Re: [DNG] Netiquette

[Florian Zieboll via Dng]

On Sun, 21 Mar 2021 22:33:27 + (GMT)
Jim Jackson  wrote:

> well well well. Many thanks for that. And I thought I knew my way
> around alpine :-(


Glad I could help :-)
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Re: [DNG] Netiquette

[Jim Jackson]

On Wed, 17 Mar 2021, Florian Zieboll via Dng wrote:

> On Wed, 17 Mar 2021 12:53:58 + (GMT)
> Jim Jackson  wrote:
> 
> > for the record alpine is broken in that area. As far as I can make
> > out it just uses the subject line to "thread" emails (modulo the
> > various "re:"s etc)
> 
> 
> It's a while ago that I used (al)pine (in fact, it was still pine back
> then, IIRC in combination with fetchmail). Nevertheless, I'd bet that
> you can make alpine sort threads by the "References" header. Just out
> of curiosity, I did a quick websearch and found the following document:
> 
> http://www.chiark.greenend.org.uk/doc/alpine-doc/tech-notes/config.html#show-sort


well well well. Many thanks for that. And I thought I knew my way around 
alpine :-( 

As they say: Familiarity breeds contempt!


> 
> libre Gr??e,
> Florian
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Re: [DNG] Netiquette

[Florian Zieboll via Dng]

On Wed, 17 Mar 2021 12:53:58 + (GMT)
Jim Jackson  wrote:

> for the record alpine is broken in that area. As far as I can make
> out it just uses the subject line to "thread" emails (modulo the
> various "re:"s etc)


It's a while ago that I used (al)pine (in fact, it was still pine back
then, IIRC in combination with fetchmail). Nevertheless, I'd bet that
you can make alpine sort threads by the "References" header. Just out
of curiosity, I did a quick websearch and found the following document:

http://www.chiark.greenend.org.uk/doc/alpine-doc/tech-notes/config.html#show-sort

libre Grüße,
Florian
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Re: [DNG] Netiquette

[Jim Jackson]

On Wed, 3 Mar 2021, Rick Moen wrote:

> Quoting g4sra via Dng (dng@lists.dyne.org):
> 
> > What is the netiquette on this list for changing subject lines.
> > I hate hijacking threads but I also hate breaking them.
> > Which is the lesser of the two evils ?
> 
> Standards-compliant mailers' threading doesn't get broken by altering
> the Subject header.  (Last I heard, MS-Outlook still didn't follow 
> the RFCs in that area, and thus gets adversely affected.  Probably, 
> some other common mailers share that defect.)

for the record alpine is broken in that area. As far as I can make out it 
just uses the subject line to "thread" emails (modulo the various "re:"s 
etc)

Jim
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Re: [DNG] Netiquette

[Lars Noodén via Dng]

There are also some informal Netiquette Guidelines from October 1995 in
the form of RFC 1855:
https://tools.ietf.org/html/rfc1855#section-3.0

Section 3 covers one-to-many communications.

/Lars
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Re: [DNG] Netiquette

[spiralofhope]

On Wed, 3 Mar 2021 13:58:57 -0800
Rick Moen  wrote:

> Personally, I deliberately break the thread by snipping In-Reply-To
> (or use mutt's new-message command, which amounts to the same thing)
> if the new discussion will be semantically quite different from the
> old one.

This makes a lot of sense since there is thread-level ignore
functionality out there, for example with Claws Mail.
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Re: [DNG] Netiquette

[Olaf Meeuwissen via Dng]

Hi Steve,

Steve Litt writes:

>>What is the netiquette on this list for changing subject lines.
>>I hate hijacking threads but I also hate breaking them.
>>Which is the lesser of the two evils ?
>>
>
> :-)
>
> My 2 cents: When the stuff I'm discussing no longer is apropos to the
> OP's post, I change the subject line. I typically do it like the
> following:
>
> Name of my new discussion: Was: Name of the OP's discussion

I usually put the "Was: ..." bit between parentheses and use lowercase
so you get:

  Name of my new discussion (was: Name of the OP's discussion)

but that's just me.

> It's a gray area because generally threads aren't full-on hijacked, but
> instead slowly drift away. My decision difficulty is determining at
> what point do I change the subject .
>
> By the way, people who take an ongoing, solid discussion, and reply
> about something totally unconnected with the discussion have a special
> place in hell reserved for them. Perhaps, in addition to the normal
> fire and brimstone, they'll be forced to use systemd for eternity.
>
> And then there are the people who say "sorry for hijacking this
> thread, but", and then go on to hijack it. In addition to the
> punishments mentioned in the preceding paragraph, these people's
> eternal roommate will be Lennart Poettering, who will lecture them, for
> eternity, on why they are wrong about everything.

Thanks for giving me a good laugh, the ROTFL-kind actually, when I could
use one :bow:

Hope this helps,
--
Olaf Meeuwissen, LPIC-2FSF Associate Member since 2004-01-27
 GnuPG key: F84A2DD9/B3C0 2F47 EA19 64F4 9F13  F43E B8A4 A88A F84A 2DD9
 Support Free Softwarehttps://my.fsf.org/donate
 Join the Free Software Foundation  https://my.fsf.org/join
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Re: [DNG] Netiquette

[Steve Litt]

>What is the netiquette on this list for changing subject lines.
>I hate hijacking threads but I also hate breaking them.
>Which is the lesser of the two evils ?
>

:-)

My 2 cents: When the stuff I'm discussing no longer is apropos to the
OP's post, I change the subject line. I typically do it like the
following:

Name of my new discussion: Was: Name of the OP's discussion

It's a gray area because generally threads aren't full-on hijacked, but
instead slowly drift away. My decision difficulty is determining at
what point do I change the subject .

By the way, people who take an ongoing, solid discussion, and reply
about something totally unconnected with the discussion have a special
place in hell reserved for them. Perhaps, in addition to the normal
fire and brimstone, they'll be forced to use systemd for eternity.

And then there are the people who say "sorry for hijacking this
thread, but", and then go on to hijack it. In addition to the
punishments mentioned in the preceding paragraph, these people's
eternal roommate will be Lennart Poettering, who will lecture them, for
eternity, on why they are wrong about everything.

Fortunately, I've never seen a complete hijack on DNG.

SteveT

Steve Litt 
Spring 2020 featured book: Thriving in Tough Times
http://www.troubleshooters.com/thrive
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Re: [DNG] Netiquette

[Rick Moen]

Quoting g4sra via Dng (dng@lists.dyne.org):

> What is the netiquette on this list for changing subject lines.
> I hate hijacking threads but I also hate breaking them.
> Which is the lesser of the two evils ?

Standards-compliant mailers' threading doesn't get broken by altering
the Subject header.  (Last I heard, MS-Outlook still didn't follow 
the RFCs in that area, and thus gets adversely affected.  Probably, 
some other common mailers share that defect.)

In a standards-compliant mailer that relies on Message-IDs and the
In-Reply-To header to arrange threading, you will continue to see a
reply with changed Subject header sorted immediately below the
replied-to post within the conversation's tree of postings.

Therefore, changing Subject lines and breaking or not breaking threads
are (or, at least, should be) orthogonal concerns.  If you wish to
deliberately break threading in your reply, snip out the In-Reply-To
from your headers before posting.  If you don't wish to, then don't
do that.  Either way, changing or not changing the Subject header ought
to have zero effect on threading (except for MS-Outlook victims^W
users).

Since you're a GMail person, you _may_ find it to be non-trivial to assert
control over your SMTP headers, but I wish you good hunting, on that.
I'll be polite and not say how I prefer to cure GMail problems.  (It's
very similar to how I cure Facebook problems.)

Personally, I deliberately break the thread by snipping In-Reply-To (or
use mutt's new-message command, which amounts to the same thing) if the
new discussion will be semantically quite different from the old one.  
OTOH, if I'm just adjusting the Subject header to account for topic
drift, I don't break threading because I regard it as part of the
ongoing conversation.

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Re: [DNG] netiquette Was: Re: Installing & running eudev broke USB drives auto-listing in Thunar.

[aitor_czr]

On 08/12/17 10:01, Edward Bartolo wrote:

On 08/12/2017, aitor_czr  wrote:

On 02/12/17 00:39, Rick Moen wrote:

Quoting Svante Signell (svante.sign...@gmail.com):


PS: Who is the best female skier currently?

Maren Lundby, from Lillehammer!  You had to ask?  ;->

You're in a invernal mood i see:)

Aitor.


Unless in his country there are artificial ice skating facilities like in Dubai.


Artificial ice in Dubai, artificial islands in Dubai, artificial 
swallows in Dubai... Dubai is so bore!



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Re: [DNG] netiquette Was: Re: Installing & running eudev broke USB drives auto-listing in Thunar.

[aitor_czr]

On 02/12/17 00:39, Rick Moen wrote:

Quoting Svante Signell (svante.sign...@gmail.com):


PS: Who is the best female skier currently?

Maren Lundby, from Lillehammer!  You had to ask?  ;->


You're in a invernal mood i see :)

  Aitor.


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Re: [DNG] netiquette Was: Re: Installing & running eudev broke USB drives auto-listing in Thunar.

[Renaud (Ron) OLGIATI]

On Sat, 2 Dec 2017 09:17:36 +
Arnt Gulbrandsen  wrote:

> Svante Signell writes:
> > This is not the first posting from Eduardo to this list. He still has
> > not learned netiquette, a very sad story. Sorry for raising this issue
> > now, I just couldn't wait any longer. Regarding technicalities we are
> > speaking about he is fully aware.  
> 
> Fix your own mail reader before you complain about how others quote. It 
> still doesn't generate RFC 3676-compliant quotations.

How about taking that discussion to the Hair-splitting group in Yahoo...
 
Cheers,
 
Ron.
-- 
Anarchy: a perfect state where no government is needed
   -- 1929 OED

   -- http://www.olgiati-in-paraguay.org --
 
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Re: [DNG] netiquette Was: Re: Installing & running eudev broke USB drives auto-listing in Thunar.

[Arnt Gulbrandsen]

Svante Signell writes:

This is not the first posting from Eduardo to this list. He still has
not learned netiquette, a very sad story. Sorry for raising this issue
now, I just couldn't wait any longer. Regarding technicalities we are
speaking about he is fully aware.


Fix your own mail reader before you complain about how others quote. It 
still doesn't generate RFC 3676-compliant quotations.


Arnt

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Re: [DNG] netiquette Was: Re: Installing & running eudev broke USB drives auto-listing in Thunar.

[Rowland Penny]

On Sat, 02 Dec 2017 00:25:16 +0100
Svante Signell  wrote:

> On Fri, 2017-12-01 at 22:55 +, Rowland Penny wrote:
> 
> > I hope they do not learn from you, your attitude is atrocious.
> > Eduardo has a valid problem and perhaps he isn't replying in exactly
> > the way you want, but so what, be polite and ask again in plain
> > questions for what you need to try and help him. Probably English
> > isn't Eduardo's first language, so cut him some slack, but most of
> > all, don't try and force your 'netiquette' on others.
> 
> Eduardos problems is not English for sure. I replied twice, and gave
> him the answers he wanted. What else? Regarding his ways of replying,
> just search the DNG mailing list logs.

I am English and I didn't really understand your replies, ever thought
it could be the way you gave the answers ?

>   
> > > 
> > > PS: Who is the best female skier currently?
> > 
> > I couldn't care less who the best female downhill leg breaker is, it
> > has nothing to do with this list.
> 
> That was meant to the Norwegian guy who replied, just ignore it. If
> you cannot take a joke, you have no humor :(
>

As I said,I am English and we invented jokes and that wasn't a
joke. ;-) 

Rowland

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Re: [DNG] netiquette Was: Re: Installing & running eudev broke USB drives auto-listing in Thunar.

[Rick Moen]

Quoting Svante Signell (svante.sign...@gmail.com):

> PS: Who is the best female skier currently?

Maren Lundby, from Lillehammer!  You had to ask?  ;->

-- 
Cheers, For good netiquette,
Rick Moen be wise and choose a four-line
r...@linuxmafia.com.sig (haiku is good).
McQ!  (4x80)
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Re: [DNG] netiquette Was: Re: Installing & running eudev broke USB drives auto-listing in Thunar.

[Svante Signell]

On Fri, 2017-12-01 at 22:55 +, Rowland Penny wrote:

> I hope they do not learn from you, your attitude is atrocious.
> Eduardo has a valid problem and perhaps he isn't replying in exactly
> the way you want, but so what, be polite and ask again in plain
> questions for what you need to try and help him. Probably English
> isn't Eduardo's first language, so cut him some slack, but most of
> all, don't try and force your 'netiquette' on others.

Eduardos problems is not English for sure. I replied twice, and gave
him the answers he wanted. What else? Regarding his ways of replying,
just search the DNG mailing list logs.
  
> > 
> > PS: Who is the best female skier currently?
> 
> I couldn't care less who the best female downhill leg breaker is, it
> has nothing to do with this list.

That was meant to the Norwegian guy who replied, just ignore it. If you
cannot take a joke, you have no humor :(

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Re: [DNG] netiquette

[Svante Signell]

On Fri, 2017-12-01 at 23:44 +0100, Antony Stone wrote:
> On Friday 01 December 2017 at 23:10:10, Svante Signell wrote:
> 
> > PS: Who is the best female skier currently?
> 
> Downhill, slalom, cross-country, or other?

Ah, I thought merely about cross-country. You know, Norway always
claims to be best, but maybe other countries are competitive. But for
sprint skiing Sweden is best, even though a Norwegian jente won last
year :( Downhill, slalom, etc is another story :), what about
freeskiing? 
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Re: [DNG] netiquette Was: Re: Installing & running eudev broke USB drives auto-listing in Thunar.

[Rowland Penny]

On Fri, 01 Dec 2017 23:10:10 +0100
Svante Signell  wrote:

> On Fri, 2017-12-01 at 21:55 +, Olav Selseng Vestreim wrote:
> > On Friday 1. December 2017 11.10.57 Svante Signell wrote:
> > > Hi again,
> > > 
> > > This is a last warning. If you are continuing to not quote
> > > previous mails,
> > > I'll never reply to a posting from you again. Learn some
> > > netiquette!
> > > 
> > > Again, you have to compare with the files with systemd-udev
> > > installed. (Or search in the *.deb files)
> 
> > Hei Svante.
> > 
> > This reply to Edward seemed a bit harsh; it might be that he didn't
> > cope with the technicality of your reply, or a whole range of other
> > possible  misunderstandings, one way or the other. If you don't get
> > the reply you expected, it doesn't mean it's intended to be so.;
> > intended bad behaviour or whatever.
> > 
> > This should be a nice place to ask for help!
> 
> Hi Olav,
> 
> This is not the first posting from Eduardo to this list. He still has
> not learned netiquette, a very sad story. Sorry for raising this issue
> now, I just couldn't wait any longer. Regarding technicalities we are
> speaking about he is fully aware.
> 
> Additionally, there are still a number of contributors to this list
> that has to be taught netiquette too. No names released here, but you
> offenders all know who you are. Sorry, I'd hoped for people on this
> list (and other Devuan lists) to know how to send and reply to
> mails :(

I hope they do not learn from you, your attitude is atrocious.
Eduardo has a valid problem and perhaps he isn't replying in exactly
the way you want, but so what, be polite and ask again in plain
questions for what you need to try and help him. Probably English
isn't Eduardo's first language, so cut him some slack, but most of
all, don't try and force your 'netiquette' on others.
  
> 
> PS: Who is the best female skier currently?
>

I couldn't care less who the best female downhill leg breaker is, it
has nothing to do with this list.

Rowland


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Re: [DNG] netiquette

[Antony Stone]

On Friday 01 December 2017 at 23:10:10, Svante Signell wrote:

> PS: Who is the best female skier currently?

Downhill, slalom, cross-country, or other?

Antony.

-- 
Is it venison for dinner again?  Oh deer.

   Please reply to the list;
 please *don't* CC me.
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