Re: [Elecraft] We Need More Power
On 27/09/2019 16:03, Bob McGraw K4TAX wrote: [Tedious eulogy snipped] QRP. It isn't big and it isn't clever. 73, Richard G4DYA __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html Message delivered to arch...@mail-archive.com
Re: [Elecraft] We Need More Power
I'm doing lots of QRP, but my joy of ham radio comes from the freedom of choice. As an example, on June 28th I worked ZL4TT on 20ms with QRP on my second call, and five minutes later I heard ZL3IO, but I gave up QRPing after some fruitless calls. I enjoyed both QSOs very much. Just my 2 cents, Gernot DF5RF __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html Message delivered to arch...@mail-archive.com
Re: [Elecraft] We Need More Power
Stuff like this annoys me greatly because it takes anecdotal information and extrapolates it into a generalization. More power isn't the solution to everything, but as a very extensive thread on one of the other reflectors (TowerTalk or Contesting, I don't remember which) recently pointed out, additional power offers the very best bang for the buck for almost any station once you get above some fairly basic antennas. 10db from a used amplifier is awfully hard to beat for cost effectiveness ... even more so if you're space challenged and can't put up gain antennas. Besides, we're in sunspot hell right now and VK6FLAB's examples were from a totally different solar environment. His 1956 example occurred during the best solar peak in our lifetime. His 1969 example was also at a solar peak on 10m and I'd bet the antennas were impressive. The night before Field Day one year I worked an FR5 station on the opposite side of the globe from here in Arizona with 5 watts to a crappy antenna with Q5 copy on both ends, but that was an anomaly and I had one of my worst FD scores ever the next two days. Anecdotes aren't worth the keystrokes it takes to type them. They are interesting oddities and should be treated as such. I've done a LOT of QRP operating and it can indeed be fun, but as others have said many times, the effectiveness of the station and ability of the operator on the other end contributes as much or more to the success of the contact as does the supposed skill of the QRP operator. I find it telling that QRP proselytizers always seem to tout being heard on the other end and rarely brag about how they dug somebody else's meager signal out of the mud. I run 5 watts for Field Day because the five points more than compensates for the weaker signal on domestic paths. I run 50 watts for FT8 because I find that with my antennas I'm able to work just about anyone I can decode and I like saving the finals in my K3. I run 100 watts for contests like NAQP and anytime I get the urge to compete in a low power category. But if I want to work DX or score more points for my club in a major contest I don't hesitate to run the amp. Using low power purely for the sake of using power has pretty much the same effect as raising the noise level for the guy on the other end, and I really wish these sanctimonious odes to low power would just go away. Communication is communication ... nobody goes to a hamfest or club meeting with a gag in their mouth. Dave AB7E On 9/27/2019 8:03 AM, Bob McGraw K4TAX wrote: As found posted in another group. Stimulated thinking and as quoted. 73 Bob, K4TAX "We need more power. I'm giving her all she's got, Captain! She cannae take anymore. I'm sure your Scottish ancestors are rolling in their graves right now, but in our community of radio amateurs we have a tendency to advocate the use of more power. More power fixes all problems and hides all sins. Another way to look at that is to think of the station with more power as an alligator, all mouth, no ears. Before you dismiss this as another advocacy for QRP or low power, let me point out that more power creates more interference, more potential for harm, more electricity consumption, more wear and tear and more cost. Previously I've spoken extensively about QRP communications, making contact with 5 Watt or less, but let's have a look at how much less. I've shared with you that I managed to contact a station on the other side of the planet with only 5 Watts, Perth to Cuba and for me that was proof positive that all this was possible, even feasible. We're doing much better than that. One measurement is to calculate how many kilometers per Watt you achieved. My example of 5 Watt between Perth and Cuba is the equivalent of 3592 km per Watt. The maximum distance to the opposite side of our globe is about 20,000 km and my contact did nearly 18,000 km. If you think that's amazing, I should warn you, my contact was special, for me, but as low power contacts go, it's not that amazing. The first solid state radio contact made across the Atlantic ocean managed over 76,000 km per Watt. That was on 18 September 1956. You'll find the radio on display at the ARRL Laboratory, together with the bug and station log showing the contact between Chelmsford, Massachusetts and Copenhagen, Denmark between Gus W1OGU and Bo OZ7BO, on a radio made of two germanium transistors and built by Gus W1OGU, Al W1OSF and Dick W1UBC, who built the diminutive gadget on a lark to see if they could Work All Continents with it. If you can copy the 40 micro-watt CW beacon run by the North American QRP CW Club, you too can join in the fun. The current record stands at just under 22 million km per Watt when Bill W4ZV managed to copy the code word OMAHA from the N2XE beacon from New London, North Carolina. Just to be clear, we're talking about a signal that traveled the equivalent
Re: [Elecraft] We Need More Power
I have a K2/100 and an 88 ft low antenna fed with ladder-line. I run FT-8 at 12 watts. I use 40, 30 and occasionally 20M. While I haven't been on in a few months, earlier this year I was regularly working into NA, SA, Europe and occasionally Africa. 72, 73, Jim - W4BQP On 9/27/2019 11:38 AM, Ignacy wrote: The correlations between passionate writing and useful content is close to zero if not negative. Due to poor conditions the bands are empty. What you could do with 5W and some wire a few years ago now requires a KW with a beam. Many hams especially in noisy neighborhoods with simple antennas have trouble making contacts and become discouraged. But they can hear a station with a KW and a beam, and they overjoy when they make a contact. The original poster has a foundational license in Australia with, I think, 10W limit. I remember the excitement of such stations when I was working them from a very good VY2 location on 40m, for their first NA contact. Ignacy, NO9E -- Sent from: http://elecraft.365791.n2.nabble.com/ __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html Message delivered to j...@w4bqp.net __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html Message delivered to arch...@mail-archive.com
Re: [Elecraft] We Need More Power
I have seen this guy on QRZ.COM with all kinds of strange philosophies. No wonder he tries to challenge the average (100 W) and the above average (1 kW) hams this time. Unlike him probably most of us know the correlation between power and signal strength. It is simple physics. And for sure almost everyone also knows that if NOBODY else is calling a certain station the chances are good that even with a QRP signal you are being heard. Even more so if the operator on the other side is skilled and has good antennas. Normally if we all would approach the hobby with the QRP attitude very few would manage to make a contact. With QRP attitude I mean I have never heard a QRP station using a stack of monobanders. Usually the antenna approach is the same as the power approach - MINIMUM! Nothing wrong with it and I like to try QRP as well if a signal is strong and not too many are calling however with minimum efforts on both sides especially under poor conditions even without competition it is often impossible to establish the contact or even hear each other. After all it is for a good reason that broadcast stations were and still running high power. Yes it is possible to communicate around the world with low power if conditions are good, competition is low or nonexistent so what is new about it? Right - NOTHING! 6 dBs are 4 times the power and "Life is too short for QRP" - that is not new either but nevertheless a valid attitude too. 73/Roger, DL5RBW -Original Message- From: elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net [mailto:elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net] On Behalf Of Ignacy Sent: Friday, September 27, 2019 5:38 PM To: elecraft@mailman.qth.net Subject: Re: [Elecraft] We Need More Power The correlations between passionate writing and useful content is close to zero if not negative. Due to poor conditions the bands are empty. What you could do with 5W and some wire a few years ago now requires a KW with a beam. Many hams especially in noisy neighborhoods with simple antennas have trouble making contacts and become discouraged. But they can hear a station with a KW and a beam, and they overjoy when they make a contact. The original poster has a foundational license in Australia with, I think, 10W limit. I remember the excitement of such stations when I was working them from a very good VY2 location on 40m, for their first NA contact. Ignacy, NO9E -- Sent from: http://elecraft.365791.n2.nabble.com/ __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html Message delivered to ro...@mulzer.de __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html Message delivered to arch...@mail-archive.com
Re: [Elecraft] We Need More Power
The correlations between passionate writing and useful content is close to zero if not negative. Due to poor conditions the bands are empty. What you could do with 5W and some wire a few years ago now requires a KW with a beam. Many hams especially in noisy neighborhoods with simple antennas have trouble making contacts and become discouraged. But they can hear a station with a KW and a beam, and they overjoy when they make a contact. The original poster has a foundational license in Australia with, I think, 10W limit. I remember the excitement of such stations when I was working them from a very good VY2 location on 40m, for their first NA contact. Ignacy, NO9E -- Sent from: http://elecraft.365791.n2.nabble.com/ __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html Message delivered to arch...@mail-archive.com
[Elecraft] We Need More Power
As found posted in another group. Stimulated thinking and as quoted. 73 Bob, K4TAX "We need more power. I'm giving her all she's got, Captain! She cannae take anymore. I'm sure your Scottish ancestors are rolling in their graves right now, but in our community of radio amateurs we have a tendency to advocate the use of more power. More power fixes all problems and hides all sins. Another way to look at that is to think of the station with more power as an alligator, all mouth, no ears. Before you dismiss this as another advocacy for QRP or low power, let me point out that more power creates more interference, more potential for harm, more electricity consumption, more wear and tear and more cost. Previously I've spoken extensively about QRP communications, making contact with 5 Watt or less, but let's have a look at how much less. I've shared with you that I managed to contact a station on the other side of the planet with only 5 Watts, Perth to Cuba and for me that was proof positive that all this was possible, even feasible. We're doing much better than that. One measurement is to calculate how many kilometers per Watt you achieved. My example of 5 Watt between Perth and Cuba is the equivalent of 3592 km per Watt. The maximum distance to the opposite side of our globe is about 20,000 km and my contact did nearly 18,000 km. If you think that's amazing, I should warn you, my contact was special, for me, but as low power contacts go, it's not that amazing. The first solid state radio contact made across the Atlantic ocean managed over 76,000 km per Watt. That was on 18 September 1956. You'll find the radio on display at the ARRL Laboratory, together with the bug and station log showing the contact between Chelmsford, Massachusetts and Copenhagen, Denmark between Gus W1OGU and Bo OZ7BO, on a radio made of two germanium transistors and built by Gus W1OGU, Al W1OSF and Dick W1UBC, who built the diminutive gadget on a lark to see if they could Work All Continents with it. If you can copy the 40 micro-watt CW beacon run by the North American QRP CW Club, you too can join in the fun. The current record stands at just under 22 million km per Watt when Bill W4ZV managed to copy the code word OMAHA from the N2XE beacon from New London, North Carolina. Just to be clear, we're talking about a signal that traveled the equivalent of 22 million km using 1 Watt of power. If you think that was amazing, Pioneer 10 managed to achieve 1.3 billion, that's 1.3 thousand million km per Watt in 2003. Mind you, that record was achieved with a slightly bulky antenna, the Deep Space Network. Are you ready for more? The current record stands at just under double the Pioneer 10 record, just under 2.6 billion km per Watt. That was achieved by Dick KL7YU and Bill W7BVV who made contacts between Alaska and Oregon in December 1969 and January 1970. A distance of 2655 km using one micro Watt. Yes, you can throw a Kilowatt at the problem, or you can take your time, do some work and have some fun with low power. You can call it QRP, or you can call it just enough to get the job done. Onno VK6FLAB" __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html Message delivered to arch...@mail-archive.com
