Re: [Elecraft] OT; electrical safety

[Richard Fjeld]

Maybe this applies.
We have buried electrical service, but I don't think it matters.  I have 
been told the NEC now calls for four conductor service to include a 
ground wire from the transformer.

I depend on a ground tree.  I like the perimeter wire Don, w3fpr describes.

Dick, n0ce


On 4/17/2017 4:00 PM, ab2tc wrote:
> Hi,
>
> This is totally off topic; I apologize.
>
> I just received the new ARRL publication "grounding and bonding  for the
> radio amateur". It is very interesting reading. I see that the NEC requires
> two ground rods for regular power installations; never mind any antennas. I
> swear that when when I moved into this house there were absolutely no ground
> rods installed. I just inspected our power pole that supplies our power. I
> could see no wires going in to the ground. So I have no idea where our
> "green wire" came from.
>
> But I have have installed two 8 foot ground rods to ground my antennas and
> they are bonded to the AC entry panel. But what's up with this? I bet my
> neighbors have no ground rods installed either.
>
> Knut - AB2TC
>
>
>
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Re: [Elecraft] OT; electrical safety

[Clay Autery]

That description appears to contain several NEC violations...

__
Clay Autery, KY5G
MONTAC Enterprises
(318) 518-1389

On 4/17/2017 4:40 PM, Mark via Elecraft wrote:
> Re:   I could see no wires going in to the ground.
>
> They really hide them these days.  I watched my house being built and noticed 
> that just below the service box, they passed the ground wire from the inside 
> of the wall to the outside, and then down to the ground rod.  Since the wall 
> was then covered with stucco, and the ground rod was covered with a concrete 
> walkway, it is all now invisible.
>
> Mark,
> KE6BB
> null

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Re: [Elecraft] OT; electrical safety

[Fred Jensen]

You probably have a "UFER" ground, named for Herbert Ufer who came up 
with the idea of encasing the ground electrode in concrete to protect 
ordnance storage compartments during WW2, often in the southwestern US 
with very poor soil conductivity.  In the latter 60's, the NEC permitted 
it unless a buried water pipe was available, and sometime in the late 
70's made them a requirement.  The NEC now calls them Concrete Encased 
Electrodes.


The NEC currently requires that CEE's be rebar in the concrete [usually 
the foundation] and can be difficult to find since very little if 
anything will be externally visible.  Our home is 4 years old and I 
can't see the actual ground connection.  I can see the ground conductor 
headed downward from the service entrance.  I presume it connects to a 
CEE. [:-)


As to your power pole:  If it has a distribution transformer, it will 
very likely have lightning arrestors on the primary with a ground 
conductor and electrode.  If it doesn't have a transformer, it's only 
purpose is to hold up the conductors on insulators.


None of this drivel applies to RF.

73,

Fred ("Skip") K6DGW
Sparks NV USA
Washoe County DM09dn



On 4/17/2017 2:00 PM, ab2tc wrote:

Hi,

This is totally off topic; I apologize.

I just received the new ARRL publication "grounding and bonding  for the
radio amateur". It is very interesting reading. I see that the NEC requires
two ground rods for regular power installations; never mind any antennas. I
swear that when when I moved into this house there were absolutely no ground
rods installed. I just inspected our power pole that supplies our power. I
could see no wires going in to the ground. So I have no idea where our
"green wire" came from.

But I have have installed two 8 foot ground rods to ground my antennas and
they are bonded to the AC entry panel. But what's up with this? I bet my
neighbors have no ground rods installed either.

Knut - AB2TC



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Re: [Elecraft] OT; electrical safety

[Mark via Elecraft]

Re:   I could see no wires going in to the ground.

They really hide them these days.  I watched my house being built and noticed 
that just below the service box, they passed the ground wire from the inside of 
the wall to the outside, and then down to the ground rod.  Since the wall was 
then covered with stucco, and the ground rod was covered with a concrete 
walkway, it is all now invisible.

Mark,
KE6BB
null
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Re: [Elecraft] OT; electrical safety

[Don Wilhelm]

Knut,

When I built my house in 2001, only one ground rod at the utility entry 
point was required.  We built a house next door in 2009, and two ground 
rods separated by 6 feet was required.  So sometime between those two 
dates the NEC requirements changed.


None-the-less, I have a perimeter wire around the house with a driven 
ground rod at each corner.  Since I have 45 degree corners on one side, 
and several other 90 degree offsets that means I have 9 ground rods plus 
the one at the utility entry, so I think I am "covered".


73,
Don W3FPR

On 4/17/2017 5:00 PM, ab2tc wrote:

Hi,

This is totally off topic; I apologize.

I just received the new ARRL publication "grounding and bonding  for the
radio amateur". It is very interesting reading. I see that the NEC requires
two ground rods for regular power installations; never mind any antennas. I
swear that when when I moved into this house there were absolutely no ground
rods installed. I just inspected our power pole that supplies our power. I
could see no wires going in to the ground. So I have no idea where our
"green wire" came from.

But I have have installed two 8 foot ground rods to ground my antennas and
they are bonded to the AC entry panel. But what's up with this? I bet my
neighbors have no ground rods installed either.

Knut - AB2TC



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Re: [Elecraft] OT; electrical safety

[Bill Johnson]

Or you are the ground! :-)  Open your panel cover, if you are comfortable, and 
look for copper to grounding bar installation.  I had my electrician bind an 
around the foundation wire to my box and then to the rebar.  At the time I 
built there was no inspector, 2004.  Can you believe it?  Lots of pathetic 
electrical work in the world.  Wonder why all the fires?

73,
Bill
K9YEQ

-Original Message-
From: Elecraft [mailto:elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net] On Behalf Of Jim Miller
Sent: Monday, April 17, 2017 4:04 PM
To: ab2tc <ab...@arrl.net>
Cc: Elecraft Reflector <elecraft@mailman.qth.net>
Subject: Re: [Elecraft] OT; electrical safety

I'm guessing you and your neighbors have grounding via a basement slab Ufer.

73

jim ab3cv

On Mon, Apr 17, 2017 at 5:00 PM, ab2tc <ab...@arrl.net> wrote:

> Hi,
>
> This is totally off topic; I apologize.
>
> I just received the new ARRL publication "grounding and bonding  for 
> the radio amateur". It is very interesting reading. I see that the NEC 
> requires two ground rods for regular power installations; never mind 
> any antennas. I swear that when when I moved into this house there 
> were absolutely no ground rods installed. I just inspected our power 
> pole that supplies our power. I could see no wires going in to the 
> ground. So I have no idea where our "green wire" came from.
>
> But I have have installed two 8 foot ground rods to ground my antennas 
> and they are bonded to the AC entry panel. But what's up with this? I 
> bet my neighbors have no ground rods installed either.
>
> Knut - AB2TC
>
>
>
> --
> View this message in context: http://elecraft.365791.n2.
> nabble.com/OT-electrical-safety-tp7629429.html
> Sent from the Elecraft mailing list archive at Nabble.com.
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Re: [Elecraft] OT; electrical safety

[Matt Zilmer]

Most house grounds are just a piece of re-bar hammered into the soil, 
andthis is done before the foundation is poured around it. Ours is 
barely visible except for the big chair clamp that secures the bare #8 
wire to it. I've seen it other ways too, for example in the upper 
midwest.  The ground we had in Iowa was three copper-plated rods within 
about one square foot, all bonded together.  Not sure why anyone would 
do that, but the builder did the same for all houses in that development.


73,

matt W6NIA


On 4/17/2017 2:00 PM, ab2tc wrote:

Hi,

This is totally off topic; I apologize.

I just received the new ARRL publication "grounding and bonding  for the
radio amateur". It is very interesting reading. I see that the NEC requires
two ground rods for regular power installations; never mind any antennas. I
swear that when when I moved into this house there were absolutely no ground
rods installed. I just inspected our power pole that supplies our power. I
could see no wires going in to the ground. So I have no idea where our
"green wire" came from.

But I have have installed two 8 foot ground rods to ground my antennas and
they are bonded to the AC entry panel. But what's up with this? I bet my
neighbors have no ground rods installed either.

Knut - AB2TC



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-- unknonwn

Matt Zilmer, W6NIA
[Shiraz]

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Re: [Elecraft] OT; electrical safety

[Jim Miller]

I'm guessing you and your neighbors have grounding via a basement slab Ufer.

73

jim ab3cv

On Mon, Apr 17, 2017 at 5:00 PM, ab2tc  wrote:

> Hi,
>
> This is totally off topic; I apologize.
>
> I just received the new ARRL publication "grounding and bonding  for the
> radio amateur". It is very interesting reading. I see that the NEC requires
> two ground rods for regular power installations; never mind any antennas. I
> swear that when when I moved into this house there were absolutely no
> ground
> rods installed. I just inspected our power pole that supplies our power. I
> could see no wires going in to the ground. So I have no idea where our
> "green wire" came from.
>
> But I have have installed two 8 foot ground rods to ground my antennas and
> they are bonded to the AC entry panel. But what's up with this? I bet my
> neighbors have no ground rods installed either.
>
> Knut - AB2TC
>
>
>
> --
> View this message in context: http://elecraft.365791.n2.
> nabble.com/OT-electrical-safety-tp7629429.html
> Sent from the Elecraft mailing list archive at Nabble.com.
> __
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> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
> Message delivered to j...@jtmiller.com
>
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[Elecraft] OT; electrical safety

[ab2tc]

Hi,

This is totally off topic; I apologize.

I just received the new ARRL publication "grounding and bonding  for the
radio amateur". It is very interesting reading. I see that the NEC requires
two ground rods for regular power installations; never mind any antennas. I
swear that when when I moved into this house there were absolutely no ground
rods installed. I just inspected our power pole that supplies our power. I
could see no wires going in to the ground. So I have no idea where our
"green wire" came from.

But I have have installed two 8 foot ground rods to ground my antennas and
they are bonded to the AC entry panel. But what's up with this? I bet my
neighbors have no ground rods installed either.

Knut - AB2TC



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