane pealing (presumably resolved with the newer design) there numerous ingenious local repairs such that most are still working after 7 years. regards. -walter On Mon, Jun 16, 2014 at 5:35 AM, James Cameron qu...@laptop.org wrote: On Mon, Jun 16, 2014 at 01:54:19PM +0545, Basanta Shrestha wrote: Hi all, We are planning on ordering the next lot of XO-4s and I need some suggestions on which keyboard model to choose -membrane or hard/clicky one. I think it is great to seek input from the community, but don't forget to ask your OLPC contact for help as well. We had membrane one for our first lot and keyboard switching was very convenient on that model. One reason not to choose hard/clicky one is that it doesn't have key for language switching ( correct me if I am wrong) -I have one spanish hard/clicky and it doesn't have that key - key 56 at http://wiki.laptop.org/go/OLPC_Keyboard_layouts. Yes, that's a good reason not to choose the mechanical keyboard; you would have to customise your operating system build again, to add a key combination for keyboard language switch. If the cost of customising is too high, you should order membrane keyboard. I don't know the relative costs of the keyboards, and their replacement rates, but it might be factored in to your decision. You identified the lack of language switch key in this same thread on sugar-devel@ back in November 2013, from which I'll draw some status: Walter says use a key combination: http://lists.sugarlabs.org/archive/sugar-devel/2013-November/045724.html And says that customisation will be needed: http://lists.sugarlabs.org/archive/sugar-devel/2013-November/045800.html Then you suggest alt+space: http://lists.sugarlabs.org/archive/sugar-devel/2013-November/045807.html Daniel Drake says to use olpc-os-builder: http://lists.sugarlabs.org/archive/sugar-devel/2013-November/045851.html And you asked about the alt+space: http://lists.sugarlabs.org/archive/sugar-devel/2013-November/045857.html But the thread dried up on that subject because the units you received had a membrane keyboard, not a mechanical keyboard. I think you need to change the xkb files, but I'm not sure. Do you have a mechanical keyboard you can test with? If not, you'll have to get someone else to do this. Hard/Clicky on the other hard is more convenient while typing. Please suggest. I don't understand why you think it is more convenient. To me the keyboards are equally convenient for an inexperienced child. Perhaps you intended to mention some characteristic? -- James Cameron http://quozl.linux.org.au/ -- Walter Bender Sugar Labs http://www.sugarlabs.org ___ Devel mailing list Devel@lists.laptop.org http://lists.laptop.org/listinfo/devel
Re: [Sugar-devel] seeking help to enable nepali keyboard input for XO-4
Walter, You remember correctly. The hard/clicky/crunchy keyboards are not rated for as long a lifetime as the membrane/chewy keyboards. While the membrane keyboard design was tested to 5 million key presses, IIRC the clicky keyboard is only rated to 1 million key presses. (On the other hand, it takes one minute to replace a clicky keyboard versus twenty for a membrane keyboard.) WARNING: The clicky keyboard was not approved for use by small children by UL. The reason is that if the keys are pulled off they present a choking hazard. Cheers, wad On Jun 16, 2014, at 7:13 AM, Walter Bender wrote: James, Do we have any data re the mechanical reliability/durability/repairability of the hard/clicky keyboards? We do know that although there were some issues with membrane pealing (presumably resolved with the newer design) there numerous ingenious local repairs such that most are still working after 7 years. regards. -walter On Mon, Jun 16, 2014 at 5:35 AM, James Cameron qu...@laptop.org wrote: On Mon, Jun 16, 2014 at 01:54:19PM +0545, Basanta Shrestha wrote: Hi all, We are planning on ordering the next lot of XO-4s and I need some suggestions on which keyboard model to choose -membrane or hard/clicky one. I think it is great to seek input from the community, but don't forget to ask your OLPC contact for help as well. We had membrane one for our first lot and keyboard switching was very convenient on that model. One reason not to choose hard/clicky one is that it doesn't have key for language switching ( correct me if I am wrong) -I have one spanish hard/clicky and it doesn't have that key - key 56 at http://wiki.laptop.org/go/OLPC_Keyboard_layouts. Yes, that's a good reason not to choose the mechanical keyboard; you would have to customise your operating system build again, to add a key combination for keyboard language switch. If the cost of customising is too high, you should order membrane keyboard. I don't know the relative costs of the keyboards, and their replacement rates, but it might be factored in to your decision. You identified the lack of language switch key in this same thread on sugar-devel@ back in November 2013, from which I'll draw some status: Walter says use a key combination: http://lists.sugarlabs.org/archive/sugar-devel/2013-November/045724.html And says that customisation will be needed: http://lists.sugarlabs.org/archive/sugar-devel/2013-November/045800.html Then you suggest alt+space: http://lists.sugarlabs.org/archive/sugar-devel/2013-November/045807.html Daniel Drake says to use olpc-os-builder: http://lists.sugarlabs.org/archive/sugar-devel/2013-November/045851.html And you asked about the alt+space: http://lists.sugarlabs.org/archive/sugar-devel/2013-November/045857.html But the thread dried up on that subject because the units you received had a membrane keyboard, not a mechanical keyboard. I think you need to change the xkb files, but I'm not sure. Do you have a mechanical keyboard you can test with? If not, you'll have to get someone else to do this. Hard/Clicky on the other hard is more convenient while typing. Please suggest. I don't understand why you think it is more convenient. To me the keyboards are equally convenient for an inexperienced child. Perhaps you intended to mention some characteristic? -- James Cameron http://quozl.linux.org.au/ -- Walter Bender Sugar Labs http://www.sugarlabs.org ___ Devel mailing list Devel@lists.laptop.org http://lists.laptop.org/listinfo/devel ___ Devel mailing list Devel@lists.laptop.org http://lists.laptop.org/listinfo/devel
Re: [Sugar-devel] seeking help to enable nepali keyboard input for XO-4
On Mon, Jun 16, 2014 at 9:03 PM, John Watlington w...@laptop.org wrote: Walter, You remember correctly. The hard/clicky/crunchy keyboards are not rated for as long a lifetime as the membrane/chewy keyboards. While the membrane keyboard design was tested to 5 million key presses, IIRC the clicky keyboard is only rated to 1 million key presses. (On the other hand, it takes one minute to replace a clicky keyboard versus twenty for a membrane keyboard.) ..if you have a replacement keyboard... any insight into how easy it would be to make replacement keys in the field? WARNING: The clicky keyboard was not approved for use by small children by UL. The reason is that if the keys are pulled off they present a choking hazard. Cheers, wad On Jun 16, 2014, at 7:13 AM, Walter Bender wrote: James, Do we have any data re the mechanical reliability/durability/repairability of the hard/clicky keyboards? We do know that although there were some issues with membrane pealing (presumably resolved with the newer design) there numerous ingenious local repairs such that most are still working after 7 years. regards. -walter On Mon, Jun 16, 2014 at 5:35 AM, James Cameron qu...@laptop.org wrote: On Mon, Jun 16, 2014 at 01:54:19PM +0545, Basanta Shrestha wrote: Hi all, We are planning on ordering the next lot of XO-4s and I need some suggestions on which keyboard model to choose -membrane or hard/clicky one. I think it is great to seek input from the community, but don't forget to ask your OLPC contact for help as well. We had membrane one for our first lot and keyboard switching was very convenient on that model. One reason not to choose hard/clicky one is that it doesn't have key for language switching ( correct me if I am wrong) -I have one spanish hard/clicky and it doesn't have that key - key 56 at http://wiki.laptop.org/go/OLPC_Keyboard_layouts. Yes, that's a good reason not to choose the mechanical keyboard; you would have to customise your operating system build again, to add a key combination for keyboard language switch. If the cost of customising is too high, you should order membrane keyboard. I don't know the relative costs of the keyboards, and their replacement rates, but it might be factored in to your decision. You identified the lack of language switch key in this same thread on sugar-devel@ back in November 2013, from which I'll draw some status: Walter says use a key combination: http://lists.sugarlabs.org/archive/sugar-devel/2013-November/045724.html And says that customisation will be needed: http://lists.sugarlabs.org/archive/sugar-devel/2013-November/045800.html Then you suggest alt+space: http://lists.sugarlabs.org/archive/sugar-devel/2013-November/045807.html Daniel Drake says to use olpc-os-builder: http://lists.sugarlabs.org/archive/sugar-devel/2013-November/045851.html And you asked about the alt+space: http://lists.sugarlabs.org/archive/sugar-devel/2013-November/045857.html But the thread dried up on that subject because the units you received had a membrane keyboard, not a mechanical keyboard. I think you need to change the xkb files, but I'm not sure. Do you have a mechanical keyboard you can test with? If not, you'll have to get someone else to do this. Hard/Clicky on the other hard is more convenient while typing. Please suggest. I don't understand why you think it is more convenient. To me the keyboards are equally convenient for an inexperienced child. Perhaps you intended to mention some characteristic? -- James Cameron http://quozl.linux.org.au/ -- Walter Bender Sugar Labs http://www.sugarlabs.org ___ Devel mailing list Devel@lists.laptop.org http://lists.laptop.org/listinfo/devel -- Walter Bender Sugar Labs http://www.sugarlabs.org ___ Devel mailing list Devel@lists.laptop.org http://lists.laptop.org/listinfo/devel
Re: [Sugar-devel] seeking help to enable nepali keyboard input for XO-4
On a related note, I was curious about deployment experiences with the new membrane design with plastic grid in between keys. Although this does help with premature peeling of keys, I've always had trouble with these keyboards - the outer edges of my fingers get in the way of a full key depress. Then again, the keys aren't designed for me, so I'm curious how these do in the field. cheers, Sameer On Mon, Jun 16, 2014 at 6:03 PM, John Watlington w...@laptop.org wrote: Walter, You remember correctly. The hard/clicky/crunchy keyboards are not rated for as long a lifetime as the membrane/chewy keyboards. While the membrane keyboard design was tested to 5 million key presses, IIRC the clicky keyboard is only rated to 1 million key presses. (On the other hand, it takes one minute to replace a clicky keyboard versus twenty for a membrane keyboard.) WARNING: The clicky keyboard was not approved for use by small children by UL. The reason is that if the keys are pulled off they present a choking hazard. Cheers, wad On Jun 16, 2014, at 7:13 AM, Walter Bender wrote: James, Do we have any data re the mechanical reliability/durability/repairability of the hard/clicky keyboards? We do know that although there were some issues with membrane pealing (presumably resolved with the newer design) there numerous ingenious local repairs such that most are still working after 7 years. regards. -walter On Mon, Jun 16, 2014 at 5:35 AM, James Cameron qu...@laptop.org wrote: On Mon, Jun 16, 2014 at 01:54:19PM +0545, Basanta Shrestha wrote: Hi all, We are planning on ordering the next lot of XO-4s and I need some suggestions on which keyboard model to choose -membrane or hard/clicky one. I think it is great to seek input from the community, but don't forget to ask your OLPC contact for help as well. We had membrane one for our first lot and keyboard switching was very convenient on that model. One reason not to choose hard/clicky one is that it doesn't have key for language switching ( correct me if I am wrong) -I have one spanish hard/clicky and it doesn't have that key - key 56 at http://wiki.laptop.org/go/OLPC_Keyboard_layouts. Yes, that's a good reason not to choose the mechanical keyboard; you would have to customise your operating system build again, to add a key combination for keyboard language switch. If the cost of customising is too high, you should order membrane keyboard. I don't know the relative costs of the keyboards, and their replacement rates, but it might be factored in to your decision. You identified the lack of language switch key in this same thread on sugar-devel@ back in November 2013, from which I'll draw some status: Walter says use a key combination: http://lists.sugarlabs.org/archive/sugar-devel/2013-November/045724.html And says that customisation will be needed: http://lists.sugarlabs.org/archive/sugar-devel/2013-November/045800.html Then you suggest alt+space: http://lists.sugarlabs.org/archive/sugar-devel/2013-November/045807.html Daniel Drake says to use olpc-os-builder: http://lists.sugarlabs.org/archive/sugar-devel/2013-November/045851.html And you asked about the alt+space: http://lists.sugarlabs.org/archive/sugar-devel/2013-November/045857.html But the thread dried up on that subject because the units you received had a membrane keyboard, not a mechanical keyboard. I think you need to change the xkb files, but I'm not sure. Do you have a mechanical keyboard you can test with? If not, you'll have to get someone else to do this. Hard/Clicky on the other hard is more convenient while typing. Please suggest. I don't understand why you think it is more convenient. To me the keyboards are equally convenient for an inexperienced child. Perhaps you intended to mention some characteristic? -- James Cameron http://quozl.linux.org.au/ -- Walter Bender Sugar Labs http://www.sugarlabs.org ___ Devel mailing list Devel@lists.laptop.org http://lists.laptop.org/listinfo/devel ___ Devel mailing list Devel@lists.laptop.org http://lists.laptop.org/listinfo/devel ___ Devel mailing list Devel@lists.laptop.org http://lists.laptop.org/listinfo/devel
Re: [Sugar-devel] seeking help to enable nepali keyboard input for XO-4
On Jun 16, 2014, at 9:05 PM, Walter Bender wrote: On Mon, Jun 16, 2014 at 9:03 PM, John Watlington w...@laptop.org wrote: Walter, You remember correctly. The hard/clicky/crunchy keyboards are not rated for as long a lifetime as the membrane/chewy keyboards. While the membrane keyboard design was tested to 5 million key presses, IIRC the clicky keyboard is only rated to 1 million key presses. (On the other hand, it takes one minute to replace a clicky keyboard versus twenty for a membrane keyboard.) ..if you have a replacement keyboard... any insight into how easy it would be to make replacement keys in the field? I would say impossible, but that would be underestimating the creativeness of our deployments. At the electrical level, the crunchy and chewy keyboards have the same contacts, so I don't expect that to be the failure mechanism. Failure should be due to the mechanical parts (as it is with the membrane keyboards). If you pull off the keycap and the guide mechanism, the key still activates when you press on the membrane or the rubber cap (which provides both the spring action and presses on the contacts) glued to it. Cheers, wad WARNING: The clicky keyboard was not approved for use by small children by UL. The reason is that if the keys are pulled off they present a choking hazard. Cheers, wad ___ Devel mailing list Devel@lists.laptop.org http://lists.laptop.org/listinfo/devel
Re: [Sugar-devel] seeking help to enable nepali keyboard input for XO-4
Sameer, We made a tooling change to improve that feeling --- we increased the chamfer around the key openings so that if you miss the key slightly, your finger slides into the opening more easily. Unfortunately, this didn't go into production until the XO-4 hit production. Thanks for pointing that out. I'm not sure if Subir and Rabi are aware that the original membrane keyboard is no longer available. The current membrane keyboard is covered by a plastic grid (making it much harder to peel off a key). See http://wiki.laptop.org/go/File:XO-1.75_siblings.jpg Cheers, wad On Jun 16, 2014, at 9:08 PM, Sameer Verma wrote: On a related note, I was curious about deployment experiences with the new membrane design with plastic grid in between keys. Although this does help with premature peeling of keys, I've always had trouble with these keyboards - the outer edges of my fingers get in the way of a full key depress. Then again, the keys aren't designed for me, so I'm curious how these do in the field. cheers, Sameer On Mon, Jun 16, 2014 at 6:03 PM, John Watlington w...@laptop.org wrote: Walter, You remember correctly. The hard/clicky/crunchy keyboards are not rated for as long a lifetime as the membrane/chewy keyboards. While the membrane keyboard design was tested to 5 million key presses, IIRC the clicky keyboard is only rated to 1 million key presses. (On the other hand, it takes one minute to replace a clicky keyboard versus twenty for a membrane keyboard.) WARNING: The clicky keyboard was not approved for use by small children by UL. The reason is that if the keys are pulled off they present a choking hazard. Cheers, wad On Jun 16, 2014, at 7:13 AM, Walter Bender wrote: James, Do we have any data re the mechanical reliability/durability/repairability of the hard/clicky keyboards? We do know that although there were some issues with membrane pealing (presumably resolved with the newer design) there numerous ingenious local repairs such that most are still working after 7 years. regards. -walter On Mon, Jun 16, 2014 at 5:35 AM, James Cameron qu...@laptop.org wrote: On Mon, Jun 16, 2014 at 01:54:19PM +0545, Basanta Shrestha wrote: Hi all, We are planning on ordering the next lot of XO-4s and I need some suggestions on which keyboard model to choose -membrane or hard/clicky one. I think it is great to seek input from the community, but don't forget to ask your OLPC contact for help as well. We had membrane one for our first lot and keyboard switching was very convenient on that model. One reason not to choose hard/clicky one is that it doesn't have key for language switching ( correct me if I am wrong) -I have one spanish hard/clicky and it doesn't have that key - key 56 at http://wiki.laptop.org/go/OLPC_Keyboard_layouts. Yes, that's a good reason not to choose the mechanical keyboard; you would have to customise your operating system build again, to add a key combination for keyboard language switch. If the cost of customising is too high, you should order membrane keyboard. I don't know the relative costs of the keyboards, and their replacement rates, but it might be factored in to your decision. You identified the lack of language switch key in this same thread on sugar-devel@ back in November 2013, from which I'll draw some status: Walter says use a key combination: http://lists.sugarlabs.org/archive/sugar-devel/2013-November/045724.html And says that customisation will be needed: http://lists.sugarlabs.org/archive/sugar-devel/2013-November/045800.html Then you suggest alt+space: http://lists.sugarlabs.org/archive/sugar-devel/2013-November/045807.html Daniel Drake says to use olpc-os-builder: http://lists.sugarlabs.org/archive/sugar-devel/2013-November/045851.html And you asked about the alt+space: http://lists.sugarlabs.org/archive/sugar-devel/2013-November/045857.html But the thread dried up on that subject because the units you received had a membrane keyboard, not a mechanical keyboard. I think you need to change the xkb files, but I'm not sure. Do you have a mechanical keyboard you can test with? If not, you'll have to get someone else to do this. Hard/Clicky on the other hard is more convenient while typing. Please suggest. I don't understand why you think it is more convenient. To me the keyboards are equally convenient for an inexperienced child. Perhaps you intended to mention some characteristic? -- James Cameron http://quozl.linux.org.au/ -- Walter Bender Sugar Labs http://www.sugarlabs.org ___ Devel mailing list Devel@lists.laptop.org http://lists.laptop.org/listinfo/devel ___ Devel mailing list Devel@lists.laptop.org http://lists.laptop.org/listinfo/devel ___ Devel mailing list
Re: [Sugar-devel] seeking help to enable nepali keyboard input for XO-4
On Mon, Jun 16, 2014 at 6:19 PM, John Watlington w...@laptop.org wrote: On Jun 16, 2014, at 9:05 PM, Walter Bender wrote: On Mon, Jun 16, 2014 at 9:03 PM, John Watlington w...@laptop.org wrote: Walter, You remember correctly. The hard/clicky/crunchy keyboards are not rated for as long a lifetime as the membrane/chewy keyboards. While the membrane keyboard design was tested to 5 million key presses, IIRC the clicky keyboard is only rated to 1 million key presses. (On the other hand, it takes one minute to replace a clicky keyboard versus twenty for a membrane keyboard.) ..if you have a replacement keyboard... any insight into how easy it would be to make replacement keys in the field? I would say impossible, but that would be underestimating the creativeness of our deployments. At the electrical level, the crunchy and chewy keyboards have the same contacts, so I don't expect that to be the failure mechanism. Failure should be due to the mechanical parts (as it is with the membrane keyboards). If you pull off the keycap and the guide mechanism, the key still activates when you press on the membrane or the rubber cap (which provides both the spring action and presses on the contacts) glued to it. Back in January 2013, while visiting Khairat (India) I saw a couple of girls using the eraser end of a pencil to push the torn keys on their XO-1s from 2007 (which BTW still hold charge and run the mesh!). Sameer Cheers, wad WARNING: The clicky keyboard was not approved for use by small children by UL. The reason is that if the keys are pulled off they present a choking hazard. Cheers, wad ___ Sugar-devel mailing list sugar-de...@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel ___ Devel mailing list Devel@lists.laptop.org http://lists.laptop.org/listinfo/devel
Re: [Sugar-devel] seeking help to enable nepali keyboard input for XO-4
On Mon, Jun 16, 2014 at 3:20 PM, James Cameron qu...@laptop.org wrote: On Mon, Jun 16, 2014 at 01:54:19PM +0545, Basanta Shrestha wrote: Hi all, We are planning on ordering the next lot of XO-4s and I need some suggestions on which keyboard model to choose -membrane or hard/clicky one. I think it is great to seek input from the community, but don't forget to ask your OLPC contact for help as well. We had membrane one for our first lot and keyboard switching was very convenient on that model. One reason not to choose hard/clicky one is that it doesn't have key for language switching ( correct me if I am wrong) -I have one spanish hard/clicky and it doesn't have that key - key 56 at http://wiki.laptop.org/go/OLPC_Keyboard_layouts. Yes, that's a good reason not to choose the mechanical keyboard; you would have to customise your operating system build again, to add a key combination for keyboard language switch. If the cost of customising is too high, you should order membrane keyboard. I don't know the relative costs of the keyboards, and their replacement rates, but it might be factored in to your decision. The cost for customization and building again is not expensive. I have a build machine set up in front of me. You identified the lack of language switch key in this same thread on sugar-devel@ back in November 2013, from which I'll draw some status: Walter says use a key combination: http://lists.sugarlabs.org/archive/sugar-devel/2013-November/045724.html And says that customisation will be needed: http://lists.sugarlabs.org/archive/sugar-devel/2013-November/045800.html Then you suggest alt+space: http://lists.sugarlabs.org/archive/sugar-devel/2013-November/045807.html Daniel Drake says to use olpc-os-builder: http://lists.sugarlabs.org/archive/sugar-devel/2013-November/045851.html And you asked about the alt+space: http://lists.sugarlabs.org/archive/sugar-devel/2013-November/045857.html But the thread dried up on that subject because the units you received had a membrane keyboard, not a mechanical keyboard. Yes, that was exactly what happened. I think you need to change the xkb files, but I'm not sure. Do you have a mechanical keyboard you can test with? If not, you'll have to get someone else to do this. Yes, I have one - the spanish one. What I need to know is how to enable the key combination for language switching . Hard/Clicky on the other hard is more convenient while typing. Please suggest. I don't understand why you think it is more convenient. To me the keyboards are equally convenient for an inexperienced child. Perhaps you intended to mention some characteristic? Parhaps you may be right, but It is really inconvenient when you want to type fast on membrane keyboard. The problem is exactly what Prof. Sameer Varma has pointed out later in this thread - the outer edges of the fingers get in the way of a full key depress but even thismay not be big issues for kids cause they mostly type character by character using two fingers. -- James Cameron http://quozl.linux.org.au/ -- Basanta Shrestha Network Engineer Open Learning Exchange (OLE) Nepal Tel: +977.1.551, 5520075 Ext. 303 Cell: +977.9818 605110 http://www.olenepal.org ___ Devel mailing list Devel@lists.laptop.org http://lists.laptop.org/listinfo/devel
[Server-devel] Server Backup on HaitiOS
Tim discovered that backups to the XSCE in release 5.0 were failing. I had changed ds-backup-server to use the WSGI interface (mod_python was obsoleted in FC18). So I assumed that the ball was in my court. But I believe the test just completed indicates that the problem was really that the superuser bit in /bin/ping was removed in FC17 (the base for HaitiOS). The test: 1. Load OS13.2.0 on an XO4. 2. Install XSCE release 5.0 on top of that -- installs ds-backup-server hash c5d86 (unchanged from XSCE-0.4) 3. Load HaitiOS hash 6d78 on an XO1 4. Register XO1 to server 5. Wait for 2 hours -- observe no data in directory at /library/user/SHC 6. execute chmod 4755 /bin/ping on the XO1 7. Wait for 1 hour -- observe that the backup had occurred I think the wifi fixup that Tim has prepared for Sora to take to Haiti should include the change in permissions on /bin/pin. I do remember that, in the Tiny Core environment, it is hard to find the file that I wanted to change (because I don't have a clear idea of the disk tree, before the chroot that the firmware does as it is bringing up the XO. ___ Server-devel mailing list Server-devel@lists.laptop.org http://lists.laptop.org/listinfo/server-devel
Re: [Server-devel] [UKids] Server Backup on HaitiOS
On Mon, Jun 16, 2014 at 03:35:40PM -0400, George Hunt wrote: Tim discovered that backups to the XSCE in release 5.0 were failing. I had changed ds-backup-server to use the WSGI interface (mod_python was obsoleted in FC18). I suggest adding a test for backups to the release checklist for XSCE. So I assumed that the ball was in my court. But I believe the test just completed indicates that the problem was really that the superuser bit in /bin/ ping was removed in FC17 (the base for HaitiOS). It was replaced by another mechanism in Fedora 17 (no core), but that other mechanism was incorrectly removed by OLPC OS, and the setuid bit is a workaround. (In my opinion a more correct solution is to change ds-backup to not need ping, but instead attempt the backup anyway. This would avoid failing a backup if ping could not be run.) The test: 1. Load OS13.2.0 on an XO4. 2. Install XSCE release 5.0 on top of that -- installs ds-backup-server hash c5d86 (unchanged from XSCE-0.4) 3. Load HaitiOS hash 6d78 on an XO1 4. Register XO1 to server 5. Wait for 2 hours -- observe no data in directory at /library/user/SHC 6. execute chmod 4755 /bin/ping on the XO1 7. Wait for 1 hour -- observe that the backup had occurred You can make this test faster by starting the backup manually on the XO-1, by typing this in Terminal: /usr/bin/ds-backup.sh You can find in /etc/cron.d/ds-backup the method by which the backup is started. I think the wifi fixup that Tim has prepared for Sora to take to Haiti should include the change in permissions on /bin/pin. I do remember that, in the Tiny Core environment, it is hard to find the file that I wanted to change (because I don't have a clear idea of the disk tree, before the chroot that the firmware does as it is bringing up the XO. You can find files more easily in the Tiny Core Linux environment by doing the chroot manually at a prompt. You can pull fragments out of Jerry's xo-custom, especially the functions, and use them as command line tools. -- James Cameron http://quozl.linux.org.au/ ___ Server-devel mailing list Server-devel@lists.laptop.org http://lists.laptop.org/listinfo/server-devel
Re: [Server-devel] [UKids] Server Backup on HaitiOS
sudo seems to work without setting the bit on ping, so that would be an alternate approach. either way, I did a test that confirms that your approach fixes the problem. as far as testing is concerned, ds-backup is already on the checklist, but we haven't always followed the list. I was more diligent this time in following https://github.com/XSCE/xsce/blob/master/docs/TESTING.rst because I was afraid that restructuring the install might break things. Miguel started automating the smoke test and we should add ds-backup to it. Tim -Original Message- From: James Cameron Sent: Monday, June 16, 2014 6:46 PM To: George Hunt Cc: Tim Moody ; Adam Holt ; unleashk...@googlegroups.com ; XS Devel Subject: Re: [UKids] Server Backup on HaitiOS On Mon, Jun 16, 2014 at 03:35:40PM -0400, George Hunt wrote: Tim discovered that backups to the XSCE in release 5.0 were failing. I had changed ds-backup-server to use the WSGI interface (mod_python was obsoleted in FC18). I suggest adding a test for backups to the release checklist for XSCE. So I assumed that the ball was in my court. But I believe the test just completed indicates that the problem was really that the superuser bit in /bin/ ping was removed in FC17 (the base for HaitiOS). It was replaced by another mechanism in Fedora 17 (no core), but that other mechanism was incorrectly removed by OLPC OS, and the setuid bit is a workaround. (In my opinion a more correct solution is to change ds-backup to not need ping, but instead attempt the backup anyway. This would avoid failing a backup if ping could not be run.) The test: 1. Load OS13.2.0 on an XO4. 2. Install XSCE release 5.0 on top of that -- installs ds-backup-server hash c5d86 (unchanged from XSCE-0.4) 3. Load HaitiOS hash 6d78 on an XO1 4. Register XO1 to server 5. Wait for 2 hours -- observe no data in directory at /library/user/SHC 6. execute chmod 4755 /bin/ping on the XO1 7. Wait for 1 hour -- observe that the backup had occurred You can make this test faster by starting the backup manually on the XO-1, by typing this in Terminal: /usr/bin/ds-backup.sh You can find in /etc/cron.d/ds-backup the method by which the backup is started. I think the wifi fixup that Tim has prepared for Sora to take to Haiti should include the change in permissions on /bin/pin. I do remember that, in the Tiny Core environment, it is hard to find the file that I wanted to change (because I don't have a clear idea of the disk tree, before the chroot that the firmware does as it is bringing up the XO. You can find files more easily in the Tiny Core Linux environment by doing the chroot manually at a prompt. You can pull fragments out of Jerry's xo-custom, especially the functions, and use them as command line tools. -- James Cameron http://quozl.linux.org.au/ -- Unsung Heroes of OLPC, interviewed live @ http://unleashkids.org ! --- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Unleash Kids group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to unleashkids+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.___ Server-devel mailing list Server-devel@lists.laptop.org http://lists.laptop.org/listinfo/server-devel
