Re: [Elecraft] 630 meter band open for use

[Ron D'Eau Claire]

Possibly Fred. I didn't specify because by the 1980's there were several newer 
types with the same features - some even solid state! They all went away when 
the 500 kHz distress frequency was abandoned in the 1990's.

73, Ron AC7AC  

-Original Message-
From: elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net 
[mailto:elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net] On Behalf Of Fred Jensen
Sent: Saturday, September 16, 2017 11:02 AM
To: elecraft@mailman.qth.net
Subject: Re: [Elecraft] 630 meter band open for use

AN/CRT-3 [aka BC-778] "Gibson Girl" survival radio.  The ones we had in SE Asia 
in the 60's included a rock-bound 8 MHz distress frequency too.

73,

Fred ["Skip"] K6DGW
Sparks NV DM09dn
Washoe County


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Re: [Elecraft] 630 meter band open for use

[Fred Jensen]

AN/CRT-3 [aka BC-778] "Gibson Girl" survival radio.  The ones we had in 
SE Asia in the 60's included a rock-bound 8 MHz distress frequency too.


73,

Fred ["Skip"] K6DGW
Sparks NV DM09dn
Washoe County

On 9/15/2017 8:25 PM, Ron D'Eau Claire wrote:

It is true that a little bit CAN go a long way. Back in the 1990s when I was
working on ships with MF CW gear I had the opportunity to share coffee with
a radio operator and his captain who had spent hours circling in the Pacific
looking for the source of an SOS on 500 kHz. It turned out to be a
hand-cranked lifeboat transmitter in the Med.! They were chasing a phantom
signal at the antinode half way around the world. The emergency transmitter
ran a couple of watts at best into a very limited antenna hung by a kite or
balloon over the raft.

73, Ron AC7AC



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Re: [Elecraft] 630 meter band open for use

[Richard Lamont]

On 16/09/17 03:16, Edward R Cole wrote:

> But seriously no 3-KHz phone should be used since one QSO would occupy
> nearly 50% of the 7-KHz wide band.

We've had these bands in Europe for years and AFAIK nobody uses voice
modes. The IARU R1 bandplan suggests a maximum bandwidth of 500 Hz.

73,
Richard G4DYA
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[Elecraft] 630 meter band open for use

[James F. Boehner MD via Elecraft]

Well,

This is getting off topic for this reflector, but information is that there
have been experimental (amateur radio) stations on the (new) bands for some
time, with higher power limits than have currently been authorized for
general amateur radio use going forward.  There have been no interference
reports.

The ARRL was very conservative suggesting a 1 Kilometer standard for
separation between an amateur radio station and transmission lines carrying
PLC data in regards to non-interference.  The truth is, shorter distances
would still likely not produce interference.  The FCC did adopt the 1
kilometer distance as a standard, however.

'73 de JIM N2ZZ


Aha! So PLC and amateur radio DO interfere with each other after all.


In the end, amateur radio operators have been vindicated on this point.

Al  W6LX



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Re: [Elecraft] 630 meter band open for use

[Al Lorona]

>From the ARRL announcement today:


"This notification process will ensure that amateur stations seeking
to operate are located beyond a minimum separation distance from PLC
transmission lines, which will help ensure the compatibility and
coexistence of amateur and PLC operations, and promote shared use of
the bands."

Aha! So PLC and amateur radio DO interfere with each other after all.


In the end, amateur radio operators have been vindicated on this point.

Al  W6LX
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Re: [Elecraft] 630 meter band open for use

[Ron D'Eau Claire]

My reaction to "phone" exactly, since a typical "AM Phone" signal will
occupy 6 of the 7 kHz! 

Back in the days when shipping used these frequencies, only Morse was
allowed for routine communications although modulation was applied to
produce MCW for emergencies. That was a carryover from the days when some
ships still used crystal detectors for emergency comms. Un-modulated CW
produces no tone and at best soft clicks in a crystal receiver. But in those
situations everyone had to QRT around the frequency of the emergency signal
(usually 500 kHz) so sidebands were of no concern. 

It is true that a little bit CAN go a long way. Back in the 1990s when I was
working on ships with MF CW gear I had the opportunity to share coffee with
a radio operator and his captain who had spent hours circling in the Pacific
looking for the source of an SOS on 500 kHz. It turned out to be a
hand-cranked lifeboat transmitter in the Med.! They were chasing a phantom
signal at the antinode half way around the world. The emergency transmitter
ran a couple of watts at best into a very limited antenna hung by a kite or
balloon over the raft.

73, Ron AC7AC  

-Original Message-
From: elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net
[mailto:elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net] On Behalf Of Edward R Cole
Sent: Friday, September 15, 2017 7:17 PM
To: Elecraft Reflector
Subject: Re: [Elecraft] 630 meter band open for use

Bill,

I could not believe it when you stated all modes allowed, so I checked the
CFR47, 90.307
https://ecfr.io/Title-47/se47.5.97_1305

  630m allows RTTY, data (see 97.307 (3)

  630m phone and image (see 97.307 (1)(2)

But seriously no 3-KHz phone should be used since one QSO would occupy
nearly 50% of the 7-KHz wide band.  I'm astonished that the FCC permits
phone on 630m.
CW and digital is most efficient use of spectrum and weak signals.

97.313
https://www.ecfr.gov/cgi-bin/text-idx?SID=2689706e634fb3e73b9f4ef814c352e9
c=true=se47.5.97_1313=div8

(l) No station may transmit in the 472-479 kHz (630 m) band with a
transmitter power exceeding 500 W PEP or a radiated power exceeding 5 W
EIRP, except that in Alaska, stations located within 800 kilometers of the
Russian Federation may not transmit with a radiated power exceeding 1 W
EIRP.

So this observes that 630m transmitting antenna are expected to be very
inefficient 500w resulting in < 5w erp.  My inverted-L calculates to be 3w
erp with 100w.

So Mel +20 dBm (100mw) will result in about 3mw erp using my antenna.  Of
course you may put up a full size vertical 521 foot high (with 521 foot
ground plane) or a 1142 foot dipole only 1000-foot high.  Most of us will
use antenna under 10% full size with resulting dismal efficiency.

But 5w erp can go a long distance on 630m; my signal was detected in
Buffalo, NY (about 4,000 miles).

73, Ed - KL7UW, WD2XSH/45 (ARRL Experimental License)
---

To: Bill Frantz <fra...@pwpconsult.com>,
Subject: Re: [Elecraft] 630 meter band open for use


Interesting in reading the FCC notice, ALL modes are allowed!!! ?So some
enterprising company should make a transverter for us??? ?It is only
allowing 5W EIRP, a signal generator and do +20 dBm, Hummm.
Mel, K6KBE

   From: Bill Frantz <fra...@pwpconsult.com>
  To: elecraft@mailman.qth.net
  Sent: Friday, September 15, 2017 4:02 PM
  Subject: Re: [Elecraft] 630 meter band open for use

Just submitted my data for both bands. I got the lat/long from QRZ.com and
checked it against the "Maidenhead" app on my cell phone.

73 Bill AE6JV


73, Ed - KL7UW
   http://www.kl7uw.com
Dubus-NA Business mail:
   dubus...@gmail.com 

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Re: [Elecraft] 630 meter band open for use

[Edward R Cole]

Bill,

I could not believe it when you stated all modes allowed, so I 
checked the CFR47, 90.307

https://ecfr.io/Title-47/se47.5.97_1305

 630m allows RTTY, data (see 97.307 (3)

 630m phone and image (see 97.307 (1)(2)

But seriously no 3-KHz phone should be used since one QSO would 
occupy nearly 50% of the 7-KHz wide band.  I'm astonished that the 
FCC permits phone on 630m.

CW and digital is most efficient use of spectrum and weak signals.

97.313
https://www.ecfr.gov/cgi-bin/text-idx?SID=2689706e634fb3e73b9f4ef814c352e9=true=se47.5.97_1313=div8

(l) No station may transmit in the 472-479 kHz (630 m) band with a 
transmitter power exceeding 500 W PEP or a radiated power exceeding 5 
W EIRP, except that in Alaska, stations located within 800 kilometers 
of the Russian Federation may not transmit with a radiated power 
exceeding 1 W EIRP.


So this observes that 630m transmitting antenna are expected to be 
very inefficient 500w resulting in < 5w erp.  My inverted-L 
calculates to be 3w erp with 100w.


So Mel +20 dBm (100mw) will result in about 3mw erp using my 
antenna.  Of course you may put up a full size vertical 521 foot high 
(with 521 foot ground plane) or a 1142 foot dipole only 1000-foot 
high.  Most of us will use antenna under 10% full size with resulting 
dismal efficiency.


But 5w erp can go a long distance on 630m; my signal was detected in 
Buffalo, NY (about 4,000 miles).


73, Ed - KL7UW, WD2XSH/45 (ARRL Experimental License)
---

To: Bill Frantz <fra...@pwpconsult.com>,
Subject: Re: [Elecraft] 630 meter band open for use


Interesting in reading the FCC notice, ALL modes are allowed!!! ?So 
some enterprising company should make a transverter for us??? ?It 
is only allowing 5W EIRP, a signal generator and do +20 dBm, Hummm.

Mel, K6KBE

  From: Bill Frantz <fra...@pwpconsult.com>
 To: elecraft@mailman.qth.net
 Sent: Friday, September 15, 2017 4:02 PM
 Subject: Re: [Elecraft] 630 meter band open for use

Just submitted my data for both bands. I got the lat/long from
QRZ.com and checked it against the "Maidenhead" app on my cell phone.

73 Bill AE6JV


73, Ed - KL7UW
  http://www.kl7uw.com
Dubus-NA Business mail:
  dubus...@gmail.com 


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Re: [Elecraft] 630 meter band open for use

[Clay Autery]

Not broken  just a line break that breaks the "linkification".  

Copy/paste of the entire link gets the document open.

App/notice submitted...  Thanks.  Can't imagine that I'll be up on those
bands anytime soon, but it will be nice to know if I CAN go up from my QTH.

73,

__
Clay Autery, KY5G
MONTAC Enterprises
(318) 518-1389

On 9/15/2017 1:47 PM, James F. Boehner MD via Elecraft wrote:
> Broken link.  Try this one:
>
> <http://transition.fcc.gov/Daily_Releases/Daily_Business/2017/db0915/DA-17-8
> 93A1.pdf>
>
>
> '73 de JIM N2ZZ
> Elecraft_K3 Listowner
>
>
> -Original Message-
> From: elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net
> [mailto:elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net] On Behalf Of Merv Schweigert via
> Elecraft
> Sent: Friday, September 15, 2017 1:41 PM
> To: elecraft@mailman.qth.net
> Subject: [Elecraft] 630 meter band open for use
>
> Since we finally have the 630 meter band open for amateur use, (after you
> file intent of operation with the UTC and wait 30 days),
>
> is there any plan to put this band on the K3/K3S band plan?
> Would sure be nice to be able to get to 630 with out going through the
> settings to enable/disable etc.
> Or publish a macro that could be used with PF1 or PF2 to engage the band
> quickly.
>
> 73 Merv K9FD/KH6
>
>
>
>
> __
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Re: [Elecraft] 630 meter band open for use

[Don Wilhelm]

Yes, +20 dBm would do it if the antenna and transmission line efficiency 
were a perfect 100%.  A no-loss transmission line and a full size dipole 
or vertical.


With the small antennas (with respect for wavelength) that are typical 
for that band, very low antenna and transmission line efficiency is most 
likely quite low.


EIRP is stated to account for those losses, and more power will be required.

73,
Don W3FPR

On 9/15/2017 7:23 PM, Mel Farrer via Elecraft wrote:

Interesting in reading the FCC notice, ALL modes are allowed!!!  So some 
enterprising company should make a transverter for us???  It is only 
allowing 5W EIRP, a signal generator and do +20 dBm, Hummm.

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[Elecraft] 630 meter band open for use

[John AE5X]

I recently built a 630m transverter that some here may be interested in knowing 
about. It went together easily, has a small parts count and works quite well 
(into a dummy load for now):

https://ae5x.blogspot.com/2017/06/630m-kit-completed-tested.html

John AE5X
http://ae5x.blogspot.com/
 
 


Mind & Body Guide: 3 Effective Ways To Lose Belly Fat
LCR Health
http://thirdpartyoffers.juno.com/TGL3131/59bc639fd1bc7639f3116st01vuc
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[Elecraft] 630 meter band open for use

[John AE5X]

Lat/long can easily be found here:

http://www.latlong.net/

John AE5X
http://ae5x.blogspot.com/
 
 


We Say GoodBye To Sally Fields
iflperfecttouch.com
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Re: [Elecraft] 630 meter band open for use

[Mel Farrer via Elecraft]

Interesting in reading the FCC notice, ALL modes are allowed!!!  So some 
enterprising company should make a transverter for us???  It is only 
allowing 5W EIRP, a signal generator and do +20 dBm, Hummm.
Mel, K6KBE

  From: Bill Frantz <fra...@pwpconsult.com>
 To: elecraft@mailman.qth.net 
 Sent: Friday, September 15, 2017 4:02 PM
 Subject: Re: [Elecraft] 630 meter band open for use
   
Just submitted my data for both bands. I got the lat/long from 
QRZ.com and checked it against the "Maidenhead" app on my cell phone.

73 Bill AE6JV

On 9/15/17 at 11:47 AM, elecraft@mailman.qth.net (James F. 
Boehner MD via Elecraft) wrote:

>Broken link.  Try this one:
>
><http://transition.fcc.gov/Daily_Releases/Daily_Business/2017/db0915/DA-17-8
>93A1.pdf>
>
>
>'73 de JIM N2ZZ
-
Bill Frantz        | The first thing you need when  | Periwinkle
(408)356-8506      | using a perimeter defense is a | 16345 
Englewood Ave
www.pwpconsult.com | perimeter.                    | Los Gatos, 
CA 95032

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Re: [Elecraft] 630 meter band open for use

[Bill Frantz]

Just submitted my data for both bands. I got the lat/long from 
QRZ.com and checked it against the "Maidenhead" app on my cell phone.


73 Bill AE6JV

On 9/15/17 at 11:47 AM, elecraft@mailman.qth.net (James F. 
Boehner MD via Elecraft) wrote:



Broken link.  Try this one:




'73 de JIM N2ZZ

-
Bill Frantz| The first thing you need when  | Periwinkle
(408)356-8506  | using a perimeter defense is a | 16345 
Englewood Ave
www.pwpconsult.com | perimeter. | Los Gatos, 
CA 95032


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[Elecraft] 630 meter band open for use

[James F. Boehner MD via Elecraft]

Broken link.  Try this one:

<http://transition.fcc.gov/Daily_Releases/Daily_Business/2017/db0915/DA-17-8
93A1.pdf>


'73 de JIM N2ZZ
Elecraft_K3 Listowner


-Original Message-
From: elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net
[mailto:elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net] On Behalf Of Merv Schweigert via
Elecraft
Sent: Friday, September 15, 2017 1:41 PM
To: elecraft@mailman.qth.net
Subject: [Elecraft] 630 meter band open for use

Since we finally have the 630 meter band open for amateur use, (after you
file intent of operation with the UTC and wait 30 days),

is there any plan to put this band on the K3/K3S band plan?
Would sure be nice to be able to get to 630 with out going through the
settings to enable/disable etc.
Or publish a macro that could be used with PF1 or PF2 to engage the band
quickly.

73 Merv K9FD/KH6




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..
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[Elecraft] 630 meter band open for use

[James F. Boehner MD via Elecraft]

Since the availability of the 630 meter band was mentioned,  I wanted to
pass along the link for amateurs to inform the UTC of intent to operate on
the new  2200 meter and 630 meter bands.

Recommendation is that EVERYONE submits this form ASAP, even if you don't
immediately intend to operate on the new frequency bands:

http://transition.fcc.gov/Daily_Releases/Daily_Business/2017/db0915/DA-17-89
3A1.pdf  has an imbedded link to the UTC's online form.  I just did mine and
got a confirmation that my submission was accepted.


'73 de JIM N2ZZ
Elecraft_K3 Listowner


-Original Message-
From: elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net
[mailto:elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net] On Behalf Of Merv Schweigert via
Elecraft
Sent: Friday, September 15, 2017 1:41 PM
To: elecraft@mailman.qth.net
Subject: [Elecraft] 630 meter band open for use

Since we finally have the 630 meter band open for amateur use, (after you
file intent of operation with the UTC and wait 30 days),

is there any plan to put this band on the K3/K3S band plan?
Would sure be nice to be able to get to 630 with out going through the
settings to enable/disable etc.
Or publish a macro that could be used with PF1 or PF2 to engage the band
quickly.

73 Merv K9FD/KH6




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Re: [Elecraft] 630 meter band open for use

[donovanf]

For those that missed the announcement, the PLC database notification 
web site is accepting registrations. Registration takes just a minute, 
you need to know your latitude and longitude in deg. min. sec. before 
you register. 


https://utc.org/plc-database-amateur-notification-process 


Is there any possibility that Elecraft will introduce a 100 watt amplifier 
for 630 meters? 


73 
Frank 
W3LPL 

- Original Message -

From: "Merv Schweigert via Elecraft" <elecraft@mailman.qth.net> 
To: elecraft@mailman.qth.net 
Sent: Friday, September 15, 2017 5:41:08 PM 
Subject: [Elecraft] 630 meter band open for use 

Since we finally have the 630 meter band open for amateur use, 
(after you file intent of operation with the UTC and wait 30 days), 

is there any plan to put this band on the K3/K3S band plan? 
Would sure be nice to be able to get to 630 with out going 
through the settings to enable/disable etc. 
Or publish a macro that could be used with PF1 or PF2 to engage 
the band quickly. 

73 Merv K9FD/KH6 




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[Elecraft] 630 meter band open for use

[Merv Schweigert via Elecraft]

Since we finally have the 630 meter band open for amateur use,
(after you file intent of operation with the UTC and wait 30 days),

is there any plan to put this band on the K3/K3S band plan?
Would sure be nice to be able to get to 630 with out going
through the settings to enable/disable etc.
Or publish a macro that could be used with PF1 or PF2 to engage
the band quickly.

73 Merv K9FD/KH6




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Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
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