Re: [Development] Do we need version tags in released src packages?
Hi, >I'm afraid it won't work. There will be a number of users downloading >the wrong tarball. Also having the tag in the tarball means you can >still know what it is in your downloads folder, where you already lost >the version. As Jani mentioned in the original mail the idea was to simplify that part of the packaging but given the reasoning in this thread I don't see we should remove it from the tarballs. (e.g. instead we could read the module version tag from the CI integration's .git repo + ref (.cmake.cache) instead of a separate configuration file in packaging) br, Iikka Eklund From: Development on behalf of Lisandro Damián Nicanor Pérez Meyer Sent: Sunday, August 15, 2021 2:06 AM To: development@qt-project.org Subject: Re: [Development] Do we need version tags in released src packages? On Fri, 13 Aug 2021 at 04:20, Jani Heikkinen wrote: > > Hi! > > We are planning to simplify our packaging and releasing scripts and one thing > which would simplify our scripts is removal of version tag parsing for src > (and example) packages. So the question is if we can remove version tag > (-alpha, -beta1 etc) from our src and exmple packages? > > In my opinion we don't need those; packages are always released in proper > release folder (like > https://download.qt.io/development_releases/qt/6.2/6.2.0-beta2/) and so on it > should be quite obvious in which pre-release packages belongs to. Official > release are already without any version tag so removing those from > development releases shouldn't matter either. But does someone disagree and > if yes why? I'm afraid it won't work. There will be a number of users downloading the wrong tarball. Also having the tag in the tarball means you can still know what it is in your downloads folder, where you already lost the version. ___ Development mailing list Development@qt-project.org https://lists.qt-project.org/listinfo/development ___ Development mailing list Development@qt-project.org https://lists.qt-project.org/listinfo/development
Re: [Development] Do we need version tags in released src packages?
On Fri, 13 Aug 2021 at 04:20, Jani Heikkinen wrote: > > Hi! > > We are planning to simplify our packaging and releasing scripts and one thing > which would simplify our scripts is removal of version tag parsing for src > (and example) packages. So the question is if we can remove version tag > (-alpha, -beta1 etc) from our src and exmple packages? > > In my opinion we don't need those; packages are always released in proper > release folder (like > https://download.qt.io/development_releases/qt/6.2/6.2.0-beta2/) and so on it > should be quite obvious in which pre-release packages belongs to. Official > release are already without any version tag so removing those from > development releases shouldn't matter either. But does someone disagree and > if yes why? I'm afraid it won't work. There will be a number of users downloading the wrong tarball. Also having the tag in the tarball means you can still know what it is in your downloads folder, where you already lost the version. ___ Development mailing list Development@qt-project.org https://lists.qt-project.org/listinfo/development
Re: [Development] Do we need version tags in released src packages?
On 13 Aug 2021, at 13:39, Albert Astals Cid via Development mailto:development@qt-project.org>> wrote: It seems a bad idea to have files with the same name and the different contents. It can lead to all kind of confusion in which you download something, then "download the same file" 5 days later and it has a different shasum and you wonder if the mirror you downloaded something was hacked or if your computer is hacked or what happened. My thoughts exactly; it’s like when you download a bank statement from the bank website and it’s called something generic like document.pdf or kontoutskrift.pdf. I always wonder why the site doesn’t create the filename on-the-fly in a way that contains the year and month, at least, because why would I download it if not to save it, at least for a while? Unique files should have unique and meaningful filenames IMO, because nobody is reproducing the directory name when they download it, and proper metadata has always been MIA too. It could be different if all files had resource forks and ls would show you that information, but that’s only in some parallel universe. ___ Development mailing list Development@qt-project.org https://lists.qt-project.org/listinfo/development
Re: [Development] Do we need version tags in released src packages?
On Fri, Aug 13, 2021 at 07:17:16AM +, Jani Heikkinen wrote: > Hi! > > We are planning to simplify our packaging and releasing scripts and one thing > which > would simplify our scripts is removal of version tag parsing for src (and > example) > packages. So the question is if we can remove version tag (-alpha, -beta1 > etc) from > our src and exmple packages? This would effectively separate potentially interesting metainformation from actual contents, so I guess this boils down to the question of who uses the source packages for what purpose. The problem I can imagime that people actively using the source packages (who would as long as one can the same contents _plus_ history from git? - but there are apparently such users?) will end up with qt-everywhere.tar.xz in their ~/Downloads and have no real idea what this contains exactly after a few weeks time. Does it really have an impact on the complexity of the scripts whether the -beta1 decoration is on the file name or on the directory name or both? Andre' ___ Development mailing list Development@qt-project.org https://lists.qt-project.org/listinfo/development
Re: [Development] Do we need version tags in released src packages?
Il 13/08/21 09:17, Jani Heikkinen ha scritto: In my opinion we don't need those; packages are always released in proper release folder (likehttps://download.qt.io/development_releases/qt/6.2/6.2.0-beta2/) and so on it should be quite obvious in which pre-release packages belongs to. Official release are already without any version tag so removing those from development releases shouldn't matter either. But does someone disagree and if yes why? What are the advantages of such an approach? If you're preparing N files in a version-release/ directory, is it a "problem" that the files are also called version-release.whatever...? I can see many disadvantages, including having N files with identical names but very different content (alpha, beta, rc, final), which could become super-confusing (incl. the already mentioned security concerns, say when checking the files' hashes). Thanks, -- Giuseppe D'Angelo | giuseppe.dang...@kdab.com | Senior Software Engineer KDAB (France) S.A.S., a KDAB Group company Tel. France +33 (0)4 90 84 08 53, http://www.kdab.com KDAB - The Qt, C++ and OpenGL Experts smime.p7s Description: Firma crittografica S/MIME ___ Development mailing list Development@qt-project.org https://lists.qt-project.org/listinfo/development
Re: [Development] Do we need version tags in released src packages?
El divendres, 13 d’agost de 2021, a les 11:06:07 (CEST), Jani Heikkinen va escriure: > Hi, > > > -Original Message- > > From: Edward Welbourne > > Sent: perjantai 13. elokuuta 2021 10.43 > > To: Jani Heikkinen > > Cc: Albert Astals Cid ; development@qt- > > project.org > > Subject: Re: [Development] Do we need version tags in released src > > packages? > > > > El divendres, 13 d’agost de 2021, a les 9:17:16 (CEST), Jani Heikkinen va > > > > escriure: > > >> We are planning to simplify our packaging and releasing scripts and > > >> one thing which would simplify our scripts is removal of version tag > > >> parsing for src (and example) packages. So the question is if we can > > >> remove version tag (-alpha, -beta1 etc) from our src and exmple > > > > packages? > > > > Albert Astals Cid (13 August 2021 09:26) replied: > > > Does this mean that alpha/beta packages would have exactly the same > > > filename as the final packages? > > That was my proposal It seems a bad idea to have files with the same name and the different contents. It can lead to all kind of confusion in which you download something, then "download the same file" 5 days later and it has a different shasum and you wonder if the mirror you downloaded something was hacked or if your computer is hacked or what happened. Sure you can argue that the file is in a different parent folder, but for a link like https://download.qt.io/official_releases/qt/6.1/6.1.2/submodules/qtcharts-everywhere-src-6.1.2.tar.xz can you sincerely tell me you look at the full URL? I will look at the domain name to see it is not super fishy and at the filename, the internet has told us that the rest is just "internal storage" decisions by the people serving the file. Cheers, Albert > > > and, more generally, what would the practical consequences of your > > proposed change be ? What would Qt-users (or indeed anyone aside from > > our packaging team) see changed ? > > > > Eddy. > > Only release packages would change; no changes to files in git > > * Standalone src packages in > https://download.qt.io/development_releases/qt/6.3/6.3.0-beta1/single/ > would be qt-everywhere-src-6.3.0.zip instead of > qt-everywhere-src-6.3.0-beta1.zip. And main folder in the archive wouldn't > contain 'beta1' either > > * Submodule specific src packages in > https://download.qt.io/development_releases/qt/6.3/6.3.0-beta1/submodules/ > would be qt-everywhere-src-6.3.0.zip instead of > qt-everywhere-src-6.3.0-beta1.zip. And main folder in the > archive wouldn't contain 'beta1' either > > There is no effect to installation done by online installer; in the > installation there isn't version tag shown at all currently either. > > br, > Jani -- Albert Astals Cid | albert.astals@kdab.com | Senior Software Engineer Klarälvdalens Datakonsult AB, a KDAB Group company Tel: Sweden (HQ) +46-563-540090, USA +1-866-777-KDAB(5322) KDAB - The Qt, C++ and OpenGL Experts ___ Development mailing list Development@qt-project.org https://lists.qt-project.org/listinfo/development
Re: [Development] Do we need version tags in released src packages?
El divendres, 13 d’agost de 2021, a les 9:17:16 (CEST), Jani Heikkinen va escriure: We are planning to simplify our packaging and releasing scripts and one thing which would simplify our scripts is removal of version tag parsing for src (and example) packages. So the question is if we can remove version tag (-alpha, -beta1 etc) from our src and exmple packages? Albert Astals Cid (13 August 2021 09:26) replied: >>> Does this mean that alpha/beta packages would have exactly the same >>> filename as the final packages? Jani Heikkinen (13 August 2021 11:06) replied: > That was my proposal I had asked: >> and, more generally, what would the practical consequences of your >> proposed change be ? What would Qt-users (or indeed anyone aside from >> our packaging team) see changed ? > Only release packages would change; no changes to files in git > > * Standalone src packages in > https://download.qt.io/development_releases/qt/6.3/6.3.0-beta1/single/ > would be qt-everywhere-src-6.3.0.zip instead of > qt-everywhere-src-6.3.0-beta1.zip. And main folder in the archive > wouldn't contain 'beta1' either > > * Submodule specific src packages in > https://download.qt.io/development_releases/qt/6.3/6.3.0-beta1/submodules/ > would be qt-everywhere-src-6.3.0.zip instead of > qt-everywhere-src-6.3.0-beta1.zip. And main folder in the > archive wouldn't contain 'beta1' either > > There is no effect to installation done by online installer; in the > installation there isn't version tag shown at all currently either. So only leaf file-names change, the directories they're found in retain their release-process tags. The only problem I can see is that someone who downloads the leaf file to a local place and comes back a few weeks later to look at it won't know where in the release process it came out, so might not know which beta to report a bug against, or might need to download the same file a second time just because they can't remember which release-tag they already had. Not deal-breakers, I guess. They might also mistakenly think what they've got is a final release, if only because they're used to all but that having a release tag in them, which might be a more serious issue. Eddy. ___ Development mailing list Development@qt-project.org https://lists.qt-project.org/listinfo/development
Re: [Development] Do we need version tags in released src packages?
Hi, > -Original Message- > From: Edward Welbourne > Sent: perjantai 13. elokuuta 2021 10.43 > To: Jani Heikkinen > Cc: Albert Astals Cid ; development@qt- > project.org > Subject: Re: [Development] Do we need version tags in released src > packages? > > El divendres, 13 d’agost de 2021, a les 9:17:16 (CEST), Jani Heikkinen va > escriure: > >> We are planning to simplify our packaging and releasing scripts and > >> one thing which would simplify our scripts is removal of version tag > >> parsing for src (and example) packages. So the question is if we can > >> remove version tag (-alpha, -beta1 etc) from our src and exmple > packages? > > Albert Astals Cid (13 August 2021 09:26) replied: > > Does this mean that alpha/beta packages would have exactly the same > > filename as the final packages? That was my proposal > > and, more generally, what would the practical consequences of your > proposed change be ? What would Qt-users (or indeed anyone aside from > our packaging team) see changed ? > > Eddy. Only release packages would change; no changes to files in git * Standalone src packages in https://download.qt.io/development_releases/qt/6.3/6.3.0-beta1/single/ would be qt-everywhere-src-6.3.0.zip instead of qt-everywhere-src-6.3.0-beta1.zip. And main folder in the archive wouldn't contain 'beta1' either * Submodule specific src packages in https://download.qt.io/development_releases/qt/6.3/6.3.0-beta1/submodules/ would be qt-everywhere-src-6.3.0.zip instead of qt-everywhere-src-6.3.0-beta1.zip. And main folder in the archive wouldn't contain 'beta1' either There is no effect to installation done by online installer; in the installation there isn't version tag shown at all currently either. br, Jani ___ Development mailing list Development@qt-project.org https://lists.qt-project.org/listinfo/development
Re: [Development] Do we need version tags in released src packages?
El divendres, 13 d’agost de 2021, a les 9:17:16 (CEST), Jani Heikkinen va escriure: >> We are planning to simplify our packaging and releasing scripts and one >> thing which would simplify our scripts is removal of version tag parsing >> for src (and example) packages. So the question is if we can remove version >> tag (-alpha, -beta1 etc) from our src and exmple packages? Albert Astals Cid (13 August 2021 09:26) replied: > Does this mean that alpha/beta packages would have exactly the same filename > as > the final packages? and, more generally, what would the practical consequences of your proposed change be ? What would Qt-users (or indeed anyone aside from our packaging team) see changed ? Eddy. ___ Development mailing list Development@qt-project.org https://lists.qt-project.org/listinfo/development
Re: [Development] Do we need version tags in released src packages?
El divendres, 13 d’agost de 2021, a les 9:17:16 (CEST), Jani Heikkinen va escriure: > Hi! > > We are planning to simplify our packaging and releasing scripts and one > thing which would simplify our scripts is removal of version tag parsing > for src (and example) packages. So the question is if we can remove version > tag (-alpha, -beta1 etc) from our src and exmple packages? Does this mean that alpha/beta packages would have exactly the same filename as the final packages? Cheers, Albert > > In my opinion we don't need those; packages are always released in proper > release folder (like > https://download.qt.io/development_releases/qt/6.2/6.2.0-beta2/) and so on > it should be quite obvious in which pre-release packages belongs to. > Official release are already without any version tag so removing those from > development releases shouldn't matter either. But does someone disagree and > if yes why? > > br, > Jani Heikkinen > Release Manager > ___ > Development mailing list > Development@qt-project.org > https://lists.qt-project.org/listinfo/development -- Albert Astals Cid | albert.astals@kdab.com | Senior Software Engineer Klarälvdalens Datakonsult AB, a KDAB Group company Tel: Sweden (HQ) +46-563-540090, USA +1-866-777-KDAB(5322) KDAB - The Qt, C++ and OpenGL Experts ___ Development mailing list Development@qt-project.org https://lists.qt-project.org/listinfo/development
[Development] Do we need version tags in released src packages?
Hi! We are planning to simplify our packaging and releasing scripts and one thing which would simplify our scripts is removal of version tag parsing for src (and example) packages. So the question is if we can remove version tag (-alpha, -beta1 etc) from our src and exmple packages? In my opinion we don't need those; packages are always released in proper release folder (like https://download.qt.io/development_releases/qt/6.2/6.2.0-beta2/) and so on it should be quite obvious in which pre-release packages belongs to. Official release are already without any version tag so removing those from development releases shouldn't matter either. But does someone disagree and if yes why? br, Jani Heikkinen Release Manager ___ Development mailing list Development@qt-project.org https://lists.qt-project.org/listinfo/development
