Re: [Elecraft] KX3: Cleaner audio with Yamaha CM500, also PTT
On Mon,8/17/2015 11:20 PM, Luis V. Romero wrote: The Audio Technica BPHS1. Its a bit expensive, but it sounds just lovely with its flat response dynamic element. Its way more comfortable than the Heil Elite and the new Pro cans. Its built for sports play-by-play announcing. Hi Lu, AT is a great company, with lots of fine products. I've done some consulting for them, know some of their people, and like them professionally. My consulting was limited to RFI issues on their mics -- I've had no input to the design of their products. I serve on the AES Standards Committee with Jackie Green, VP Engineering of AT, and Vice Chair of the AES Standards Committee Working Group on Microphones, and Jackie is a class act. All of that said, I think that the CM500 is the best bargain for hams. I own two and I've worn out two, thanks to relatively lightweight construction. 73, Jim K9YC __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html Message delivered to arch...@mail-archive.com
Re: [Elecraft] KX3: Cleaner audio with Yamaha CM500, also PTT
I have several CM500'ds and also a Koss SB40. The Koss SB40 headset is IDENTICAL to the CM500 in design and construction, except in one area: The Mic capsule. The Koss mic capsule is dynamic, not condenser. It is also HORRIBLE! I believe it is a cheap earphone soldered up for mic duty. It sounds like absolute mud and no amount of eq in the K3 or with my outboard equipment made it sound acceptably. Its so bad, I actually removed it. The top cover to the Koss mic capsule holder is a clamp-on to the flexible goose neck, so its removable... up to a point. The bottom of it is glued on, but I was able to pry it off in one piece with patience. The wires are potted into the goose neck in some sort of plastic-like gray goo. This left very little exposed wire after I removed the plastic holder and then unsoldered the capsule from the wires. I replaced the whole kit and caboodle with a mic holder and capsule from a broken Heil BM10/DX4. The capsule holder from the BM10 boom fits perfectly into the Koss goose neck after some very minor reaming of the hole. This is the mic I take to Multi Multi operations that use rigs such as Yaesu 1000MP's and Orions, which like the DX4 element; Im losing my love of it... Its tinny and thin with no presence but boy, does it make the meters jump on those old Yaesus! :). But fewer and fewer of these rigs are out there, so the SB40 stays on its hanger in the shack more often than not anymore. I have owned it since 2009. I seem to be using the CM500 less and less too... I have found a headset that I really really like the sound of, both in RX and in TX: The Audio Technica BPHS1. Its a bit expensive, but it sounds just lovely with its flat response dynamic element. Its way more comfortable than the Heil Elite and the new Pro cans. Its built for sports play-by-play announcing. I have also used the Audio Technica PRO8Hex boom mic along with some $11 Skull Candy earbuds I purchased at Target. This combination works extremely well in very noisy environments. The earbuds seal out most of any outside noise and the Pro8HEx mic has really good articulation and great presence. I use that mic at trade shows when doing demo artist duty as it is light and easy on the head, plus, since only I use it, I keep my germs to myself at the demo stations. The same capsule used on the Pro8HEx is used in the BPHS1, so the sound is identical. However, I must say, Im a dweeb when it comes to micsand headsets but, in all seriousness, you cant go wrong with the $55 CM500 for K3 use. Lu Romero - W4LT I suspect that the mic in the Koss is an electret, simply because electrets are cheaper than dynamics, and these are cheap products we're talking about. :) The challenge, of course, is to separate the good cheap from the bad and not very good cheap. I've not seen the Koss products, so have no opinion as to their quality. 73, Jim K9YC __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html Message delivered to arch...@mail-archive.com
[Elecraft] KX3: Cleaner audio with Yamaha CM500, also PTT
That's odd, I use a Koss SB-40 on my IC-9100 for satellite. I had originally bought it to dismantle and use the ear cushions to replace the worn out one's on a CM-500 I had. But when I listen to my D/L it sounds good enough for me, never a bad audio report. I don't think I would use it to rag-chew with on HF but it is more comfortable to wear and does the same job as a Heil PRO 7 I bought to replace it when I mistakenly shipped the 40's to my winter home. The Koss set is now back here where it belongs, the Heil now sits on the shelf waiting to be sold at the next hamfest I table at. For 25 $, the SB-40's are a good deal. I use the CM-500's exclusively on my remote K3/0 mini setup 73 Jeff kb2m -Original Message- From: Elecraft [mailto:elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net] On Behalf Of Luis V. Romero Sent: Tuesday, August 18, 2015 2:20 AM To: Elecraft List Subject: Re: [Elecraft] KX3: Cleaner audio with Yamaha CM500, also PTT I have several CM500'ds and also a Koss SB40. The Koss SB40 headset is IDENTICAL to the CM500 in design and construction, except in one area: The Mic capsule. The Koss mic capsule is dynamic, not condenser. It is also HORRIBLE! I believe it is a cheap earphone soldered up for mic duty. It sounds like absolute mud and no amount of eq in the K3 or with my outboard equipment made it sound acceptably. Lu Romero - W4LT __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html Message delivered to arch...@mail-archive.com
Re: [Elecraft] KX3: Cleaner audio with Yamaha CM500, also PTT
wunder, After building an adapter using a TRRS plug for myself, I had a head-slapping reaction to your solution. It should work wonders for not only the CM500, but also for most any other microphone designed to be used on a computer - most, if not all, have the tip and ring connected together. 73, Don W3FPR On 8/17/2015 12:47 AM, Walter Underwood wrote: My blog post was mostly about providing clean mic bias with the KX3 for electrets that get bias from both tip and ring, like the Yamaha CM500. Give it a quick read, it might answer some questions. http://observer.wunderwood.org/2015/08/16/yamaha-cm500-headset-with-ptt-on-elecraft-kx3/ __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html Message delivered to arch...@mail-archive.com
Re: [Elecraft] KX3: Cleaner audio with Yamaha CM500, also PTT
I kept planning to build an adaptor to fix it, but didn’t get around to it. Then I drew it out to make sure I know what was going on and it hit me. Very much a case of “laziness is the mother of non-reinvention”. The PTT jack was an unexpected bonus. wunder K6WRU CM87wj http://observer.wunderwood.org/ (my blog) On Aug 17, 2015, at 4:40 PM, Don Wilhelm w3...@embarqmail.com wrote: wunder, After building an adapter using a TRRS plug for myself, I had a head-slapping reaction to your solution. It should work wonders for not only the CM500, but also for most any other microphone designed to be used on a computer - most, if not all, have the tip and ring connected together. 73, Don W3FPR On 8/17/2015 12:47 AM, Walter Underwood wrote: My blog post was mostly about providing clean mic bias with the KX3 for electrets that get bias from both tip and ring, like the Yamaha CM500. Give it a quick read, it might answer some questions. http://observer.wunderwood.org/2015/08/16/yamaha-cm500-headset-with-ptt-on-elecraft-kx3/ __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html Message delivered to arch...@mail-archive.com
[Elecraft] KX3: Cleaner audio with Yamaha CM500, also PTT
There's still another Koss headset - Model KS-45 that's plug-in compatible with the Yamaha CM500. It has an electret mic. Also about $25 on Amazon. Look also at Amazon's listing for a RoverBeats Bravo. Electrically and functionally (and sound) it's interchangeable with the CM500 and - for us REALLY CHEAP hams, it's only about $10. Well worth a try. All three of these are look-alikes and have electret mics and the same wiring and 3.5mm plugs. They sound almost the same plugged into the rear jacks on my K3 (with bias turned on.) Jim - W4RKS __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html Message delivered to arch...@mail-archive.com
Re: [Elecraft] KX3: Cleaner audio with Yamaha CM500, also PTT
On Sun,8/16/2015 5:12 PM, James Wilson wrote: All three of these are look-alikes and have electret mics and the same wiring and 3.5mm plugs. They sound almost the same plugged into the rear jacks on my K3 (with bias turned on.) No surprise. BUT -- how comfortable are they? Have you worn them for a weekend contest full time? My Sony MDR7506 and the CM500 pass that test with flying colors. Have you gotten any reports from CRITICAL listeners about how the mic sounds? Several years ago, I browsed a big Fry's store for boom mic headsets, with the objective of Skype for the XYL, and bought a couple rather different cheapies. The mics sounded barely OK, the phones were about the same, and were VERY uncomfortable. And this caution: The Koss mic is described as noise cancelling. True noise cancelling mics must be talked very close to work, and they don't sound very good. If the mic is simply a cardioid, it has a different problem -- an overemphasized low end when worked close, which wastes TX power, emphasizes breathe pops and handling noise. People who sell this stuff and write the ad copy almost never know the difference, and often use the wrong words to describe what's going on. For example, Yamaha's own description of the CM500 called it a dynamic mic, while it definitely an electret. I suspect that the mic in the Koss is an electret, simply because electrets are cheaper than dynamics, and these are cheap products we're talking about. :) The challenge, of course, is to separate the good cheap from the bad and not very good cheap. I've not seen the Koss products, so have no opinion as to their quality. 73, Jim K9YC __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html Message delivered to arch...@mail-archive.com
Re: [Elecraft] KX3: Cleaner audio with Yamaha CM500, also PTT
Jim: Don't electrets have to be powered (voltage applied) where dynamics do not? Brian KB1VBF Sent from my iPad On Aug 16, 2015, at 8:34 PM, Jim Brown j...@audiosystemsgroup.com wrote: For example, Yamaha's own description of the CM500 called it a dynamic mic, while it definitely an electret. I suspect that the mic in the Koss is an electret, simply because electrets are cheaper than dynamics, and these are cheap products we're talking about. :) The challenge, of course, is to separate the good cheap from the bad and not very good cheap. I've not seen the Koss products, so have no opinion as to their quality. 73, Jim K9YC __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html Message delivered to b.den...@comcast.net __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html Message delivered to arch...@mail-archive.com
Re: [Elecraft] KX3: Cleaner audio with Yamaha CM500, also PTT
On Sun,8/16/2015 7:17 PM, Brian Denley wrote: Don't electrets have to be powered (voltage applied) where dynamics do not? Right. On Sun,8/16/2015 8:00 PM, James Wilson wrote: Yes, the electret mics do require a small amount of power - Elecraft and others call it BIAS voltage. It's called bias because it IS bias -- electret capsules have a very high output Z, so they use a FET follower as an output stage. The voltage provides bias for that output stage. Fortunately - with the K3 and K3S and very likely the KX3 also - that needed bias is available and can be turned on or off with a menu selection. Virtually all modern rigs (within the last 30+ years) provide V+, usually about 8 V, on one pin of the mic connector. All it takes to use that for bias is a resistor in the range of 5K ohms from V+ to the mic input. 73, Jim K9YC __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html Message delivered to arch...@mail-archive.com
Re: [Elecraft] KX3: Cleaner audio with Yamaha CM500, also PTT
My blog post was mostly about providing clean mic bias with the KX3 for electrets that get bias from both tip and ring, like the Yamaha CM500. Give it a quick read, it might answer some questions. http://observer.wunderwood.org/2015/08/16/yamaha-cm500-headset-with-ptt-on-elecraft-kx3/ wunder K6WRU CM87wj http://observer.wunderwood.org/ (my blog) On Aug 16, 2015, at 9:20 PM, Jim Brown j...@audiosystemsgroup.com wrote: On Sun,8/16/2015 7:17 PM, Brian Denley wrote: Don't electrets have to be powered (voltage applied) where dynamics do not? Right. On Sun,8/16/2015 8:00 PM, James Wilson wrote: Yes, the electret mics do require a small amount of power - Elecraft and others call it BIAS voltage. It's called bias because it IS bias -- electret capsules have a very high output Z, so they use a FET follower as an output stage. The voltage provides bias for that output stage. Fortunately - with the K3 and K3S and very likely the KX3 also - that needed bias is available and can be turned on or off with a menu selection. Virtually all modern rigs (within the last 30+ years) provide V+, usually about 8 V, on one pin of the mic connector. All it takes to use that for bias is a resistor in the range of 5K ohms from V+ to the mic input. 73, Jim K9YC __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html Message delivered to wun...@wunderwood.org __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html Message delivered to arch...@mail-archive.com
Re: [Elecraft] KX3: Cleaner audio with Yamaha CM500, also PTT
I got a quick response from David Anderson, GM4JJJ, that the Koss SB40 has a dynamic mic. Looking at the specs at BH Photo, I agree. I’ve updated the blog post. wunder K6WRU CM87wj http://observer.wunderwood.org/ (my blog) On Aug 16, 2015, at 1:47 PM, Walter Underwood wun...@wunderwood.org wrote: Finally got around to writing up my simple hack for cleaner mic bias with the KX3 and Yamaha CM500. Along the way, I spotted something that will make all us cheap hams happy. It looks like the Koss SB40 ($25) is the same headset as the Yamaha CM500 ($55). But we really care about the better audio quality, right? Also, this makes it easy to have a separate PTT hand switch or foot switch. http://observer.wunderwood.org/2015/08/16/yamaha-cm500-headset-with-ptt-on-elecraft-kx3/ wunder K6WRU CM87wj http://observer.wunderwood.org/ (my blog) __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html Message delivered to wun...@wunderwood.org __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html Message delivered to arch...@mail-archive.com
[Elecraft] KX3: Cleaner audio with Yamaha CM500, also PTT
Finally got around to writing up my simple hack for cleaner mic bias with the KX3 and Yamaha CM500. Along the way, I spotted something that will make all us cheap hams happy. It looks like the Koss SB40 ($25) is the same headset as the Yamaha CM500 ($55). But we really care about the better audio quality, right? Also, this makes it easy to have a separate PTT hand switch or foot switch. http://observer.wunderwood.org/2015/08/16/yamaha-cm500-headset-with-ptt-on-elecraft-kx3/ wunder K6WRU CM87wj http://observer.wunderwood.org/ (my blog) __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html Message delivered to arch...@mail-archive.com
[Elecraft] KX3: Cleaner audio with Yamaha CM500, also PTT
Jim, it's true audio quality is very subjective. For good communications quality, I personally judge the three headsets I mentioned to be about equal. Over the ear comfort also compares with my over the ear headphones - a sauna for the ears. :-) Brian, Yes, the electret mics do require a small amount of power - Elecraft and others call it BIAS voltage. Fortunately - with the K3 and K3S and very likely the KX3 also - that needed bias is available and can be turned on or off with a menu selection. __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html Message delivered to arch...@mail-archive.com
