Re: [tdf-discuss] On the Future of TDF
In data lunedì 15 novembre 2010 17:39:08, Mirek M. ha scritto: It would also be great if LibO, KOffice, AbiWord, Gnumeric, Ease, and all the other open-source editors worked together to set standards. It's called Open Document Format (ODF) and LibO/OOo support it. It's managed by OASIS (http://www.oasis-open.org/committees/office/) and has been accepted as an ISO standard as well. I know that ODF is a standard. I meant set other standards, such as keyboard shortcuts, default websites for content (fonts, templates, clipart, ...), symbolism, command names, default fonts (as I explained, if all the open-source projects agreed on a triad of default fonts, these fonts could easily gain the widespread usage as Times-Arial-Courier have enjoyed for years), etc. This is an interesting point of view... So, what about joining efforts to create a bigger open source office suite project? I mean, LibO, KOffice, Abiword, Gnumeric et als all together against closed and commercial products... :-) Regards, -- Valter Registered Linux User #466410 http://counter.li.org Kubuntu Linux: www.kubuntu.org OpenOffice.org: www.openoffice.org -- Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to discuss+h...@documentfoundation.org Archive: http://www.documentfoundation.org/lists/discuss/ *** All posts to this list are publicly archived for eternity ***
Re: [tdf-discuss] On the Future of TDF
On Sun, 05 Dec 2010 07:11:24 -0600, Valter Mura valterm...@gmail.com wrote: In data lunedì 15 novembre 2010 17:39:08, Mirek M. ha scritto: It would also be great if LibO, KOffice, AbiWord, Gnumeric, Ease, and all the other open-source editors worked together to set standards. It's called Open Document Format (ODF) and LibO/OOo support it. It's managed by OASIS (http://www.oasis-open.org/committees/office/) and has been accepted as an ISO standard as well. I know that ODF is a standard. I meant set other standards, such as keyboard shortcuts, default websites for content (fonts, templates, clipart, ...), symbolism, command names, default fonts (as I explained, if all the open-source projects agreed on a triad of default fonts, these fonts could easily gain the widespread usage as Times-Arial-Courier have enjoyed for years), etc. This is an interesting point of view... So, what about joining efforts to create a bigger open source office suite project? I mean, LibO, KOffice, Abiword, Gnumeric et als all together against closed and commercial products... :-) Regards, Please read 'why dont we merge gnome with kde to see if we can go against windows'. I am not sure the goal is really to go against anybody. Goal is to provide the best solution for users. Joining too projects doesn't really mean we will have twice the resources. This is not a merge and acquisition environment like HP buying compaq to go against dell. -- Alexandro Colorado OOoES A.C - http://oooes.org GPG: 68D072E6 -- Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to discuss+h...@documentfoundation.org Archive: http://www.documentfoundation.org/lists/discuss/ *** All posts to this list are publicly archived for eternity ***
Re: [tdf-discuss] On the Future of TDF
- Original Message From: AG computing.acco...@googlemail.com On 14/11/10 11:25, Mirek M. wrote: In addition, each single module of LibreOffice will be undergoing an extensive rewrite, with Calc being the first one to be redeveloped around a brand new engine - code named Ixion - that will increase performance, allow true versatility and add long awaited database and VBA macro handling features. Yep - that +does+ sound interesting. Any time-lines given for this or the other improvements? What I am interested in is what is TDF going to do to support VBA? And how are they going to get around issues like parts of the language being patented by Microsoft? There's a reason that the makers of Star Office and most everyone else do not support Visual Basic or VBA in their applications. So I'm quite curious how TDF is going to resolve that supposing they do implement it. Same goes for supporting .Net/Mono, OOXML, and the various other technologies Microsoft has there that they seem to be pledging to add - as there is a lot there that Microsoft does not relicense for use or implementation. Ben -- Unsubscribe instructions: Email to discuss+h...@documentfoundation.org Posting guidelines: http://netmeister.org/news/learn2quote.html Archive: http://www.documentfoundation.org/lists/discuss/ *** All posts to this list are publicly archived ***
Re: [tdf-discuss] On the Future of TDF
Il 14/11/2010 23.27, Thorsten Behrens ha scritto: asking for a*forever* promise is maybe a bit too much - but rest assured that I can't see anybody in his right mind axe Windows support in the next ten years.;) Oh, well, Windows may disappear before LibO! ;-) -- Gianluca Turconi -- Unsubscribe instructions: Email to discuss+h...@documentfoundation.org Posting guidelines: http://netmeister.org/news/learn2quote.html Archive: http://www.documentfoundation.org/lists/discuss/ *** All posts to this list are publicly archived ***
Re: [tdf-discuss] On the Future of TDF
Oh, well, Windows may disappear before LibO! ;-) -- Gianluca Turconi we can only hope -- Unsubscribe instructions: Email to discuss+h...@documentfoundation.org Posting guidelines: http://netmeister.org/news/learn2quote.html Archive: http://www.documentfoundation.org/lists/discuss/ *** All posts to this list are publicly archived ***
Re: [tdf-discuss] On the Future of TDF
On 14/11/10 11:25, Mirek M. wrote: Hi everyone, I've been meaning to write this e-mail for a while now, but haven't gotten around to it until now -- I hope it's still relevant. The Next Decade Manifesto and the recent press release (available at http://www.documentfoundation.org/lists/announce/msg00016.html for those who haven't read it yet) open up a lot of question and comments: TDF founders foresee a completely different future for the office suite paradigm, which - in the actual format - is over 20 years old, to be based on the document (where the software is a layer for the creation or the presentation of the contents). What exactly does that mean for the internal structure of LibreOffice? Does this mean that LibO will be more object-oriented? In addition, each single module of LibreOffice will be undergoing an extensive rewrite, with Calc being the first one to be redeveloped around a brand new engine - code named Ixion - that will increase performance, allow true versatility and add long awaited database and VBA macro handling features. Great. Yep - that +does+ sound interesting. Any time-lines given for this or the other improvements? Writer is going to be improved in the area of layout fidelity and Impress in the area of slideshow fidelity. Most of the new features are either meant to maintain compatibility with the market leading office suite or will introduce radical innovations. Can't wait to see it. I'm very curious as to what the radical innovations will bring. Ditto. The Document Foundation is going to be at the heart of the Free Software universe, where users want to build a different future for office suites, working together with developers. It'd be great if TDF focused on integration and interoperability with other open-source projects. +1 I'd really like to see Linux become the primary platform to focus on (yes, Linux has a much smaller user base than Windows, but that will never change if software companies keep favoring Windows). For Linux, OpenOffice.org (going forward LibreOffice) is vital. +1 It would also be great if LibO, KOffice, AbiWord, Gnumeric, Ease, and all the other open-source editors worked together to set standards. It'd be great, for example, if you could choose a standard open-source font triad that was bundled with all (relevant) open-source software (and closed-source software too) to counter MS's Times-Arial-Courier triad (and the rising Calibri-Cambria-Candara triad). Or if you could agree on the same keyboard shortcuts. Personally, I couldn't care one way or another - I just want crisp and clear fonts and a suitable range. snip Users read, write, modify and share documents, and are focused on contents rather than software features. After 20 years of feature oriented software, it is now the right time to bring back content at the centre of user focus. Does this mean that the ribbonesque UI that came out of OOo Renaissance will be abandoned in favor of a more efficient and less distracting UI? +1 This is a great aspiration: the art of software design would be similar to the contribution the drummer makes to a song: reliable, robust, and not too much in the way of the rest of the music.[1] In the same way, in order to help the user focus on the content, the workspace needs to be paramount with the tools and options accessible and intuitive so that the user can get on with the work and not worry about how things work and how to accomplish common tasks. And what I would really appreciate is a help guide that suggests *why* someone might want to use a particular tool (especially for the more esoteric options). This would certainly help expand my usage of the suite and tap into its power more effectively. Cheers AG [1] Gratuitous information dept: metaphor inspired by listening to the great grooves of Grand Funk Railroad's 1971 tour with drumming by Don Brewer. -- Unsubscribe instructions: Email to discuss+h...@documentfoundation.org Posting guidelines: http://netmeister.org/news/learn2quote.html Archive: http://www.documentfoundation.org/lists/discuss/ *** All posts to this list are publicly archived ***
Re: [tdf-discuss] On the Future of TDF
On Mon, Nov 15, 2010 at 8:38 PM, AG computing.acco...@googlemail.com wrote: On 14/11/10 11:25, Mirek M. wrote: Hi everyone, I've been meaning to write this e-mail for a while now, but haven't gotten around to it until now -- I hope it's still relevant. The Next Decade Manifesto and the recent press release (available at http://www.documentfoundation.org/lists/announce/msg00016.html for those who haven't read it yet) open up a lot of question and comments: TDF founders foresee a completely different future for the office suite paradigm, which - in the actual format - is over 20 years old, to be based on the document (where the software is a layer for the creation or the presentation of the contents). What exactly does that mean for the internal structure of LibreOffice? Does this mean that LibO will be more object-oriented? In addition, each single module of LibreOffice will be undergoing an extensive rewrite, with Calc being the first one to be redeveloped around a brand new engine - code named Ixion - that will increase performance, allow true versatility and add long awaited database and VBA macro handling features. Great. Yep - that +does+ sound interesting. Any time-lines given for this or the other improvements? Writer is going to be improved in the area of layout fidelity and Impress in the area of slideshow fidelity. Most of the new features are either meant to maintain compatibility with the market leading office suite or will introduce radical innovations. Can't wait to see it. I'm very curious as to what the radical innovations will bring. Ditto. The Document Foundation is going to be at the heart of the Free Software universe, where users want to build a different future for office suites, working together with developers. It'd be great if TDF focused on integration and interoperability with other open-source projects. +1 I agree too, this is extremely important. Let's focus on similar goals of all these projects instead the differences and collaborate strongly on that. The real enemy is the propietary software and non-standards, no other free software. I propose another idea: What about convert the file support of LibO into a portable, resource efficient, well designed and multiplatform library for all FOSS projects? I would imagine it like the WebKit of document file formats, but governed in a less corporate way. This library would have it´s own site into backed or being a TDF subdomain (or both), and improved between all friend projects. Of course this idea would need lot's of PR, negotiate with different projects and probably even deep changes in the original source code. This could make not only more interoperability, but FOSS projects having a lot stronger file type support. It could be used easily for non-interactive document converters too. A strong official alliance about this and other interoperability stuff could be very good for the FOSS productivity suite. I'd really like to see Linux become the primary platform to focus on (yes, Linux has a much smaller user base than Windows, but that will never change if software companies keep favoring Windows). For Linux, OpenOffice.org (going forward LibreOffice) is vital. +1 It would also be great if LibO, KOffice, AbiWord, Gnumeric, Ease, and all the other open-source editors worked together to set standards. It'd be great, for example, if you could choose a standard open-source font triad that was bundled with all (relevant) open-source software (and closed-source software too) to counter MS's Times-Arial-Courier triad (and the rising Calibri-Cambria-Candara triad). Or if you could agree on the same keyboard shortcuts. Personally, I couldn't care one way or another - I just want crisp and clear fonts and a suitable range. snip Users read, write, modify and share documents, and are focused on contents rather than software features. After 20 years of feature oriented software, it is now the right time to bring back content at the centre of user focus. Does this mean that the ribbonesque UI that came out of OOo Renaissance will be abandoned in favor of a more efficient and less distracting UI? +1 This is a great aspiration: the art of software design would be similar to the contribution the drummer makes to a song: reliable, robust, and not too much in the way of the rest of the music.[1] In the same way, in order to help the user focus on the content, the workspace needs to be paramount with the tools and options accessible and intuitive so that the user can get on with the work and not worry about how things work and how to accomplish common tasks. And what I would really appreciate is a help guide that suggests *why* someone might want to use a particular tool (especially for the more esoteric options). This would certainly help expand my usage of the suite and tap into its power more effectively. Cheers AG [1]
[tdf-discuss] On the Future of TDF
Hi everyone, I've been meaning to write this e-mail for a while now, but haven't gotten around to it until now -- I hope it's still relevant. The Next Decade Manifesto and the recent press release (available at http://www.documentfoundation.org/lists/announce/msg00016.html for those who haven't read it yet) open up a lot of question and comments: TDF founders foresee a completely different future for the office suite paradigm, which - in the actual format - is over 20 years old, to be based on the document (where the software is a layer for the creation or the presentation of the contents). What exactly does that mean for the internal structure of LibreOffice? Does this mean that LibO will be more object-oriented? In addition, each single module of LibreOffice will be undergoing an extensive rewrite, with Calc being the first one to be redeveloped around a brand new engine - code named Ixion - that will increase performance, allow true versatility and add long awaited database and VBA macro handling features. Great. Writer is going to be improved in the area of layout fidelity and Impress in the area of slideshow fidelity. Most of the new features are either meant to maintain compatibility with the market leading office suite or will introduce radical innovations. Can't wait to see it. I'm very curious as to what the radical innovations will bring. The Document Foundation is going to be at the heart of the Free Software universe, where users want to build a different future for office suites, working together with developers. It'd be great if TDF focused on integration and interoperability with other open-source projects. I'd really like to see Linux become the primary platform to focus on (yes, Linux has a much smaller user base than Windows, but that will never change if software companies keep favoring Windows). For Linux, OpenOffice.org (going forward LibreOffice) is vital. It would also be great if LibO, KOffice, AbiWord, Gnumeric, Ease, and all the other open-source editors worked together to set standards. It'd be great, for example, if you could choose a standard open-source font triad that was bundled with all (relevant) open-source software (and closed-source software too) to counter MS's Times-Arial-Courier triad (and the rising Calibri-Cambria-Candara triad). Or if you could agree on the same keyboard shortcuts. Lastly, it'd be nice if all the office suite powers integrated with and helped expand websites for open-source fonts (http://openfontlibrary.org/), clipart (http://www.openclipart.org/), and ODF templates (no central website yet). I'm guessing collaborating on a single extension framework is out of the question, but would a single dictionary framework (for spelling and grammar checks) be plausible? Users read, write, modify and share documents, and are focused on contents rather than software features. After 20 years of feature oriented software, it is now the right time to bring back content at the centre of user focus. Does this mean that the ribbonesque UI that came out of OOo Renaissance will be abandoned in favor of a more efficient and less distracting UI? -- Unsubscribe instructions: Email to discuss+h...@documentfoundation.org Posting guidelines: http://netmeister.org/news/learn2quote.html Archive: http://www.documentfoundation.org/lists/discuss/ *** All posts to this list are publicly archived ***
Re: [tdf-discuss] On the Future of TDF
Il 14/11/2010 12.25, Mirek M. ha scritto: I'd really like to see Linux become the primary platform to focus on (yes, Linux has a much smaller user base than Windows, but that will never change if software companies keep favoring Windows). For Linux, OpenOffice.org (going forward LibreOffice) is vital. I hope this *won't* happen, ever. However, I've heard and read several comments about this matter and I'd like to see a (somehow) official statement that confirms LibO will be a multiplatform software *forever*. At least, as priciple. In the facts, it will depend on dev resources. -- Gianluca Turconi -- Unsubscribe instructions: Email to discuss+h...@documentfoundation.org Posting guidelines: http://netmeister.org/news/learn2quote.html Archive: http://www.documentfoundation.org/lists/discuss/ *** All posts to this list are publicly archived ***
Re: [tdf-discuss] On the Future of TDF
On Monday 15 Nov 2010 00:39:09 Gianluca Turconi wrote: Il 14/11/2010 12.25, Mirek M. ha scritto: I'd really like to see Linux become the primary platform to focus on (yes, Linux has a much smaller user base than Windows, but that will never change if software companies keep favoring Windows). For Linux, OpenOffice.org (going forward LibreOffice) is vital. I hope this *won't* happen, ever. However, I've heard and read several comments about this matter and I'd like to see a (somehow) official statement that confirms LibO will be a multiplatform software *forever*. At least, as priciple. In the facts, it will depend on dev resources. Agreed, LibreO is cross platform, that is it's strength. let's keep it that way. Cheers GL -- Graham Lauder, OpenOffice.org MarCon (Marketing Contact) NZ http://marketing.openoffice.org/contacts.html OpenOffice.org Migration and training Consultant. INGOTs Assessor Trainer (International Grades in Open Technologies) www.theingots.org -- Unsubscribe instructions: Email to discuss+h...@documentfoundation.org Posting guidelines: http://netmeister.org/news/learn2quote.html Archive: http://www.documentfoundation.org/lists/discuss/ *** All posts to this list are publicly archived ***
Re: [tdf-discuss] On the Future of TDF
2010/11/14 Graham Lauder yori...@openoffice.org On Monday 15 Nov 2010 00:39:09 Gianluca Turconi wrote: Il 14/11/2010 12.25, Mirek M. ha scritto: I'd really like to see Linux become the primary platform to focus on (yes, Linux has a much smaller user base than Windows, but that will never change if software companies keep favoring Windows). For Linux, OpenOffice.org (going forward LibreOffice) is vital. I hope this *won't* happen, ever. However, I've heard and read several comments about this matter and I'd like to see a (somehow) official statement that confirms LibO will be a multiplatform software *forever*. At least, as priciple. In the facts, it will depend on dev resources. Agreed, LibreO is cross platform, that is it's strength. let's keep it that way. I definitely agree. What I meant was that, instead of focusing to make LibO work the best on Windows, leaving the Mac and Linux a step behind (for example, so far, it's pretty laborious to even install LibO beta 2 on Linux, while it's really easy to install on Windows), TDF should focus on making LibO work the best on Linux, and then focus on Windows and Mac OS. Cheers GL -- Graham Lauder, OpenOffice.org MarCon (Marketing Contact) NZ http://marketing.openoffice.org/contacts.html OpenOffice.org Migration and training Consultant. INGOTs Assessor Trainer (International Grades in Open Technologies) www.theingots.org -- Unsubscribe instructions: Email to discuss+h...@documentfoundation.orgdiscuss%2bh...@documentfoundation.org Posting guidelines: http://netmeister.org/news/learn2quote.html Archive: http://www.documentfoundation.org/lists/discuss/ *** All posts to this list are publicly archived *** -- Q: Why is this email five sentences or less? A: http://five.sentenc.es -- Unsubscribe instructions: Email to discuss+h...@documentfoundation.org Posting guidelines: http://netmeister.org/news/learn2quote.html Archive: http://www.documentfoundation.org/lists/discuss/ *** All posts to this list are publicly archived ***
Re: [tdf-discuss] On the Future of TDF
Il 14/11/2010 14.04, Mirek M. ha scritto: What I meant was that, instead of focusing to make LibO work the best on Windows, leaving the Mac and Linux a step behind (for example, so far, it's pretty laborious to even install LibO beta 2 on Linux, while it's really easy to install on Windows), TDF should focus on making LibO work the best on Linux, and then focus on Windows and Mac OS. Well, if there will be more Linux devs than Windows/Mac devs, it'll work that way. It's natural selection. :) -- Gianluca Turconi -- Unsubscribe instructions: Email to discuss+h...@documentfoundation.org Posting guidelines: http://netmeister.org/news/learn2quote.html Archive: http://www.documentfoundation.org/lists/discuss/ *** All posts to this list are publicly archived ***
Re: [tdf-discuss] On the Future of TDF
Gianluca Turconi wrote: However, I've heard and read several comments about this matter and I'd like to see a (somehow) official statement that confirms LibO will be a multiplatform software *forever*. Hi Gianluca, asking for a *forever* promise is maybe a bit too much - but rest assured that I can't see anybody in his right mind axe Windows support in the next ten years. ;) Cheers, -- Thorsten -- Unsubscribe instructions: Email to discuss+h...@documentfoundation.org Posting guidelines: http://netmeister.org/news/learn2quote.html Archive: http://www.documentfoundation.org/lists/discuss/ *** All posts to this list are publicly archived ***
