Re: [Elecraft] New Elecraft Message Board? [End of Thread]
Folks, I just returned from a couple days unexpected stay at the hospital, so I hope Eric will excuse this one (hopefully) last post on this subject - When I returned, all 144 of the [Elecraft] messages were lined up in the proper folder, and it took me about 20 minutes to scan through them all (I did read most of them), I sorted out 4 that I will respond to and deleted many that were of no further interest. I could not do that as quickly or efficiently on any web-based forum that I have worked with. I do contribute to this list frequently, and if it ever goes web-based, my contributions will likely become more scarce is about all I can say about it. Thank you Eric for keeping this list in a format I can handle as I chose to, rather than having some web designer who 'thinks' he knows how I should best handle the resulting traffic. 73, Don W3FPR Eric Swartz - WA6HHQ, Elecraft wrote: Ahh - I see this was more about changing the list to a message board format. We also will be keeping the list email based. As several have mentioned before, it is very easy to set up your email client program to filter individual messages to separate folders based on words in the subject line or body. I use this extensively to handle the huge email load I receive daily. [Elecraft] list posts go to the 'Elecraft List' folder, and even K3 posts can go to a 'K3' sub folder. None of the list postings are ever seen in my main inbox. ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
Re: [Elecraft] New Elecraft Message Board? [END of Thread - Please]
Chris Kantarjiev wrote: For the list to change format, Elecraft would just have to do it. And they have repeatedly said that they won't ... most recently about a month ago. Actually, most recently in my post this morning to the list. See: http://www.ac6rm.net/mailarchive/html/elecraft-list/2007-06/msg00171.html and http://www.ac6rm.net/mailarchive/html/elecraft-list/2007-06/msg00170.html Let's end this thread now. Its actually causing more email overload and noise than many of the recent K3 threads. ;-) 73, Eric WA6HHQ Elecraft List Moderator ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
Fw: [Elecraft] New Elecraft Message Board?
Tain't broke ... let's not fix it Please! 73! Ken Kopp - K0PP [EMAIL PROTECTED] ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
Re: [Elecraft] New Elecraft Message Board?
Sorry for the multiple post. I'm fighting Earthlink this week, in upstate NY - awaiting roadrunner. Earthlink dies and stalls, by the hour. This MESSAGE BOARD list topic should be killed. I imagine that no one really manages this self perpetuating email REFLECTOR list, it just runs itself. I've been using Elecraft's RELECTOR list for 2 years, and have never liked it at all. I was a computer engineer by profession . technology marches on. There is no interest in this topic - story closed. Can someone kill the topic, please. 73, de Fred N3CSY FL/NY - canadian/U.S. boarder 4 June ___ You snooze, you lose. Get messages ASAP with AutoCheck in the all-new Yahoo! Mail Beta. http://advision.webevents.yahoo.com/mailbeta/newmail_html.html ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
Re: [Elecraft] New Elecraft Message Board?
On Mon, 04 Jun 2007 14:08:04 +0200, Toby Deinhardt wrote: >I use the support services of various companies and their >customers at work - Some are mail lists (reflectors) and some are >web based forums. >In Elecraft's case my vote is: Elecraft please *do not* change >anything. I second that motion. I detest having to use a web-based forum when e-mail is available. -- 73 de K2ASP - Phil Kane Elecraft K2/100 s/n 5402 ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
Re: [Elecraft] New Elecraft Message Board?
Fred (FL) wrote: I've got a lot of time, retired, but I'm not going to spend my time - sorting and saving and cataloging Elecraft member emails - why would I need to do that? There are very well tuned software forum tools out there - that do that for us. I find it no great problem, even though some folks think their words are so important they feel the need to send the same message...twice. It only makes one hit the delete key..twice..while mumbling "idiot" twice also -- --- _____ / \ / \ / \ / \ / \ John L. Sielke ( W )( 2 )( A )( G )( N ) http://w2agn.net \_/ \_/ \_/ \_/ \_/ http://www.blurty.com/users/w2agn check out: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/QRPariahs/ ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
[Elecraft] New Elecraft Message Board?
Wow - 98 against, 2 for. Everyone seems perfectly satisfied with managing their own archives and email pile, via their own email programs. I'm surprised. Industry, and commercial orgs - DO NOT go the reflector mail-based route. I refuse to load my email provider down with the endless Elecraft messages that come thru by the hour. I'd rather a formum server do this, and catalog the messages, and structure all the hundreds of topic types. Microsoft's OUTLOOK EXPRESS is one of the most spam & virus ridden places on one's PC. I have never used, nor would I think of using it on my PC's. Gmail, IMHO, is somewhat of a joke - for a modern email system. Cumbersome is a good descriptor, for gmail. I use Elecraft REFLECTOR - as it time manages all the user messages that get posted. So I then pour down thru them all, in chronological order - trying to make sense out of who posted what about what topic. That is what they make forum BB's for! I've got a lot of time, retired, but I'm not going to spend my time - sorting and saving and cataloging Elecraft member emails - why would I need to do that? There are very well tuned software forum tools out there - that do that for us. I found out the the forum software I referenced, is a free, ans supported product, free for the asking. In the referenced bateau2.com forum, when they changed over to their current system - it took like 1 or 2 weeks for all the posters and customers to roll over. It just happened. I'm quite sure people and customers - don't patronize and buy Elecraft electronic products, because of the REFLECTOR tool! I suspect, even Bill Gates would turn over in his on this topic. IMHO KILL THIS THREAD, IT'LL NEVER HAPPEN. O&O de N3CSY, Fred, FL, NY Looking for a deal? Find great prices on flights and hotels with Yahoo! FareChase. http://farechase.yahoo.com/ ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
[Elecraft] New Elecraft Message Board?
Wow - 98 against, 2 for. Everyone seems perfectly satisfied with managing their own archives and email pile, via their own email programs. I'm surprised. Industry, and commercial orgs - DO NOT go the reflector mail-based route. I refuse to load my email provider down with the endless Elecraft messages that come thru by the hour. I'd rather a formum server do this, and catalog the messages, and structure all the hundreds of topic types. Microsoft's OUTLOOK EXPRESS is one of the most spam & virus ridden places on one's PC. I have never used, nor would I think of using it on my PC's. Gmail, IMHO, is somewhat of a joke - for a modern email system. Cumbersome is a good descriptor, for gmail. I use Elecraft REFLECTOR - as it time manages all the user messages that get posted. So I then pour down thru them all, in chronological order - trying to make sense out of who posted what about what topic. That is what they make forum BB's for! I've got a lot of time, retired, but I'm not going to spend my time - sorting and saving and cataloging Elecraft member emails - why would I need to do that? There are very well tuned software forum tools out there - that do that for us. I found out the the forum software I referenced, is a free, ans supported product, free for the asking. In the referenced bateau2.com forum, when they changed over to their current system - it took like 1 or 2 weeks for all the posters and customers to roll over. It just happened. I'm quite sure people and customers - don't patronize and buy Elecraft electronic products, because of the REFLECTOR tool! I suspect, even Bill Gates would turn over in his on this topic. IMHO KILL THIS THREAD, IT'LL NEVER HAPPEN. O&O de N3CSY, Fred, FL, NY It's here! Your new message! Get new email alerts with the free Yahoo! Toolbar. http://tools.search.yahoo.com/toolbar/features/mail/ ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
Re: [Elecraft] New Elecraft Message Board?
> > For the list to change format, Elecraft would just have to do it. And they have repeatedly said that they won't ... most recently about a month ago. 73 de chris K6DBG ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
Re: [Elecraft] New Elecraft Message Board?
Apologies. That last, untrimmed, reply from me was not intended for the entire mailing list. Is there any reason that someone outside Elecraft couldn't set up a "forum" that was gatewayed in and out of the mailing list? I've mostly found the archive access gives the advantages of a forum (with the exception of cases where a discussion extends over the boundary between months.) I much prefer the mailing list. 73, doug ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
Re: [Elecraft] New Elecraft Message Board?
Fred (FL) wrote: I'm proposing it is way past about time, for Elecraft Inc. to create and support an "Elecraft Message Board" for all its many customers and fans. IMHO - this REFLECTOR thing - is about 10 years out of date, and an antique. This is a complaint that keeps popping up, like a gopher on a golf course. *NONE* of the clever web-based solutions for "forums", "message boards" etc. is a good a solution for this type of discussion as the old-fashioned reflector. Why? 1) No matter how fast your internet connection is, the process of navigation and reading messages in such a system is slower than an email client like Thunderbird or Outlook Express. You cannot get away from the net and server overhead. Glancing at a post to see if I want to pay attention to it takes a fraction of a second. 2) Many of us do not dedicate time to reading Elecraft messages; we simply deal with them as part of our regular email usage. For example, part of my job is doing technical support for users of a product. I also belong to several discussion groups for political subjects, etc. I get tons of mail. By using a basic email client I can quickly scan the hundred emails or so in my inbox and attend to the high-priority ones first. It is an extremely efficient use of my time. 3) You can set up folders in a basic email client that alow you to file saved messages and sort and search them in the most convenient way for you personally. Web-based systems can barely approach the same functionality, they are harder to use and are SLOW! The old-fashioned reflector is efficient, appropriate technology. It is a perfect tool for the job at hand. Don't fix what isn't broken! -- 73, Vic, K2VCO Fresno CA http://www.qsl.net/k2vco ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
Re: [Elecraft] New Elecraft Message Board? [End of Thread]
Welcome back Eric, and thanks for ending that thread. There was plenty of time to waste this weekend with the bands the way they were (dead) but I thought I'd update you on what the scoundrels in the other camp were up to while you were away. You know that computer, I mean transceiver that's all computer? The newest model is hidden on a big box so you cannot see the Windows but I hear tale that XP and lots of other Bill Gates evil is inside when you buy it. You don't need to be too smart to set this one up, just need to be able to find the USB post on your existing computer I hear. Well they had the mystery antenna guy (W5GI?) on the air with Serial Number #1 this weekend and he was taking calls. He said he wanted to take some QRP signals first so I had the Argo V ready to go but the calls he took were oddly all SDR1000's doing 1.5kw. What a coincidence? It was just like coming home for those guys and I could "feel the love". Anyway, the SDR crowd got a bone this weekend and they gave that radio a test which is good because they are supposed to ship in a month. Too much money and too much computer for myself, but hey it's something new on the bands. Now pse get bk to work, hope you had a nice weekend! from [Eric Swartz - WA6HHQ, Elecraft] To: "Gregg R. Lengling" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Subject: Re: [Elecraft] New Elecraft Message Board? [End of Thread] From: "Eric Swartz - WA6HHQ, Elecraft" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Date: Mon, 04 Jun 2007 07:56:01 -0700 Cc: 'Elecraft Discussion List' User-agent: Thunderbird 1.5.0.12 (Windows/20070509) Guys - I apologize for not stepping in earlier. I was out of town this weekend. ( It seems every time I'm out a new thread explodes.. ;-) We are not splitting the list. It would be impossible for us to participate in multiple lists, and to be honest, it would just make it confusing for someone new to Elecraft. In addition, this list serves as valuable marketing and technical feedback for us, and a single point method for communicating with a large number of Elecraft customers. 73, Eric WA6HHQ ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
Re: [Elecraft] New Elecraft Message Board?
Well put, sir. As far as forums being being "up-to-date", forums were available to the general public before email was. And they've not gotten a lot better, either. 73, doug From: "Craig Rairdin" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Date: Mon, 4 Jun 2007 09:24:27 -0500 Thread-Index: AcemmcbecYuqNq4ITfObab9Bbnhj6gAFlr9Q > this REFLECTOR thing - is about 10 years out of date, > and an antique. > Take a look at the following link (if Elecraft's > REFLECTOR will let it thru) - and see how a 2007 > Message Board & forum looks and feels. Hmmm. Looks like the CompuServe forum I was using for customer support in 1989 -- almost 20 years ago -- and the Web-based forum I was using for customer support in 1995. List servers like this one grew up in about the same time period, reaching the Internet in the early 1990's. I have a strong personal preference for an email list. It is a "push" technology -- all the information comes to me instead of me having to go to the information -- and I can use a variety of easy-to-use tools to organize it. I can block posts from particular users, I can archive messages I may want to refer to in the future, and I can sort messages by date, subject, author or whatever. The Web-based archive at qth.net allows me to search the entire history of the list, and gives me the ability to download all messages over the entire history of the list to my local machine for storage or searching. Web-based forums require ME to visit THEM. In order to keep track of what I've seen before, some write a cookie to my machine. From time to time I flush my cookies and as a result, the Web forum may lose track of what I've seen and not seen, requiring me to manually review each thread. It is difficult to save posts for later review, except by cutting and pasting into a document of some kind, which loses the threaded nature of the discussion. My email program archives all the emails I send, so I have an easy record of everything I've posted to every email list of which I am a member. It is more difficult to get the same from a Web-based forum. But my purpose for posting was not so much to argue in favor of the email list over a Web forum (an argument I happen to know I'm going to win because I know where Eric stands on the issue) but rather to point out that email lists are no more "old fashioned" than forums. Their history overlaps. They were both developed at the same time. Rather than spit into the wind, the email list detractors should take five minutes to figure out how to better organize their incoming email. It's trivial to send all Elecraft email to its own folder in most email clients. It's trivial to further divide them by K1, K2, K3, etc. It's also trivial to switch to digest mode, or leave the list until such time as you need help. The solutions to the amount of traffic generated by this list are myriad and none require changes of the scope some have suggested, inconveniencing all 2000 members of the list. Craig NZ0R KX1 #1499 K1 #1966 K2/100 #4941 K3/100 < #200 ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
Re: [Elecraft] New Elecraft Message Board? [End of Thread]
Ahh - I see this was more about changing the list to a message board format. We also will be keeping the list email based. As several have mentioned before, it is very easy to set up your email client program to filter individual messages to separate folders based on words in the subject line or body. I use this extensively to handle the huge email load I receive daily. [Elecraft] list posts go to the 'Elecraft List' folder, and even K3 posts can go to a 'K3' sub folder. None of the list postings are ever seen in my main inbox. Also, for those who prefer to read the list in a web based format, we have been providing this service for a long time. See: http://www.ac6rm.net/mailarchive/html/elecraft-list/It does much of what people are asking for. You can click on [Date] to read each days postings sorted by time and date. [Thread] sorts by thread etc. I use the [Date] sorted list to display each posting just by its subject line. I then only need to click on the posting subject lines that I actually want to read and I am not overloaded by email headers etc. If you prefer to read the list this way, just set your list options to 'no email' to stop individual mail delivery but still be allowed to post. (I'll post instructions for this next.) 73, Eric ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
Re: [Elecraft] New Elecraft Message Board? [End of Thread]
Guys - I apologize for not stepping in earlier. I was out of town this weekend. ( It seems every time I'm out a new thread explodes.. ;-) We are not splitting the list. It would be impossible for us to participate in multiple lists, and to be honest, it would just make it confusing for someone new to Elecraft. In addition, this list serves as valuable marketing and technical feedback for us, and a single point method for communicating with a large number of Elecraft customers. 73, Eric WA6HHQ Gregg R. Lengling wrote: Enough already everyone, this has been hashed over before and even myself and Simon offered to set up and host a web based forum for Elecraft. However Elecraft said they aren't interested at this time, So that should end the conversations. When Eric or whomever decides to do something different they can do it...but for now just live with the email list. ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
[Elecraft] New Elecraft Message Board?
If it's to change, I don't want to see any advertising - at all - 100% bandwidth goes to Elecraft posts or posts on IBM/Microsoft/Bill Gates. ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
RE: [Elecraft] New Elecraft Message Board?
Enough already everyone, this has been hashed over before and even myself and Simon offered to set up and host a web based forum for Elecraft. However Elecraft said they aren't interested at this time, So that should end the conversations. When Eric or whomever decides to do something different they can do it...but for now just live with the email list. Gregg Lengling, W9DHI Administrator http://forums.ham-radio.ch http://www.milwaukeehdtv.org ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
RE: [Elecraft] New Elecraft Message Board?
> this REFLECTOR thing - is about 10 years out of date, > and an antique. > Take a look at the following link (if Elecraft's > REFLECTOR will let it thru) - and see how a 2007 > Message Board & forum looks and feels. Hmmm. Looks like the CompuServe forum I was using for customer support in 1989 -- almost 20 years ago -- and the Web-based forum I was using for customer support in 1995. List servers like this one grew up in about the same time period, reaching the Internet in the early 1990's. I have a strong personal preference for an email list. It is a "push" technology -- all the information comes to me instead of me having to go to the information -- and I can use a variety of easy-to-use tools to organize it. I can block posts from particular users, I can archive messages I may want to refer to in the future, and I can sort messages by date, subject, author or whatever. The Web-based archive at qth.net allows me to search the entire history of the list, and gives me the ability to download all messages over the entire history of the list to my local machine for storage or searching. Web-based forums require ME to visit THEM. In order to keep track of what I've seen before, some write a cookie to my machine. From time to time I flush my cookies and as a result, the Web forum may lose track of what I've seen and not seen, requiring me to manually review each thread. It is difficult to save posts for later review, except by cutting and pasting into a document of some kind, which loses the threaded nature of the discussion. My email program archives all the emails I send, so I have an easy record of everything I've posted to every email list of which I am a member. It is more difficult to get the same from a Web-based forum. But my purpose for posting was not so much to argue in favor of the email list over a Web forum (an argument I happen to know I'm going to win because I know where Eric stands on the issue) but rather to point out that email lists are no more "old fashioned" than forums. Their history overlaps. They were both developed at the same time. Rather than spit into the wind, the email list detractors should take five minutes to figure out how to better organize their incoming email. It's trivial to send all Elecraft email to its own folder in most email clients. It's trivial to further divide them by K1, K2, K3, etc. It's also trivial to switch to digest mode, or leave the list until such time as you need help. The solutions to the amount of traffic generated by this list are myriad and none require changes of the scope some have suggested, inconveniencing all 2000 members of the list. Craig NZ0R KX1 #1499 K1 #1966 K2/100 #4941 K3/100 < #200 ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
Re: [Elecraft] New Elecraft Message Board?
See bottom post On Mon, 2007-04-06 at 04:15 -0700, Fred (FL) wrote: I'm proposing it is way past about time, for Elecraft Inc. to create and support an "Elecraft Message Board" If it ain't broke don't fix it. With any modern email client one can sort messages by thread, and filter out those one finds objectionable. I find email less cumbersome than message board systems, which have no filtering. I do agree that a message board can organize by topic, thread or sender, but I just can not bring myself to like the system. Just my $.02 worth, now back in my hole. 73 de John AI4JH ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
Re: [Elecraft] New Elecraft Message Board?
I prefer current, email based system. -- This email message, including any attachments, is for the sole use of the intended recipient(s) and may contain information that is proprietary, confidential, and exempt from disclosure under applicable law. Any unauthorized review, use, disclosure, or distribution is prohibited. If you have received this email in error please notify the sender by return email and delete the original message. Please note, the recipient should check this email and any attachments for the presence of viruses. The organization accepts no liability for any damage caused by any virus transmitted by this email. == ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
Re: [Elecraft] New Elecraft Message Board?
On Jun 4, 2007, at 5:08 AM, Arthur Gunn wrote: Fred I follow several message boards also and they are more rewarding to follow and and more efficient to use than the present Elecraft approach to communications among users. I disagree. I don't want to have to log into some other board to read messages. I want them all in one place -- my mailbox. Yes I have the various reflectors to which I subscribe split out into separate folders automatically but that is an easy thing to deal with. I too would prefer to keep the reflector the way it is. Since the messages are better organized into topics & sub topics the long term topic searching is considerably better organized. In the long run this should reduce the duplicated question traffic. All of the major mail readers offer threading for topics. If people will properly alter the subject line when they alter a topic this works fine. And a BBS has no advantage there either as you won't see a new thread if people don't create one. 73 de Brian, WB6RQN Brian Lloyd - brian HYPHEN wb6rqn AT lloyd DOT com ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
Re: [Elecraft] New Elecraft Message Board?
I second that, Bill. Leave well enough alone! Cheers, Rod K5BGB Bill Tippett <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: G4ILO: >The list archives would be an excellent tool for those who just want to follow specific threads of interest, but they waste way to much space displaying completely irrelevant header information, so you have to scroll down to read the actual text, and there is no easy way to send an in-context reply to a post. I beg to differ on your last sentence above and cite this post as an example of doing what you want. It's extremely simple to do but requires you to do more than simply hit reply. All of the features mentioned (sorting by thread, web-based presentations, etc) are completely possible within the present structure. You just have to take the time and effort to learn to do it! Leave it alone. Let those who want to change it spend 5 minutes learning how to do what they need (below). 73, Bill W4ZV P.S. Time for our monthly deja vu: http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/elecraft/2007-May/067199.html ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
Re: [Elecraft] New Elecraft Message Board?
On Mon, 4 Jun 2007, Fred (FL) wrote: I'm proposing it is way past about time, for Elecraft Inc. to create and support an "Elecraft Message Board" for all its many customers and fans. IMHO - this REFLECTOR thing - is about 10 years out of date, and an antique. I have experience in mailing lists(reflectors) versus web based forums. Both work, and both have their own set of "customers". Some folks enjoy email and avoid web-based forums, others can't live without a forum and don't want the emails. You can almost make bets that if a mailing list community is changed to a forum, a number of people will leave, and turning a forum into email will also loose folks. Both Yahoo and Google groups offer the community the ability to choose between email, web based forums or both...with the distinct advantage that the information posted by the web forum only community is sent to the email only community and vice versa. I create, design and support several websites for a few commerical orgs, and this kind of change for the better - is just that. It comes with the internet territory. The REFLECTOR thing - is something from the past. So is cwyet many of us still use it. I hope that Elecraft does NOT take your suggestion to eliminate the email list and change it to a web-based forum...I would hope that in time they accomodate both venues where each of us can hove our own favored venue and not impose that upong others, which would be the end result of your proposal Thom,EIEIO Email, Internet, Electronic Information Officer k3hrn www.baltimorehon.com/Home of the Baltimore Lexicon www.tlchost.net/hosting/ Web Hosting as low as 3.49/month ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
[Elecraft] New Elecraft Message Board?
G4ILO: >The list archives would be an excellent tool for those who just want to follow specific threads of interest, but they waste way to much space displaying completely irrelevant header information, so you have to scroll down to read the actual text, and there is no easy way to send an in-context reply to a post. I beg to differ on your last sentence above and cite this post as an example of doing what you want. It's extremely simple to do but requires you to do more than simply hit reply. All of the features mentioned (sorting by thread, web-based presentations, etc) are completely possible within the present structure. You just have to take the time and effort to learn to do it! Leave it alone. Let those who want to change it spend 5 minutes learning how to do what they need (below). 73, Bill W4ZV P.S. Time for our monthly deja vu: http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/elecraft/2007-May/067199.html ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
RE: [Elecraft] New Elecraft Message Board?
Good luck Fred. Getting something like this to change is like pulling teeth. People have gotten very used to this old-style system. For the list to change format, Elecraft would just have to do it. If they said that the old system was too costly and the new one was they way they were going, we'd all just follow along and things would be fine. Some features would be lost, many others gained and we'd all be happy in 6 months. Ask for consensus and you'll have opinions all over the place with no agreement. Some of my hobby stuff is on e-mail lists like this. Others are on forum style systems. I prefer the latter but I can deal with either. - Keith N1AS - - K2 5411.ssb.100 - -Original Message- I'm proposing it is way past about time, for Elecraft Inc. to create and support an "Elecraft Message Board" for all its many customers and fans. IMHO - this REFLECTOR thing - is about 10 years out of date, and an antique. ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
Re: [Elecraft] New Elecraft Message Board?
I don't think it's possible to find a solution that suits both experienced users with powerful email programs who know how to set up filters to organize messages how they want, and those who just have everything end up in their inbox and who fret over the pennies it costs them to download posts that are off-topic or of no interest. The list archives would be an excellent tool for those who just want to follow specific threads of interest, but they waste way to much space displaying completely irrelevant header information, so you have to scroll down to read the actual text, and there is no easy way to send an in-context reply to a post. I see that Michael W2CVZ has echoed my suggestion of using Gmail as a dedicated account for Elecraft messages. It's free and it works great. But I guess there may still be some who won't use a web based reader because they pay for net access by the minute. I sympathize with those people but I don't think the answer is strict moderation because this is not just an Elecraft support group but also a *community* and it is inevitable that people will now and again want to discuss things with fellow members that are not strictly about using or fixing Elecraft products. -- Julian, G4ILO G4ILO's Shack: www.g4ilo.com K2 s/n: 392 K3 s/n: ??? ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
Fwd: [Elecraft] New Elecraft Message Board?
Get Gmail it's free and it automatically sorts messages into threads so if someone sends an EMail and another person replies they are shown right below each other in the same message plus you get 2 GB of storge and you can forward your Yahoo mail to gmail also. Reply if you wan't an Invitation. -- W2CVZ, Michael K1#2343 ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
RE: [Elecraft] New Elecraft Message Board?
As is, please. Regards, Dick - KA5KKT/4 ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
Re: [Elecraft] New Elecraft Message Board?
On Mon, 4 Jun 2007, Matt Osborn wrote: > On Mon, 4 Jun 2007 04:15:49 -0700 (PDT), "Fred (FL)" > <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > >I'm proposing it is way past about time, for Elecraft > >Inc. to create and support an "Elecraft Message Board" > >for all its many customers and fans. IMHO - > >this REFLECTOR thing - is about 10 years out of date, > >and an antique. > > I very much prefer the current reflector with my modern reader and its > single key stroke message reading to the limited, mouse based, > graphical interface. > Me too An email based "reflector" is much more useable than any "web forum". It's up to you how you set up your email software to filter/thread/sort. A web-forum requires you to be online to read any messages, requires use of a web browser etc. An email list just requres you to download messages and then you can disconnect and read at your leisure. For the maximum coverage, with the maximum compatabilty of hardware/software/OS/net availabilty/bandwidth requirements it just has to be plain, simple TEXT (no HTML) email Web forums are indeed easy to set up (I run a small one myself http://www.gm3zet.org/phpBB2/index.php) but I've never enjoyed using any of them for quick & easy navigation/reading/replying/filtering/ignoring threads/following threads YMMV... Cheers, John GM4SLV ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
RE: [Elecraft] New Elecraft Message Board?
I like the current elecraft message board as I receive the emails into outlook where I can read and respond I don't have to go to some website to keep up to date so as for my vote elecraft should keep it the same it works and it aint broke so don't fix it -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Arthur Gunn Sent: Monday, June 04, 2007 8:08 AM To: Fred (FL) Cc: elecraft@mailman.qth.net Subject: Re: [Elecraft] New Elecraft Message Board? Fred I follow several message boards also and they are more rewarding to follow and and more efficient to use than the present Elecraft approach to communications among users. Since the messages are better organized into topics & sub topics the long term topic searching is considerably better organized. In the long run this should reduce the duplicated question traffic. The following example is typical of well supported boards on the same scale as Elecraft: forum.freespire.org/ Thanks for your posting and I hope the idea is developed for the betterment of Elecraft support. Arthur On Mon, 2007-04-06 at 04:15 -0700, Fred (FL) wrote: > I'm proposing it is way past about time, for Elecraft > Inc. to create and support an "Elecraft Message Board" > for all its many customers and fans. IMHO - > this REFLECTOR thing - is about 10 years out of date, > and an antique. > > Take a look at the following link (if Elecraft's > REFLECTOR will let it thru) - and see how a 2007 > Message Board & forum looks and feels. > > >http://forums.bateau2.com/ > > Bateau Inc. is a company that sells boat plans, boat > kits, boat parts, and has a large customer base of > boat builders, and people who are repairing, building > and upgrading their boats. Their message board is > their forum for all their customers, for all the > categories of things that one would get involved in, > in providing a "boat plans" and kits company to the > world. > > I'm not sure how much people-time it would take to put > up such a message board for Elecraft's customers and > fans, but it would be a "K3" type of improvement. > Boards like the one bateau uses - are a canned > commercial software board, and I'm quite sure reside > on the company's servers. No big deal at all. > > Elecraft might even be able to talk a customer into > providing the time for care, feeding and maintenance > of such a modern MESSAGE BOARD Forum. > > I don't know about others - but the experience of > reading Elecraft REFLECTOR posts, where 1/2 of the > message is header/links/message trails, gets very old. > One wonders at times, if the message content on the > Elecraft RELFLECTOR is secondary to all the header > material that tags along each and every post. > > I create, design and support several websites for > a few commerical orgs, and this kind of change for > the better - is just that. It comes with the > internet territory. The REFLECTOR thing - is > something from the past. > > Any chance - Elecraft's "computer guy or girl" > could put one up for us? > > 73, de Fred, N3CSY > > > > > > __ > __ > Never miss an email again! > Yahoo! Toolbar alerts you the instant new Mail arrives. > http://tools.search.yahoo.com/toolbar/features/mail/ > ___ > Elecraft mailing list > Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net > You must be a subscriber to post to the list. > Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): > http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft > > Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm > Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com -- Arthur Gunn VE9BP [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] (files >5Mb) ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
Re: [Elecraft] New Elecraft Message Board?
Fred I follow several message boards also and they are more rewarding to follow and and more efficient to use than the present Elecraft approach to communications among users. Since the messages are better organized into topics & sub topics the long term topic searching is considerably better organized. In the long run this should reduce the duplicated question traffic. The following example is typical of well supported boards on the same scale as Elecraft: forum.freespire.org/ Thanks for your posting and I hope the idea is developed for the betterment of Elecraft support. Arthur On Mon, 2007-04-06 at 04:15 -0700, Fred (FL) wrote: > I'm proposing it is way past about time, for Elecraft > Inc. to create and support an "Elecraft Message Board" > for all its many customers and fans. IMHO - > this REFLECTOR thing - is about 10 years out of date, > and an antique. > > Take a look at the following link (if Elecraft's > REFLECTOR will let it thru) - and see how a 2007 > Message Board & forum looks and feels. > > >http://forums.bateau2.com/ > > Bateau Inc. is a company that sells boat plans, boat > kits, boat parts, and has a large customer base of > boat builders, and people who are repairing, building > and upgrading their boats. Their message board is > their forum for all their customers, for all the > categories of things that one would get involved in, > in providing a "boat plans" and kits company to the > world. > > I'm not sure how much people-time it would take to put > up such a message board for Elecraft's customers and > fans, but it would be a "K3" type of improvement. > Boards like the one bateau uses - are a canned > commercial software board, and I'm quite sure reside > on the company's servers. No big deal at all. > > Elecraft might even be able to talk a customer into > providing the time for care, feeding and maintenance > of such a modern MESSAGE BOARD Forum. > > I don't know about others - but the experience of > reading Elecraft REFLECTOR posts, where 1/2 of the > message is header/links/message trails, gets very old. > One wonders at times, if the message content on the > Elecraft RELFLECTOR is secondary to all the header > material that tags along each and every post. > > I create, design and support several websites for > a few commerical orgs, and this kind of change for > the better - is just that. It comes with the > internet territory. The REFLECTOR thing - is > something from the past. > > Any chance - Elecraft's "computer guy or girl" > could put one up for us? > > 73, de Fred, N3CSY > > > > > > > Never miss an email again! > Yahoo! Toolbar alerts you the instant new Mail arrives. > http://tools.search.yahoo.com/toolbar/features/mail/ > ___ > Elecraft mailing list > Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net > You must be a subscriber to post to the list. > Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): > http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft > > Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm > Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com -- Arthur Gunn VE9BP [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] (files >5Mb) ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
Re: [Elecraft] New Elecraft Message Board?
Hallo Fred et al, I'm proposing it is way past about time, for Elecraft Inc. to create and support an "Elecraft Message Board" for all its many customers and fans. IMHO - this REFLECTOR thing - is about 10 years out of date, and an antique. I use the support services of various companies and their customers at work - Some are mail lists (reflectors) and some are web based forums. In Elecraft's case my vote is: Elecraft please *do not* change anything. vy 73 de toby -- DD5FZ, 4N6FZ (ex dj7mgq, dg5mgq, dd5fz) K2 #885, K2/100 #3248 K3/100 #??? (< #200) DOK C12, BCC, DL-QRP-AG ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
Re: [Elecraft] New Elecraft Message Board?
On Mon, 4 Jun 2007 04:15:49 -0700 (PDT), "Fred (FL)" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: >I'm proposing it is way past about time, for Elecraft >Inc. to create and support an "Elecraft Message Board" >for all its many customers and fans. IMHO - >this REFLECTOR thing - is about 10 years out of date, >and an antique. With the current reflector and modern reader, I can see the subject and authors for 80 to 90 threads at a glance (no scrolling). I can also automatically filter the posts by subject or author. The posts can be ordered by thread, time (ascending or descending), alphabetical by subject or author and various combinations of the above. The forum you recommend requires that I use a cumbersome interface that I find backward and non-intuitive. On my screen, I can see at most 20 message classifications without scrolling or opening nested window interfaces, all of which, when opened, display approx. 20 message headers, which when opened, display the actual messages. I very much prefer the current reflector with my modern reader and its single key stroke message reading to the limited, mouse based, graphical interface. -- kc0ukk at msosborn dot com ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
[Elecraft] New Elecraft Message Board?
I'm proposing it is way past about time, for Elecraft Inc. to create and support an "Elecraft Message Board" for all its many customers and fans. IMHO - this REFLECTOR thing - is about 10 years out of date, and an antique. Take a look at the following link (if Elecraft's REFLECTOR will let it thru) - and see how a 2007 Message Board & forum looks and feels. http://forums.bateau2.com/ Bateau Inc. is a company that sells boat plans, boat kits, boat parts, and has a large customer base of boat builders, and people who are repairing, building and upgrading their boats. Their message board is their forum for all their customers, for all the categories of things that one would get involved in, in providing a "boat plans" and kits company to the world. I'm not sure how much people-time it would take to put up such a message board for Elecraft's customers and fans, but it would be a "K3" type of improvement. Boards like the one bateau uses - are a canned commercial software board, and I'm quite sure reside on the company's servers. No big deal at all. Elecraft might even be able to talk a customer into providing the time for care, feeding and maintenance of such a modern MESSAGE BOARD Forum. I don't know about others - but the experience of reading Elecraft REFLECTOR posts, where 1/2 of the message is header/links/message trails, gets very old. One wonders at times, if the message content on the Elecraft RELFLECTOR is secondary to all the header material that tags along each and every post. I create, design and support several websites for a few commerical orgs, and this kind of change for the better - is just that. It comes with the internet territory. The REFLECTOR thing - is something from the past. Any chance - Elecraft's "computer guy or girl" could put one up for us? 73, de Fred, N3CSY Never miss an email again! Yahoo! Toolbar alerts you the instant new Mail arrives. http://tools.search.yahoo.com/toolbar/features/mail/ ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
