Re: [O] From latest maint/master, no need to (require 'org-install)

[Bastien]

Hi Michael,

Michael Brand michael.ch.br...@gmail.com writes:

 Would it be possible/reasonable to have org-version available before
 (require 'org)? I would like to put the Org version into the Message
 Buffer at Emacs startup without the need of loading the entire Org
 yet.

Yes, you can call (org-version) before any (require 'org).
This will call the org-version that is autoloaded in Emacs.

-- 
 Bastien

Re: [O] From latest maint/master, no need to (require 'org-install)

[Bastien]

Achim Gratz strom...@nexgo.de writes:

 Starting Emacs now requires ~18 seconds vs 2 seconds before.

 That is one of the consequences of how org.el is currently structured.

The move to using org-loaddefs.el was to optimize things within Emacs.

Before org-loaddefs.el, all Org's autoloads were added to loaddefs.el.
This had the effect of preloading too many Org's functions in a bare
emacs -Q.

After org-loaddefs.el, only the core Org functions are added to Emacs'
loaddefs.el.

The time you spare by not preloading all autoloads in loaddefs.el is
lost when you require org for the first time -- either in your config
or by simply finding a new .org file.

But on the overall, I think it's cleaner that way.

The next step to optimize things a bit is to have less autoloads
in org-autoloads.el... any suggestion is welcome in this area!

-- 
 Bastien

Re: [O] From latest maint/master, no need to (require 'org-install)

[Sebastien Vauban]

Hi Achim,

Achim Gratz wrote:
 Eric Fraga writes:
 My question now is whether I should replace the =(require 'org)= by
 =(require 'org-loaddefs)= which seems to be the way that Emacs is moving
 for packages?

 No. The definitions in org-loaddefs are require'd from org internally, you
 should never reference to it directly. What Emacs and package managers are
 doing is not exactly the same thing, but again they should setup things in a
 way that only =(require 'org)= is needed.

You mean we must require Org in our .emacs file (instead of just loading the
autoload definitions)?

IIUC, (in my case at least) that could seriously impact the Emacs startup
time?

Best regards,
  Seb

-- 
Sebastien Vauban

Re: [O] From latest maint/master, no need to (require 'org-install)

[Sebastien Vauban]

Hi Achim,

Sebastien Vauban wrote:
 Achim Gratz wrote:
 only =(require 'org)= is needed.

 You mean we must require Org in our .emacs file (instead of just loading the
 autoload definitions)?

 IIUC, (in my case at least) that could seriously impact the Emacs startup
 time?

Confirmed with Org-mode version 7.9.2 (release_7.9.2-425-g8ec79b @
d:/home/sva/src/org-mode/lisp/).

Starting Emacs now requires ~18 seconds vs 2 seconds before.

Some culprits are:

- loading some of my 45 Org agenda files (not all, though -- maybe, the one in
  which I'm currently clocking and the ones I clocked in before, from the
  clock history?)

- loading lots of extra packages which I don't necessarily need when I just
  fire up Emacs for doing non-Org related work, such as gnus-sum (hence, all
  of Gnus, along with MIME utils, URL stuff, etc.)

- loading all my Org config (Babel, LOB, exporters, etc.), which is in an
  (eval-after-load org ...).

Best regards,
  Seb

-- 
Sebastien Vauban

Re: [O] From latest maint/master, no need to (require 'org-install)

[Achim Gratz]

Sebastien Vauban writes:
 Starting Emacs now requires ~18 seconds vs 2 seconds before.

That is one of the consequences of how org.el is currently structured.
If you know exactly what you're doing when in your init file, you can at
the moment still do a

(require 'org-loaddefs)

where you formerly did require org-install.  Of course this will then
not work if you fall back to the built-in Org version of an old Emacs,
so maybe you'd want

(require 'org-loaddefs nil 'noerror)

I'm not sure how Bastien wants this to work going forward, but by the
way it's been announced and implemented the need to do this should go
away.


Regards,
Achim.
-- 
+[Q+ Matrix-12 WAVE#46+305 Neuron microQkb Andromeda XTk Blofeld]+

SD adaptations for KORG EX-800 and Poly-800MkII V0.9:
http://Synth.Stromeko.net/Downloads.html#KorgSDada

Re: [O] From latest maint/master, no need to (require 'org-install)

[Michael Brand]

Hi Achim

On Tue, Oct 9, 2012 at 7:47 PM, Achim Gratz strom...@nexgo.de wrote:
 I'm not sure how Bastien wants this to work going forward, but by the
 way it's been announced and implemented the need to do this should go
 away.

Would it be possible/reasonable to have org-version available before
(require 'org)? I would like to put the Org version into the Message
Buffer at Emacs startup without the need of loading the entire Org
yet.

Michael

Re: [O] From latest maint/master, no need to (require 'org-install)

[Sebastien Vauban]

Hi Achim,

Achim Gratz wrote:
 Sebastien Vauban writes:
 Starting Emacs now requires ~18 seconds vs 2 seconds before.

 That is one of the consequences of how org.el is currently structured.
 If you know exactly what you're doing when in your init file, you can at
 the moment still do a

 (require 'org-loaddefs)

 where you formerly did require org-install.

Good to know...

 Of course this will then not work if you fall back to the built-in Org
 version of an old Emacs, so maybe you'd want

 (require 'org-loaddefs nil 'noerror)

I guess the risk of falling to the built-in Org version is no bigger than it
was with org-install?

Anyway, I always protect all require's of stuff which can be absent from some
distribution (as my .emacs is used by colleagues).

 I'm not sure how Bastien wants this to work going forward, but by the
 way it's been announced and implemented the need to do this should go
 away.

OK. We'll see with him as soon as he comes back online.

Best regards,
  Seb

-- 
Sebastien Vauban

Re: [O] From latest maint/master, no need to (require 'org-install)

[Achim Gratz]

Eric Fraga writes:
 My question now is whether I should replace the =(require 'org)= by
 =(require 'org-loaddefs)= which seems to be the way that Emacs is moving
 for packages?

No.  The definitions in org-loaddefs are require'd from org internally,
you should never reference to it directly.  What Emacs and package
managers are doing is not exactly the same thing, but again they should
setup things in a way that only =(require 'org)= is needed.


Regards,
Achim.
-- 
+[Q+ Matrix-12 WAVE#46+305 Neuron microQkb Andromeda XTk Blofeld]+

Wavetables for the Terratec KOMPLEXER:
http://Synth.Stromeko.net/Downloads.html#KomplexerWaves

Re: [O] From latest maint/master, no need to (require 'org-install)

[Eric S Fraga]

Achim Gratz strom...@nexgo.de writes:

 Eric Fraga writes:
 My question now is whether I should replace the =(require 'org)= by
 =(require 'org-loaddefs)= which seems to be the way that Emacs is moving
 for packages?

 No.  The definitions in org-loaddefs are require'd from org internally,
 you should never reference to it directly.  What Emacs and package
 managers are doing is not exactly the same thing, but again they should
 setup things in a way that only =(require 'org)= is needed.


 Regards,
 Achim.

Thanks Achim for the clarification!

-- 
: Eric S Fraga, GnuPG: 0xC89193D8FFFCF67D
: in Emacs 24.2.50.1 and Org release_7.9.2-402-ge5e49e

Re: [O] From latest maint/master, no need to (require 'org-install)

[Eric Fraga]

Sebastien Vauban wxhgmqzgw...@spammotel.com writes:

 Hi Eric,

 Eric Fraga wrote:
 (add-to-list 'load-path ~/git/org-mode)

 Why that one?

Ahh, that's a bit of historical garbage.  There was a point a while back
where org-install seemed to have lisp/org-xxx paths and the easiest fix
was to add the root to the list of paths.  The problem was fixed fairly
quickly but I forgot to remove my temporary fix.

 What should I or could I remove from this?

 What I do is:

 #+begin_src emacs-lisp
   (when (locate-library org-install)
 (require 'org-install))
 #+end_src

Actually, I now have

#+begin_src emacs-lisp
(add-to-list 'load-path ~/git/org-mode/lisp)
(add-to-list 'load-path ~/git/org-mode/contrib/lisp/)
(require 'org)
#+end_src

with a number of other =require= calls for specific ob- and org-e-
packages.  This seems to work just fine.

My question now is whether I should replace the =(require 'org)= by
=(require 'org-loaddefs)= which seems to be the way that Emacs is moving
for packages?

Thanks,
eric

-- 
: Eric S Fraga, GnuPG: 0xC89193D8FFFCF67D
: in Emacs 24.2.50.1 and Org release_7.9.2-406-g2c78ca

Re: [O] From latest maint/master, no need to (require 'org-install)

[Nick Dokos]

Eric Fraga e.fr...@ucl.ac.uk wrote:

 Sebastien Vauban wxhgmqzgw...@spammotel.com writes:
 
  Hi Eric,
 
  Eric Fraga wrote:
  (add-to-list 'load-path ~/git/org-mode)
 
  Why that one?
 
 Ahh, that's a bit of historical garbage.  There was a point a while back
 where org-install seemed to have lisp/org-xxx paths and the easiest fix
 was to add the root to the list of paths.  The problem was fixed fairly
 quickly but I forgot to remove my temporary fix.
 
  What should I or could I remove from this?
 
  What I do is:
 
  #+begin_src emacs-lisp
(when (locate-library org-install)
  (require 'org-install))
  #+end_src
 
 Actually, I now have
 
 #+begin_src emacs-lisp
 (add-to-list 'load-path ~/git/org-mode/lisp)
 (add-to-list 'load-path ~/git/org-mode/contrib/lisp/)
 (require 'org)
 #+end_src
 
 with a number of other =require= calls for specific ob- and org-e-
 packages.  This seems to work just fine.
 

Note however that this way, the contrib directory will be found before
the main lisp directory and that may cause occasional problems. This was
recently discussed in this thread:

 http://thread.gmane.org/gmane.emacs.orgmode/60929/focus=61131

Nick

 My question now is whether I should replace the =(require 'org)= by
 =(require 'org-loaddefs)= which seems to be the way that Emacs is moving
 for packages?
 
 Thanks,
 eric
 
 -- 
 : Eric S Fraga, GnuPG: 0xC89193D8FFFCF67D
 : in Emacs 24.2.50.1 and Org release_7.9.2-406-g2c78ca
 

Re: [O] From latest maint/master, no need to (require 'org-install)

[Thomas S. Dye]

Eric Fraga e.fr...@ucl.ac.uk writes:

 Bastien b...@altern.org writes:

 Hi all again,

 Bastien b...@altern.org writes:

 there is no need to (require 'org-install) anymore from the maint
 and master branches.

 ... and you should actually remove (require 'org-install) from your
 configuration, since this file is not automatically created anymore.

 Thanks,

 Okay but with what should I replace this, if anything?

 Specifically, I currently have (in my organically grown customisation
 file ;-):

 (add-to-list 'load-path ~/git/org-mode)
 (add-to-list 'load-path ~/git/org-mode/lisp)
 (add-to-list 'load-path ~/git/org-mode/contrib/lisp/)
 (require 'org-install)
 (require 'org-e-latex)
 (require 'org-e-odt)
 (require 'org-latex)
 (require 'org-mime)
 (require 'ob-jacaranda)
 (require 'ob-python)
 (require 'ob-R)
 (require 'ob-sh)
 (require 'org-crypt) (org-crypt-use-before-save-magic)
 (require 'org-inlinetask) ;binding C-c C-x t
 (require 'org-protocol)
 (require 'org-wc) 
 ;; customisations follow

 What should I or could I remove from this?

 Thanks,
 eric

Hi Eric,

ob-jacaranda?  Any chance this might swell the list of babel supported
languages? 

All the best,
Tom
-- 
Thomas S. Dye
http://www.tsdye.com

Re: [O] From latest maint/master, no need to (require 'org-install)

[Rainer M Krug]

-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
Hash: SHA1

On 03/10/12 11:25, Bastien wrote:
 Hi all again,
 
 Bastien b...@altern.org writes:
 
 there is no need to (require 'org-install) anymore from the maint and master 
 branches.
 
 ... and you should actually remove (require 'org-install) from your 
 configuration, since this
 file is not automatically created anymore.

OK - now I am getting slightly confused again.

Could you please give some example configuration code? For example, in
my case, I am using org mode from git, I am using the script posted
above in the thread to update org-mode git:

#!/bin/sh
cd ~/.emacs.d/org-mode-git/org-mode

git checkout master
git fetch --tags origin

# git clone git://repo.or.cz/org-mode.git
git pull
git gc

git checkout master

make clean
make
make autoloads
make doc
make info

# make install



in my .emacs.d/init.el I have:

;; Load up Org Mode and Org Babel for elisp embedded in Org Mode files
(add-to-list 'load-path ~/.emacs.d/org-mode/lisp)
(add-to-list 'load-path ~/.emacs.d/org-mode/contrib/lisp)

;; load up Org-mode and Org-babel
(require 'org-install)

;; load up the main file
(org-babel-load-file ~/.emacs.d/emacs.org)

And i my emacs.org, I have at the beginning:

* ELPA settings
#+begin_src emacs-lisp
  ;; set package-load-list -- default is all
  (setq package-archives '(
   (ELPA . http://tromey.com/elpa/;)
   (gnu . http://elpa.gnu.org/packages/;)
   (suco . 
http://joseito.republika.pl/sunrise-commander/;)
   (marmalade . http://marmalade-repo.org/packages/;)
   )
)
(package-initialize)
#+end_src

Later on, I have some customizations.


So do I have to change something?
What should I do with the (require 'org-install)?

Rainer

 
 Thanks,
 

From: rai...@krugs.de (Rainer M. Krug)
Date: Fri, 05 Oct 2012 09:57:30 +0200
Message-ID: 87txu9z6z9@krugs.de
-BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-
Version: GnuPG v1.4.11 (GNU/Linux)
Comment: Using GnuPG with Mozilla - http://www.enigmail.net/

iEYEARECAAYFAlBuk0UACgkQoYgNqgF2egrCrQCdEAZA42TLb4Xs48fIkairYgxO
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Re: [O] From latest maint/master, no need to (require 'org-install)

[Sebastien Vauban]

Hi Eric,

Eric Fraga wrote:
 Bastien b...@altern.org writes:
 Bastien b...@altern.org writes:
 there is no need to (require 'org-install) anymore from the maint and
 master branches.

 ... and you should actually remove (require 'org-install) from your
 configuration, since this file is not automatically created anymore.

 Okay but with what should I replace this, if anything?

 Specifically, I currently have (in my organically grown customisation file
 ;-):

 (add-to-list 'load-path ~/git/org-mode)

Why that one?

 (add-to-list 'load-path ~/git/org-mode/lisp)
 (add-to-list 'load-path ~/git/org-mode/contrib/lisp/)
 (require 'org-install)
 (require 'org-e-latex)
 (require 'org-e-odt)
 (require 'org-latex)
 (require 'org-mime)
 (require 'ob-jacaranda)
 (require 'ob-python)
 (require 'ob-R)
 (require 'ob-sh)
 (require 'org-crypt) (org-crypt-use-before-save-magic)
 (require 'org-inlinetask) ;binding C-c C-x t
 (require 'org-protocol)
 (require 'org-wc) 
 ;; customisations follow

 What should I or could I remove from this?

What I do is:

#+begin_src emacs-lisp
  (when (locate-library org-install)
(require 'org-install))
#+end_src

That way, if it's still present (and maybe necessary[1]), it will be loaded.

If not, it simply has no effect.

Best regards,
  Seb

[1] On old Emacs/Org versions, for people using my .emacs configuration file.

-- 
Sebastien Vauban

Re: [O] From latest maint/master, no need to (require 'org-install): Lisp error

[Rainer Stengele]

Am 02.10.2012 17:39, schrieb Bastien:
 Rainer Stengele rainer.steng...@online.de writes:
 
 Still complaining about org-version ..
 
 Dong!  Fixed.  Please pull again.
 
Thanks Bastien,

works perfectly now.
Actually I am confused - I did not quite understand - why do I no more
require 'org-install and also not 'org. Can you point me to some docs
about this?

Rainer

Re: [O] From latest maint/master, no need to (require 'org-install): Lisp error

[Achim Gratz]

Rainer Stengele writes:
 Actually I am confused - I did not quite understand - why do I no more
 require 'org-install and also not 'org. Can you point me to some docs
 about this?

If you need anything at all, you now need to use (require 'org),
regardless of whether it's the Org version that comes with Emacs (which
has been using this in favor of org-install.el for some time) or from
Git.  However, you don't need any (require 'org) whatsoever if you don't
happen to use customizations in your initialization file that require
Org to be loaded already, since simply using any of the autoloaded
functions will now arrange for the necesary files being loaded.


Regards,
Achim.
-- 
+[Q+ Matrix-12 WAVE#46+305 Neuron microQkb Andromeda XTk Blofeld]+

SD adaptation for Waldorf rackAttack V1.04R1:
http://Synth.Stromeko.net/Downloads.html#WaldorfSDada

Re: [O] From latest maint/master, no need to (require 'org-install)

[Bastien]

Hi all again,

Bastien b...@altern.org writes:

 there is no need to (require 'org-install) anymore from the maint
 and master branches.

... and you should actually remove (require 'org-install) from your
configuration, since this file is not automatically created anymore.

Thanks,

-- 
 Bastien

Re: [O] From latest maint/master, no need to (require 'org-install)

[Bastien]

Hi Charles,

Charles mill...@verizon.net writes:

 I ran make autoloads again and then make update2 - no complaints this time.

 Was this to be expected?

There might be some hicups in the transition from the old org-install
way to the new org-loaddefs way, but if things are fine then it's fine.

-- 
 Bastien

Re: [O] From latest maint/master, no need to (require 'org-install)

[John Hendy]

On Wed, Oct 3, 2012 at 4:26 AM, Bastien b...@altern.org wrote:
 Hi Charles,

 Charles mill...@verizon.net writes:

 I ran make autoloads again and then make update2 - no complaints this time.

 Was this to be expected?

 There might be some hicups in the transition from the old org-install
 way to the new org-loaddefs way, but if things are fine then it's fine.

Or does this have to do with Emacs version. In your original
announcement, you said:

,---
| This is not yet in Emacs trunk but will be in Emacs 24.3.
`---

I didn't follow if that was about removing (require 'org-install) or
only about something having to do with autoloading. Charles mentioned
he is using Emacs 24.2.1, so I just thought to mention this. For
finality... will *all* versions of Emacs now allow for removing
(require 'org-install) with a fresh git pull of orgmode, or does one
need to be using Emacs 24.3?


Thanks,
John


 --
  Bastien

Re: [O] From latest maint/master, no need to (require 'org-install)

[Achim Gratz]

John Hendy writes:
 will *all* versions of Emacs now allow for removing
 (require 'org-install) with a fresh git pull of orgmode, or does one
 need to be using Emacs 24.3?

Yes, all of them.  Emacs 24.3 is just the first to be released with a
change that triggered this.


Regards,
Achim.
-- 
+[Q+ Matrix-12 WAVE#46+305 Neuron microQkb Andromeda XTk Blofeld]+

Factory and User Sound Singles for Waldorf rackAttack:
http://Synth.Stromeko.net/Downloads.html#WaldorfSounds

Re: [O] From latest maint/master, no need to (require 'org-install)

[Eric Fraga]

Bastien b...@altern.org writes:

 Hi all again,

 Bastien b...@altern.org writes:

 there is no need to (require 'org-install) anymore from the maint
 and master branches.

 ... and you should actually remove (require 'org-install) from your
 configuration, since this file is not automatically created anymore.

 Thanks,

Okay but with what should I replace this, if anything?

Specifically, I currently have (in my organically grown customisation
file ;-):

--8---cut here---start-8---
(add-to-list 'load-path ~/git/org-mode)
(add-to-list 'load-path ~/git/org-mode/lisp)
(add-to-list 'load-path ~/git/org-mode/contrib/lisp/)
(require 'org-install)
(require 'org-e-latex)
(require 'org-e-odt)
(require 'org-latex)
(require 'org-mime)
(require 'ob-jacaranda)
(require 'ob-python)
(require 'ob-R)
(require 'ob-sh)
(require 'org-crypt) (org-crypt-use-before-save-magic)
(require 'org-inlinetask)   ;binding C-c C-x t
(require 'org-protocol)
(require 'org-wc) 
;; customisations follow
--8---cut here---end---8---

What should I or could I remove from this?

Thanks,
eric

-- 
: Eric S Fraga, GnuPG: 0xC89193D8FFFCF67D
: in Emacs 24.2.50.1 and Org release_7.9.2-350-g934208

[O] From latest maint/master, no need to (require 'org-install)

[Bastien]

Hi all,

there is no need to (require 'org-install) anymore from the maint
and master branches.

When using the Org distribution that comes with Emacs, Emacs will add
Org's autoloaded core functions to [emacs]/lisp/loaddefs.el and the rest
of the autoloaded functions to [emacs]/lisp/org/org-loaddefs.el.  This
is an improvement over the present situation, where *all* autoloaded
functions where added to Emacs' loaddefs.el -- too much.  This is not
yet in Emacs trunk but will be in Emacs 24.3.

When getting Org as a .tar.gz/.zip archive file, you'll have a file
org-loaddefs.el in the lisp/ directory -- this file is now loaded when
org.el is loaded.

When getting Org from ELPA (either org or org-plus-contrib),
org-loaddefs.el will also be in the load-path.

When getting Org from git, you *HAVE* to created org-loaddefs.el with
`make autoloads' (which is also run by a simple `make'), otherwise
some needed functions will not be autoloaded.

You can check whether org-loaddefs.el has been correctly been loaded
with M-x org-version RET.

Thanks,

-- 
 Bastien

Re: [O] From latest maint/master, no need to (require 'org-install)

[Torsten Wagner]

Hi Bastien,

nice. One line less in u  how long is my emacs config, but it
was a constant trap for people and hence this is smoothed out... good
job ;)
Anyhow I just realized that ELPA contains
org and org-plus-contrib
I stupidly overlooked that and always read
org or org-contrib

Well, thats the way many Linux distros does that kind of things. Sure
enough org-contrib would need org as a requirement.
Maybe thats not possible in ELPA yet?!

Anyhow any reason for the above way?

Greetings

Torsten


On 2 October 2012 22:15, Bastien b...@altern.org wrote:
 Hi all,

 there is no need to (require 'org-install) anymore from the maint
 and master branches.

 When using the Org distribution that comes with Emacs, Emacs will add
 Org's autoloaded core functions to [emacs]/lisp/loaddefs.el and the rest
 of the autoloaded functions to [emacs]/lisp/org/org-loaddefs.el.  This
 is an improvement over the present situation, where *all* autoloaded
 functions where added to Emacs' loaddefs.el -- too much.  This is not
 yet in Emacs trunk but will be in Emacs 24.3.

 When getting Org as a .tar.gz/.zip archive file, you'll have a file
 org-loaddefs.el in the lisp/ directory -- this file is now loaded when
 org.el is loaded.

 When getting Org from ELPA (either org or org-plus-contrib),
 org-loaddefs.el will also be in the load-path.

 When getting Org from git, you *HAVE* to created org-loaddefs.el with
 `make autoloads' (which is also run by a simple `make'), otherwise
 some needed functions will not be autoloaded.

 You can check whether org-loaddefs.el has been correctly been loaded
 with M-x org-version RET.

 Thanks,

 --
  Bastien

Re: [O] From latest maint/master, no need to (require 'org-install)

[Bastien]

Hi Torsten,

Torsten Wagner torsten.wag...@gmail.com writes:

 Anyhow I just realized that ELPA contains
 org and org-plus-contrib
 I stupidly overlooked that and always read
 org or org-contrib

 Well, thats the way many Linux distros does that kind of things. Sure
 enough org-contrib would need org as a requirement.
 Maybe thats not possible in ELPA yet?!

org-plus-contrib has this lenghthy name precisely to make sure that
people know this is Org + Contributed files, not just contributed files.

 Anyhow any reason for the above way?

Apparently it's not possible/easy to handle dependancies between ELPA
packages so we're good like this (for now.)

All best,

-- 
 Bastien

Re: [O] From latest maint/master, no need to (require 'org-install)

[Rainer M Krug]

-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
Hash: SHA1

On 02/10/12 15:15, Bastien wrote:
 Hi all,
 
 there is no need to (require 'org-install) anymore from the maint and master 
 branches.
 
 When using the Org distribution that comes with Emacs, Emacs will add Org's 
 autoloaded core 
 functions to [emacs]/lisp/loaddefs.el and the rest of the autoloaded 
 functions to 
 [emacs]/lisp/org/org-loaddefs.el.  This is an improvement over the present 
 situation, where 
 *all* autoloaded functions where added to Emacs' loaddefs.el -- too much.  
 This is not yet in 
 Emacs trunk but will be in Emacs 24.3.
 
 When getting Org as a .tar.gz/.zip archive file, you'll have a file 
 org-loaddefs.el in the 
 lisp/ directory -- this file is now loaded when org.el is loaded.
 
 When getting Org from ELPA (either org or org-plus-contrib), 
 org-loaddefs.el will also be 
 in the load-path.
 
 When getting Org from git, you *HAVE* to created org-loaddefs.el with `make 
 autoloads' (which 
 is also run by a simple `make'), otherwise some needed functions will not be 
 autoloaded.
 
 You can check whether org-loaddefs.el has been correctly been loaded with M-x 
 org-version RET.

But how do I see it? I get:

Org-mode version 7.9.2 (release_7.9.2-352-g7f74da.dirty @ 
/home/rkrug/.emacs.d/org-mode/lisp/) [2
times]

I am getting confused.

I use org mode from git, and my update script for org from git is:

#!/bin/sh
cd ~/.emacs.d/org-mode-git/org-mode

git checkout master
git fetch --tags origin

# git clone git://repo.or.cz/org-mode.git
git pull
git gc

git checkout master

make clean
make
make autoloads
make doc
make info

# make install

Is this OK, or should I change something in the script? Or switch to ELPA 
(emacs 24.2.1)?

Rainer
 
 Thanks,
 

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Re: [O] From latest maint/master, no need to (require 'org-install)

[Bastien]

Hi Rainer,

Rainer M Krug r.m.k...@gmail.com writes:

 Org-mode version 7.9.2 (release_7.9.2-352-g7f74da.dirty @
 /home/rkrug/.emacs.d/org-mode/lisp/)

Looks fine.

 I use org mode from git, and my update script for org from git is:

 #!/bin/sh
 cd ~/.emacs.d/org-mode-git/org-mode

Okay.

 git checkout master
 git fetch --tags origin

 # git clone git://repo.or.cz/org-mode.git
 git pull
 git gc

 git checkout master

 make clean
 make
 make autoloads
 make doc
 make info

 # make install

Instead of the above quote you can simply use

make update

(And you can clone from git://orgmode.org/org-mode.git
it will be faster and more recent. repo.or.cz is behind
by one hour.) 

 Is this OK, or should I change something in the script? Or switch to ELPA 
 (emacs 24.2.1)?

Things look okay.  My suggestions are just to spare some lines.

Best,

-- 
 Bastien

Re: [O] From latest maint/master, no need to (require 'org-install)

[Rainer M Krug]

-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
Hash: SHA1

On 02/10/12 16:20, Bastien wrote:
 Hi Rainer,
 
 Rainer M Krug r.m.k...@gmail.com writes:
 
 Org-mode version 7.9.2 (release_7.9.2-352-g7f74da.dirty @ 
 /home/rkrug/.emacs.d/org-mode/lisp/)
 
 Looks fine.

Good to know.

 
 I use org mode from git, and my update script for org from git is:
 
 #!/bin/sh cd ~/.emacs.d/org-mode-git/org-mode
 
 Okay.

 
 git checkout master git fetch --tags origin
 
 # git clone git://repo.or.cz/org-mode.git git pull git gc
 
 git checkout master
 
 make clean make make autoloads make doc make info
 
 # make install
 
 Instead of the above quote you can simply use
 
 make update

I guess you mean instead of the make ... commands - right? The git ... have to 
stay I assume?

 
 (And you can clone from git://orgmode.org/org-mode.git it will be faster and 
 more recent.
 repo.or.cz is behind by one hour.)

Switched some time ago - the repo.or.cz in the comment is just a leftover.

 
 Is this OK, or should I change something in the script? Or switch to ELPA 
 (emacs 24.2.1)?
 
 Things look okay.  My suggestions are just to spare some lines.

Thanks a lot,

now I can sleep a little better,

Rainer

 
 Best,
 


- -- 
Rainer M. Krug, PhD (Conservation Ecology, SUN), MSc (Conservation Biology, 
UCT), Dipl. Phys.
(Germany)

Centre of Excellence for Invasion Biology
Stellenbosch University
South Africa

Tel :   +33 - (0)9 53 10 27 44
Cell:   +33 - (0)6 85 62 59 98
Fax :   +33 - (0)9 58 10 27 44

Fax (D):+49 - (0)3 21 21 25 22 44

email:  rai...@krugs.de

Skype:  RMkrug
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Re: [O] From latest maint/master, no need to (require 'org-install): Lisp error

[Rainer Stengele]

Am 02.10.2012 16:20, schrieb Bastien:
 Hi Rainer,
 
 Rainer M Krug r.m.k...@gmail.com writes:
 
 Org-mode version 7.9.2 (release_7.9.2-352-g7f74da.dirty @
 /home/rkrug/.emacs.d/org-mode/lisp/)
 
 Looks fine.
 
 I use org mode from git, and my update script for org from git is:

 #!/bin/sh
 cd ~/.emacs.d/org-mode-git/org-mode
 
 Okay.
 
 git checkout master
 git fetch --tags origin

 # git clone git://repo.or.cz/org-mode.git
 git pull
 git gc

 git checkout master

 make clean
 make
 make autoloads
 make doc
 make info

 # make install
 
 Instead of the above quote you can simply use
 
 make update
 
 (And you can clone from git://orgmode.org/org-mode.git
 it will be faster and more recent. repo.or.cz is behind
 by one hour.) 
 
 Is this OK, or should I change something in the script? Or switch to ELPA 
 (emacs 24.2.1)?
 
 Things look okay.  My suggestions are just to spare some lines.
 
 Best,
 
Hi!

I tried make update and ended up here:

Debugger entered--Lisp error: (error Required feature `org-version' was
not provided)
  require(org-version
c:/Users/rainer/AppData/Roaming/.emacs.d/org/lisp/org-version.el noerror)
  (if (require (quote org-version) org-version\.el (quote noerror))
(quote (progn (autoload (quote org-release) org-version.el) (autoload
(quote org-git-version) org-version.el))) (if (require (quote
org-fixup) org-fixup\.el (quote noerror)) (quote (org-fixup)) (warn
Could not define org version correctly.  Check installation!) (quote
(progn (defun org-release nil N/A) (defun org-git-version nil N/A
!!check installation!!)
  (let* ((org-dir (org-find-library-dir org)) (org-version\.el (concat
org-dir org-version.el)) (org-fixup\.el (concat org-dir
../mk/org-fixup.el))) (if (require (quote org-version) org-version\.el
(quote noerror)) (quote (progn (autoload (quote org-release)
org-version.el) (autoload (quote org-git-version) org-version.el)))
(if (require (quote org-fixup) org-fixup\.el (quote noerror)) (quote
(org-fixup)) (warn Could not define org version correctly.  Check
installation!) (quote (progn (defun org-release nil N/A) (defun
org-git-version nil N/A !!check installation!!))
  (lambda nil Try very hard to provide sensible version strings. (let*
((org-dir (org-find-library-dir org)) (org-version\.el (concat org-dir
org-version.el)) (org-fixup\.el (concat org-dir
../mk/org-fixup.el))) (if (require (quote org-version) org-version\.el
(quote noerror)) (quote (progn (autoload (quote org-release)
org-version.el) (autoload (quote org-git-version) org-version.el)))
(if (require (quote org-fixup) org-fixup\.el (quote noerror)) (quote
(org-fixup)) (warn Could not define org version correctly.  Check
installation!) (quote (progn (defun org-release nil N/A) (defun
org-git-version nil N/A !!check installation!!)))()
  (org-check-version)
  eval-buffer(#buffer  *load*2 nil
c:/Users/rainer/AppData/Roaming/.emacs.d/org/lisp/org.el nil t)  ;
Reading at buffer position 9046

load-with-code-conversion(c:/Users/rainer/AppData/Roaming/.emacs.d/org/lisp/org.el
c:/Users/rainer/AppData/Roaming/.emacs.d/org/lisp/org.el nil t)
  require(org)
  byte-code(\300\301!\210\300\302!\207 [require org find-func] 2)
  require(org-exp-blocks)
  eval-buffer(#buffer  *load* nil
c:/Users/rainer/AppData/Roaming/.emacs nil t)  ; Reading at buffer
position 6546
  load-with-code-conversion(c:/Users/rainer/AppData/Roaming/.emacs
c:/Users/rainer/AppData/Roaming/.emacs t t)
  load(~/.emacs t t)
  #[0 \205\262


What is wrong in my setup?

Rainer

Re: [O] From latest maint/master, no need to (require 'org-install): Lisp error

[Bastien]

Rainer Stengele rainer.steng...@online.de writes:

 What is wrong in my setup?

run

make autoloads 

at least once before 

make update

-- 
 Bastien

Re: [O] From latest maint/master, no need to (require 'org-install)

[Bastien]

Rainer M Krug r.m.k...@gmail.com writes:

 I guess you mean instead of the make ... commands - right? The git
 ... have to stay I assume?

Nope... `make update' will do everything for you.

Try `make helpall' to get more info.

 now I can sleep a little better,

:)

-- 
 Bastien

Re: [O] From latest maint/master, no need to (require 'org-install): Lisp error

[Rainer Stengele]

Am 02.10.2012 17:20, schrieb Bastien:
 Rainer Stengele rainer.steng...@online.de writes:
 
 What is wrong in my setup?
 
 run
 
 make autoloads 
 
 at least once before 
 
 make update
 
sorry but no.

Still complaining about org-version ..

Rainer

Re: [O] From latest maint/master, no need to (require 'org-install): Lisp error

[Bastien]

Rainer Stengele rainer.steng...@online.de writes:

 Still complaining about org-version ..

Dong!  Fixed.  Please pull again.

-- 
 Bastien

Re: [O] From latest maint/master, no need to (require 'org-install): Lisp error

[johnlist]

On 02.10.2012 11:28, Rainer Stengele wrote:

run

make autoloads

at least once before

make update


sorry but no.

Still complaining about org-version ..

Rainer


fwiw, I updated via git this morning and entered the same problem with 
the same error message. I'm swamped and didn't have time to debug 
further (though I did check list-load-path-shadows and didn't see a 
problem there).


I reverted to current stable version (tar.gz) and this loads fine.

emacs 24.2.1
Org-mode version 7.9.2 (7.9.2-dist @ /home/me/elisp/org-mode/lisp/)

--
John

Re: [O] From latest maint/master, no need to (require 'org-install): Lisp error

[Achim Gratz]

johnl...@johnrakestraw.com writes:
 fwiw, I updated via git this morning and entered the same problem with
 the same error message. I'm swamped and didn't have time to debug
 further (though I did check list-load-path-shadows and didn't see a
 problem there).

That's what Git is for:

git reflog -5 HEAD

will show you where your branch head was for the last five operations
that moved it.  If you want to go back 2 steps you'd say

git checkout HEAD@{2}

for instance.  No need to deal with pesky tar files.


Regards,
Achim.
-- 
+[Q+ Matrix-12 WAVE#46+305 Neuron microQkb Andromeda XTk Blofeld]+

Waldorf MIDI Implementation  additional documentation:
http://Synth.Stromeko.net/Downloads.html#WaldorfDocs

Re: [O] From latest maint/master, no need to (require 'org-install)

[Charles]

Bastien,

Early this morning, i.e. before your message, I pulled from git, ran 
make update2 and at the end of compiling org-loaddefs.el was mentioned 
as  not loaded. This in cygwin.


This evening I followed your instructions (I think!)  and ran 
~/elisp/org-mode   make autoloads


Then make update2; at the end of this it complained about org-version.el

I ran make autoloads again and then make update2 - no complaints this time.

Was this to be expected?

Windows 7 HP 64
Emacs 24.2.1
cygwin 1.7.16
org version 7.9.2 (release_7.9.2-383-g09d6bc) (which I obtained by M-x 
org-version)


Charlie Millar

On 10/2/2012 9:15 AM, Bastien wrote:

Hi all,

there is no need to (require 'org-install) anymore from the maint
and master branches.

When using the Org distribution that comes with Emacs, Emacs will add
Org's autoloaded core functions to [emacs]/lisp/loaddefs.el and the rest
of the autoloaded functions to [emacs]/lisp/org/org-loaddefs.el.  This
is an improvement over the present situation, where *all* autoloaded
functions where added to Emacs' loaddefs.el -- too much.  This is not
yet in Emacs trunk but will be in Emacs 24.3.

When getting Org as a .tar.gz/.zip archive file, you'll have a file
org-loaddefs.el in the lisp/ directory -- this file is now loaded when
org.el is loaded.

When getting Org from ELPA (either org or org-plus-contrib),
org-loaddefs.el will also be in the load-path.

When getting Org from git, you *HAVE* to created org-loaddefs.el with
`make autoloads' (which is also run by a simple `make'), otherwise
some needed functions will not be autoloaded.

You can check whether org-loaddefs.el has been correctly been loaded
with M-x org-version RET.

Thanks,

Re: [O] From latest maint/master, no need to (require 'org-install)

[Torsten Wagner]

On 2 October 2012 22:49, Bastien b...@altern.org wrote:
 Hi Torsten,

 Torsten Wagner torsten.wag...@gmail.com writes:

 Anyhow I just realized that ELPA contains
 org and org-plus-contrib
 I stupidly overlooked that and always read
 org or org-contrib

 Well, thats the way many Linux distros does that kind of things. Sure
 enough org-contrib would need org as a requirement.
 Maybe thats not possible in ELPA yet?!

 org-plus-contrib has this lenghthy name precisely to make sure that
 people know this is Org + Contributed files, not just contributed files.

Well I said  I stupidly overlooked that, did I ;)

Greetings

Torsten