Re: a request for some brain picking

[Will Dampier]

> watching the pycon and django talks now (and it looks super cool) ...
> but at least by what I see so far is that its trying to allow people
> to download and create an "even more batteries included" type of
> platform.  I'm hoping to create a repository of templates and designs
> (more for learning and examples), not necessarily an integrated
> platform.

After watching their two talks and playing around with the code I'm
quite impressed with their system.  In about 20 minutes I actually re-
implemented the entire site in pinax (and I may do the same with some
of my other projects).  At this point I'm not above throwing out my
crummy code if something better comes along ;).  It certainly
implements all of the "social features" that I was scratching my head
about.

All I really need to do is create a hook for rendering the arbitrary
templates.


On Jan 2, 3:55 pm, Will Dampier <judow...@gmail.com> wrote:
> watching the pycon and django talks now (and it looks super cool) ...
> but at least by what I see so far is that its trying to allow people
> to download and create an "even more batteries included" type of
> platform.  I'm hoping to create a repository of templates and designs
> (more for learning and examples), not necessarily an integrated
> platform.
>
> On Jan 2, 2:02 pm, Jim White <white.j...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > If you don't already know about Pinax perhaps you should look 
> > athttp://pinaxproject.com/.  They already provide some of this and (as a
> > Pinax user) it would be nice to see some template compatibility.
> > Unfortunately they are still sub 1.0 in their release but it looks
> > like they have settled down a bit in their base.html and css.
>
> > On Jan 2, 10:16 am, Will Dampier <judow...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > >  ... I do like the idea of having a handful of "standard django
> > > plugables" like django-registration, django-cms, django-profiles, and
> > > dozens of others ... the Django-Resources page would be a good place
> > > to start.
>
> > > Then designers could upload either a full "website layout" against all
> > > of my, and the "plugable", views or simply a against a subset of the
> > > "plugable" applications. If I "standardize" the blocks that the
> > > designers are allowed to use, then for any missing templates I could
> > > just implement my default template.  With some sort of trickery I
> > > could even allow people to create mash-ups combining different
> > > designs.
>
> > > On Jan 2, 12:58 pm, Raja <rajas...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > > > IMO, it would be useful if we get standard templates for django
> > > > libraries that are out there, like django-registration, django-
> > > > profiles etc. Since the library offers the models and views, it would
> > > > be helpful if the templates are also available. The developer could
> > > > then take it and modify it to adapt to their website.
>
> > > > Also, frameworks like Blueprint CSS (http://www.blueprintcss.org) make
> > > > it much easier to start designing a layout by providing a pre-defined
> > > > template , so its not all that difficult now, but blueprint could be
> > > > one of the templates thats available in the original poster's library.
>
> > > > -- Raja
>
> > > > On Jan 2, 6:01 pm, Dougal Matthews <douga...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > > > > How would you propose people edit and manage the templates?
>
> > > > > Do you follow a wiki style where everybody can edit others? or follow 
> > > > > a VCS
> > > > > and allow forking of templates?
>
> > > > > I think it will be hard to find contributors since it will be hard to 
> > > > > have a
> > > > > limited/standard template context that still remains a useful 
> > > > > resource for
> > > > > all.
>
> > > > > Have you any thoughts about example templates? Perhaps a good place 
> > > > > to start
> > > > > would be by creating custom admin templates as that context is 
> > > > > defined by
> > > > > django already (pretty much) and then it would be useful and usable by
> > > > > anybody in real projects rather than scenarios.
>
> > > > > Dougal
>
> > > > > ---
> > > > > Dougal Matthews - @d0ugalhttp://www.dougalmatthews.com/

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Re: a request for some brain picking

[Will Dampier]

watching the pycon and django talks now (and it looks super cool) ...
but at least by what I see so far is that its trying to allow people
to download and create an "even more batteries included" type of
platform.  I'm hoping to create a repository of templates and designs
(more for learning and examples), not necessarily an integrated
platform.

On Jan 2, 2:02 pm, Jim White <white.j...@gmail.com> wrote:
> If you don't already know about Pinax perhaps you should look 
> athttp://pinaxproject.com/.  They already provide some of this and (as a
> Pinax user) it would be nice to see some template compatibility.
> Unfortunately they are still sub 1.0 in their release but it looks
> like they have settled down a bit in their base.html and css.
>
> On Jan 2, 10:16 am, Will Dampier <judow...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> >  ... I do like the idea of having a handful of "standard django
> > plugables" like django-registration, django-cms, django-profiles, and
> > dozens of others ... the Django-Resources page would be a good place
> > to start.
>
> > Then designers could upload either a full "website layout" against all
> > of my, and the "plugable", views or simply a against a subset of the
> > "plugable" applications. If I "standardize" the blocks that the
> > designers are allowed to use, then for any missing templates I could
> > just implement my default template.  With some sort of trickery I
> > could even allow people to create mash-ups combining different
> > designs.
>
> > On Jan 2, 12:58 pm, Raja <rajas...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > > IMO, it would be useful if we get standard templates for django
> > > libraries that are out there, like django-registration, django-
> > > profiles etc. Since the library offers the models and views, it would
> > > be helpful if the templates are also available. The developer could
> > > then take it and modify it to adapt to their website.
>
> > > Also, frameworks like Blueprint CSS (http://www.blueprintcss.org) make
> > > it much easier to start designing a layout by providing a pre-defined
> > > template , so its not all that difficult now, but blueprint could be
> > > one of the templates thats available in the original poster's library.
>
> > > -- Raja
>
> > > On Jan 2, 6:01 pm, Dougal Matthews <douga...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > > > How would you propose people edit and manage the templates?
>
> > > > Do you follow a wiki style where everybody can edit others? or follow a 
> > > > VCS
> > > > and allow forking of templates?
>
> > > > I think it will be hard to find contributors since it will be hard to 
> > > > have a
> > > > limited/standard template context that still remains a useful resource 
> > > > for
> > > > all.
>
> > > > Have you any thoughts about example templates? Perhaps a good place to 
> > > > start
> > > > would be by creating custom admin templates as that context is defined 
> > > > by
> > > > django already (pretty much) and then it would be useful and usable by
> > > > anybody in real projects rather than scenarios.
>
> > > > Dougal
>
> > > > ---
> > > > Dougal Matthews - @d0ugalhttp://www.dougalmatthews.com/

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Re: a request for some brain picking

[Will Dampier]

Hmmm,

I wonder if I could make the entire site out of plugables.  Then
designers would have a well defined (or at least standard) set of
views and templates to program against.  It would also be useful for
newbies to find templates and designs for these commonly used apps.

I've created a simple voting thingy on "Moderator" at this url:
http://moderator.appspot.com/#15/e=125fbc=125fbd  Please suggest
and vote for the sort of apps you'd like to see included into a
repository.

On a side-note, I wonder if there's a way to create a "template-
loader" which will return the uploaded templates.  My current
implementation is to use a "r'(P.*?)/" in my urls.py to
determine which template to load.  This would be an annoying way to
implement it if I'm including pluggables.
Any thoughts?

On Jan 2, 2:43 pm, Dougal Matthews  wrote:
> 2010/1/2 Raja 
>
> > IMO, it would be useful if we get standard templates for django
> > libraries that are out there, like django-registration, django-
> > profiles etc. Since the library offers the models and views, it would
> > be helpful if the templates are also available. The developer could
> > then take it and modify it to adapt to their website.
>
> +1 making templates that are fitted for common apps (including contrib)
> would be great.
>
>
>
> > Also, frameworks like Blueprint CSS (http://www.blueprintcss.org) make
> > it much easier to start designing a layout by providing a pre-defined
> > template , so its not all that difficult now, but blueprint could be
> > one of the templates thats available in the original poster's library.
>
> +1 again - would help with standardisation of what is made

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Re: a request for some brain picking

[Will Dampier]

 ... I do like the idea of having a handful of "standard django
plugables" like django-registration, django-cms, django-profiles, and
dozens of others ... the Django-Resources page would be a good place
to start.

Then designers could upload either a full "website layout" against all
of my, and the "plugable", views or simply a against a subset of the
"plugable" applications. If I "standardize" the blocks that the
designers are allowed to use, then for any missing templates I could
just implement my default template.  With some sort of trickery I
could even allow people to create mash-ups combining different
designs.

On Jan 2, 12:58 pm, Raja  wrote:
> IMO, it would be useful if we get standard templates for django
> libraries that are out there, like django-registration, django-
> profiles etc. Since the library offers the models and views, it would
> be helpful if the templates are also available. The developer could
> then take it and modify it to adapt to their website.
>
> Also, frameworks like Blueprint CSS (http://www.blueprintcss.org) make
> it much easier to start designing a layout by providing a pre-defined
> template , so its not all that difficult now, but blueprint could be
> one of the templates thats available in the original poster's library.
>
> -- Raja
>
> On Jan 2, 6:01 pm, Dougal Matthews  wrote:
>
> > How would you propose people edit and manage the templates?
>
> > Do you follow a wiki style where everybody can edit others? or follow a VCS
> > and allow forking of templates?
>
> > I think it will be hard to find contributors since it will be hard to have a
> > limited/standard template context that still remains a useful resource for
> > all.
>
> > Have you any thoughts about example templates? Perhaps a good place to start
> > would be by creating custom admin templates as that context is defined by
> > django already (pretty much) and then it would be useful and usable by
> > anybody in real projects rather than scenarios.
>
> > Dougal
>
> > ---
> > Dougal Matthews - @d0ugalhttp://www.dougalmatthews.com/

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Re: a request for some brain picking

[Will Dampier]

Thanks for the thoughts Dougal.  At the moment the only "managing" of
templates comes from uploading them through a form.  If you wanted to
change/fork them you'd have to create your own "design" and then re-
upload the modified template.

Right now my example templates are super simple HTML templates
(they're in the repository mentioned above).  If a design implements
then it will preferentially render the design's template over my own.

I do like the idea of people uploading templates that over-ride admin
templates.  It would make it more "plug-able" with current django
installations.  I could use many different models to to show all of
the possible "view-types" that the standard ModelAdmin allows.
Although I have a question about the usefulness of these templates.
(my understanding at least) Is that the admin site is supposed to be a
"no-mess" administration site that "covers all the bases" so the coder
doesn't have to worry about implementing it.  Do you think this would
be a useful resource for people creating "front-facing" templates
though?

The problem I see with a "wiki style" editing would be people
introducing malicious code which I end up unknowingly loading into
django and exposing myself and others to the whims of "bad people".
"Forking" a design would be pretty easy in implement, I could simply
copy the relevant files into a new one.

On Jan 2, 8:01 am, Dougal Matthews  wrote:
> How would you propose people edit and manage the templates?
>
> Do you follow a wiki style where everybody can edit others? or follow a VCS
> and allow forking of templates?
>
> I think it will be hard to find contributors since it will be hard to have a
> limited/standard template context that still remains a useful resource for
> all.
>
> Have you any thoughts about example templates? Perhaps a good place to start
> would be by creating custom admin templates as that context is defined by
> django already (pretty much) and then it would be useful and usable by
> anybody in real projects rather than scenarios.
>
> Dougal
>
> ---
> Dougal Matthews - @d0ugalhttp://www.dougalmatthews.com/

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Re: a request for some brain picking

[Will Dampier]

I agree I'll be limiting things.  And I don't expect that you'd be
able to download the templates from this website and plug it into your
own without any modification what so ever.  The standardization comes
from the limiting of what I actually put in the context-dictionary
when I render the template.

I hope this will become a resource for people to download templates
that they can "tinker" into their own django programs.  I've noticed
that everytime I start a django project I get the views, forms,
models, etc. programmed easily but I stare at a blank editor screen
trying to write the template.  If I had a place to go and find a
"slick-looking" template to tinker with I'd be able to do things even
faster.

I'm hoping to make this into an ideal place for people to demonstrate
the tricks they use in constructing their templates ... stuff like how
they arrange the "blocks", which css items they use, whether they use
lists or tables, how they implement 'nav-bars', etc.



On Jan 1, 5:12 pm, aditya <bluemangrou...@gmail.com> wrote:
> Will,
> Django is much more flexible over template-based systems like
> Wordpress or Tumblr. Wordpress standardizes a lot of things so generic
> templates are easy to make and will work on just about any Wordpress
> installation. It seems to me like to have templates in Django you'd
> have to standardize things somehow...but that would result in loss of
> flexibility.
>
> Aditya
>
> On Jan 1, 1:06 pm, Will Dampier <judow...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > An open call,
>
> > This is Will Dampier, I've been an avid python and django programmer for the
> > past two years or so.  I've worked on a few in-house django projects and
> > I've been looking for a project to "give-back" to the community.  I've
> > always worked on the "programming" side of projects and have only dabbled on
> > the "design" side.  Whenever I've started a new project I've scoured the
> > internet for django templates that come complete with css, images, etc. and
> > always come up empty.
>
> > So I was thinking of making a "meta"-django project.  I could make a site
> > that allows designers to upload django-templates against a well defined set
> > of models, views, forms, etc.  Then users could switch between templates and
> > see how more "complex" examples function.  This would be useful for
> > designers to advertise their skills and for newbies to get a richer set of
> > functions.  Something akin to the CSS Zen Garden.
>
> > I'm looking for a collaborator or two ... or even just a few people to pick
> > their brains about some of the details.  I have some code in a git-hub
> > repositoryhttp://github.com/JudoWill/DjangoTemplateRepository/andI've got
> > about a dozen google-wave invitations if people would like to try
> > collaborating that way.  If you wouldn't mind either forwarding this to
> > anyone you think would be interested or posting it on your blog.
>
> > Thanks in advance,
> > Will

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a request for some brain picking

[Will Dampier]

An open call,


This is Will Dampier, I've been an avid python and django programmer for the
past two years or so.  I've worked on a few in-house django projects and
I've been looking for a project to "give-back" to the community.  I've
always worked on the "programming" side of projects and have only dabbled on
the "design" side.  Whenever I've started a new project I've scoured the
internet for django templates that come complete with css, images, etc. and
always come up empty.

So I was thinking of making a "meta"-django project.  I could make a site
that allows designers to upload django-templates against a well defined set
of models, views, forms, etc.  Then users could switch between templates and
see how more "complex" examples function.  This would be useful for
designers to advertise their skills and for newbies to get a richer set of
functions.  Something akin to the CSS Zen Garden.

I'm looking for a collaborator or two ... or even just a few people to pick
their brains about some of the details.  I have some code in a git-hub
repository http://github.com/JudoWill/DjangoTemplateRepository/ and I've got
about a dozen google-wave invitations if people would like to try
collaborating that way.  If you wouldn't mind either forwarding this to
anyone you think would be interested or posting it on your blog.

Thanks in advance,
Will

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