Re: Sharing files among several XO
On 29.10.2009, at 16:23, Hilaire Fernandes wrote: 2009/10/29 Bert Freudenberg b...@freudenbergs.de: On 29.10.2009, at 02:47, Hilaire Fernandes wrote: Under Etoys, If I keep down the mouse button and choose Save under another name (I am not sure about the exact message), and save the project with another name, then in the journal the previous instance of the project is replaced with this new one. I will check again tonight. Note: Pay attention I am not just using the Keep button Why?! Because I need it to conduct test and I want to be sure to save another instance of the project, under another name. No, I meant why you don't simply click the Keep button. Btw, I can confirm you renaming the project in Etoys toolbar then saving does not produce another instance everytime. For me it does, every time. Can you write up steps to reproduce the problem? The modus operendi of the journal does not looks intuitive to me, but well it does not count really as I am not the typical target audiance. Hilaire Be that as it may I still think Etoys should follow the Sugar conventions closely. And as far as I know it does. If clicking the Keep button does not save another copy every time you click it, that's a bug. Mind I'm not talking about the save menu item, just the Keep button. - Bert - Simply stop Etoys to save to the Journal, overwriting the previous entry. Simply click the Keep button to create a new entry in the Journal. Simply edit the name in the Etoys toolbar to rename. Or rename in the Journal. The hidden save menu options let you save to a file or upload to the Squeakland website. They do not save to the Journal. They are hidden for a reason. - Bert - -- http://blog.ofset.org/hilaire ___ Devel mailing list Devel@lists.laptop.org http://lists.laptop.org/listinfo/devel
Re: Sharing files among several XO
On Fri, Oct 30, 2009 at 9:11 AM, Bert Freudenberg b...@freudenbergs.de wrote: On 29.10.2009, at 16:23, Hilaire Fernandes wrote: 2009/10/29 Bert Freudenberg b...@freudenbergs.de: On 29.10.2009, at 02:47, Hilaire Fernandes wrote: Under Etoys, If I keep down the mouse button and choose Save under another name (I am not sure about the exact message), and save the project with another name, then in the journal the previous instance of the project is replaced with this new one. I will check again tonight. Note: Pay attention I am not just using the Keep button Why?! Because I need it to conduct test and I want to be sure to save another instance of the project, under another name. No, I meant why you don't simply click the Keep button. Btw, I can confirm you renaming the project in Etoys toolbar then saving does not produce another instance everytime. For me it does, every time. Can you write up steps to reproduce the problem? The modus operendi of the journal does not looks intuitive to me, but well it does not count really as I am not the typical target audiance. Hilaire Be that as it may I still think Etoys should follow the Sugar conventions closely. And as far as I know it does. If clicking the Keep button does not save another copy every time you click it, that's a bug. Mind I'm not talking about the save menu item, just the Keep button. Hi Bert, It sounds like Etoys is behaving appropriately. However, perhaps part of the solution is just in naming this other feature that causing confusion. What does it do exactly? Perhaps save isn't the right term for it. Also, I understand uploading to Squeakland, but how does save to a file differ from Keep? Eben - Bert - Simply stop Etoys to save to the Journal, overwriting the previous entry. Simply click the Keep button to create a new entry in the Journal. Simply edit the name in the Etoys toolbar to rename. Or rename in the Journal. The hidden save menu options let you save to a file or upload to the Squeakland website. They do not save to the Journal. They are hidden for a reason. - Bert - -- http://blog.ofset.org/hilaire ___ Devel mailing list Devel@lists.laptop.org http://lists.laptop.org/listinfo/devel ___ Devel mailing list Devel@lists.laptop.org http://lists.laptop.org/listinfo/devel
Re: Sharing files among several XO
On 30.10.2009, at 09:27, Eben Eliason wrote: On Fri, Oct 30, 2009 at 9:11 AM, Bert Freudenberg b...@freudenbergs.de wrote: On 29.10.2009, at 16:23, Hilaire Fernandes wrote: 2009/10/29 Bert Freudenberg b...@freudenbergs.de: On 29.10.2009, at 02:47, Hilaire Fernandes wrote: Under Etoys, If I keep down the mouse button and choose Save under another name (I am not sure about the exact message), and save the project with another name, then in the journal the previous instance of the project is replaced with this new one. I will check again tonight. Note: Pay attention I am not just using the Keep button Why?! Because I need it to conduct test and I want to be sure to save another instance of the project, under another name. No, I meant why you don't simply click the Keep button. Btw, I can confirm you renaming the project in Etoys toolbar then saving does not produce another instance everytime. For me it does, every time. Can you write up steps to reproduce the problem? The modus operendi of the journal does not looks intuitive to me, but well it does not count really as I am not the typical target audiance. Hilaire Be that as it may I still think Etoys should follow the Sugar conventions closely. And as far as I know it does. If clicking the Keep button does not save another copy every time you click it, that's a bug. Mind I'm not talking about the save menu item, just the Keep button. Hi Bert, It sounds like Etoys is behaving appropriately. However, perhaps part of the solution is just in naming this other feature that causing confusion. What does it do exactly? Perhaps save isn't the right term for it. Also, I understand uploading to Squeakland, but how does save to a file differ from Keep? Eben It saves to a file, not to the Journal. - Bert - ___ Devel mailing list Devel@lists.laptop.org http://lists.laptop.org/listinfo/devel
Re: Sharing files among several XO
Under Etoys, If I keep down the mouse button and choose Save under another name (I am not sure about the exact message), and save the project with another name, then in the journal the previous instance of the project is replaced with this new one. I will check again tonight. Note: Pay attention I am not just using the Keep button 2009/10/28 Bert Freudenberg b...@freudenbergs.de: On 28.10.2009, at 17:22, Hilaire Fernandes wrote: 2009/10/28 Bert Freudenberg b...@freudenbergs.de: If you click the Etoys Keep button it should create a new Journal entry. I did not get a new entry in the journal. Could it be because I keep pushing the keep button to save under another name? Hilaire I just tried with the original Etoys version in 8.2-767 and it does create a new Journal entry every time I press the Keep button. I also tried with the latest Etoys in latest Sugar, works too. What exactly is failing for you? Is there anything suspicious in the Etoys log file? - Bert - -- http://blog.ofset.org/hilaire ___ Devel mailing list Devel@lists.laptop.org http://lists.laptop.org/listinfo/devel
Re: Sharing files among several XO
On 29.10.2009, at 02:47, Hilaire Fernandes wrote: Under Etoys, If I keep down the mouse button and choose Save under another name (I am not sure about the exact message), and save the project with another name, then in the journal the previous instance of the project is replaced with this new one. I will check again tonight. Note: Pay attention I am not just using the Keep button Why?! Simply stop Etoys to save to the Journal, overwriting the previous entry. Simply click the Keep button to create a new entry in the Journal. Simply edit the name in the Etoys toolbar to rename. Or rename in the Journal. The hidden save menu options let you save to a file or upload to the Squeakland website. They do not save to the Journal. They are hidden for a reason. - Bert - ___ Devel mailing list Devel@lists.laptop.org http://lists.laptop.org/listinfo/devel
Re: Sharing files among several XO
2009/10/29 Bert Freudenberg b...@freudenbergs.de: On 29.10.2009, at 02:47, Hilaire Fernandes wrote: Under Etoys, If I keep down the mouse button and choose Save under another name (I am not sure about the exact message), and save the project with another name, then in the journal the previous instance of the project is replaced with this new one. I will check again tonight. Note: Pay attention I am not just using the Keep button Why?! Because I need it to conduct test and I want to be sure to save another instance of the project, under another name. Btw, I can confirm you renaming the project in Etoys toolbar then saving does not produce another instance everytime. The modus operendi of the journal does not looks intuitive to me, but well it does not count really as I am not the typical target audiance. Hilaire Simply stop Etoys to save to the Journal, overwriting the previous entry. Simply click the Keep button to create a new entry in the Journal. Simply edit the name in the Etoys toolbar to rename. Or rename in the Journal. The hidden save menu options let you save to a file or upload to the Squeakland website. They do not save to the Journal. They are hidden for a reason. - Bert - -- http://blog.ofset.org/hilaire ___ Devel mailing list Devel@lists.laptop.org http://lists.laptop.org/listinfo/devel
Re: Sharing files among several XO
I am unware of Mentaly, I can not find such activity in the OLPC wiki. Does it requires a server to work? Hilaire 2009/10/28 DancesWithCars danceswithc...@gmail.com: Good question, I that some one from Cambridge said you could share files, but maybe that is from our other machine peer to peer file sharing mentality, and not really implemented on the XO, or did I miss something? Even the files term is a little shakey, as a Journal Activity instance may not be the same as we usually think of a jpg, .txt file , etc. as the sugar wraps activity metadata around the instance? So, I will also be anxious for the solution... On Tue, Oct 27, 2009 at 8:36 AM, Hilaire Fernandes hilaire.fernan...@edu.ge.ch wrote: In a server-less environment I need to share several files among XO, in the term of an Etoys project file provided by the teacher and the students grabbing it. I tried to share a project from Etoys, but it lead to an error, (kind of server error messages) I tried the Distribute activity but it proved to be unreliable. I am using XO with latest stable Sugar updated from olpc-update Hilaire -- http://blog.ofset.org/hilaire ___ Devel mailing list Devel@lists.laptop.org http://lists.laptop.org/listinfo/devel -- DancesWithCars leave the wolves behind ;-) -- http://blog.ofset.org/hilaire ___ Devel mailing list Devel@lists.laptop.org http://lists.laptop.org/listinfo/devel
Re: Sharing files among several XO
On Wed, Oct 28, 2009 at 00:57, DancesWithCars danceswithc...@gmail.com wrote: Good question, I that some one from Cambridge said you could share files, but maybe that is from our other machine peer to peer file sharing mentality, and not really implemented on the XO, or did I miss something? Sugar supports direct file transfers between machines, but only from 0.84. Hilaire said he uses the last stable OLPC release, so he is using 0.82. Maybe we should try to troubleshoot Distribute and make it more robust? The only other option I can think of is using a usb stick to share entries. Regards, Tomeu Even the files term is a little shakey, as a Journal Activity instance may not be the same as we usually think of a jpg, .txt file , etc. as the sugar wraps activity metadata around the instance? So, I will also be anxious for the solution... On Tue, Oct 27, 2009 at 8:36 AM, Hilaire Fernandes hilaire.fernan...@edu.ge.ch wrote: In a server-less environment I need to share several files among XO, in the term of an Etoys project file provided by the teacher and the students grabbing it. I tried to share a project from Etoys, but it lead to an error, (kind of server error messages) I tried the Distribute activity but it proved to be unreliable. I am using XO with latest stable Sugar updated from olpc-update Hilaire -- http://blog.ofset.org/hilaire ___ Devel mailing list Devel@lists.laptop.org http://lists.laptop.org/listinfo/devel -- DancesWithCars leave the wolves behind ;-) ___ Devel mailing list Devel@lists.laptop.org http://lists.laptop.org/listinfo/devel -- «Sugar Labs is anyone who participates in improving and using Sugar. What Sugar Labs does is determined by the participants.» - David Farning ___ Devel mailing list Devel@lists.laptop.org http://lists.laptop.org/listinfo/devel
Re: Sharing files among several XO
The term mentality is not an software Activity but a general construct (mental model?) within our conditioned (other computer using) brains. I should have been more clear with possible cross language audience, though I started using psychology jargon, a little mixed with plain [human] language. The instance of the OLPC presentation I heard it was an impromptu fill in for a XO 1.5 demo at the Gallaudet.edu campus during the ClassActs book sprint. And I have trouble with English as a dyslexic. On Wed, Oct 28, 2009 at 3:55 AM, Hilaire Fernandes hilaire.fernan...@edu.ge.ch wrote: I am unware of Mentaly, I can not find such activity in the OLPC wiki. Does it requires a server to work? Hilaire 2009/10/28 DancesWithCars danceswithc...@gmail.com: Good question, I that some one from Cambridge said you could share files, but maybe that is from our other machine peer to peer file sharing mentality, and not really implemented on the XO, or did I miss something? Even the files term is a little shakey, as a Journal Activity instance may not be the same as we usually think of a jpg, .txt file , etc. as the sugar wraps activity metadata around the instance? So, I will also be anxious for the solution... On Tue, Oct 27, 2009 at 8:36 AM, Hilaire Fernandes hilaire.fernan...@edu.ge.ch wrote: In a server-less environment I need to share several files among XO, in the term of an Etoys project file provided by the teacher and the students grabbing it. I tried to share a project from Etoys, but it lead to an error, (kind of server error messages) I tried the Distribute activity but it proved to be unreliable. I am using XO with latest stable Sugar updated from olpc-update Hilaire -- http://blog.ofset.org/hilaire ___ Devel mailing list Devel@lists.laptop.org http://lists.laptop.org/listinfo/devel -- DancesWithCars leave the wolves behind ;-) -- http://blog.ofset.org/hilaire -- DancesWithCars leave the wolves behind ;-) ___ Devel mailing list Devel@lists.laptop.org http://lists.laptop.org/listinfo/devel
Re: Sharing files among several XO
2009/10/28 Tomeu Vizoso to...@sugarlabs.org: Sugar supports direct file transfers between machines, but only from 0.84. Hilaire said he uses the last stable OLPC release, so he is using 0.82. And so far, I don't have any avalaible time to test installing the 0.84 on XO. At least there are some bits of information regarding 0.84. I sill have to port back DrGeo to Etoys and improve the scripting programming of DrGeo within Etoys, then start to design learning activities with Etoys/DrGeo projects. Then these learning activities will be shared to student XO. So all in all, is it really the case there are no way to share file between XO through the mesh? Maybe we should try to troubleshoot Distribute and make it more robust? The only other option I can think of is using a usb stick to share entries. Not really a viable option in real life with those students. I am thinking about a wifi access point with a third party laptop providing FTP access for Etoys project (Etoys can directly cope with that in user friendly way) Hilaire -- http://blog.ofset.org/hilaire ___ Devel mailing list Devel@lists.laptop.org http://lists.laptop.org/listinfo/devel
Re: Sharing files among several XO
On Wed, Oct 28, 2009 at 7:40 AM, Hilaire Fernandes hilaire.fernan...@edu.ge.ch wrote: 2009/10/28 Tomeu Vizoso to...@sugarlabs.org: Sugar supports direct file transfers between machines, but only from 0.84. Hilaire said he uses the last stable OLPC release, so he is using 0.82. And so far, I don't have any avalaible time to test installing the 0.84 on XO. At least there are some bits of information regarding 0.84. I sill have to port back DrGeo to Etoys and improve the scripting programming of DrGeo within Etoys, then start to design learning activities with Etoys/DrGeo projects. Then these learning activities will be shared to student XO. So all in all, is it really the case there are no way to share file between XO through the mesh? It's possible to share objects directly between 2 XOs (0.84), but there is currently no mechanism, other than activities, for sharing with many people at once. A long overdue feature of Sugar is Groups, which would allow anyone to create groups of people (such as a class) to enable sending objects and sharing activities with specific sets of individuals at once. Eben Maybe we should try to troubleshoot Distribute and make it more robust? The only other option I can think of is using a usb stick to share entries. Not really a viable option in real life with those students. I am thinking about a wifi access point with a third party laptop providing FTP access for Etoys project (Etoys can directly cope with that in user friendly way) Hilaire -- http://blog.ofset.org/hilaire ___ Devel mailing list Devel@lists.laptop.org http://lists.laptop.org/listinfo/devel ___ Devel mailing list Devel@lists.laptop.org http://lists.laptop.org/listinfo/devel
Re: Sharing files among several XO
2009/10/28 Eben Eliason eben.elia...@gmail.com: On Wed, Oct 28, 2009 at 7:40 AM, Hilaire Fernandes hilaire.fernan...@edu.ge.ch wrote: 2009/10/28 Tomeu Vizoso to...@sugarlabs.org: Sugar supports direct file transfers between machines, but only from 0.84. Hilaire said he uses the last stable OLPC release, so he is using 0.82. And so far, I don't have any avalaible time to test installing the 0.84 on XO. At least there are some bits of information regarding 0.84. I sill have to port back DrGeo to Etoys and improve the scripting programming of DrGeo within Etoys, then start to design learning activities with Etoys/DrGeo projects. Then these learning activities will be shared to student XO. So all in all, is it really the case there are no way to share file between XO through the mesh? It's possible to share objects directly between 2 XOs (0.84), but hum, but 0.84 seems to be unsupported by olpc, right? You can imagine what it could mean when you are in production. By the way a bit sidetopic, but related to usability, I noted the buggy behavior of the touchpad is still there. Is it related to a physical problem which can't be fixed? I am pretty sure my student will be very easily frustrated with that, and drop any effort after that. there is currently no mechanism, other than activities, for sharing with many people at once. A long overdue feature of Sugar is Groups, even sharing between 2 xo will be a big step. I am still impressed such feature was not present since day 1. Was it not part of the sold package? I am wondering how it looks like in place where thousand of xo are deployed. Hilaire -- http://blog.ofset.org/hilaire ___ Devel mailing list Devel@lists.laptop.org http://lists.laptop.org/listinfo/devel
Re: Sharing files among several XO
2009/10/28 Gary C Martin g...@garycmartin.com: I tried to share a project from Etoys, but it lead to an error, (kind of server error messages) What was the error, this is the problem to resolve. I tried again this afternoon to write down the error message. When your drop a project Morph in the buddies representation in Etoys, the project Morph is effectively received in the other XO, but opening the project lead to an error. I write it down this afternoon, Etoys issues this error messages: 'Current project does not know a server either', then 'project not found' It worked very well last time I tested. Sure. The issue is when sharing a whole complex project, like I will have in the class ecosystem. Thanks Hilaire -- http://blog.ofset.org/hilaire ___ Devel mailing list Devel@lists.laptop.org http://lists.laptop.org/listinfo/devel
Re: Sharing files among several XO
On 28.10.2009, at 15:51, Hilaire Fernandes wrote: 2009/10/28 Gary C Martin g...@garycmartin.com: I tried to share a project from Etoys, but it lead to an error, (kind of server error messages) What was the error, this is the problem to resolve. I tried again this afternoon to write down the error message. When your drop a project Morph in the buddies representation in Etoys, the project Morph is effectively received in the other XO, but opening the project lead to an error. I write it down this afternoon, Etoys issues this error messages: 'Current project does not know a server either', then 'project not found' Ah. Apparently it really only transmits the project thumbnail, not the project itself. Too bad. OTOH this would have been impractical anyway if there are more than a handful kids. The teacher would have had to drop the project on each badge. And I think Etoys can't even show more than a handful of badges at the same time, if there are more people joining the badges go off screen. The Distribute activity would be your best bet I guess. Where is it? - Bert - It worked very well last time I tested. Sure. The issue is when sharing a whole complex project, like I will have in the class ecosystem. Thanks Hilaire -- http://blog.ofset.org/hilaire ___ Devel mailing list Devel@lists.laptop.org http://lists.laptop.org/listinfo/devel
Re: Sharing files among several XO
Bert Freudenberg wrote: The Distribute activity would be your best bet I guess. Where is it? http://dev.laptop.org/~bemasc/Distribute-1.xo Distribute is the barest prototype of a sharing activity, designed purely as a proof of concept. It is unmaintained, has essentially no user interface, and is not available in any language other than English. The code is a simplified derivative of the hackish HTTP-based sharing system from Read. Any attempts to revive it are welcome. This is the first time I've ever heard of anyone even attempting to use it. --Ben signature.asc Description: OpenPGP digital signature ___ Devel mailing list Devel@lists.laptop.org http://lists.laptop.org/listinfo/devel
Re: Sharing files among several XO
I tested it again tonight. I have been able to share a project file, modify this file and save it with a new name (it does not produce another instance in the journal), then share it again. Don't know what is different from yesterday evening. I will test it again with condition closer to the ecosystem. Thanks Hilaire 2009/10/28 Benjamin M. Schwartz bmsch...@fas.harvard.edu: Bert Freudenberg wrote: The Distribute activity would be your best bet I guess. Where is it? http://dev.laptop.org/~bemasc/Distribute-1.xo Distribute is the barest prototype of a sharing activity, designed purely as a proof of concept. It is unmaintained, has essentially no user interface, and is not available in any language other than English. The code is a simplified derivative of the hackish HTTP-based sharing system from Read. Any attempts to revive it are welcome. This is the first time I've ever heard of anyone even attempting to use it. --Ben ___ Devel mailing list Devel@lists.laptop.org http://lists.laptop.org/listinfo/devel -- http://blog.ofset.org/hilaire ___ Devel mailing list Devel@lists.laptop.org http://lists.laptop.org/listinfo/devel
Re: Sharing files among several XO
On 28.10.2009, at 16:43, Hilaire Fernandes wrote: I tested it again tonight. I have been able to share a project file, modify this file and save it with a new name (it does not produce another instance in the journal), then share it again. Don't know what is different from yesterday evening. I will test it again with condition closer to the ecosystem. Thanks Hilaire You mean shared using the Distribute activity? If you click the Etoys Keep button it should create a new Journal entry. - Bert - 2009/10/28 Benjamin M. Schwartz bmsch...@fas.harvard.edu: Bert Freudenberg wrote: The Distribute activity would be your best bet I guess. Where is it? http://dev.laptop.org/~bemasc/Distribute-1.xo Distribute is the barest prototype of a sharing activity, designed purely as a proof of concept. It is unmaintained, has essentially no user interface, and is not available in any language other than English. The code is a simplified derivative of the hackish HTTP-based sharing system from Read. Any attempts to revive it are welcome. This is the first time I've ever heard of anyone even attempting to use it. --Ben ___ Devel mailing list Devel@lists.laptop.org http://lists.laptop.org/listinfo/devel
Re: Sharing files among several XO
2009/10/28 Bert Freudenberg b...@freudenbergs.de: You mean shared using the Distribute activity? yes. If you click the Etoys Keep button it should create a new Journal entry. I did not get a new entry in the journal. Could it be because I keep pushing the keep button to save under another name? Hilaire ___ Devel mailing list Devel@lists.laptop.org http://lists.laptop.org/listinfo/devel
Re: Sharing files among several XO
On 28.10.2009, at 17:22, Hilaire Fernandes wrote: 2009/10/28 Bert Freudenberg b...@freudenbergs.de: If you click the Etoys Keep button it should create a new Journal entry. I did not get a new entry in the journal. Could it be because I keep pushing the keep button to save under another name? Hilaire I just tried with the original Etoys version in 8.2-767 and it does create a new Journal entry every time I press the Keep button. I also tried with the latest Etoys in latest Sugar, works too. What exactly is failing for you? Is there anything suspicious in the Etoys log file? - Bert - ___ Devel mailing list Devel@lists.laptop.org http://lists.laptop.org/listinfo/devel
Sharing files among several XO
In a server-less environment I need to share several files among XO, in the term of an Etoys project file provided by the teacher and the students grabbing it. I tried to share a project from Etoys, but it lead to an error, (kind of server error messages) I tried the Distribute activity but it proved to be unreliable. I am using XO with latest stable Sugar updated from olpc-update Hilaire -- http://blog.ofset.org/hilaire ___ Devel mailing list Devel@lists.laptop.org http://lists.laptop.org/listinfo/devel
