Re: [ECOLOG-L] HUMPBACK WHALE RESEARCH ON THE GREAT BARRIER REEF,AUSTRALIA (JULY-SEPT 2017) ? RESEARCH ASSISTANT OPPORTUNITIES

[cruzan]

The worst part is that many of these organizations promise research 
engagement. Any use of the terms "internship" or "research" promises an 
intellectually stimulating experience that goes beyond just raw data 
collection. The problem is that many of these organizations (including 
several in Central America) are nothing more than tourist companies 
trying to make money off of students who are passionate about 
conservation issues. These organizations are nothing short of predators 
that take advantage of college students to make money. They are not 
interested in research and they do not typically have scientists on 
their staff. Students are lured in by promises of "contributing to 
conservation of" but they end up doing nothing more than data 
collection for no particular purpose.


In my opinion these predatory organizations should be banned from 
posting on EcoLog and Evoldir. I also run an email list service for 
undergraduates - Biology Opportunities at Portland State University (a 
Google Group with 500+ followers) - that focuses on all sorts of 
volunteer and paid positions (plus field stations), with a focus on 
positions in OR and the PNW. I try to filter out the ones that charge 
for participation, but it is not always easy to tell without some 
digging. I encourage anyone advising undergraduates looking for research 
experiences to caution them to avoid these predatory organizations.


Mitch Cruzan
On 3/23/2017 6:55 PM, Zeenal wrote:

Hi Emily,
I do understand of the need for the project and the funding for its 
execution. But I have volunteered before and volunteering itself means 
unpaid. But it does not mean pay and volunteer, that's just asking for 
funds indirectly. I joined this list to understand and work with 
researchers of the world so that it could help me help the wildlife 
and the environment. Joining such lists should be a booster for 
students and exciting as well. Learning and helping is what 
researchers and organisation should seek. I am from India and that 
much amount is a lot. I mean in that much amount, I could possibly do 
a short term course than volunteer. Stipend or no stipend, 
accommodation and food is/has been done by the organisation or the 
researchers seeking interns. And I don't think even the hosting 
country students would be able to afford it. We already pay a hefty 
amount for the education and then even pay for volunteering? That's a 
big disappointment for students who are so capable and talented but 
cannot afford. I liked that program as I wanted to experience marine 
life so that I can understand it more. In my country, interns are paid 
by managing the food and accommodation and after completion, 
reimbursement of the travel but the students get a good experience. 
That's how it should work. Those who can afford, well, they earn too 
to spend on such volunteering.


Zeenal.

From: Emily Moran <mailto:emor...@ucmerced.edu>
Sent: ‎24-‎03-‎2017 00:12
To: ECOLOG-L@LISTSERV.UMD.EDU <mailto:ECOLOG-L@LISTSERV.UMD.EDU>
Subject: Re: [ECOLOG-L] HUMPBACK WHALE RESEARCH ON THE GREAT BARRIER 
REEF,AUSTRALIA (JULY-SEPT 2017) ? RESEARCH ASSISTANT OPPORTUNITIES


I have been collecting paid research/work experience postings from 
this list to forward to my undergraduate students (so that they can at 
least get an idea of the opportunities that are out there if they are 
interested), and fortunately there are a lot of them.  It seems like 
most people doing research in the USA are offering $10-15/hour for 
assistant/technician positions.  There are also a fair number of 
postings for REU positions that don’t necessarily pay a lot but 
usually at least cover living expenses (with maybe some stipend left 
over depending on local cost of living).


It is unclear what the situation is for projects in other countries - 
perhaps Zeenal and others on this list from outside of the US could 
speak to that.  The internships or training programs I have noticed on 
this listserve that are unpaid and/or actually require the student to 
pay seem to be mostly in more “exotic” locations (eg. mostly 
rainforest and marine).  In some cases the rationale may be that 
running these programs (including transporting people and supplies to 
the field site) is so expensive that contributions from participants 
are needed for it to happen at all.  I’m not sure if this is the case 
for the posting that sparked this debate, as in this case the 
organizing institution seems to be fairly close to the field site.


If it starts to seem impossible to get experience in a particular 
field unless you have the funds to support yourself during an 
internship and/or pay a hefty fee, that is a very bad thing for 
students and for the field in general.  While that doesn’t seem to be 
the case for, say, temperate-zone pollinator ecology or forestry, it 
could very well be a proble

Re: [ECOLOG-L] HUMPBACK WHALE RESEARCH ON THE GREAT BARRIER REEF,AUSTRALIA (JULY-SEPT 2017) ? RESEARCH ASSISTANT OPPORTUNITIES

[Zeenal]

Hi Emily,
I do understand of the need for the project and the funding for its execution. 
But I have volunteered before and volunteering itself means unpaid. But it does 
not mean pay and volunteer, that's just asking for funds indirectly. I joined 
this list to understand and work with researchers of the world so that it could 
help me help the wildlife and the environment. Joining such lists should be a 
booster for students and exciting as well. Learning and helping is what 
researchers and organisation should seek. I am from India and that much amount 
is a lot. I mean in that much amount, I could possibly do a short term course 
than volunteer. Stipend or no stipend, accommodation and food is/has been done 
by the organisation or the researchers seeking interns. And I don't think even 
the hosting country students would be able to afford it. We already pay a hefty 
amount for the education and then even pay for volunteering? That's a big 
disappointment for students who are so capable and talented but cannot afford. 
I liked that program as I wanted to experience marine life so that I can 
understand it more. In my country, interns are paid by managing the food and 
accommodation and after completion, reimbursement of the travel but the 
students get a good experience. That's how it should work. Those who can 
afford, well, they earn too to spend on such volunteering. 

Zeenal.

-Original Message-
From: "Emily Moran" <emor...@ucmerced.edu>
Sent: ‎24-‎03-‎2017 00:12
To: "ECOLOG-L@LISTSERV.UMD.EDU" <ECOLOG-L@LISTSERV.UMD.EDU>
Subject: Re: [ECOLOG-L] HUMPBACK WHALE RESEARCH ON THE GREAT BARRIER 
REEF,AUSTRALIA (JULY-SEPT 2017) ? RESEARCH ASSISTANT OPPORTUNITIES

I have been collecting paid research/work experience postings from this list to 
forward to my undergraduate students (so that they can at least get an idea of 
the opportunities that are out there if they are interested), and fortunately 
there are a lot of them.  It seems like most people doing research in the USA 
are offering $10-15/hour for assistant/technician positions.  There are also a 
fair number of postings for REU positions that don’t necessarily pay a lot but 
usually at least cover living expenses (with maybe some stipend left over 
depending on local cost of living). 


It is unclear what the situation is for projects in other countries - perhaps 
Zeenal and others on this list from outside of the US could speak to that.  The 
internships or training programs I have noticed on this listserve that are 
unpaid and/or actually require the student to pay seem to be mostly in more 
“exotic” locations (eg. mostly rainforest and marine).  In some cases the 
rationale may be that running these programs (including transporting people and 
supplies to the field site) is so expensive that contributions from 
participants are needed for it to happen at all.  I’m not sure if this is the 
case for the posting that sparked this debate, as in this case the organizing 
institution seems to be fairly close to the field site.  


If it starts to seem impossible to get experience in a particular field unless 
you have the funds to support yourself during an internship and/or pay a hefty 
fee, that is a very bad thing for students and for the field in general.  While 
that doesn’t seem to be the case for, say, temperate-zone pollinator ecology or 
forestry, it could very well be a problem for tropical ecology and/or 
“charismatic megafauna” studies where the high cost of studies and the 
availability of people willing to pay to experience those environments could be 
tempting more and more study organizers to go this route.  And that can lead to 
exploitation of students who can’t really afford these fees but really want to 
go into that area of research.


Having some pay-to-learn or unpaid internships available is not necessarily a 
bad thing - “Voluntourism” seems to be growing in demand as people seek out 
more meaningful things to do on their vacations, and that can help an 
underfunded project get enough workers to carry on.   But I definitely agree 
that unpaid or pay-to-learn internships should be clearly labeled as such.


Moreover, we should as a research community have more discussions about how to 
keep our projects running without exploiting student labor.  It can be 
difficult in a funding environment where a 20% success rate is terrific, and 
where grant sizes seem to increase slower than the amount of things you are 
expected to do with that money - but it is important.  Perhaps we need to make 
stronger arguments to our elected leaders about the immediate economic benefits 
of research funding.  That is, besides leading to new knowledge that could be 
important down the road, and training the next generation of scientists, a huge 
chunk of many grants goes toward employing people right now.  Students are not 
only learning skills that will make them more successful in the future, they 

Re: [ECOLOG-L] HUMPBACK WHALE RESEARCH ON THE GREAT BARRIER REEF, AUSTRALIA (JULY-SEPT 2017) ? RESEARCH ASSISTANT OPPORTUNITIES

[Katharine Catelotti]

Hi Lara,

I'm looking to do volunteer work in the Caribbean and haven't found much 
available (or have sent emails and had no reply) could you please do a quick 
name drop for me?

All the best

Katharine

> On 24 Mar 2017, at 4:37 am, Lara Brenner  wrote:
> 
> When I see posts like this, I interpret it as an exorbitantly expensive 
> vacation to the Great Barrier Reef. No one seriously interested in a career 
> in marine biology should ever think of doing something like this. For $3000 
> you could live for months in the Caribbean doing volunteer work that will 
> actually give you marketable skills. I think it's fine to advertise something 
> like this but ethically it should be marketed to tourists, not aspiring 
> biologists.
> 
> Even better would be to compensate people financially if you expect them to 
> work. If your budget doesn't allow for that, adjust your expectations 
> (shorter work days, less experienced field techs) and provide housing/a food 
> stipend/other benefits.
> 
> We need to do everything we can to ensure that careers in conservation are 
> possible for people who don't come from wealth and wealthy nations.
> 
> -Lara
> 
>> On Thu, Mar 23, 2017 at 11:01 AM, Annette Narzynski 
>>  wrote:
>> I am happy to see this being discussed. A similar discussion has recently 
>> started in Coral List. Steven Carrion has made an interesting point about 
>> the role that the listserv itself plays on these kind of posts. I think it 
>> would also be valuable to discuss what  aspiring scientists, professors, 
>> researchers, and those involved in hiring can do regarding the issues 
>> associated with positions like these. 
>> 
>>> On Thu, Mar 23, 2017 at 9:08 AM, John Anderson  wrote:
>>> Very much agree with Steve's post here. Given the already high cost of 
>>> university, this seems sheer exploitation. Is also a really interesting 
>>> demonstration of the "charismatic megafauna " issue in conservation...
>>> 
 On Thu, Mar 23, 2017 at 6:54 AM CARRION Steven  
 wrote:
 The whole "unpaid" vs "paid" vs "exploitative" internships discussion has 
 been discussed in ECOLOG before but I had to bring it up again after 
 seeing this post.
 
 A "research assistant" position wherein students have to pay a almost 3 
 grand to participate in an activity less than a week? And this covers 
 accommodation and food? This amount of money is what people pay to go on 
 luxury cruises. This seems like it's a way to fund the organization's 
 research costs while being provided with freely given labor. Exploitative 
 is the nicest way I can put that.
 
 I don't think these types of posts should have a place on academic list 
 serv. or if they are included they should more accurately be called 
 for-profit/paid volunteering.
 
 Best Regards,
 
 Steven Carrion
 University of Edinburgh
 
 > On Mar 23, 2017, at 1:16 AM, Lesley Douglas 
 >  wrote:
 >
 > The Great Barrier Reef Whale and Dolphin Research Programme is led by
 > Blue Planet Marine and operated in collaboration with the Cetacean
 > Ecology and Acoustics Laboratory at The University of Queensland,
 > Australia. http://gbr.blueplanetmarine.com.
 >
 > Running from July to September 2017, there are opportunities for
 > Research Assistants (RAs) to join the Programme. As a RA, you will work
 > in an exceptional location with world leading scientists. You?ll be
 > exposed to a variety of research techniques, including: the latest in
 > genetic sampling; acoustic recording of social sounds and whale song;
 > behavioural observations; video recordings; and photo-identification.
 > You?ll be involved in data management, and in the day-to-day activities
 > of the research vessels.
 >
 > The Programme is based on a live-aboard research vessel in and around
 > the world-famous Whitsunday Islands. The aim of the Programme is to
 > collect data on the breeding sub-stocks of south west Pacific humpback
 > whales. These data are important because organisations such as the
 > Scientific Committee of the International Whaling Commission don?t have
 > enough information to make decisions on whether these breeding sub-
 > stocks should be managed together or as separate populations. The IWC
 > Scientific Committee has even identified the collection of these data as
 > highest priority research for these populations of whales. The Programme
 > is targeted, it?s scientifically robust, it?s relevant and
 > it?s exciting.
 >
 > The Programme will:
 > * Identify areas of the Great Barrier Reef that are most important
 > for humpback whale breeding activities;
 > * Gather information regarding the structure of the east
 > Australian 

Re: [ECOLOG-L] HUMPBACK WHALE RESEARCH ON THE GREAT BARRIER REEF, AUSTRALIA (JULY-SEPT 2017) ? RESEARCH ASSISTANT OPPORTUNITIES

[Lara Brenner]

When I see posts like this, I interpret it as an exorbitantly expensive
vacation to the Great Barrier Reef. No one seriously interested in a career
in marine biology should ever think of doing something like this. For $3000
you could live for months in the Caribbean doing volunteer work that will
actually give you marketable skills. I think it's fine to advertise
something like this but ethically it should be marketed to tourists, not
aspiring biologists.

Even better would be to compensate people financially if you expect them to
work. If your budget doesn't allow for that, adjust your expectations
(shorter work days, less experienced field techs) and provide housing/a
food stipend/other benefits.

We need to do everything we can to ensure that careers in conservation are
possible for people who don't come from wealth and wealthy nations.

-Lara

On Thu, Mar 23, 2017 at 11:01 AM, Annette Narzynski <
anarzynski2...@my.fit.edu> wrote:

> I am happy to see this being discussed. A similar discussion has recently
> started in Coral List. Steven Carrion has made an interesting point about
> the role that the listserv itself plays on these kind of posts. I think it
> would also be valuable to discuss what  aspiring scientists, professors,
> researchers, and those involved in hiring can do regarding the issues
> associated with positions like these.
>
> On Thu, Mar 23, 2017 at 9:08 AM, John Anderson  wrote:
>
>> Very much agree with Steve's post here. Given the already high cost of
>> university, this seems sheer exploitation. Is also a really interesting
>> demonstration of the "charismatic megafauna " issue in conservation...
>>
>> On Thu, Mar 23, 2017 at 6:54 AM CARRION Steven 
>> wrote:
>>
>>> The whole "unpaid" vs "paid" vs "exploitative" internships discussion
>>> has been discussed in ECOLOG before but I had to bring it up again after
>>> seeing this post.
>>>
>>> A "research assistant" position wherein students have to pay a almost 3
>>> grand to participate in an activity less than a week? And this covers
>>> accommodation and food? This amount of money is what people pay to go on
>>> luxury cruises. This seems like it's a way to fund the organization's
>>> research costs while being provided with freely given labor. Exploitative
>>> is the nicest way I can put that.
>>>
>>> I don't think these types of posts should have a place on academic list
>>> serv. or if they are included they should more accurately be called
>>> for-profit/paid volunteering.
>>>
>>> Best Regards,
>>>
>>> Steven Carrion
>>> University of Edinburgh
>>>
>>> > On Mar 23, 2017, at 1:16 AM, Lesley Douglas <
>>> lesley.doug...@blueplanetmarine.com> wrote:
>>> >
>>> > The Great Barrier Reef Whale and Dolphin Research Programme is led by
>>> > Blue Planet Marine and operated in collaboration with the Cetacean
>>> > Ecology and Acoustics Laboratory at The University of Queensland,
>>> > Australia. http://gbr.blueplanetmarine.com.
>>> >
>>> > Running from July to September 2017, there are opportunities for
>>> > Research Assistants (RAs) to join the Programme. As a RA, you will work
>>> > in an exceptional location with world leading scientists. You?ll be
>>> > exposed to a variety of research techniques, including: the latest in
>>> > genetic sampling; acoustic recording of social sounds and whale song;
>>> > behavioural observations; video recordings; and photo-identification.
>>> > You?ll be involved in data management, and in the day-to-day activities
>>> > of the research vessels.
>>> >
>>> > The Programme is based on a live-aboard research vessel in and around
>>> > the world-famous Whitsunday Islands. The aim of the Programme is to
>>> > collect data on the breeding sub-stocks of south west Pacific humpback
>>> > whales. These data are important because organisations such as the
>>> > Scientific Committee of the International Whaling Commission don?t have
>>> > enough information to make decisions on whether these breeding sub-
>>> > stocks should be managed together or as separate populations. The IWC
>>> > Scientific Committee has even identified the collection of these data
>>> as
>>> > highest priority research for these populations of whales. The
>>> Programme
>>> > is targeted, it?s scientifically robust, it?s relevant and
>>> > it?s exciting.
>>> >
>>> > The Programme will:
>>> > * Identify areas of the Great Barrier Reef that are most important
>>> > for humpback whale breeding activities;
>>> > * Gather information regarding the structure of the east
>>> > Australian humpback whale sub-stock; and
>>> > * Gain a better understanding of whale acoustic communication and
>>> > the potential for anthropogenic impacts within the breeding grounds of
>>> > the Great Barrier Reef.
>>> >
>>> > This is a great opportunity to: gain valuable experience and skills to
>>> > further your career with marine mammals; make valuable connections with
>>> > some of the world?s most respected humpback 

Re: [ECOLOG-L] HUMPBACK WHALE RESEARCH ON THE GREAT BARRIER REEF, AUSTRALIA (JULY-SEPT 2017) ? RESEARCH ASSISTANT OPPORTUNITIES

[Victoria Lukasik]

Thank you, Steven, for sharing your thoughts on paid-volunteer positions. I
am often discouraged and frustrated by such positions. I understand that
they can be a way to fund a project, but it really undervalues the whole
field, not to mention that it gives those people who are financially
privileged an upper-hand by giving them access to field experiences that
the rest of us can't even consider based on our financial situations. In
fact, a position like this makes it more important to have money than to
have an education. When I was an undergraduate student, I found it hard
enough just to afford to forego a salary, never mind paying to volunteer on
a project. The fact that you can have experience and a PhD and only get
paid around $35,000 for some post-docs is, I believe, related to the kind
of thinking behind these kinds of positions. Exploitation is definitely
right. The whole thing is absurd, and it pushes out people who are
hard-working but don't have external financial support (e.g. from family)
to fall back on.

I fully support Steven's suggestions about such postings on this listserv.

Sincerely,

Victoria

---
Victoria Lukasik, MSc
PhD Candidate
University of Calgary



On 22 March 2017 at 19:27, CARRION Steven  wrote:

> The whole "unpaid" vs "paid" vs "exploitative" internships discussion has
> been discussed in ECOLOG before but I had to bring it up again after seeing
> this post.
>
> A "research assistant" position wherein students have to pay a almost 3
> grand to participate in an activity less than a week? And this covers
> accommodation and food? This amount of money is what people pay to go on
> luxury cruises. This seems like it's a way to fund the organization's
> research costs while being provided with freely given labor. Exploitative
> is the nicest way I can put that.
>
> I don't think these types of posts should have a place on academic list
> serv. or if they are included they should more accurately be called
> for-profit/paid volunteering.
>
> Best Regards,
>
> Steven Carrion
> University of Edinburgh
>
> > On Mar 23, 2017, at 1:16 AM, Lesley Douglas  BLUEPLANETMARINE.COM> wrote:
> >
> > The Great Barrier Reef Whale and Dolphin Research Programme is led by
> > Blue Planet Marine and operated in collaboration with the Cetacean
> > Ecology and Acoustics Laboratory at The University of Queensland,
> > Australia. http://gbr.blueplanetmarine.com.
> >
> > Running from July to September 2017, there are opportunities for
> > Research Assistants (RAs) to join the Programme. As a RA, you will work
> > in an exceptional location with world leading scientists. You?ll be
> > exposed to a variety of research techniques, including: the latest in
> > genetic sampling; acoustic recording of social sounds and whale song;
> > behavioural observations; video recordings; and photo-identification.
> > You?ll be involved in data management, and in the day-to-day activities
> > of the research vessels.
> >
> > The Programme is based on a live-aboard research vessel in and around
> > the world-famous Whitsunday Islands. The aim of the Programme is to
> > collect data on the breeding sub-stocks of south west Pacific humpback
> > whales. These data are important because organisations such as the
> > Scientific Committee of the International Whaling Commission don?t have
> > enough information to make decisions on whether these breeding sub-
> > stocks should be managed together or as separate populations. The IWC
> > Scientific Committee has even identified the collection of these data as
> > highest priority research for these populations of whales. The Programme
> > is targeted, it?s scientifically robust, it?s relevant and
> > it?s exciting.
> >
> > The Programme will:
> > * Identify areas of the Great Barrier Reef that are most important
> > for humpback whale breeding activities;
> > * Gather information regarding the structure of the east
> > Australian humpback whale sub-stock; and
> > * Gain a better understanding of whale acoustic communication and
> > the potential for anthropogenic impacts within the breeding grounds of
> > the Great Barrier Reef.
> >
> > This is a great opportunity to: gain valuable experience and skills to
> > further your career with marine mammals; make valuable connections with
> > some of the world?s most respected humpback whale researchers; work on a
> > meaningful research programme; and experience one of the seven wonders
> > of the natural world.
> >
> > * The participation fee for a six-day research trip is $2,995
> > Australian dollars, including tax.
> > * The participation fee for a twelve-day research trip is $5,690
> > Australian dollars, including tax.
> >
> > If you pay on or before 14 April 2017, you?ll receive an early-bird
> > discount of $300 Australian dollars off the Programme fee for each trip
> > booked.
> >
> > The Programme fee covers accommodation and food aboard the research
> > vessel. RAs are responsible 

Re: [ECOLOG-L] HUMPBACK WHALE RESEARCH ON THE GREAT BARRIER REEF, AUSTRALIA (JULY-SEPT 2017) ? RESEARCH ASSISTANT OPPORTUNITIES

[Emily Moran]

I have been collecting paid research/work experience postings from this list to 
forward to my undergraduate students (so that they can at least get an idea of 
the opportunities that are out there if they are interested), and fortunately 
there are a lot of them.  It seems like most people doing research in the USA 
are offering $10-15/hour for assistant/technician positions.  There are also a 
fair number of postings for REU positions that don’t necessarily pay a lot but 
usually at least cover living expenses (with maybe some stipend left over 
depending on local cost of living).

It is unclear what the situation is for projects in other countries - perhaps 
Zeenal and others on this list from outside of the US could speak to that.  The 
internships or training programs I have noticed on this listserve that are 
unpaid and/or actually require the student to pay seem to be mostly in more 
“exotic” locations (eg. mostly rainforest and marine).  In some cases the 
rationale may be that running these programs (including transporting people and 
supplies to the field site) is so expensive that contributions from 
participants are needed for it to happen at all.  I’m not sure if this is the 
case for the posting that sparked this debate, as in this case the organizing 
institution seems to be fairly close to the field site.

If it starts to seem impossible to get experience in a particular field unless 
you have the funds to support yourself during an internship and/or pay a hefty 
fee, that is a very bad thing for students and for the field in general.  While 
that doesn’t seem to be the case for, say, temperate-zone pollinator ecology or 
forestry, it could very well be a problem for tropical ecology and/or 
“charismatic megafauna” studies where the high cost of studies and the 
availability of people willing to pay to experience those environments could be 
tempting more and more study organizers to go this route.  And that can lead to 
exploitation of students who can’t really afford these fees but really want to 
go into that area of research.

Having some pay-to-learn or unpaid internships available is not necessarily a 
bad thing - “Voluntourism” seems to be growing in demand as people seek out 
more meaningful things to do on their vacations, and that can help an 
underfunded project get enough workers to carry on.   But I definitely agree 
that unpaid or pay-to-learn internships should be clearly labeled as such.

Moreover, we should as a research community have more discussions about how to 
keep our projects running without exploiting student labor.  It can be 
difficult in a funding environment where a 20% success rate is terrific, and 
where grant sizes seem to increase slower than the amount of things you are 
expected to do with that money - but it is important.  Perhaps we need to make 
stronger arguments to our elected leaders about the immediate economic benefits 
of research funding.  That is, besides leading to new knowledge that could be 
important down the road, and training the next generation of scientists, a huge 
chunk of many grants goes toward employing people right now.  Students are not 
only learning skills that will make them more successful in the future, they 
are getting cash they can spend in their local communities.  I don’t know how 
much impact that argument would have, but I haven’t seen it made much, and it 
would be interesting to try.

Emily Moran
UC Merced


On Mar 23, 2017, at 10:01 AM, Annette Narzynski 
> wrote:

I am happy to see this being discussed. A similar discussion has recently 
started in Coral List. Steven Carrion has made an interesting point about the 
role that the listserv itself plays on these kind of posts. I think it would 
also be valuable to discuss what  aspiring scientists, professors, researchers, 
and those involved in hiring can do regarding the issues associated with 
positions like these.

On Thu, Mar 23, 2017 at 9:08 AM, John Anderson 
> wrote:
Very much agree with Steve's post here. Given the already high cost of 
university, this seems sheer exploitation. Is also a really interesting 
demonstration of the "charismatic megafauna " issue in conservation...

On Thu, Mar 23, 2017 at 6:54 AM CARRION Steven 
> wrote:
The whole "unpaid" vs "paid" vs "exploitative" internships discussion has been 
discussed in ECOLOG before but I had to bring it up again after seeing this 
post.

A "research assistant" position wherein students have to pay a almost 3 grand 
to participate in an activity less than a week? And this covers accommodation 
and food? This amount of money is what people pay to go on luxury cruises. This 
seems like it's a way to fund the organization's research costs while being 
provided with freely given labor. Exploitative is the nicest way I can put that.

I don't think 

Re: [ECOLOG-L] HUMPBACK WHALE RESEARCH ON THE GREAT BARRIER REEF, AUSTRALIA (JULY-SEPT 2017) ? RESEARCH ASSISTANT OPPORTUNITIES

[Annette Narzynski]

I am happy to see this being discussed. A similar discussion has recently
started in Coral List. Steven Carrion has made an interesting point about
the role that the listserv itself plays on these kind of posts. I think it
would also be valuable to discuss what  aspiring scientists, professors,
researchers, and those involved in hiring can do regarding the issues
associated with positions like these.

On Thu, Mar 23, 2017 at 9:08 AM, John Anderson  wrote:

> Very much agree with Steve's post here. Given the already high cost of
> university, this seems sheer exploitation. Is also a really interesting
> demonstration of the "charismatic megafauna " issue in conservation...
>
> On Thu, Mar 23, 2017 at 6:54 AM CARRION Steven 
> wrote:
>
>> The whole "unpaid" vs "paid" vs "exploitative" internships discussion has
>> been discussed in ECOLOG before but I had to bring it up again after seeing
>> this post.
>>
>> A "research assistant" position wherein students have to pay a almost 3
>> grand to participate in an activity less than a week? And this covers
>> accommodation and food? This amount of money is what people pay to go on
>> luxury cruises. This seems like it's a way to fund the organization's
>> research costs while being provided with freely given labor. Exploitative
>> is the nicest way I can put that.
>>
>> I don't think these types of posts should have a place on academic list
>> serv. or if they are included they should more accurately be called
>> for-profit/paid volunteering.
>>
>> Best Regards,
>>
>> Steven Carrion
>> University of Edinburgh
>>
>> > On Mar 23, 2017, at 1:16 AM, Lesley Douglas > BLUEPLANETMARINE.COM> wrote:
>> >
>> > The Great Barrier Reef Whale and Dolphin Research Programme is led by
>> > Blue Planet Marine and operated in collaboration with the Cetacean
>> > Ecology and Acoustics Laboratory at The University of Queensland,
>> > Australia. http://gbr.blueplanetmarine.com.
>> >
>> > Running from July to September 2017, there are opportunities for
>> > Research Assistants (RAs) to join the Programme. As a RA, you will work
>> > in an exceptional location with world leading scientists. You?ll be
>> > exposed to a variety of research techniques, including: the latest in
>> > genetic sampling; acoustic recording of social sounds and whale song;
>> > behavioural observations; video recordings; and photo-identification.
>> > You?ll be involved in data management, and in the day-to-day activities
>> > of the research vessels.
>> >
>> > The Programme is based on a live-aboard research vessel in and around
>> > the world-famous Whitsunday Islands. The aim of the Programme is to
>> > collect data on the breeding sub-stocks of south west Pacific humpback
>> > whales. These data are important because organisations such as the
>> > Scientific Committee of the International Whaling Commission don?t have
>> > enough information to make decisions on whether these breeding sub-
>> > stocks should be managed together or as separate populations. The IWC
>> > Scientific Committee has even identified the collection of these data as
>> > highest priority research for these populations of whales. The Programme
>> > is targeted, it?s scientifically robust, it?s relevant and
>> > it?s exciting.
>> >
>> > The Programme will:
>> > * Identify areas of the Great Barrier Reef that are most important
>> > for humpback whale breeding activities;
>> > * Gather information regarding the structure of the east
>> > Australian humpback whale sub-stock; and
>> > * Gain a better understanding of whale acoustic communication and
>> > the potential for anthropogenic impacts within the breeding grounds of
>> > the Great Barrier Reef.
>> >
>> > This is a great opportunity to: gain valuable experience and skills to
>> > further your career with marine mammals; make valuable connections with
>> > some of the world?s most respected humpback whale researchers; work on a
>> > meaningful research programme; and experience one of the seven wonders
>> > of the natural world.
>> >
>> > * The participation fee for a six-day research trip is $2,995
>> > Australian dollars, including tax.
>> > * The participation fee for a twelve-day research trip is $5,690
>> > Australian dollars, including tax.
>> >
>> > If you pay on or before 14 April 2017, you?ll receive an early-bird
>> > discount of $300 Australian dollars off the Programme fee for each trip
>> > booked.
>> >
>> > The Programme fee covers accommodation and food aboard the research
>> > vessel. RAs are responsible for all costs associated with travel to and
>> > from the Programme.
>> >
>> > No prior experience is necessary and training will be provided.
>> > Preference will be given, however, to individuals involved in marine
>> > mammal science courses or related institutions and/or with prior
>> > volunteer marine mammal field experience. Places are limited to ten RAs
>> > on each research trip.
>> >
>> > To find 

Re: [ECOLOG-L] HUMPBACK WHALE RESEARCH ON THE GREAT BARRIER REEF, AUSTRALIA (JULY-SEPT 2017) ? RESEARCH ASSISTANT OPPORTUNITIES

[John Anderson]

Very much agree with Steve's post here. Given the already high cost of
university, this seems sheer exploitation. Is also a really interesting
demonstration of the "charismatic megafauna " issue in conservation...
On Thu, Mar 23, 2017 at 6:54 AM CARRION Steven 
wrote:

> The whole "unpaid" vs "paid" vs "exploitative" internships discussion has
> been discussed in ECOLOG before but I had to bring it up again after seeing
> this post.
>
> A "research assistant" position wherein students have to pay a almost 3
> grand to participate in an activity less than a week? And this covers
> accommodation and food? This amount of money is what people pay to go on
> luxury cruises. This seems like it's a way to fund the organization's
> research costs while being provided with freely given labor. Exploitative
> is the nicest way I can put that.
>
> I don't think these types of posts should have a place on academic list
> serv. or if they are included they should more accurately be called
> for-profit/paid volunteering.
>
> Best Regards,
>
> Steven Carrion
> University of Edinburgh
>
> > On Mar 23, 2017, at 1:16 AM, Lesley Douglas <
> lesley.doug...@blueplanetmarine.com> wrote:
> >
> > The Great Barrier Reef Whale and Dolphin Research Programme is led by
> > Blue Planet Marine and operated in collaboration with the Cetacean
> > Ecology and Acoustics Laboratory at The University of Queensland,
> > Australia. http://gbr.blueplanetmarine.com.
> >
> > Running from July to September 2017, there are opportunities for
> > Research Assistants (RAs) to join the Programme. As a RA, you will work
> > in an exceptional location with world leading scientists. You?ll be
> > exposed to a variety of research techniques, including: the latest in
> > genetic sampling; acoustic recording of social sounds and whale song;
> > behavioural observations; video recordings; and photo-identification.
> > You?ll be involved in data management, and in the day-to-day activities
> > of the research vessels.
> >
> > The Programme is based on a live-aboard research vessel in and around
> > the world-famous Whitsunday Islands. The aim of the Programme is to
> > collect data on the breeding sub-stocks of south west Pacific humpback
> > whales. These data are important because organisations such as the
> > Scientific Committee of the International Whaling Commission don?t have
> > enough information to make decisions on whether these breeding sub-
> > stocks should be managed together or as separate populations. The IWC
> > Scientific Committee has even identified the collection of these data as
> > highest priority research for these populations of whales. The Programme
> > is targeted, it?s scientifically robust, it?s relevant and
> > it?s exciting.
> >
> > The Programme will:
> > * Identify areas of the Great Barrier Reef that are most important
> > for humpback whale breeding activities;
> > * Gather information regarding the structure of the east
> > Australian humpback whale sub-stock; and
> > * Gain a better understanding of whale acoustic communication and
> > the potential for anthropogenic impacts within the breeding grounds of
> > the Great Barrier Reef.
> >
> > This is a great opportunity to: gain valuable experience and skills to
> > further your career with marine mammals; make valuable connections with
> > some of the world?s most respected humpback whale researchers; work on a
> > meaningful research programme; and experience one of the seven wonders
> > of the natural world.
> >
> > * The participation fee for a six-day research trip is $2,995
> > Australian dollars, including tax.
> > * The participation fee for a twelve-day research trip is $5,690
> > Australian dollars, including tax.
> >
> > If you pay on or before 14 April 2017, you?ll receive an early-bird
> > discount of $300 Australian dollars off the Programme fee for each trip
> > booked.
> >
> > The Programme fee covers accommodation and food aboard the research
> > vessel. RAs are responsible for all costs associated with travel to and
> > from the Programme.
> >
> > No prior experience is necessary and training will be provided.
> > Preference will be given, however, to individuals involved in marine
> > mammal science courses or related institutions and/or with prior
> > volunteer marine mammal field experience. Places are limited to ten RAs
> > on each research trip.
> >
> > To find out more about The Great Barrier Reef Whale and Dolphin Research
> > Project (including the dates of research trips) visit:
> > http://gbr.blueplanetmarine.com or read the attached brochure. You can
> > secure your place today by paying online.
> >
> > Best regards,
> > Lesley
> >
> > Lesley Douglas, MSC.
> > Marine Scientist | Nelson Office| Ph: +64 (0)27 631-9000 |
> > Email: lesley.doug...@blueplanetmarine.com | www.blueplanetmarine.com
> > PO Box 3639, Richmond, Nelson, New Zealand
>
> --
> The University of Edinburgh is a charitable body, registered in
> Scotland, 

Re: [ECOLOG-L] HUMPBACK WHALE RESEARCH ON THE GREAT BARRIER REEF, AUSTRALIA (JULY-SEPT 2017) ? RESEARCH ASSISTANT OPPORTUNITIES

[CARRION Steven]

The whole "unpaid" vs "paid" vs "exploitative" internships discussion has been 
discussed in ECOLOG before but I had to bring it up again after seeing this 
post. 

A "research assistant" position wherein students have to pay a almost 3 grand 
to participate in an activity less than a week? And this covers accommodation 
and food? This amount of money is what people pay to go on luxury cruises. This 
seems like it's a way to fund the organization's research costs while being 
provided with freely given labor. Exploitative is the nicest way I can put that.

I don't think these types of posts should have a place on academic list serv. 
or if they are included they should more accurately be called for-profit/paid 
volunteering.

Best Regards,

Steven Carrion
University of Edinburgh

> On Mar 23, 2017, at 1:16 AM, Lesley Douglas 
>  wrote:
> 
> The Great Barrier Reef Whale and Dolphin Research Programme is led by 
> Blue Planet Marine and operated in collaboration with the Cetacean 
> Ecology and Acoustics Laboratory at The University of Queensland, 
> Australia. http://gbr.blueplanetmarine.com.
> 
> Running from July to September 2017, there are opportunities for 
> Research Assistants (RAs) to join the Programme. As a RA, you will work 
> in an exceptional location with world leading scientists. You?ll be 
> exposed to a variety of research techniques, including: the latest in 
> genetic sampling; acoustic recording of social sounds and whale song; 
> behavioural observations; video recordings; and photo-identification. 
> You?ll be involved in data management, and in the day-to-day activities 
> of the research vessels.
> 
> The Programme is based on a live-aboard research vessel in and around 
> the world-famous Whitsunday Islands. The aim of the Programme is to 
> collect data on the breeding sub-stocks of south west Pacific humpback 
> whales. These data are important because organisations such as the 
> Scientific Committee of the International Whaling Commission don?t have 
> enough information to make decisions on whether these breeding sub-
> stocks should be managed together or as separate populations. The IWC 
> Scientific Committee has even identified the collection of these data as 
> highest priority research for these populations of whales. The Programme 
> is targeted, it?s scientifically robust, it?s relevant and 
> it?s exciting. 
> 
> The Programme will:
> * Identify areas of the Great Barrier Reef that are most important 
> for humpback whale breeding activities; 
> * Gather information regarding the structure of the east 
> Australian humpback whale sub-stock; and
> * Gain a better understanding of whale acoustic communication and 
> the potential for anthropogenic impacts within the breeding grounds of 
> the Great Barrier Reef.
> 
> This is a great opportunity to: gain valuable experience and skills to 
> further your career with marine mammals; make valuable connections with 
> some of the world?s most respected humpback whale researchers; work on a 
> meaningful research programme; and experience one of the seven wonders 
> of the natural world.
> 
> * The participation fee for a six-day research trip is $2,995 
> Australian dollars, including tax.
> * The participation fee for a twelve-day research trip is $5,690 
> Australian dollars, including tax.
> 
> If you pay on or before 14 April 2017, you?ll receive an early-bird 
> discount of $300 Australian dollars off the Programme fee for each trip 
> booked.
> 
> The Programme fee covers accommodation and food aboard the research 
> vessel. RAs are responsible for all costs associated with travel to and 
> from the Programme.
> 
> No prior experience is necessary and training will be provided. 
> Preference will be given, however, to individuals involved in marine 
> mammal science courses or related institutions and/or with prior 
> volunteer marine mammal field experience. Places are limited to ten RAs 
> on each research trip.
> 
> To find out more about The Great Barrier Reef Whale and Dolphin Research 
> Project (including the dates of research trips) visit: 
> http://gbr.blueplanetmarine.com or read the attached brochure. You can 
> secure your place today by paying online.
> 
> Best regards,
> Lesley
> 
> Lesley Douglas, MSC.
> Marine Scientist | Nelson Office| Ph: +64 (0)27 631-9000 |
> Email: lesley.doug...@blueplanetmarine.com | www.blueplanetmarine.com
> PO Box 3639, Richmond, Nelson, New Zealand

-- 
The University of Edinburgh is a charitable body, registered in
Scotland, with registration number SC005336.

[ECOLOG-L] HUMPBACK WHALE RESEARCH ON THE GREAT BARRIER REEF, AUSTRALIA (JULY-SEPT 2017) � RESEARCH ASSISTANT OPPORTUNITIES

[Lesley Douglas]

The Great Barrier Reef Whale and Dolphin Research Programme is led by 
Blue Planet Marine and operated in collaboration with the Cetacean 
Ecology and Acoustics Laboratory at The University of Queensland, 
Australia. http://gbr.blueplanetmarine.com.

Running from July to September 2017, there are opportunities for 
Research Assistants (RAs) to join the Programme. As a RA, you will work 
in an exceptional location with world leading scientists. You’ll be 
exposed to a variety of research techniques, including: the latest in 
genetic sampling; acoustic recording of social sounds and whale song; 
behavioural observations; video recordings; and photo-identification. 
You’ll be involved in data management, and in the day-to-day activities 
of the research vessels.

The Programme is based on a live-aboard research vessel in and around 
the world-famous Whitsunday Islands. The aim of the Programme is to 
collect data on the breeding sub-stocks of south west Pacific humpback 
whales. These data are important because organisations such as the 
Scientific Committee of the International Whaling Commission don’t have 
enough information to make decisions on whether these breeding sub-
stocks should be managed together or as separate populations. The IWC 
Scientific Committee has even identified the collection of these data as 
highest priority research for these populations of whales. The Programme 
is targeted, it’s scientifically robust, it’s relevant and 
it’s exciting. 

The Programme will:
* Identify areas of the Great Barrier Reef that are most important 
for humpback whale breeding activities; 
* Gather information regarding the structure of the east 
Australian humpback whale sub-stock; and
* Gain a better understanding of whale acoustic communication and 
the potential for anthropogenic impacts within the breeding grounds of 
the Great Barrier Reef.

This is a great opportunity to: gain valuable experience and skills to 
further your career with marine mammals; make valuable connections with 
some of the world’s most respected humpback whale researchers; work on a 
meaningful research programme; and experience one of the seven wonders 
of the natural world.

* The participation fee for a six-day research trip is $2,995 
Australian dollars, including tax.
* The participation fee for a twelve-day research trip is $5,690 
Australian dollars, including tax.

If you pay on or before 14 April 2017, you’ll receive an early-bird 
discount of $300 Australian dollars off the Programme fee for each trip 
booked.

The Programme fee covers accommodation and food aboard the research 
vessel. RAs are responsible for all costs associated with travel to and 
from the Programme.

No prior experience is necessary and training will be provided. 
Preference will be given, however, to individuals involved in marine 
mammal science courses or related institutions and/or with prior 
volunteer marine mammal field experience. Places are limited to ten RAs 
on each research trip.

To find out more about The Great Barrier Reef Whale and Dolphin Research 
Project (including the dates of research trips) visit: 
http://gbr.blueplanetmarine.com or read the attached brochure. You can 
secure your place today by paying online.

Best regards,
Lesley

Lesley Douglas, MSC.
Marine Scientist | Nelson Office| Ph: +64 (0)27 631-9000 |
Email: lesley.doug...@blueplanetmarine.com | www.blueplanetmarine.com
PO Box 3639, Richmond, Nelson, New Zealand