Re: [O] The Org Package
David Masterson writes: I still need more understanding of the Emacs packaging system. That's a question you better ask of the Emacs developers, after you've read the documentation. Something doesn't seem right and I'm sure I'm missing some key in understanding how its supposed to work. What I see right now seems like something doesn't match up -- particularly with the Org package: 1. Most modern Emacs have Org pre-installed. 2. Unfortunately, that Org is not up-to-date (24.3 has 7.9.3f). 3. Therefore, installing the latest Org package seems natural. The pitfall here is that you _must_ do the first install of the Org package from an Emacs that didn't load any part of the built-in Org. 4. However, this does not uninstall the built-in Org package. No, the built-in package unfortunately isn't really a package. It's still inextricably built-in the same way it ever was, just that it now additionally shows up in package manager as built-in package. 5. Packages are not initialized until after .emacs is run. You should add (package-initialize) to your .emacs, but read http://www.gnu.org/software/emacs/manual/html_node/emacs/Package-Installation.html before doing that so you'll understand where to put it. 6. Therefore, any of the latest variables are not defined yet. 7. Therefore, setting a hook may not do what you think. 8. The documentation for Org suggests hooks (etc.) to set. 9. I've run into times when org-version was still 7.9.3f. Do you see where I'm heading? Does anyone else run into this problem? Or do most people ignore the Org package and install the latest from GitHub in a more manual process (a la Bernt Hansen's paper)? Do we need more concrete documentation on setting up the Org Package? See above. The package system in Emacs isn't really designed for something as big and complicated as Org and its interaction with built-in packages has room for improvement; but you can make it work, even for Org. Whether you want to install Org from Git is another story and you should mainly decide from whether you need to always run the very latest development version. If that decision rather falls to I always want the latest released version, then the ELPA package is a better choice, IMHO. Regards, Achim. -- +[Q+ Matrix-12 WAVE#46+305 Neuron microQkb Andromeda XTk Blofeld]+ Samples for the Waldorf Blofeld: http://Synth.Stromeko.net/Downloads.html#BlofeldSamplesExtra
Re: [O] The Org Package
Achim Gratz strom...@nexgo.de writes: 1. Most modern Emacs have Org pre-installed. 2. Unfortunately, that Org is not up-to-date (24.3 has 7.9.3f). 3. Therefore, installing the latest Org package seems natural. The pitfall here is that you _must_ do the first install of the Org package from an Emacs that didn't load any part of the built-in Org. That's an interesting piece of information. I can't find it in (info (org) Installation). Just to make sure I understand it : I can imagine older macros being byte compiled into the newer org, is that the reason ? -- Nico.
Re: [O] A file with 'org-mode rot'?
* Bastien b...@gnu.org wrote: Hi Eric and Karl, Hi Bastien! Just checking -- are things better now? I am still facing strange behavior and I still do think that we need an org-mode-syntax-checker for Org-mode files that cause problems. Example: | foo | bar | baz | | 42 | | | | 23 | | | It takes seven seconds with 100% CPU core load to move the foo-column from above from the second column to the first by applying ALT-left. This is in my main Org-mode file which has got 29000 lines. #+BEGIN_EXAMPLE - command-execute 29550 99% - call-interactively 29550 99% - org-metaleft29469 99% - call-interactively 29469 99% - org-table-move-column 24559 83% org-table-align 9832 33% + byte-code 74 0% + execute-extended-command7 0% + yas--post-command-handler 6 0% + timer-event-handler 6 0% + ... 0 0% #+END_EXAMPLE The very same operation in a small test file works fine. Another example: moving from @2$1 to @2$2 with TAB: 4 seconds #+BEGIN_EXAMPLE - command-execute3847 80% - call-interactively3845 80% - yas-expand 3509 73% - yas--fallback 3509 73% - call-interactively 3509 73% - org-cycle 3509 73% - call-interactively 3503 73% - org-table-next-field3503 73% org-table-align1760 36% + org-try-structure-completion6 0% + org-self-insert-command91 1% + byte-code 85 1% + next-line 49 1% + previous-line 42 0% + minibuffer-complete22 0% + execute-extended-command 17 0% + profiler-report-toggle-entry 12 0% + org-yank7 0% + kill-ring-save 3 0% + org-return 3 0% org-kill-line 3 0% scroll-up-command 2 0% + yas--post-command-handler 648 13% + redisplay_internal (C function) 103 2% + ... 100 2% + timer-event-handler 73 1% + clm/log-command 12 0% + xselect-convert-to-string10 0% internal-timer-start-idle 2 0% #+END_EXAMPLE Again: in a small test file, it works in a fast way. Still not possible: org-agenda-list org-agenda-write to ICS file. Org-mode is working hard but is in some kind of endless loop. I assume that this also would work when I would change to a small Org-mode file. I can test this if it helps. -- mail|git|SVN|photos|postings|SMS|phonecalls|RSS|CSV|XML to Org-mode: get Memacs from https://github.com/novoid/Memacs https://github.com/novoid/extract_pdf_annotations_to_orgmode + more on github
Re: [O] A file with 'org-mode rot'?
Hello, Karl Voit devn...@karl-voit.at writes: I am still facing strange behavior and I still do think that we need an org-mode-syntax-checker for Org-mode files that cause problems. Example: | foo | bar | baz | | 42 | | | | 23 | | | I don't understand what a syntax checker has to do with it. Notwithstanding the fact that such a checker assumes all Org obeys to a single syntax definition, which is what I'm struggling for, but is not the case actually, it would report, in this case, that syntax is valid. How would that help? It takes seven seconds with 100% CPU core load to move the foo-column from above from the second column to the first by applying ALT-left. This is in my main Org-mode file which has got 29000 lines. #+BEGIN_EXAMPLE - command-execute 29550 99% - call-interactively 29550 99% - org-metaleft29469 99% - call-interactively 29469 99% - org-table-move-column 24559 83% org-table-align 9832 33% + byte-code 74 0% + execute-extended-command7 0% + yas--post-command-handler 6 0% + timer-event-handler 6 0% + ... 0 0% #+END_EXAMPLE I generated a 32000 lines long file and couldn't reproduce the problem. What Org version are you using? Still not possible: org-agenda-list org-agenda-write to ICS file. Org-mode is working hard but is in some kind of endless loop. I assume that this also would work when I would change to a small Org-mode file. I can test this if it helps. It would help. So would an ECM for the reported infloop. Also you can try to set `toggle-debug-on-quit', C-g amid the infloop, and report the backtrace. Regards, -- Nicolas Goaziou
Re: [O] A file with 'org-mode rot'?
* Nicolas Goaziou n.goaz...@gmail.com wrote: Hello, Karl Voit devn...@karl-voit.at writes: I am still facing strange behavior and I still do think that we need an org-mode-syntax-checker for Org-mode files that cause problems. Example: | foo | bar | baz | | 42 | | | | 23 | | | I don't understand what a syntax checker has to do with it. Notwithstanding the fact that such a checker assumes all Org obeys to a single syntax definition, which is what I'm struggling for, but is not the case actually, it would report, in this case, that syntax is valid. How would that help? I had some issues where time-stamps of deadlines and logbook were written in the wrong position, messing up drawers. A syntax checker is not a 100% sure thing, yes. However, it would help to get information on unknown drawers, missing :END: lines, mismatching blocks, and so forth. I am not completely sure how to achieve this. However, my (long) Org-mode files with the performance issues is not a situation I am satisfied. Last week I presented Org-mode at a Linuxdays-event here in Graz and I had to apologize for all the weird behavior. This was somewhat embarrassing :-( I generated a 32000 lines long file and couldn't reproduce the problem. What Org version are you using? d5484ae 2014-04-12 from the repos. Probably it has to do with my Emacs binary as well: GNU Emacs 24.3.50.1 (x86_64-pc-linux-gnu, GTK+ Version 3.4.2) of 2014-01-01 on gkar, modified by Debian The Emacs on the Windows machine in the office does not show many issues. However, my configuration is only 95% the same for both machines. Still not possible: org-agenda-list org-agenda-write to ICS file. Org-mode is working hard but is in some kind of endless loop. I assume that this also would work when I would change to a small Org-mode file. I can test this if it helps. It would help. So would an ECM for the reported infloop. Pfuh, I totally understand this :-) Wow, I am afraid this will be hard work to generate but I will schedule it. Please be patient because I have lots of stuff to do these days. Also you can try to set `toggle-debug-on-quit', C-g amid the infloop, and report the backtrace. Sure. After a couple of minutes, I C-g and this is the output: http://paste.grml.org/1898/ -- mail|git|SVN|photos|postings|SMS|phonecalls|RSS|CSV|XML to Org-mode: get Memacs from https://github.com/novoid/Memacs https://github.com/novoid/extract_pdf_annotations_to_orgmode + more on github
Re: [O] update to ob-clojure.el
On Thu, 2014-04-10 at 10:36 +0200, Oleh wrote: Hi all, I've made an update to ob-clojure.el, which wasn't working for me with the new cider (the required function was removed). I haven't looked into 'nrepl or 'slime options for evaluation, is anyone using them? Eric, should 'nrepl option be removed as obsolete? And maybe 'slime as well? regards, Oleh I'm not sure about removing nrepl and slime, as there may be some still using them, especially nrepl. As long as it is not getting in the way, perhaps at this time it would be better to leave them in? I'm not sure the open-source and/or emacs-org philosophy on this kind of thing. Prior to updating the documentation for Clojure code blocks earlier this year, which was several years old, I did a lot of searching around and came to the conclusion that the slime and swank-clojure functionality was no longer being developed, and the community had moved on to nrepl. CIDER evolved from nrepl, and is the current direction. https://github.com/clojure-emacs/cider The revised documentation is very CIDER-centric: http://orgmode.org/worg/org-contrib/babel/languages/ob-doc-clojure.html Regards, Greg
Re: [O] how to debug Archive view in custom agenda
Ken Mankoff mank...@gmail.com writes: Hello, Ken! Debugger entered--Lisp error: (wrong-type-argument integer-or-marker-p nil) put-text-property(28799 nil org-effort :15) org-refresh-properties(Effort org-effort) byte-code(\306!\203\f.q\210\202. I think Bastien has just committed a patch fixing this in the maint branch. Hope that helps! =) Sacha
Re: [O] [RFC] Org Minor Mode?
Nicolas Goaziou n.goaz...@gmail.com writes: Hello, Thorsten Jolitz tjol...@gmail.com writes: What do you think - is there any chance that Org-mode switches from static hardcoded regexp strings (all over the place) to dynamic regexps calculated at runtime (using libraries like drx.el or rx.el)? I hope not. The syntax should stabilize, not drift away. This is not so much about changing the syntax but rather about the common programming practice to define and change/modify a variable or constant in one place only. #+begin_src emacs-lisp (defvar BOL ^) ; once (looking-at (concat BOL foo)) ; many times #+end_src instead of #+begin_src emacs-lisp (looking-at ^foo) ; many times #+end_src The need to abstract from the Org star '*' too would only arise from need to deal with Emacs Lisp coding conventions (;;; Level1 Headline), which is a (unfortunately very important) special case. In all other cases it would be only about BOL (^) and EOL ($) in regexps. There would be a cost definitely, but then a true org-minor-mode could become reality that offers the full power of Org-mode in programming mode's comment section (I'm actually working on it by merging outshine with orgstruct: [[https://github.com/tj64/omm][omm.el]]). I don't see why you would need the full power of Org-mode (whatever that means) in mere comments. That means that Org headlines are much more 'intelligent' than outline headlines (they know about todos, priorities, tags, timestamps, properties, planning, clocking, being archived etc.) and one could have that kind of intelligent headlines in other modes too with a true org-minor-mode. -- cheers, Thorsten
Re: [O] [RFC] Org Minor Mode?
Bastien b...@gnu.org writes: Hi Thorsten, Nicolas Goaziou n.goaz...@gmail.com writes: Thorsten Jolitz tjol...@gmail.com writes: What do you think - is there any chance that Org-mode switches from static hardcoded regexp strings (all over the place) to dynamic regexps calculated at runtime (using libraries like drx.el or rx.el)? I hope not. The syntax should stabilize, not drift away. Agreed. Maybe there are some hardcoded regexps that we can factor out, but dynamically building those fundamental regexp is a deadend. In the case of regexps its of course not considered bad practice to write ^foo$ many times in a program, so nobody is to blame here, but the issue is the same as writing (message What a wonderful world) many times in a program and then entering a depressed state. Would have been better to write (message What a %s world current-world-view) ... -- cheers, Thorsten
Re: [O] [RFC] Org Minor Mode?
Richard Lawrence richard.lawre...@berkeley.edu writes: Hi Richard, Bastien b...@gnu.org writes: Nicolas Goaziou n.goaz...@gmail.com writes: Thorsten Jolitz tjol...@gmail.com writes: What do you think - is there any chance that Org-mode switches from static hardcoded regexp strings (all over the place) to dynamic regexps calculated at runtime (using libraries like drx.el or rx.el)? I hope not. The syntax should stabilize, not drift away. Agreed. Maybe there are some hardcoded regexps that we can factor out, but dynamically building those fundamental regexp is a deadend. I agree with what Nicolas and Bastien have said, but I wanted to say that I think there is an interesting idea in Thorsten's post that shouldn't be dismissed out of hand. Org provides a set of UI concepts (tree-like structure, visibility cycling, tree filtering, task state tracking, building an agenda from multiple sources, ...) that map nicely onto a lot of other situations, and would be really handy to have access to even when the syntax of the underlying file is incompatible with Org's syntax. There are two ways to think about Org syntax, which I think should be distinguished here. One is as the grammar of a .org file: basically, a set of rules that allow a sequence of characters to be parsed into an AST. The other way to think about Org syntax is the way Lisp programmers sometimes talk about syntax: as the AST itself, the collection of Lisp data types and their interrelationships that define a valid Org document. If Org were to evolve to the point where the UI concepts were implemented purely as transformations on an AST -- on Org syntax in the second sense -- then the way would be clear for making those concepts available in editing modes where the grammar of the underlying file is incompatible with Org syntax in the first sense. A programming mode could, say, parse comments into an Org AST, then expose that AST to the functions implementing Org's UI concepts. Et voila: you get visibility cycling, task state tracking, agendas...in your source code comments. One sort of use case where I think this idea could really shine is in dealing with email. Obviously, the grammar of the underlying mail files (say, in a Maildir) will never be compatible with Org syntax in the first sense. But Org handles so many of the concepts that apply to email (threading messages into hierarchies, visibility cycling, tagging, sorting by date or priority, thinking of messages as tasks to be dealt with, dealing with attachments) in such a nice way that I find myself sorely missing Org whenever I read mail in a client that doesn't implement them as nicely -- which is all of them. If it were possible to build a parser for message files that transformed them into an Org AST, the mail client of my dreams would be in reach. I have no idea if evolving Org in this direction is feasible or even really desireable. It may be that the two notions of Org syntax are tightly coupled in principle, so that the idea of producing an Org AST from an alternative underlying file format will never make sense. But I think that would be surprising. This evolution would clearly require more work than just abstracting out the regular expressions that implement much of Org's syntax in the first sense, and I think Bastien and Nicolas are right that we don't want either notion of Org syntax to become less stable. Still, I think there's a lot of interesting possibilities we could explore if Org's implementations of the two notions of syntax were to become less tightly coupled. thanks for your long and interesting comment! But thats very ambitious, I'm actually looking for something much more prosaic - being able to structure and use a buffer/file in a programming mode like an Org-mode buffer/file besides the fact the headlines and text needs to be outcommented. Thats partly possible with orgstruct or outshine, but I think there is potential for more if Org functions could deal with outcommented syntax-elements. And at the lowest level its all about regexps that don't match because there is comment-syntax behind the ^ and before the $ (and maybe a different star is used instead of *), e.g. (outshine-style) Elisp , | ^;; \\* Headline$ ` oldschool Elisp ,- | ^;;; Headline$ `- or CSS ,--- | ^/* \\* Headline */$ `--- instead of the default Org-mode ,- | ^\\* Headline$ `- -- cheers, Thorsten
Re: [O] Prepare release 8.2.6
On Thu, Apr 10, 2014 at 10:43 PM, Eric Schulte schulte.e...@gmail.com wrote: I just tried to apply the second patch, but it no longer applies (with git am) to the Org-mode repo. Would you mind sending along an updated version? Hi Eric, The attached should apply cleanly against master. Michael 0001-Keybinding-to-remove-result-blocks.patch Description: Binary data
Re: [O] A file with 'org-mode rot'?
Karl Voit devn...@karl-voit.at writes: However, my (long) Org-mode files with the performance issues is not a situation I am satisfied. Last week I presented Org-mode at a Linuxdays-event here in Graz and I had to apologize for all the weird behavior. This was somewhat embarrassing :-( Does this happen on stable branch? Sure. After a couple of minutes, I C-g and this is the output: http://paste.grml.org/1898/ Would the following patch improve the situation? Regards, -- Nicolas Goaziou From 3b772bab6d99298844d9d05f79a12e1a9fb87a3a Mon Sep 17 00:00:00 2001 From: Nicolas Goaziou n.goaz...@gmail.com Date: Sun, 13 Apr 2014 19:28:20 +0200 Subject: [PATCH] ob-exp: Improve speed --- lisp/ob-exp.el | 25 + 1 file changed, 13 insertions(+), 12 deletions(-) diff --git a/lisp/ob-exp.el b/lisp/ob-exp.el index 220a3c3..dc2bc94 100644 --- a/lisp/ob-exp.el +++ b/lisp/ob-exp.el @@ -153,20 +153,12 @@ may make them unreachable. (save-window-excursion (save-excursion (let ((case-fold-search t) - (org-babel-exp-reference-buffer reference-buffer) - (regexp (concat org-babel-inline-src-block-regexp \\| - org-babel-lob-one-liner-regexp \\| - ^[ \t]*#\\+BEGIN_SRC))) + (org-babel-exp-reference-buffer reference-buffer)) (goto-char (point-min)) - (while (re-search-forward regexp nil t) + (while (re-search-forward + src_\\|^[ \t]*#\\+\\(call:\\|begin_src\\)\\|call_ nil t) (unless (save-match-data (org-in-commented-heading-p)) - (let* ((element (save-excursion - ;; If match is inline, point is at its - ;; end. Move backward so - ;; `org-element-context' can get the - ;; object, not the following one. - (backward-char) - (save-match-data (org-element-context + (let* ((element (save-match-data (org-element-context))) (type (org-element-type element)) (begin (copy-marker (org-element-property :begin element))) (end (copy-marker @@ -176,6 +168,10 @@ may make them unreachable. (point) (case type (inline-src-block + (goto-char begin) + (unless (bolp) (backward-char)) + (looking-at org-babel-inline-src-block-regexp) + (goto-char (match-end 0)) (let* ((info (org-babel-parse-inline-src-block-match)) (params (nth 2 info))) (setf (nth 1 info) @@ -201,6 +197,11 @@ may make them unreachable. (delete-region begin end) (insert replacement) ((babel-call inline-babel-call) + (goto-char (or (org-element-property :post-affiliated element) +begin)) + (unless (bolp) (backward-char)) + (looking-at org-babel-lob-one-liner-regexp) + (goto-char (match-end 0)) (let* ((lob-info (org-babel-lob-get-info)) (results (org-babel-exp-do-export -- 1.9.2
Re: [O] A file with 'org-mode rot'?
Remote possibility: I've had issues with org-mode being slow when using linum-mode in the past: E.g., http://stackoverflow.com/questions/5229705/emacs-org-mode-turn-off-line-numbers So you might want to make sure that's not enabled. On Sun, Apr 13, 2014 at 12:49 PM, Nicolas Goaziou n.goaz...@gmail.comwrote: Karl Voit devn...@karl-voit.at writes: However, my (long) Org-mode files with the performance issues is not a situation I am satisfied. Last week I presented Org-mode at a Linuxdays-event here in Graz and I had to apologize for all the weird behavior. This was somewhat embarrassing :-( Does this happen on stable branch? Sure. After a couple of minutes, I C-g and this is the output: http://paste.grml.org/1898/ Would the following patch improve the situation? Regards, -- Nicolas Goaziou
[O] How to make sparse tree sparser and/or reveal less context?
Hello! After you have a sparse tree, is there a way to hide away headlines and entries that you don't actually want to be part of your final export? There's a command to reveal context ... but is there a command that will help you hide away context? Thanks! Mark
[O] ob-clojure: ':results pp' parses the output as a string value
I am getting a strange effect from :results pp and ob-clojure. It\n looks\n like\n this.\n I built Emacs 24.4.50 from trunk and cloned ob-clojure from git today. clojure-mode is 20140331 from ELPA. cider is 20140411 from ELPA. Two examples follow. 1. uses =:results pp= (and\n looks\n like\n this\n) 2. uses its own ~pprint~, and =:results output= (and looks correct) I expected example 2's output from both 1 and 2. Here's the data to pretty-print: #+name: columnar-stuff | State | Bird | | New York| Eastern Bluebird | | New Jersey | Eastern Goldfinch | | Connecticut | Penguin | Here is an attempt using =:results pp=: #+begin_src clojure :exports both :results pp :var rows=columnar-stuff rows #+end_src #+RESULTS: : ((\State\ \Bird\)\n (\New York\ \Eastern Bluebird\)\n (\New Jersey\ \Eastern Goldfinch\)\n (\Connecticut\ \Penguin\))\n Here is a successful (but uglier) src block with an explicit ~pprint~, and =:results output=: #+begin_src clojure :exports both :results output :var rows=columnar-stuff (clojure.pprint/pprint rows) #+end_src #+RESULTS: : ((State Bird) : (New York Eastern Bluebird) : (New Jersey Eastern Goldfinch) : (Connecticut Penguin)) I would prefer =:results pp= to produce the same effect as the explicit ~pprint~, because keeping the ~pprint~ out of the published src block makes the presentation clearer.
Re: [O] The Org Package
Achim Gratz strom...@nexgo.de writes: David Masterson writes: Something doesn't seem right and I'm sure I'm missing some key in understanding how its supposed to work. What I see right now seems like something doesn't match up -- particularly with the Org package: 1. Most modern Emacs have Org pre-installed. 2. Unfortunately, that Org is not up-to-date (24.3 has 7.9.3f). 3. Therefore, installing the latest Org package seems natural. The pitfall here is that you _must_ do the first install of the Org package from an Emacs that didn't load any part of the built-in Org. What does this mean? Does this mean you expect people to build Emacs from scratch just to ensure they do not have Org built-in? -- David Masterson Programmer At Large
[O] Fwd: Mac OS Alias file links
Hi, I posted something at the beginning of the week, and have received no reply. If nobody had anything to say that is fine. But I notice that my original post on gmane http://article.gmane.org/gmane.emacs.orgmode/84707 appears blank, so perhaps the no reply is due to a posting issue. Hence, I send the email again... -k. On 2014-04-08 at 03:03, Ken Mankoff wrote: I use links to files quite often in Org Mode. Either by C-l file: or drag-and-drop (with smart-dnd). But when files move, the links break. BibDesk solves this by storing Mac OS Aliases to files. Then if files move, the alias still works. BibDesk actually stores more: The Bdsk-File entries store Mac OS aliases, which contain a file ID and absolute path. Bdsk-File entries also store a relative path, which is used if the alias is broken. Is there a way to add this feature to Org Mode? Yes, obviously, since this is emacs and Org Mode. But has anyone already done this? Any advice where to start? Thanks, -k.
Re: [O] The Org Package
David Masterson dsmaster...@gmail.com writes: Achim Gratz strom...@nexgo.de writes: David Masterson writes: Something doesn't seem right and I'm sure I'm missing some key in understanding how its supposed to work. What I see right now seems like something doesn't match up -- particularly with the Org package: 1. Most modern Emacs have Org pre-installed. 2. Unfortunately, that Org is not up-to-date (24.3 has 7.9.3f). 3. Therefore, installing the latest Org package seems natural. The pitfall here is that you _must_ do the first install of the Org package from an Emacs that didn't load any part of the built-in Org. What does this mean? Does this mean you expect people to build Emacs from scratch just to ensure they do not have Org built-in? I believe it means the installation must be done from an Emacs instance that hasn't loaded any Org mode functions yet. You must make sure there are no =Org-mode= functions loaded while the update is done. For that, exit Emacs and then run Emacs without loading your =.emacs= (=Emacs -Q=). Remove the old =Org-mode= #+BEGIN_SRC sh rm -rf ~/.emacs.d/elpa/org-”Tab” #+END_SRC where =Tab= means press =Tab= to see and auto complete the old =Org-mode= directory you want to remove. Finally, update =Org-mode= (=M-x package-install RET org RET=) and restart Emacs as usual. See http://nickhigham.wordpress.com/2013/07/05/emacs-org-mode-version-8/ hth, Tom -- Thomas S. Dye http://www.tsdye.com
