Re: [Elecraft] [Elecraft_K3] New from Elecraft: KPA1500 amplifier with built-in ATU, separate power supply

[Fred Townsend]

Hi Wayne:

I noticed you are using the big Power Poles for the DC HV. I also note the 
cable length is listed at 5.5’ and that longer cable lengths will be supported. 
I have found that high currents cables can be a PITA. I hope that you are using 
high flex welding cables, hopefully the kind with embedded control lines so 
that Kelvin sensing can be used for longer cable lengths. 

Are the fans temperature controlled liked KPA500?

I also have not seen the drive requirements listed. Have we gotten around the 
FCC 13db rule? 

Finally, you need to proof the FAQ one more time. You have ‘cable’ in place of 
‘cabinet’ in one place.

 

73

Fred, AE6QL

 

From: elecraft...@yahoogroups.com [mailto:elecraft...@yahoogroups.com] 
Sent: Thursday, April 20, 2017 9:01 PM
To: Elecraft Reflector
Cc: elecraft...@yahoogroups.com; elecr...@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [Elecraft_K3] New from Elecraft: KPA1500 amplifier with built-in ATU, 
separate power supply

 

  

We’re pleased to announce our KPA1500 solid-state amplifier, covering 160 to 6 
meters. Max power output is 1500 Watts. Other important features include:

- Small RF deck fits on nearly any desktop (~4.5 x 13 x 11.5”, HWD); weighs 
only ~22 pounds
- Separate lightweight switching power supply weighs ~15 pounds (standard cable 
is 6 feet long)
- Styling matches our other K-Line products
- Built-in wide-range antenna tuner (ATU) with instant recall of 
per-band/per-segment settings
- Dual antenna jacks
- Rich I/O complement including Ethernet
- Interfaces to nearly any transceiver; fully integrated with K3 and K3S
- Extensive parametric monitoring ensures safe operation
- Silent PIN-diode T/R switching (no QSK relays)

Introductory price: $5995.

For photos and additional information, use the links below:

http://www.elecraft.com/KPA1500/KPA1500%20FAQ%20rev%20A1b.pdf

If you’d like to be notified when we begin taking orders, please contact 
Elecraft. Or add your name to the list at the Visalia DX convention this 
weekend. 

Required notification: "This device has not yet been authorized as required by 
FCC rules. It is not, and may not be
offered for sale, or lease, or sold or leased, until authorization is obtained."

73,
Wayne, N6KR
Eric, WA6HHQ

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Re: [Elecraft] [Elecraft_K3] New from Elecraft: KPA1500 amplifier with built-in ATU, separate power supply

[Clay Autery]

Excellent point  I look forward to deploying more/better copper!  :-)

__
Clay Autery, KY5G

On 4/21/2017 11:32 AM, Alan Bloom wrote:
> With 1500W of power, if the SWR is greater than 3:1 you may be
> exceeding the ratings of the feedline.  For example, Belden 9914 is
> rated at a maximum of 300 VRMS, which is 1800W with a 50-ohm feedline
> or only 600W with a 3:1 SWR.  At 30 MHz, RG-8/213 style coax is
> typically rated at 1500W with a 1:1 SWR.
>
> It's true that you can do more than that with low-duty-factor modes
> like CW and SSB, but if you are running much more than 3:1 SWR you may
> be in danger of damaging the feedline.
>
> Alan N1AL
>
>

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Re: [Elecraft] [Elecraft_K3] New from Elecraft: KPA1500 amplifier with built-in ATU, separate power supply

[Bill Breeden]

An excellent point missed by many of the desktop tuner and high feedline 
SWR advocates who insist on using coax fed antennas. Typically, they 
blame their failures on cheap coax.


73,

Bill - NA5DX


On 4/21/2017 11:32 AM, Alan Bloom wrote:
With 1500W of power, if the SWR is greater than 3:1 you may be 
exceeding the ratings of the feedline.  For example, Belden 9914 is 
rated at a maximum of 300 VRMS, which is 1800W with a 50-ohm feedline 
or only 600W with a 3:1 SWR.  At 30 MHz, RG-8/213 style coax is 
typically rated at 1500W with a 1:1 SWR.


It's true that you can do more than that with low-duty-factor modes 
like CW and SSB, but if you are running much more than 3:1 SWR you may 
be in danger of damaging the feedline.


Alan N1AL


On 04/21/2017 06:28 AM, Jim Miller wrote:

Wes

Can you describe your affected antennas?

73

Jim ab3cv

On Apr 21, 2017, at 8:56 AM, Wes Stewart 
wrote:

A couple of points.

If you believe that an SWR of >3 necessarily degrades the efficiency
of an antenna, you are simply wrong.

If the "tuner" components have to be derated to this extent then
perhaps it should be called a line flattener rather than a tuner
because a lot of guys are still going to need a tuner.




On 4/21/2017 4:34 AM, j...@kk9a.com wrote: The KPA1500 tuner range
is fine. If your antennas have >3:1 SWR you need to do some work
outside. It will help your signal much more than the amp. Even when
I operated the RTTY Roundup in January after an ice storm my
antennas were within this amplifiers SWR range.

John KK9A


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Re: [Elecraft] [Elecraft_K3] New from Elecraft: KPA1500 amplifier with built-in ATU, separate power supply

[Clay Autery]

Ease up for a minute  Look at it my way.  I KNOW I am gonna need an
external tuner with massive capability to do the same thing I am doing
now  only one tuner on the commercial market will tune my 80m loop
at 1500W the way the K3s can.

I didn't WANT an onboard tuner...  I consider the price point fair for
an amp only.  It would cost me roughly that much to build one from a
true kit, boards, or schematic...  (Looking forward to it).

Tuning full range, full-power, from 160-6m, from more than 3:1 gets
expensive, big, and heavy in a hurry

MOST folks don't need/want a tuner like that, especially if it takes
more money out their pocket.

Consider the on-board tuner a bonus extra...  and if so inclined send up
a prayer the FCC approval is rapidly forthcoming.  :-)

73,

__
Clay Autery, KY5G

On 4/21/2017 7:56 AM, Wes Stewart wrote:
> A couple of points.
>
> If you believe that an SWR of >3 necessarily degrades the efficiency
> of an antenna, you are simply wrong.
>
> If the "tuner" components have to be derated to this extent then
> perhaps it should be called a line flattener rather than a tuner
> because a lot of guys are still going to need a tuner.
>
>
>
> On 4/21/2017 4:34 AM, j...@kk9a.com wrote:
>> The KPA1500 tuner range is fine. If your antennas have >3:1 SWR you need
>> to do some work outside. It will help your signal much more than the
>> amp.
>> Even when I operated the RTTY Roundup in January after an ice storm my
>> antennas were within this amplifiers SWR range.
>>
>> John KK9A
>>
>> from: Wes Stewartn7ws
>> Fri Apr 21 01:18:59 EDT 2017
>> ]
>> Not enough full power tuner range.
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Re: [Elecraft] [Elecraft_K3] New from Elecraft: KPA1500 amplifier with built-in ATU, separate power supply

[Wes Stewart]

I'm not necessarily defining a personal situation.  But almost any 80 or 160 
antenna will suffice as an example.


I am currently constructing a vertical for those bands.  The model shows 2:1 on 
160 at resonance and >3:1 just 60 KHz away and this is with considerable ground 
loss.  Less loss would equal lower BW.  With quarter wave resonance on 80 at 3.6 
MHz it exceeds 3:1 at 3.8 MHz and is nearly 7:1 at 4.0.


Transmission line loss is a non-issue with 7/8" Heliax.

On 4/21/2017 6:28 AM, Jim Miller wrote:

Wes

Can you describe your affected antennas?

73

Jim ab3cv

On Apr 21, 2017, at 8:56 AM, Wes Stewart  wrote:

A couple of points.

If you believe that an SWR of >3 necessarily degrades the efficiency of an 
antenna, you are simply wrong.

If the "tuner" components have to be derated to this extent then perhaps it 
should be called a line flattener rather than a tuner because a lot of guys are still 
going to need a tuner.




On 4/21/2017 4:34 AM, j...@kk9a.com wrote:
The KPA1500 tuner range is fine. If your antennas have >3:1 SWR you need
to do some work outside. It will help your signal much more than the amp.
Even when I operated the RTTY Roundup in January after an ice storm my
antennas were within this amplifiers SWR range.

John KK9A

from: Wes Stewartn7ws
Fri Apr 21 01:18:59 EDT 2017
]
Not enough full power tuner range.



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Re: [Elecraft] [Elecraft_K3] New from Elecraft: KPA1500 amplifier with built-in ATU, separate power supply

[Alan Bloom]

With 1500W of power, if the SWR is greater than 3:1 you may be exceeding 
the ratings of the feedline.  For example, Belden 9914 is rated at a 
maximum of 300 VRMS, which is 1800W with a 50-ohm feedline or only 600W 
with a 3:1 SWR.  At 30 MHz, RG-8/213 style coax is typically rated at 
1500W with a 1:1 SWR.


It's true that you can do more than that with low-duty-factor modes like 
CW and SSB, but if you are running much more than 3:1 SWR you may be in 
danger of damaging the feedline.


Alan N1AL


On 04/21/2017 06:28 AM, Jim Miller wrote:

Wes

Can you describe your affected antennas?

73

Jim ab3cv

On Apr 21, 2017, at 8:56 AM, Wes Stewart 
wrote:

A couple of points.

If you believe that an SWR of >3 necessarily degrades the efficiency
of an antenna, you are simply wrong.

If the "tuner" components have to be derated to this extent then
perhaps it should be called a line flattener rather than a tuner
because a lot of guys are still going to need a tuner.




On 4/21/2017 4:34 AM, j...@kk9a.com wrote: The KPA1500 tuner range
is fine. If your antennas have >3:1 SWR you need to do some work
outside. It will help your signal much more than the amp. Even when
I operated the RTTY Roundup in January after an ice storm my
antennas were within this amplifiers SWR range.

John KK9A


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Re: [Elecraft] [Elecraft_K3] New from Elecraft: KPA1500 amplifier with built-in ATU, separate power supply

[Jim Miller]

Wes

Can you describe your affected antennas?

73

Jim ab3cv

On Apr 21, 2017, at 8:56 AM, Wes Stewart  wrote:

A couple of points.

If you believe that an SWR of >3 necessarily degrades the efficiency of an 
antenna, you are simply wrong.

If the "tuner" components have to be derated to this extent then perhaps it 
should be called a line flattener rather than a tuner because a lot of guys are 
still going to need a tuner.



> On 4/21/2017 4:34 AM, j...@kk9a.com wrote:
> The KPA1500 tuner range is fine. If your antennas have >3:1 SWR you need
> to do some work outside. It will help your signal much more than the amp.
> Even when I operated the RTTY Roundup in January after an ice storm my
> antennas were within this amplifiers SWR range.
> 
> John KK9A
> 
> from: Wes Stewartn7ws
> Fri Apr 21 01:18:59 EDT 2017
> ]
> Not enough full power tuner range.
> 

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Re: [Elecraft] [Elecraft_K3] New from Elecraft: KPA1500 amplifier with built-in ATU, separate power supply

[brian]

John,

Don't agree--unless there truly is something wrong with the antenna, 
connections or feedline.


Does your 80 or 160M antenna cover the entire band with <3:1 SWR?

If fact, on those bands the extra loss due to SWR is negligible with 
even 5:1 SWR's with usual coax. On 80M with a 5:1 SWR and 150' of RG8, 
TLW computes an additional loss of about 0.5 dB. The 4.5 db gain due to 
the extra power far outweighs the extra feedline loss.  Factoring in 
tuner loss doesn't change the conclusions.  Even on 20M, the extra loss 
for the above would be about 1.3 dB.


My experience with ice is much different.  Adding ice to a 4 el quad, 
the resonant frequency on 20M would shift 400 KHz (lower) giving 4:1 
SWR's in the phone band.  One could load it but run of the mill baluns 
at the feedpoint would pop at legal limit!


73 de Brian/K3KO


On 4/21/2017 11:34 AM, j...@kk9a.com wrote:

The KPA1500 tuner range is fine. If your antennas have >3:1 SWR you need
to do some work outside. It will help your signal much more than the amp.
Even when I operated the RTTY Roundup in January after an ice storm my
antennas were within this amplifiers SWR range.

John KK9A

from: Wes Stewartn7ws
Fri Apr 21 01:18:59 EDT 2017
]
Not enough full power tuner range.

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Re: [Elecraft] [Elecraft_K3] New from Elecraft: KPA1500 amplifier with built-in ATU, separate power supply

[David Bunte]

Wes -

Excellent points. One of the locals has very fine antennas, but really
appreciates the fact that his PW-1 can make the SWR look a 'bit' better. At
my QTH, and TUNER, is absolutely necessary... but that is because I have
only one antenna, and it is usable without a tuner on only one band. The
internal tuners in most rigs can't handle it... the tuner in my K3, or my
KAT500, are perfect on most bands. But a 30' vertical is a HUGE challenge
for ANY tuner on 160... and many can't handle it on 80.

Dave - K9FN

On Fri, Apr 21, 2017 at 8:56 AM, Wes Stewart  wrote:

> A couple of points.
>
> If you believe that an SWR of >3 necessarily degrades the efficiency of an
> antenna, you are simply wrong.
>
> If the "tuner" components have to be derated to this extent then perhaps
> it should be called a line flattener rather than a tuner because a lot of
> guys are still going to need a tuner.
>
>
>
>
> On 4/21/2017 4:34 AM, j...@kk9a.com wrote:
>
>> The KPA1500 tuner range is fine. If your antennas have >3:1 SWR you need
>> to do some work outside. It will help your signal much more than the amp.
>> Even when I operated the RTTY Roundup in January after an ice storm my
>> antennas were within this amplifiers SWR range.
>>
>> John KK9A
>>
>> from: Wes Stewartn7ws
>> Fri Apr 21 01:18:59 EDT 2017
>> ]
>> Not enough full power tuner range.
>>
>>
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Re: [Elecraft] [Elecraft_K3] New from Elecraft: KPA1500 amplifier with built-in ATU, separate power supply

[Wes Stewart]

A couple of points.

If you believe that an SWR of >3 necessarily degrades the efficiency of an 
antenna, you are simply wrong.


If the "tuner" components have to be derated to this extent then perhaps it 
should be called a line flattener rather than a tuner because a lot of guys are 
still going to need a tuner.




On 4/21/2017 4:34 AM, j...@kk9a.com wrote:

The KPA1500 tuner range is fine. If your antennas have >3:1 SWR you need
to do some work outside. It will help your signal much more than the amp.
Even when I operated the RTTY Roundup in January after an ice storm my
antennas were within this amplifiers SWR range.

John KK9A

from: Wes Stewartn7ws
Fri Apr 21 01:18:59 EDT 2017
]
Not enough full power tuner range.



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Re: [Elecraft] [Elecraft_K3] New from Elecraft: KPA1500 amplifier with built-in ATU, separate power supply

[Ken K6MR]

The Anan SDR folks are doing this using an external coupler feeding one of the 
receivers in the Anan. Google “Pure Signal”, which is their name for the 
implementation.  I think it’s a VK who is doing the firmware. There are a few 
YouTube videos showing the end result, and it is really impressive.  The basic 
concept is pretty simple, but as always the devil is in the details. Way above 
my pay grade :^)

Ken K6MR


From: 'Stephen Bloom' sbl...@acsalaska.net 
[Elecraft_K3]<mailto:elecraft...@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Thursday, April 20, 2017 11:20 PM
To: elecraft...@yahoogroups.com<mailto:elecraft...@yahoogroups.com>
Subject: RE: [Elecraft_K3] New from Elecraft: KPA1500 amplifier with built-in 
ATU, separate power supply


Ken:

How would one implement this.  I know that the real weak spot amongst the high 
power solid state amps available to the Amateur community has been high IMD, 
due to what I understand are limits to the existing DMOS chips.

Thanks/73
Steve KL7SB


From: elecraft...@yahoogroups.com [mailto:elecraft...@yahoogroups.com]
Sent: Thursday, April 20, 2017 8:48 PM
To: elecraft...@yahoogroups.com
Subject: RE: [Elecraft_K3] New from Elecraft: KPA1500 amplifier with built-in 
ATU, separate power supply


The Elecraft folks should be in charge of government secrets… nothing would 
ever leak  :^)

One interesting item in the rear panel photo: Tx Sample.  Output for “Pure 
Signal” style IMD improvement using pre-distortion in an SDR radio?

Ken K6MR



.


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Re: [Elecraft] [Elecraft_K3] New from Elecraft: KPA1500 amplifier with built-in ATU, separate power supply

[Wes Stewart]

Not enough full power tuner range.
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Re: [Elecraft] [Elecraft_K3] New from Elecraft: KPA1500 amplifier with built-in ATU, separate power supply

[Wayne Burdick]

Ken K6MR  wrote:

> One interesting item in the rear panel photo: Tx Sample.  Output for “Pure 
> Signal” style IMD improvement using pre-distortion in an SDR radio?

Yes.

Wayne
N6KR



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Re: [Elecraft] [Elecraft_K3] New from Elecraft: KPA1500 amplifier with built-in ATU, separate power supply

[Ken K6MR]

The Elecraft folks should be in charge of government secrets… nothing would 
ever leak  :^)

One interesting item in the rear panel photo: Tx Sample.  Output for “Pure 
Signal” style IMD improvement using pre-distortion in an SDR radio?

Ken K6MR

From: 'Stephen Bloom' sbl...@acsalaska.net 
[Elecraft_K3]<mailto:elecraft...@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Thursday, April 20, 2017 9:40 PM
To: elecraft...@yahoogroups.com<mailto:elecraft...@yahoogroups.com>
Subject: RE: [Elecraft_K3] New from Elecraft: KPA1500 amplifier with built-in 
ATU, separate power supply


Wow …Wayne and Eric, you do realize, this is the closest thing ever to a 
unicorn turning real, right?

Congrats/73
Steve KL7SB who *will* own 1 or 2 of these puppies


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