Re: Introduction to software developer profession for teens

[Florian Snow]

Hi,


Carmen Bianca Bakker  writes:
> - You do not need to be good at maths to be a decent software
>   engineer.

Thank you for pointing that out.  I completely forgot about that.  I
always play this little game with students where I ask them which
subject they think is the most important to become a programmer and they
usually think it is math.  They are often very surprised when I tell
them it is English and a little bit of logic.


> The first should hopefully scare off gamers who would have a miserable
> time doing software engineering.

I am always very carful in scaring people.  I completely understand what
you mean and I don't disagree with your general idea, but there are
plenty of people who got into coding because of games and have a lot of
fun.  But on a similar note:  No matter which profession people are
interested in, I usually recommend doing multiple internships to find
out what suits you best.  Even if it takes a whole year of doing nothing
but different internships, it is worthwhile because starting something
and then realizing halfway through it is not the right thing, takes much
more time than some internships.

I sometimes even go so far as to tell them that if an intern leaves
after an internship and knows they never want to touch a computer again,
I see that as a success (unless it is because my mentoring was so
terrible) because it means someone knows one field they are _not_
interested in.

Happy hacking!
Florian
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Re: Introduction to software developer profession for teens

[Paul Hänsch]

On Mon, Nov 20, 2017 at 03:53:40PM +0200, Vitaly Repin wrote:
> I found this opportunity as a very interesting but also challenging. I plan
> to tell them also about FOSS and possibilities to  study programming by
> participating in different FOSS projects.

I would say, do not set FLOSS apart as some alternative, altruistic concept at
all. Make it the default of the job description. Show that the job of a
developer is to write code for money, and how it is commonplace to publish
this code. Show that the majority of software is not written to be sold, but
because it is required by someone, and that the job involves constantly
producing new solution for everyone to use, even though the job may be paid
for by a particularly interested party.

The majority of software on the planet is contract work for small and medium
businesses, often in the form of specialised applications, and nowadays the
mindset of the entire industry is shifting insofar that it becomes normal, to
just dump the results on github, or discuss algorithms in public web forums.
The kids choosing to become developers, will most likely be working in an
environment like this anyway.

Show how it is a typical job for a developer to write an extension, patch, or
wrapper for some FLOSS product, because a client specifically requested that,
or because it will do the job, the client wants done.

-- 
Paul Hänsch █▉Webmaster, System-Hacker
  █▉█▉█▉  
Jabber: p...@jabber.fsfe.org▉▉ Free Software Foundation Europe


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Re: Introduction to software developer profession for teens

[Nico Rikken]

Hi Vitaly,

Each year I go back to my highschool for a similar purpose. I tell them
that there is more to software development than just coding: getting
requirements, providing support, trying new stuff, drinking coffee,
etc. I alway show a bit of code as a glimpse, but is quite offputting
to most. On two occasions the Python language was associated to
programming by the students. So if you'd like to point them to
something concrete, I'd aim for Python. Last year I handed them each a
double-side page with an illustrated version of my bio and concrete
pointers for the students to get started with programming. I tell them
I'm involved with the FSFE and why that matters, but it seems to
abstract. My main message is to just try some programming.

Best of luck!
Nico

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Re: Introduction to software developer profession for teens

[Vitaly Repin]

Hello,

2017-11-20 16:37 GMT+02:00 Carmen Bianca Bakker :

>
> That's quite short for a workshop.  What will they be doing, and how
> many of them will attend?
>
>
It will be a workshop for a small group - not more than 12.


> The angle of using Free Software as a self-study tool is good :) I am
> not quite sure how you could fit a proper explanation of Free Software
> into that hour and also use it to teach them about software engineering,
> though.  I feel like it might be a disservice to either topic if one
> impeded too much on the time of the other.
>
>
Yes. I think that I just need to stress on ability to get access to the
FOSS source code and play with it.  And supply them with a proper links for
the further reading.
And as it will not be my only visit to this school, they will always have
an opportunity to talk with me directly.

An objective of this session is to really introduce the profession to them.
So, that the teens who are interested could continue with further, more
in-depth questions and activities.
By the way, are you aware about any FOSS-specific communities, projects,
initiatives which can be not only interesting for this age group but to
which the teens can contribute?

I thought about drone-related projects but it might be too complicated for
the real beginners...


> - Liking video games is NOT a valid reason to study software
>   engineering, and being a video game developer is a stressful,
>   oversaturated, underpaid job.
>
> - You do not need to be good at maths to be a decent software engineer.
>   Being able to communicate (write) clearly and unambiguously is a much
>   better asset for a software engineer, as this is exactly what coding
>   is.  If you can write an accurate tutorial that describes how to boil
>   an egg that includes all the steps required (even the often-overlooked
>   ones!) in such a way that anybody can understand it effortlessly, and
>   can follow those steps without having to do any additional thinking of
>   their own, then you possess THE vital skill for programming.
>
>
Very good points, thank you!

-- 
WBR & WBW, Vitaly
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Re: Introduction to software developer profession for teens

[Carmen Bianca Bakker]

Hi Vitaly,

Vitaly Repin schreef op ma 20-11-2017 om 15:53 [+0200]:
> This Sunday I will have an 1 hour workshop with the teens (age 14-18)
> with the purpose to explain them what software developer profession is
> about. 

That's quite short for a workshop.  What will they be doing, and how
many of them will attend?

> I found this opportunity as a very interesting but also challenging. I
> plan to tell them also about FOSS and possibilities to  study
> programming by participating in different FOSS projects.

The angle of using Free Software as a self-study tool is good :) I am
not quite sure how you could fit a proper explanation of Free Software
into that hour and also use it to teach them about software engineering,
though.  I feel like it might be a disservice to either topic if one
impeded too much on the time of the other.

Perhaps use the hour primarily to teach about software engineering, and
use any extra time with individual students to bring up the ethics
involved in software?

Also, pretty please make sure to mention this at least:

- Liking video games is NOT a valid reason to study software
  engineering, and being a video game developer is a stressful,
  oversaturated, underpaid job.

- You do not need to be good at maths to be a decent software engineer.
  Being able to communicate (write) clearly and unambiguously is a much
  better asset for a software engineer, as this is exactly what coding
  is.  If you can write an accurate tutorial that describes how to boil
  an egg that includes all the steps required (even the often-overlooked
  ones!) in such a way that anybody can understand it effortlessly, and
  can follow those steps without having to do any additional thinking of
  their own, then you possess THE vital skill for programming.

The first should hopefully scare off gamers who would have a miserable
time doing software engineering.

The second should hopefully invite people who aren't maths geniuses, but
who are communicatively very strong.

I hope this was helpful.  Thank you for introducing the wonderful world
of hacking to teens!

Yours,
a software engineering student

-- 
Carmen Bianca Bakker
Technical Intern
Free Software Foundation Europe e.V.

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