Re: [Dorset] IMAP instead of POP3 in KMail
On Mon, 13 Jun 2016 16:32:07 +0100, d-...@hadrian-way.co.uk said: > Presumably IMAP doesn't work in reverse There are IMAP copy utilities around. In short, you could upload all your local mail to remote IMAP folders, but it would take a bit of work. Unlike others, I abhor Thunderbird - but the beauty of using IMAP is that it doesn't matter what your tastes are in MUAs. So long as you can find one you like, you're fine. -- "Soccer is one of those things that the rest of world cares about more than Americans do - you know, like healthcare, education and gun control" - David Letterman -- Next meeting: Bournemouth, Tuesday, 2016-07-05 20:00 Meets, Mailing list, IRC, LinkedIn, ... http://dorset.lug.org.uk/ New thread: mailto:dorset@mailman.lug.org.uk / CHECK IF YOU'RE REPLYING Reporting bugs well: http://goo.gl/4Xue / TO THE LIST OR THE AUTHOR
Re: [Dorset] IMAP instead of POP3 in KMail
On Monday, 13 June 2016 14:40:16 BST t...@ls83.eclipse.co.uk wrote: > > OK. I think I've got that. Is the end result any different from using > > POP3 and ticking 'Leave the messages on the server'? > > Yes. IMAP is a proper client/server protocol. Your folder structure is > all on the server. Your drafts and sent folders are (if you wish, and no > reason not to) on the server. So you can flit from device to device and > everything is there in one place. e.g. you can work on a draft, continue > working on it from another device. Sounds good. One final question before I try it out. I currently have several thousand messages in my local folders and sub-folders in KMail. Presumably IMAP doesn't work in reverse, so I will have to recreate that folder structure at the server. So I should probably archive them into a separate local folder before I make the change? > If running your own mail server, add in a Caldav/Carddav server like > Davical and your calendar and address book are also on the server and > accessible from any of your devices. Lightning and SOGO connector > add-ins for Thunderbird give client access to these. I have no desire to do that, so I'll let One and One deal with it. -- Terry Coles -- Next meeting: Bournemouth, Tuesday, 2016-07-05 20:00 Meets, Mailing list, IRC, LinkedIn, ... http://dorset.lug.org.uk/ New thread: mailto:dorset@mailman.lug.org.uk / CHECK IF YOU'RE REPLYING Reporting bugs well: http://goo.gl/4Xue / TO THE LIST OR THE AUTHOR
Re: [Dorset] IMAP instead of POP3 in KMail
Hi Terry On 13/06/16 10:26, Terry Coles wrote: Basically, I have three mailboxes (one for commercial comms, one for personal (family, friends, etc) and one for the DLUG (so I could respond to the list from Hotel rooms using only webmail, without the list server barfing at the address I was using). Those three mailboxes service around 100 aliases (simply put; one for each recipient). That way, if I get a surfeit of SPAM, I can kill the alias instead of the mailbox. This has worked well for years. The downside is that this takes a bit of management. KMail helps because it supports mailing lists very seamlessly and if I reply to an incoming message the Reply To address will be the alias that the sender used not the mailbox address, that the account uses. I couldn't get Thunderbird or Evolution to do those things when I tried them. Just tried sending myself emails to two different aliases. Hitting reply uses the alias I sent to, so unless I'm missing something that seems OK. Again, as Keith said, with IMAP all your messages stay on the mail server and are accessible from any of the devices you are using. In the typical case this will be your ISP IMAP server. OK. I think I've got that. Is the end result any different from using POP3 and ticking 'Leave the messages on the server'? Yes. IMAP is a proper client/server protocol. Your folder structure is all on the server. Your drafts and sent folders are (if you wish, and no reason not to) on the server. So you can flit from device to device and everything is there in one place. e.g. you can work on a draft, continue working on it from another device. If running your own mail server, add in a Caldav/Carddav server like Davical and your calendar and address book are also on the server and accessible from any of your devices. Lightning and SOGO connector add-ins for Thunderbird give client access to these. Cheers Tim -- Next meeting: Bournemouth, Tuesday, 2016-07-05 20:00 Meets, Mailing list, IRC, LinkedIn, ... http://dorset.lug.org.uk/ New thread: mailto:dorset@mailman.lug.org.uk / CHECK IF YOU'RE REPLYING Reporting bugs well: http://goo.gl/4Xue / TO THE LIST OR THE AUTHOR
Re: [Dorset] IMAP instead of POP3 in KMail
Hi Peter On 13/06/16 10:35, Peter Merchant wrote: Like Tim, I like Thunderbird. I use it with the lightning add-on to my Google calendar. It sorts incoming mail to the appropriate folder. It manages three email accounts, all set up as Pop3, with the settings to delete mail from the server when read. this aspect doesn't work too well, but I blame the Netscape/yahoo/hotmail servers as occasionally it picks up mail for a second time. The one thing that I miss in Thunderbird is putting emails into draft so that I can review them later before sending. It is not as easy as in my other mail programs. File, Save (or simply Ctrl-s). From this discussion I guess the one thing that would be nice to do would be to filter outgoing mail into folders., But as all the DLUG stuff comes back anyway. Procmail + formail. But Thunderbird may way be able to do this - set up a filter on your Sent folder. I occasionally read emails from these accounts on-line, but they then get picked up by T-bird when I fire it up. If Pop3 is obsolete(?) and IMAP is the current thing, can I reconfigure T-bird to IMAP and still delete emails once read? Yes, by default Delete sends to Trash folder, then Unpunge from trash either manually or on exit. All these are tweakable. Cheers Tim -- Next meeting: Bournemouth, Tuesday, 2016-07-05 20:00 Meets, Mailing list, IRC, LinkedIn, ... http://dorset.lug.org.uk/ New thread: mailto:dorset@mailman.lug.org.uk / CHECK IF YOU'RE REPLYING Reporting bugs well: http://goo.gl/4Xue / TO THE LIST OR THE AUTHOR
Re: [Dorset] IMAP instead of POP3 in KMail
On 13/06/16 10:05, t...@ls83.eclipse.co.uk wrote: Hi Terry On 12/06/16 12:04, Terry Coles wrote: Hi, Sometimes I wonder why I stick with KMail! This morning I made a minor change to the settings of the three mail accounts that I use and KMail proceeded to throw up dozens of errors when I closed the Settings dialog. As Keith said, try something else. I've found Thunderbird to be grief-free for many years. (Actually, I do know why I like KMail; its management of Identities, filtering and other features are better than all of the others I've tried. In particular, I like to archive messages into sub-folders and then get the filters to automatically sort incoming messages into the appropriate folders automatically.) Not sure exactly what identities management features you're after, but Thunderbird has all that. As regards mail sorting, I've always used Procmail. Really long in the tooth but very powerful and completely MUA-agnostic. In addition to sorting incoming mail, I have a cronjob which sorts all my sent messages into the relevant folders every night. My question therefore is this. If I changed from POP3 to IMAP, (to ensure that I can find the messages again in the future using any tool if this happens again) will I still be able to do all these things, bearing in mind that the messages will be retained on the server instead of locally? Again, as Keith said, with IMAP all your messages stay on the mail server and are accessible from any of the devices you are using. In the typical case this will be your ISP IMAP server. If your ISP mailbox size limits are too restrictive or you don't trust your ISP to not lose old messages, you can set up your own IMAP server. Then you can use POP3 to pull messages down from the ISP onto your own server using something like fetchmail. But getting that all set up does require a fair bit of sys admin. Cheers Tim Like Tim, I like Thunderbird. I use it with the lightning add-on to my Google calendar. It sorts incoming mail to the appropriate folder. It manages three email accounts, all set up as Pop3, with the settings to delete mail from the server when read. this aspect doesn't work too well, but I blame the Netscape/yahoo/hotmail servers as occasionally it picks up mail for a second time. The one thing that I miss in Thunderbird is putting emails into draft so that I can review them later before sending. It is not as easy as in my other mail programs. From this discussion I guess the one thing that would be nice to do would be to filter outgoing mail into folders., But as all the DLUG stuff comes back anyway. I occasionally read emails from these accounts on-line, but they then get picked up by T-bird when I fire it up. If Pop3 is obsolete(?) and IMAP is the current thing, can I reconfigure T-bird to IMAP and still delete emails once read? Peter M. -- Next meeting: Bournemouth, Tuesday, 2016-07-05 20:00 Meets, Mailing list, IRC, LinkedIn, ... http://dorset.lug.org.uk/ New thread: mailto:dorset@mailman.lug.org.uk / CHECK IF YOU'RE REPLYING Reporting bugs well: http://goo.gl/4Xue / TO THE LIST OR THE AUTHOR
Re: [Dorset] Printing of extra blank page for PDF's
Hi Ralph
On 13/06/16 10:13, Ralph Corderoy wrote:
when it comes to scaling when printing and the comprehensive scaling
options in Evince are completely missing in Okular.
I don't have a good command-line program for that. pdftk(1) does a
bunch of things, but not N-up printing. psnup(1) means going to
PostScript and back. CUPS offers -o number-up={1,2,4,6,9,16} and I
think it can be configured to print to a PDF? Anyone know of a good
command-line PDF-manipulation program? (Hijacking Clive's thread a
bit.)
pdftk is great but it is a PDF manipulation toolkit rather than a print
tool. cups-pdf is a PDF-printing backend for CUPS.
Cheers
Tim
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Re: [Dorset] IMAP instead of POP3 in KMail
On Monday, 13 June 2016 10:05:02 BST t...@ls83.eclipse.co.uk wrote: > On 12/06/16 12:04, Terry Coles wrote: > > Sometimes I wonder why I stick with KMail! This morning I made a minor > > change to the settings of the three mail accounts that I use and KMail > > proceeded to throw up dozens of errors when I closed the Settings dialog. > > As Keith said, try something else. I've found Thunderbird to be > grief-free for many years. Well. It has been a while since I tried Thunderbird (I also tried Evolution) and went back to KMail because I found its features to be superior. > Not sure exactly what identities management features you're after, but > Thunderbird has all that. As regards mail sorting, I've always used > Procmail. Really long in the tooth but very powerful and completely > MUA-agnostic. In addition to sorting incoming mail, I have a cronjob > which sorts all my sent messages into the relevant folders every night. Basically, I have three mailboxes (one for commercial comms, one for personal (family, friends, etc) and one for the DLUG (so I could respond to the list from Hotel rooms using only webmail, without the list server barfing at the address I was using). Those three mailboxes service around 100 aliases (simply put; one for each recipient). That way, if I get a surfeit of SPAM, I can kill the alias instead of the mailbox. This has worked well for years. The downside is that this takes a bit of management. KMail helps because it supports mailing lists very seamlessly and if I reply to an incoming message the Reply To address will be the alias that the sender used not the mailbox address, that the account uses. I couldn't get Thunderbird or Evolution to do those things when I tried them. > Again, as Keith said, with IMAP all your messages stay on the mail > server and are accessible from any of the devices you are using. In the > typical case this will be your ISP IMAP server. OK. I think I've got that. Is the end result any different from using POP3 and ticking 'Leave the messages on the server'? > If your ISP mailbox size limits are too restrictive or you don't trust > your ISP to not lose old messages, you can set up your own IMAP server. > Then you can use POP3 to pull messages down from the ISP onto your own > server using something like fetchmail. But getting that all set up does > require a fair bit of sys admin. I have a pretty big mailbox; I own the domain and use a SOHO product. -- Terry Coles -- Next meeting: Bournemouth, Tuesday, 2016-07-05 20:00 Meets, Mailing list, IRC, LinkedIn, ... http://dorset.lug.org.uk/ New thread: mailto:dorset@mailman.lug.org.uk / CHECK IF YOU'RE REPLYING Reporting bugs well: http://goo.gl/4Xue / TO THE LIST OR THE AUTHOR
Re: [Dorset] Printing of extra blank page for PDF's
Hi Tim,
> From memory it's associated with the way Evince mishandles duplexing
> (ie it treats a non-duplex printer like Laserjet 6P as a duplex
> printer). Try printing a pdf with an even number of pages to confirm -
> you shouldn't get the blank page.
Perhaps this is what I was remembering; I quizzed Clive in the pub
about odd v. even page documents and he said a blank appeared in both
cases.
> Currently using Evince 3.14.1 (Debian Jessie), and that has issues
> with scaling pages, which disappear if you do a print preview prior to
> printing!
Yesterday's Googling suggested some bugs related to the "scale to fit"
and "rotate to match paper" options as if evince does more intervention
in those cases and gets it wrong.
> Okular is OK
With the move away from Gnome, I've started using mupdf(1). Very fast
rendering. Lots of keyboard control. `3m' sets mark 3, `3t' moves back
to it. Plain `m' pushes the current page on the stack and `t' pops it.
Has somce nice filtering, e.g. greyscale, inverted, and tinting. But I
don't think it prints!
> when it comes to scaling when printing and the comprehensive scaling
> options in Evince are completely missing in Okular.
I don't have a good command-line program for that. pdftk(1) does a
bunch of things, but not N-up printing. psnup(1) means going to
PostScript and back. CUPS offers -o number-up={1,2,4,6,9,16} and I
think it can be configured to print to a PDF? Anyone know of a good
command-line PDF-manipulation program? (Hijacking Clive's thread a
bit.)
Cheers, Ralph.
--
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Re: [Dorset] IMAP instead of POP3 in KMail
Hi Terry On 12/06/16 12:04, Terry Coles wrote: Hi, Sometimes I wonder why I stick with KMail! This morning I made a minor change to the settings of the three mail accounts that I use and KMail proceeded to throw up dozens of errors when I closed the Settings dialog. As Keith said, try something else. I've found Thunderbird to be grief-free for many years. (Actually, I do know why I like KMail; its management of Identities, filtering and other features are better than all of the others I've tried. In particular, I like to archive messages into sub-folders and then get the filters to automatically sort incoming messages into the appropriate folders automatically.) Not sure exactly what identities management features you're after, but Thunderbird has all that. As regards mail sorting, I've always used Procmail. Really long in the tooth but very powerful and completely MUA-agnostic. In addition to sorting incoming mail, I have a cronjob which sorts all my sent messages into the relevant folders every night. My question therefore is this. If I changed from POP3 to IMAP, (to ensure that I can find the messages again in the future using any tool if this happens again) will I still be able to do all these things, bearing in mind that the messages will be retained on the server instead of locally? Again, as Keith said, with IMAP all your messages stay on the mail server and are accessible from any of the devices you are using. In the typical case this will be your ISP IMAP server. If your ISP mailbox size limits are too restrictive or you don't trust your ISP to not lose old messages, you can set up your own IMAP server. Then you can use POP3 to pull messages down from the ISP onto your own server using something like fetchmail. But getting that all set up does require a fair bit of sys admin. Cheers Tim -- Next meeting: Bournemouth, Tuesday, 2016-07-05 20:00 Meets, Mailing list, IRC, LinkedIn, ... http://dorset.lug.org.uk/ New thread: mailto:dorset@mailman.lug.org.uk / CHECK IF YOU'RE REPLYING Reporting bugs well: http://goo.gl/4Xue / TO THE LIST OR THE AUTHOR
Re: [Dorset] Printing of extra blank page for PDF's
Hi Clive On 11/06/16 22:50, C Wills wrote: Info for Ralph and others:- At the last DLUG meeting I asked if anyone was having trouble when printing a PDF, as every time I print a PDf it produces a blank page after the last page ( a blank does not show on any print preview). Ralph had a look but all the usual suggestions did not provide an answer. Tonight I tried changing the default reader from Evince to Ocular and no extra page was printed! To confirm I printed the same file again with Evince - blank page printed! I've not been able to find any setup options/properties in Evince; so my default is now Ocular. If anyone can tell me if there is a setup in Evince for PDFs I'll try going back to the supported default. System used is Cinnamon Mint 17.3 I've seen this in the past. Each new version of Evince seems to introduce a new set of printing bugs. Although it's a couple of Debian (stable) releases back that I saw this. From memory it's associated with the way Evince mishandles duplexing (ie it treats a non-duplex printer like Laserjet 6P as a duplex printer). Try printing a pdf with an even number of pages to confirm - you shouldn't get the blank page. Currently using Evince 3.14.1 (Debian Jessie), and that has issues with scaling pages, which disappear if you do a print preview prior to printing! But the blank page problem is fixed. Okular is OK, but the biggest limitation is that it decides what to do when it comes to scaling when printing and the comprehensive scaling options in Evince are completely missing in Okular. So it's no good for printing things like sheets of labels. Okular is also very easy to set up with synctex if you happen to use LaTeX for writing documents. Then there's Xpdf. I've found that it is unable to print many PDF's at all. The other option is to print straight to CUPS: lpr -P printername file.pdf Cheers Tim -- Next meeting: Bournemouth, Tuesday, 2016-07-05 20:00 Meets, Mailing list, IRC, LinkedIn, ... http://dorset.lug.org.uk/ New thread: mailto:dorset@mailman.lug.org.uk / CHECK IF YOU'RE REPLYING Reporting bugs well: http://goo.gl/4Xue / TO THE LIST OR THE AUTHOR
