Improving UI performance
I was just thinking about the various UI-related layers that are there in 2007.2/2008.8/FSO. I understand that the idea is to re-use existing technologies and concepts from the desktop world. However, wouldn't a single-layer approach make things run a lot faster? Or have a more customized / simpler X? Pros: 1) Faster and lighter UI 2) Benefits derived from (1) - like more memory / processing power for applications Suggestion: A tinier X (than KDrive) that does only full-screen applications and pop-ups. This would simplify the UI API to a subset of GTK+ / Qt (??) . The reason for this suggestion being that generally mobile applications occupy the whole screen and usually just pop-up smaller stuff once in a while. Extensive window management is NOT required. Typically the user has 1 or more applications opens and alt-tabs between them. He doesn't tile them side-by-side etc. That is (usually) not a valid use-case for mobile applications. Disclaimer: I am not well-versed in either of GTK+ or Qt. So some (or all) of the suggestions above may be stupid. Also, I read somewhere that GTK+ is not quite optimized enough for OpenMoko (something about images not being cached, just impacting responsivenes) ? Are fixes in progress for these? I would like to help. Please direct me to where I should start looking. ___ devel mailing list devel@lists.openmoko.org https://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/devel
Building for FSO
How do I build applications for FSO? Is it the same as mentioned in http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Toolchain ? What about the GTK+ libraries? Are they available? Specifically, I am wanted to compile Claws Mail, Ice Weasel and Pidgin for FSO Milestone 2? Isn't it feasible to do so? ___ devel mailing list devel@lists.openmoko.org https://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/devel
Error while building FSO
I am following the steps in MokoMakefile wiki page, to build FSO. When I do 'make setup', I get the following error: fatal: The remote end hung up unexpectedly fetch-pack from 'git://git.openembedded.net/git/openmoko.git' failed. make: *** [setup-openembedded] Error 1 (I have set OM_GIT_SITE as git.openembedded.net and OM_GIT_BRANCH as org.openembedded.dev) ___ devel mailing list devel@lists.openmoko.org https://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/devel
Errors while building Firefox 3.0 for FSO
I tried building Firefox 3 for FSO from the MokoMakefile. I get a compilation error as follows: libcairo.so: undefined reference to `pixman_format_supported_destination' A google search led me to http://www.mail-archive.com/devel@lists.openmoko.org/msg00817.html How do I include moko-autorev.inc to build/conf/local.conf ? ___ devel mailing list devel@lists.openmoko.org https://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/devel
Re: Errors while building Firefox 3.0 for FSO
On Thu, Aug 28, 2008 at 4:45 PM, sparky mat <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > I tried building Firefox 3 for FSO from the MokoMakefile. I get a > compilation error as follows: > > libcairo.so: undefined reference to `pixman_format_supported_destination' > > A google search led me to > http://www.mail-archive.com/devel@lists.openmoko.org/msg00817.html > > How do I include moko-autorev.inc to build/conf/local.conf ? > Anyone? ___ devel mailing list devel@lists.openmoko.org https://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/devel
Painless SDK installation
I was wondering if anyone's working on the "painless SDK installation" from the Wishlist on the wiki. If so, I am interested in helping out with it. ___ devel mailing list devel@lists.openmoko.org https://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/devel
x in om2007.2
kinda new here. i noticed that om2007.2 and asu are slower than qtopia (the one from trolltech, not the x11 port). i presume its partly because X is being used. would it make sense to alter gtk+ for om2007.2 to directly write to screen? and prolly add some window management i guess.. or make X a lot lighter.. are we using X.org or X11. what about TinyX? i'm not too familiar with most of the tech mentioned above, so I apologise if i'm coming across as idiotic. ___ devel mailing list devel@lists.openmoko.org https://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/devel
Re: x in om2007.2
On Sun, Jul 27, 2008 at 5:33 PM, Marcus Bauer <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>wrote: > On Sun, 2008-07-27 at 13:26 +0200, Michael 'Mickey' Lauer wrote: > > Am Sonntag 27 Juli 2008 09:52:57 schrieb sparky mat: > > > kinda new here. i noticed that om2007.2 and asu are slower than qtopia > > > (the one from trolltech, not the x11 port). i presume its partly > > > because X is being used. > > > > It's less a problem of X and more a problem of Gtk+ taking ages to > (re)draw > > things on the screen. > > It is well known that you don't like GTK+ - fine. But just stop > spreading your FUD against GTK+: > >a) GTK is quite snappy on the neo1973 (GTA01) thus the problem >is not GTK but the limited memory bandwith on the >Freerunner/GTA02 due to the glamo chip. > Why is this so (lesser memory bandwidth due to the glamo chip)? b) the neod eats up to 60% CPU on the Freerunner (GTA02) because >it opens all /dev/input/event* and thus it opens the >accelerometers and get 200 interrupts per second - for >absolutely nothing. > >But it massively slows down OM2007.2. > I am assuming neod is the "event" handler. So does it do polling or waiting for events? (Ok, I guess I should prolly start looking at the code :-) ) And unless I am mistaken, isnt this a whole another thread in the mailing list? I mean, high cpu-usage of neod? ___ devel mailing list devel@lists.openmoko.org https://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/devel
Re: Painless SDK installation
Came across this - http://andreasdalsgaard.blogspot.com/2008/07/openmoko-development-in-5-minutes.html(this is also linked from the 'Toolchain' page in wiki. On Fri, Jul 25, 2008 at 1:53 PM, sparky mat <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > I was wondering if anyone's working on the "painless SDK installation" from > the Wishlist on the wiki. If so, I am interested in helping out with it. > ___ devel mailing list devel@lists.openmoko.org https://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/devel
Re: Painless SDK installation
I would love to do that. Let me know. I haven't started development yet, so really looking forward to this :-) On Tue, Jul 29, 2008 at 9:03 AM, Julian Chu <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > On Fri, Jul 25, 2008 at 01:53:55PM +0530, sparky mat wrote: > > I was wondering if anyone's working on the "painless SDK installation" > from > > the Wishlist on the wiki. If so, I am interested in helping out with it. > > > ___ > > devel mailing list > > devel@lists.openmoko.org > > https://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/devel > > Hi Sparky, > > I am working on the meta toolchain. > > The most change of new toolchain is that it doesn't include most > libraries. > > It downloads the librares what you need. It means if Openmoko build > some packages, you don't have to build it again. > > I am integrating my works. After I finish that, maybe you could help > me to do some test. :-) > > Thank you, > > -Ju1ian > > ___ devel mailing list devel@lists.openmoko.org https://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/devel
Re: x in om2007.2
On Tue, Jul 29, 2008 at 2:42 PM, Tilman Baumann <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > sparky mat wrote: > > kinda new here. i noticed that om2007.2 and asu are slower than qtopia > > (the one from trolltech, not the x11 port). i presume its partly > > because X is being used. > > > > would it make sense to alter gtk+ for om2007.2 to directly write to > > screen? and prolly add some window management i guess.. or make X a > > lot lighter.. are we using X.org or X11. what about TinyX? > > Not so easy. Many processes one framebuffer. Who writes the framebuffer?? > possible solution: one virtual framebuffer for each app. But then there > is that ugly layer thing again. And this layer would do much the same as > x does now... > > There where many attempts made to solve this. Qtopia is the only one > that is at least still relevant today. > > X as a screen multiplexer is not too bad. Why bother? > I gathered from this thread that its GTK+ that could use some optimizations? Esp. image caching? ___ devel mailing list devel@lists.openmoko.org https://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/devel
Re: x in om2007.2
I understand there's a "bug" in neod which causes cpu usage to shoot up (well, not exactly a bug.. the accelerometers spew out too much data? 200 times per second? ) .. possibly, we could start there? On Tue, Jul 29, 2008 at 4:00 PM, Tilman Baumann <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > sparky mat wrote: > >> >> On Tue, Jul 29, 2008 at 2:42 PM, Tilman Baumann <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> [EMAIL PROTECTED]>> wrote: >>X as a screen multiplexer is not too bad. Why bother? >> >> >> I gathered from this thread that its GTK+ that could use some >> optimizations? Esp. image caching? >> > > Yea, there seems to be room for optimisation. EFL does it supposedly > better. > The x11 protocol has some ugly pitfalls. > > But i don't think render performance makes such a big difference. Startup > time and overall performance seems more important to me. > > I think before we optimize render performance by throwing X away, we have > plenty of opportunities to make big improvements somewhere else with bigger > impact and lesser drawback. > > > -- > Drucken Sie diese Mail bitte nur auf Recyclingpapier aus. > Please print this mail only on recycled paper. > ___ devel mailing list devel@lists.openmoko.org https://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/devel
Re: Painless SDK installation
Don't mean to sound nagging but could you tell me an approximate ETA for the meta toolchain? On Tue, Jul 29, 2008 at 9:03 AM, Julian Chu <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > On Fri, Jul 25, 2008 at 01:53:55PM +0530, sparky mat wrote: > > I was wondering if anyone's working on the "painless SDK installation" > from > > the Wishlist on the wiki. If so, I am interested in helping out with it. > > > ___ > > devel mailing list > > devel@lists.openmoko.org > > https://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/devel > > Hi Sparky, > > I am working on the meta toolchain. > > The most change of new toolchain is that it doesn't include most > libraries. > > It downloads the librares what you need. It means if Openmoko build > some packages, you don't have to build it again. > > I am integrating my works. After I finish that, maybe you could help > me to do some test. :-) > > Thank you, > > -Ju1ian > > ___ devel mailing list devel@lists.openmoko.org https://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/devel
Simple Makefile
I set up the toolchain as per the instructions on the wiki and was able to build and package the sample project as per the tutorial. My problem is that I am not very comfortable with the 'autoconf' way of doing things. I usually prefer a simple Makefile / Scons file. I am assuming I can make do with a simple Makefile right? It's not like the target hardware/platform is changing a lot for an Openmoko project. Possibly I can have different targets for ARMv4T build and x86 build. So I needed some help with this: I could see the usually libraries - libc, libdl, libcrypt, libgcc, libpthread .. etc. in /usr/local/openmoko/arm/arm-angstrom-linux-gnueabi/lib . What about the windowing toolkit libraries - GTK+, Qt - libraries? What about X libraries? How do I get more libraries (that have been ported)? Also, I would appreciate any tutorial on how to package into the opkg format. ___ devel mailing list devel@lists.openmoko.org https://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/devel
Re: Simple Makefile
Anyone? On Sun, Aug 3, 2008 at 9:20 AM, sparky mat <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > I set up the toolchain as per the instructions on the wiki and was able to > build and package the sample project as per the tutorial. > > My problem is that I am not very comfortable with the 'autoconf' way of > doing things. I usually prefer a simple Makefile / Scons file. > > I am assuming I can make do with a simple Makefile right? It's not like the > target hardware/platform is changing a lot for an Openmoko project. Possibly > I can have different targets for ARMv4T build and x86 build. So I needed > some help with this: > > I could see the usually libraries - libc, libdl, libcrypt, libgcc, > libpthread .. etc. in /usr/local/openmoko/arm/arm-angstrom-linux-gnueabi/lib > . What about the windowing toolkit libraries - GTK+, Qt - libraries? What > about X libraries? How do I get more libraries (that have been ported)? > > Also, I would appreciate any tutorial on how to package into the opkg > format. > > > > > > > > ___ devel mailing list devel@lists.openmoko.org https://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/devel
Re: Simple Makefile
On Mon, Aug 4, 2008 at 1:14 PM, Roland Schatz <[EMAIL PROTECTED] > wrote: > Hello > > I set up the toolchain as per the instructions on the wiki and was > > able to build and package the sample project as per the tutorial. > > > > My problem is that I am not very comfortable with the 'autoconf' way > > of doing things. I usually prefer a simple Makefile / Scons file. > No problem, just replace all occurances of gcc with > arm-angstrom-gneabi-gcc (same for g++, ld, strip, ...). > > Personally I use a combination of autoconf and hand-written makefiles > (no automake), but I see no problem doing the same thing without autoconf. > What I do is just setting a HOST variable in the makefile, and then > compile using $(HOST)-gcc, and putting all target files into the > bin.$(HOST) directory. > > I am assuming I can make do with a simple Makefile right? It's not > > like the target hardware/platform is changing a lot for an Openmoko > > project. Possibly I can have different targets for ARMv4T build and > > x86 build. So I needed some help with this: > > > > I could see the usually libraries - libc, libdl, libcrypt, libgcc, > > libpthread .. etc. in > > /usr/local/openmoko/arm/arm-angstrom-linux-gnueabi/lib . What about > > the windowing toolkit libraries - GTK+, Qt - libraries? What about X > > libraries? How do I get more libraries (that have been ported)? > Most libraries are in > /usr/local/openmoko/arm/arm-angstrom-linux-gnueabi/usr/lib. If some are > missing, you can just install them on the host using "./configure > --prefix=/usr/local/openmoko/arm/arm-angstrom-linux-gnueabi/usr > --host=arm-angstrom-linux-gnueabi; make; make install". > > Yay!! 'Hello World' working on my phone!! Yip... feel so awesome!! ___ devel mailing list devel@lists.openmoko.org https://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/devel
Re: Simple Makefile
I had a follow-up query. Please take a look at my (simple) Makefile attached. I am trying to figure out how to organize my files into the following structure: inc/ src/ build/ build/armv4t/ (which will contain an 'obj' folder and the final binary) build/x86/ ( - do - ) How do I alter the '%.o: %.c' directive so that it picks up the .c from src/ and drops the .o into build//obj/ , and link the objs into the final executable at build// ? On Tue, Aug 5, 2008 at 8:41 AM, sparky mat <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > On Mon, Aug 4, 2008 at 1:14 PM, Roland Schatz < > [EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > >> Hello >> > I set up the toolchain as per the instructions on the wiki and was >> > able to build and package the sample project as per the tutorial. >> > >> > My problem is that I am not very comfortable with the 'autoconf' way >> > of doing things. I usually prefer a simple Makefile / Scons file. >> No problem, just replace all occurances of gcc with >> arm-angstrom-gneabi-gcc (same for g++, ld, strip, ...). >> >> Personally I use a combination of autoconf and hand-written makefiles >> (no automake), but I see no problem doing the same thing without autoconf. >> What I do is just setting a HOST variable in the makefile, and then >> compile using $(HOST)-gcc, and putting all target files into the >> bin.$(HOST) directory. >> > I am assuming I can make do with a simple Makefile right? It's not >> > like the target hardware/platform is changing a lot for an Openmoko >> > project. Possibly I can have different targets for ARMv4T build and >> > x86 build. So I needed some help with this: >> > >> > I could see the usually libraries - libc, libdl, libcrypt, libgcc, >> > libpthread .. etc. in >> > /usr/local/openmoko/arm/arm-angstrom-linux-gnueabi/lib . What about >> > the windowing toolkit libraries - GTK+, Qt - libraries? What about X >> > libraries? How do I get more libraries (that have been ported)? >> Most libraries are in >> /usr/local/openmoko/arm/arm-angstrom-linux-gnueabi/usr/lib. If some are >> missing, you can just install them on the host using "./configure >> --prefix=/usr/local/openmoko/arm/arm-angstrom-linux-gnueabi/usr >> --host=arm-angstrom-linux-gnueabi; make; make install". >> >> > Yay!! 'Hello World' working on my phone!! Yip... feel so awesome!! > ___ devel mailing list devel@lists.openmoko.org https://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/devel
Jalimo apps
I was wondering how many apps were available based on the Jalimo JVM. The JVM seems to be pretty fast, along with SWT (with GTK backend). I would have thought this would prompt many applications popping up. ___ devel mailing list devel@lists.openmoko.org https://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/devel
Toolchain - GTK+ libraries?
I have installed the GTA02 toolchain as mentioned in the wiki (from http://downloads.openmoko.org/toolchains/) However, I find only some libraries in /usr/local/openmoko/arm/arm-angstrom-linux-gnueabi/lib . What about the GTK+ libraries (and its dependencies)? How do I start GTK+ (or Qt for that matter) development using the toolchain? ___ devel mailing list devel@lists.openmoko.org https://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/devel
Re: Simple Makefile
I managed to compile and execute the tutorial GTK+ application (at http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Building_a_hello_world_application#GDK_the_Wrong_.2F_Easy_Way) using the attached Makefile. On Tue, Aug 5, 2008 at 11:08 PM, sparky mat <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > I had a follow-up query. Please take a look at my (simple) Makefile > attached. I am trying to figure out how to organize my files into the > following structure: > > inc/ > src/ > build/ > build/armv4t/ (which will contain an 'obj' folder and the final binary) > build/x86/ ( - do - ) > > How do I alter the '%.o: %.c' directive so that it picks up the .c from > src/ and drops the .o into build//obj/ , and link the objs into the > final executable at build// ? > > On Tue, Aug 5, 2008 at 8:41 AM, sparky mat <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > >> On Mon, Aug 4, 2008 at 1:14 PM, Roland Schatz < >> [EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: >> >>> Hello >>> > I set up the toolchain as per the instructions on the wiki and was >>> > able to build and package the sample project as per the tutorial. >>> > >>> > My problem is that I am not very comfortable with the 'autoconf' way >>> > of doing things. I usually prefer a simple Makefile / Scons file. >>> No problem, just replace all occurances of gcc with >>> arm-angstrom-gneabi-gcc (same for g++, ld, strip, ...). >>> >>> Personally I use a combination of autoconf and hand-written makefiles >>> (no automake), but I see no problem doing the same thing without >>> autoconf. >>> What I do is just setting a HOST variable in the makefile, and then >>> compile using $(HOST)-gcc, and putting all target files into the >>> bin.$(HOST) directory. >>> > I am assuming I can make do with a simple Makefile right? It's not >>> > like the target hardware/platform is changing a lot for an Openmoko >>> > project. Possibly I can have different targets for ARMv4T build and >>> > x86 build. So I needed some help with this: >>> > >>> > I could see the usually libraries - libc, libdl, libcrypt, libgcc, >>> > libpthread .. etc. in >>> > /usr/local/openmoko/arm/arm-angstrom-linux-gnueabi/lib . What about >>> > the windowing toolkit libraries - GTK+, Qt - libraries? What about X >>> > libraries? How do I get more libraries (that have been ported)? >>> Most libraries are in >>> /usr/local/openmoko/arm/arm-angstrom-linux-gnueabi/usr/lib. If some are >>> missing, you can just install them on the host using "./configure >>> --prefix=/usr/local/openmoko/arm/arm-angstrom-linux-gnueabi/usr >>> --host=arm-angstrom-linux-gnueabi; make; make install". >>> >>> >> Yay!! 'Hello World' working on my phone!! Yip... feel so awesome!! >> > > Makefile Description: Binary data ___ devel mailing list devel@lists.openmoko.org https://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/devel
Feedback on OM2008.8
I know its still 2 days away from release, but I figured I'd give some feedback on the current state (06-August-2008 image). 1) Awesome job!! OM2008.8 is making really good progress and the new image had me all in smiles :-) . Keep up the good work!!! (My impressions were a lot less enthusiastic last week) 2) Application launch is a tad slow. It takes 5-10 seconds for an application to launch. 3) The overall look and feel is good and has improved a lot. The icons still need some work IMHO. 4) Power button doesn't do anything except power down on 4+ seconds of holding down. In OM2007.2, long-press of the power button gave many options including locking the display, changing power management and shutting down. Short-press closed the application. It doesn't make sense removing all this functionality. At the least, long press could have locked the screen. 5) Wallpaper looks decent, but I would like to put in my own wallpapers. Can someone point me to where/how I can alter the theme settings? (I read something abt Edje files in the wiki) So far so good except for a few quirks that I have listed above. Again, I would like to saw 'good work'!! It's awesome watching the team make such rapid progress. Will continue exploring and updating with more feedback. ___ devel mailing list devel@lists.openmoko.org https://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/devel
Re: Feedback on OM2008.8
On Thu, Aug 7, 2008 at 6:07 AM, The Rasterman Carsten Haitzler < [EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > they should be nice little images now (not the original app icons that come > with qtopia etc.) > Should I try a newer image? I am using Aug-06-2008 nightly build. > press power suspends immediately. hold for 2 seconds starts shutdown. > options > could be done as the power button is just a key binding to run something or > do > an action, but this is not the case in asu. it's simple. Ok. Will try again. Not sure why suspend doesn't work. It worked with last week's images. Again, will try a fresher one. > what wallpaper? well technically you get the theme default.. and its.. > black. Oh... I got a picture (of a flower) as wallpaper, and no, I didn't set it myself. It was there by default. Thanks for the update. Looking forward to the relase. ___ devel mailing list devel@lists.openmoko.org https://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/devel
Re: Feedback on OM2008.8
> > well u are NOT using what is actually ASU - you are using someones > forked/changed version.. definitely not is what is being worked on by OM. > it > should be very black. > Wierd. I flashed the image available @ http://buildhost.openmoko.org/daily/freerunner/200808/20080806/ Will try again with today's image. ___ devel mailing list devel@lists.openmoko.org https://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/devel
Re: Feedback on OM2008.8
> > Even I can confirm that I see a picture of a flower as wallpaper. I've > flashed > today with 20080807 rootfs from > > openmoko-openmoko-qtopia-x11-image-glibc-ipk--20080807-om-gta02.rootfs.jffs2 > If at all we are putting a wallpaper, it should be an Openmoko logo :-) . just my $0.02 ___ devel mailing list devel@lists.openmoko.org https://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/devel
Re: Feedback on OM2008.8
> > whatever you are seeing is not ASU - not what OM is developing it is some > derivation that is different. i can tell you that simply by the fact you > have > a wallpaper and not a black bg with grey/white text. :) i have no idea what > your source of "the good stuff" is... but your dealer is definitely > supplying > your with non-factory-direct merchandise! :) > :-) and the source would be - http://buildhost.openmoko.org/daily/freerunner/ ___ devel mailing list devel@lists.openmoko.org https://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/devel
Re: Feedback on OM2008.8
> > That image is not ASU, nor will it ever be. > > I havent even merged the latest changes in. > I had flashed : openmoko-openmoko-qtopia-x11-image-glibc-ipk--20080806-om-gta02.rootfs.jffs2 In another thread I read it need to flash : openmoko-qtopia-x11-image-om-gta02.jffs2 So is the latter one ASU? or the former? ___ devel mailing list devel@lists.openmoko.org https://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/devel
Opkg Tutorial?
I have compiled Ruby 1.9 on the phone (since the compilation involves building a miniruby first, and using that to build the rest). Using --prefix for configure, I can obtain all the files in a seperate folder. Now, how do I package these into an opkg file (.ipk/opk) ? I have a list of files (with paths where they belong to). ___ devel mailing list devel@lists.openmoko.org https://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/devel
