Re: [tdf-discuss] LibOCon proposals
Hi, Andreas Mantke wrote on 2012-02-05 13:42: We can discuss that for the next round; maybe there are better solutions / proposals. My question is only, why we open up the discussion now (and not after the voting). The BoD had discussed the topic and decided about it in public. Everyone had the oportunity to bring up his arguments before the decision. I do share this. While I totally agree that there are many valid views on that topic, discussing that now, after the public BoD confcall, and the public discussion on this list, is a bit strange. It feels like the whole discussion we had done is totally senseless, since we now open the discussion again. Most of us are volunteers, and rediscussing things again and again burns a lot of time... So, my proposal would indeed be to stick what we had decided (we all, since everyone had a chance to join the discussion and the call), and discuss options for 2013, where we can change the model, of course. I meant the job for the receiver of the mails (Florian?). I won't volunteer for the job to read all of this mails, decide to give the voting rights and put the mail- writer into a list or the environment for voting. That's a really nice job and the proposal should also contain the proposal for volunteering for the job ;-) Exactly. Receiving mails, verifying they are not fraud, writing back that how those people can vote, adding them to the voting system, it is a lot of work, and I surely can't do it. And don't forget, we run out of time, people have to vote soon, so the organizers can start preparing... Florian -- Florian Effenberger Chairman of the Board at The Document Foundation Tel: +49 8341 99660880 | Mobile: +49 151 14424108 Skype: floeff | Twitter/Identi.ca: @floeff -- Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to discuss+h...@documentfoundation.org Problems? http://www.libreoffice.org/get-help/mailing-lists/how-to-unsubscribe/ Posting guidelines + more: http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Netiquette List archive: http://listarchives.documentfoundation.org/www/discuss/ All messages sent to this list will be publicly archived and cannot be deleted
Re: [tdf-discuss] LibOCon proposals
p { margin-bottom: 0.08in; }a:link { }Hi Christian,
thanks for your remarks and questionsabout the flight connections.
**
It would be nice if Zaragoza's team could elaborate more on howto
get to Zaragoza (by plane) . It should not be a huge problem,given that
it already held some
international conferences, butnevertheless there are a couple of
pitfalls:
the usual "findme a cheap flight to XY" portals and other
travel-planningportals cannot be used, as ryanair is not included in
thoseportals (probably because of their "you have to pay a extrafee
for stuff that is included with other airlines" policy),and it
doesn't use the main airports, but the lesser frequentedones, thus
you always have to commute from$big_airport/$train_station to
$ryanair_airport. That complicatesthings quite a bit. (and it doesn't
help that you cannot see aschedule on ryanair's website, and it
appears that all flights arenot available - there are available seats
in march, but when yougo to the future, all you get is the "not
available icon".(Oct/Nov is out of the schedule already, so no hits
at all,probably also making people believe there is no connection)...
1. Regarding the flight connections,Zaragoza airport is currently under
negotiations with Ryanair toreadapt its schedule for the Summer period
(March 30thonwards) and for the rest of their agreement (I guess it
lasts until2014 or 2015). Last October, Ryanair stopped flying to
Alicante andMalaga (altough to Malaga it should restart on April), and
this is atypical example of the trading between Ryanair and many
airports(Ryanair asks for XX+1 and the airport says XX-1). That is why,
lastJanuary, Ryanair stopped selling tckets for the summer season
untilnegotiations come to an end, in order to put extra pressure on
theactivities. Probably they will discontinue some Spanish flights tothe
Canary Islands such as Tenerife, Las Palmas, and maybe Seville
orBologna. What is sure is that flights to the main EU capitals will
bepursued, since they are strategical for the authorities:
LondonStansted, Milan Orio al Serio, Brussels Charleroi, Paris
Beauvais(yes, not CDG), Rome Ciampino, etc.
However, we should be able to know theexact agreement in a few days, as
it has been stated in the localpress (first part of February), and then
flights should be on saleagain (they were on sale from November till
Christmas before Ryanairblocked the sales).
***
After being contacted, I also tried tofind a way from Munich to
Zaragoza, so let me describe theproblems by example. Feel free to
stop reading here, or jump tothe next ##
Tried the various portals asoutlined above, for example swoodoo,
expedia and a couple ofothers - none of them could find a connection
from Munich toZaragoza, and not even from Paris to Zaragoza (I knew
from theproposal that ryanair serves this route (again not Paris CDG,
butBeauvais, 80-90km outside Paris). Thus no direct way, and even
ifthere was a route from MUC to Paris, I would have to commute
betweenairports, so went to ryanair website and
looked for flights -problem see above. No schedule (or I'm too dumb
to find it), andthe booking system to check for flights basically is
useless, asunless you look in the next months, you won't get any
results.(and it uses captcha, that you have to keep filling out after
Xrequests). On the plus side, the flights really are quite cheap,
evenif you add the additional fees for your luggage and not paying
withryanair's own payment-card/system. (You can get it starting at
about60 € (with one piece of luggage with max. 15kg)).
So nextstep - get to Paris - that's an easy one and surprisingly
cheap aswell - Deutsche Bahn has "Europa Spezial" tickets thatcost
39€ from Munich to Paris (with TGV a little more than 6hours) - but
you can book that 92 days in advance only andavailability is
limited... On thSo I need to connect the two - Iknow French & English, so that
was no
real problem for me, butit took quite some time nevertheless, as the
private shuttleservices did a good job with google... Unless you're
traveling ina large group, you pay more than 100€ one way. (if you
startlooking for info at the correct places, you'll have that info
muchquicker of course).
Here only the short version:
* Beauvaisairport has a shuttle service to the city, but not to any
of theother airports, and not to any of the main stations, but to a
ratherrandom metro station (at least to me it is random to me -Porte
Maillot) it's 15€ per trip, about 90 minutes but dependingon traffic
conditions)
* Porte Maillot and Gare de l'estrequires changing trains once (at
Palais Royal/Louvre) and metrois cheap (1,70€ per trip, around 30
minutes)
So in theory Igot a connection, but it took quite a while to figure
itout...
#
so essence of the above:
*you won't find ryanair f
Re: [tdf-discuss] LibOCon proposals
On 05/02/2012 Florian Effenberger wrote: Jesús Corrius wrote on 2012-02-03 14:08: We had a huge problem in the OpenOffice.org Conference 2007 in Barcelona as more than 1000 people registered for the conference and at the end there were no more than 250 people appeared. ... We should have a registration that e.g. charges 5 € or 10 € and includes a t-shirt with it. We had that for e.g. Orvieto Yes, the idea behind the nominal participation fee in Orvieto (at the OOoCon, actually) was to limit fake registrations. While we were rather flexible about it (in some cases transferring money would have cost more than this symbolic fee), it helped in having accurate participants figures. But I wouldn't mix the two problems, i.e., avoiding that people register for a conference and then, without notice, don't show up and avoiding that random people have a say in deciding where the conference is held. Regards, Andrea. -- Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to discuss+h...@documentfoundation.org Problems? http://www.libreoffice.org/get-help/mailing-lists/how-to-unsubscribe/ Posting guidelines + more: http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Netiquette List archive: http://listarchives.documentfoundation.org/www/discuss/ All messages sent to this list will be publicly archived and cannot be deleted
Re: [tdf-discuss] LibOCon proposals
Hi Christian, *, Am Samstag, 4. Februar 2012, 15:28:07 schrieb Christian Lohmaier: > Hi Andreas, *, > > On Fri, Feb 3, 2012 at 4:54 PM, Andreas Mantke wrote: (...) > > We had a public discussion and decision of the BoD already. If there are > > no unknown facts or new arguments, we should not discuss and decide > > again (and again). > > I admit that I didn't follow the meeting, did not read the minutes, > but what Jesús did propose would make a nice compromise, wouldn't it > (not suggesting that it should be used for this year's voting, but to > consider for the next round) > We can discuss that for the next round; maybe there are better solutions / proposals. My question is only, why we open up the discussion now (and not after the voting). The BoD had discussed the topic and decided about it in public. Everyone had the oportunity to bring up his arguments before the decision. (...) > > Point 2 would be a nice job ;-( > > Maybe we will also hear some complaints, if someone missed to send a mail > > in time. > > ?? > I absolutely don't get your point. You are saying that writing a mail > is too much work, and that not writing a mail to be invited is a > problem? Reaily, you didn't got it. I meant the job for the receiver of the mails (Florian?). I won't volunteer for the job to read all of this mails, decide to give the voting rights and put the mail- writer into a list or the environment for voting. That's a really nice job and the proposal should also contain the proposal for volunteering for the job ;-) > Those non-TDF-members are not allowed to vote now, so how is opening a > door for them too much of a problem? > > But maybe I completely misunderstood and you're talking about the > opposite side, the group of people that are needed to process those > manual requests (i.e. create a voting token and send out the > corresponding link) > > > I think we should invite every contributor to apply for a membership > > status and then he / she could vote for the venue of the conferences > > 2013 and later. It would be good to increase our member base. > > But a rather bad reason. If you register just to be able to vote, then > your commitment to the project is questionable, and thus the entire > membership status is questioned. (remember that becoming a member > requires past contributions (in whatever form) and the moral > commitment to continue contributing in a similar fashion). "I want to > vote for the location of the next conference" is not enough in my > opinion. > Right. But if you want to vote only for the location of the next LibreOffice conference, where you will not attend, because your commitment is not longer than the day you write your mail or maybe the end of the voting, why should you get any voting rights? > (But don't get me wrong, sending messages to known contributors who > did not yet apply for membership is of course fine, but not if the > reason behind is "otherwise you won't be able to vote for the > LO-conference) It should be a conference, organized from the LibreOffice community for the community and we set rules that support this goal. But we should discuss the topic after this voting and in front of the next voting. We had to start the current voting very soon, thus the organizers for 2012 have enough time to prepare the conference. Regards, Andreas -- ## Developer LibreOffice ## Freie Office-Suite für Linux, Mac, Windows ## http://LibreOffice.org ## Support the Document Foundation (http://documentfoundation.org) ## Meine Seite: http://www.amantke.de -- Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to discuss+h...@documentfoundation.org Problems? http://www.libreoffice.org/get-help/mailing-lists/how-to-unsubscribe/ Posting guidelines + more: http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Netiquette List archive: http://listarchives.documentfoundation.org/www/discuss/ All messages sent to this list will be publicly archived and cannot be deleted
Re: [tdf-discuss] LibOCon proposals
Hi, just quickly from FOSDEM, more details later on. ;) Jesús Corrius wrote on 2012-02-03 14:08: We had a huge problem in the OpenOffice.org Conference 2007 in Barcelona as more than 1000 people registered for the conference and at the end there were no more than 250 people appeared. We lost a lot of money because of that and on a personal basis after more than one year of the conference I was still clearing the mess up. Yes, I am still angry ;) We should have a registration that e.g. charges 5 € or 10 € and includes a t-shirt with it. We had that for e.g. Orvieto and Budapest, and IMHO it worked quite well. 2. If you are not a member of the TDF but you also want to vote, send a message to someone (Florian maybe? :P) and you will be invited. Honestly, unless someone hires a secretary for me :) I really cannot handle this. I am already swamped with messages like insane, and handling that is just not doable in my time... sorry :/ Florian -- Florian Effenberger Chairman of the Board at The Document Foundation Tel: +49 8341 99660880 | Mobile: +49 151 14424108 Skype: floeff | Twitter/Identi.ca: @floeff -- Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to discuss+h...@documentfoundation.org Problems? http://www.libreoffice.org/get-help/mailing-lists/how-to-unsubscribe/ Posting guidelines + more: http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Netiquette List archive: http://listarchives.documentfoundation.org/www/discuss/ All messages sent to this list will be publicly archived and cannot be deleted
